Where have all the 42 inch (approx.) Plasma gone?

Originally Posted by ctviggen 

Thank you both. That does seem like a nice TV, and these have really come down in price! I bought my current 32 inch (really, more like 30 inch) LCD TV for $800, and this plasma is half that!
This TV also meets the requirement I have of having an optical output.
Thank you very much.

Originally Posted by ctviggen 

I want to upgrade from a 32 inch LCD to a 42 inch plasma, mainly to get a larger TV (so I can actually see the wording on the screen) and because I think plasma is better. I don't think I convince the wife to go much bigger than this, since we have a 92 inch screen (and 7.2 channels) and projector downstairs. She wants something "smaller" in the living room.
The trouble is, I'm having a hard time finding 42 inch plasmas. Do they exist any more? If so, can anyone recommend a TV (and a retailer)?
An example of a TV I'd buy immediately if I could find one:
Panasonic TC-P42UT50

Originally Posted by ctviggen 

Why not a 720p? Do they make 1080p plasma TVs in the 42 inch size? (I don't want to go bigger than about 42 inches.)

Also, I've been reading that plasmas tend to be more reflective than LCD/LED tvs.

In real terms, how much does this make a difference? I'll be using this TV in a living room that gets afternoon sun.

Originally Posted by ctviggen 

Why not a 720p? Do they make 1080p plasma TVs in the 42 inch size? (I don't want to go bigger than about 42 inches.)
Also, I've been reading that plasmas tend to be more reflective than LCD/LED tvs. In real terms, how much does this make a difference? I'll be using this TV in a living room that gets afternoon sun.
Thanks.

Originally Posted by RandyWalters 

Nobody makes a 1080p Plasma under 50 inches anymore. Panasonic made one earlier this year (TC-P42UT50) but they discontinued it early due to lack of interest from all but a few retailers. Sears recently bought up the remaining inventory but those may all be gone by now.
Not quite true - some Plasmas have excellent Anti-Reflective Filters while others (the low end models) do not have an AR Filter and are much more reflective. Alternately, up till a few years ago pretty much all of the LCD TVs had non-reflective matte screens but the recent trend with LCD TVs and especially the LED LCD TVs is that they now have glossy non-matte screens to add Plasma-like depth, but that results in them being even more reflective than most of the Plasmas are. There are very few current LCD or LED LCD TVs with matte screens this year.
All of the 2012 Samsung and Panasonic Plasmas in the 42" size have glossy reflective screens. If you need it to have an AR Filter, you'll have to bump it up to a 50" Panny ST50/GT50 or 51" Sammy E6500/E7000/E8000 Plasma.
Afternoon sun has always been challenging for any TV (even Plasmas with AR Filters and even matte-screen LCD TVs) but obviously it's worse with tube TVs, and those Plasma and LED/LCD models that do not have AR Filters or matte screens. Current Plasmas are bright enough to punch through the light in a bright room if you're watching sports, but during dark scenes of a movie etc a glossy screened TV will be reflective like a dark mirror.
Reflectivity is a mixed bag these days - it's hard to tell from websites and forums if a particular TV will be too reflective for a particular room or environment so it's important to go to stores and look at the screen of any TV you're considering and see if it has a glossy screen or not, and examine how it handles bright overhead lighting, banks of storefront windows or other TV screens behind you both during bright and dark scenes. But in the end, if a room is excessively bright then any TV will look poor to some extent or another.

Originally Posted by ctviggen 

Why do you recommend 1080p sets only? I have a 720p projector that shoots onto a 92 inch high power screen, and I think the picture is fantastic. That's in a light controlled room with matte walls though. By contrast, the TV I'll be purchasing is in a living room that gets afternoon sun in the summer. And I sit about 14 feet away from the TV (which is about five feet further than I sit from my 92 inch screen, by the way).
So, if I like the picture on my 92 inch screen where I sit about 9 feet away from the screen and I use 720p, why do I need a 1080p TV where I sit 14 feet away for a 42 inch screen?

Originally Posted by PlasmaPZ80U 

I suppose you don't need 1080p since like you mentioned 720p can still produce a great picture. However, 1080p is about twice the resolution of 720p (2 megapixels vs. 1 megapixel). The larger the screen and the closer you sit to it the more obvious this difference will become. Even with a 42" set, sitting 5 ft or closer will make the difference between the two resolutions quite obvious. For example, when watching HDTV on my 42" 1080p LG LCD TV, I can easily notice that 720p channels are not nearly as sharp or clear as 1080i channels. 720p video games on the PS3 have noticeably more jagged edges than 1080p ones and the picture doesn't look as clear either. For maximum sharpness and clarity, 1080p sets offer twice the resolution of 720p sets.
1920 x 1080 = 2,073,600
1280 x 720 = 921,600
44.4% the resolution of 1080p
1024 x 768 = 786,432
38% the resolution of 1080p
As you can see, what passes for 720p on a 42" plasma currently (1024 by 768) is only 38% the resolution of 1080p. You will notice this difference unless you sit very far away from your 42" set. I see you have mentioned you will sit 14' from your 42" set, but I would say that is much too far away. I sit 5' or less from mine and in reality, I could actually go for a 46" or 47" set at this viewing distance.

Originally Posted by PlasmaPZ80U 

I suppose you don't need 1080p since like you mentioned 720p can still produce a great picture. However, 1080p is about twice the resolution of 720p (2 megapixels vs. 1 megapixel). The larger the screen and the closer you sit to it the more obvious this difference will become. Even with a 42" set, sitting 5 ft or closer will make the difference between the two resolutions quite obvious. For example, when watching HDTV on my 42" 1080p LG LCD TV, I can easily notice that 720p channels are not nearly as sharp or clear as 1080i channels. 720p video games on the PS3 have noticeably more jagged edges than 1080p ones and the picture doesn't look as clear either. For maximum sharpness and clarity, 1080p sets offer twice the resolution of 720p sets.
1920 x 1080 = 2,073,600
1280 x 720 = 921,600
44.4% the resolution of 1080p
1024 x 768 = 786,432
38% the resolution of 1080p
As you can see, what passes for 720p on a 42" plasma currently (1024 by 768) is only 38% the resolution of 1080p. You will notice this difference unless you sit very far away from your 42" set. I see you have mentioned you will sit 14' from your 42" set, but I would say that is much too far away. I sit 5' or less from mine and in reality, I could actually go for a 46" or 47" set at this viewing distance.

Originally Posted by mailiang 

Your point is well taken, however, you're not looking at the whole picture. ( No pun intended ) There is more to detail then just the static resolution of which you speak of. Unlike computer screens, which more often then not display fixed images, TV's have to produce moving images for the most part. Moving and visual resolution have a profound effect on detail since they are governed by bandwidth, contrast, color saturation, gray scale and the ability for a TV (and it's source) to display moving images accurately. The award winning 2008 Pioneer PDP-428XG KURO had a mere static resolution of 1024X768 pixels and yet will probably out perform many 1080p sets of today. When it comes to HDTV, it doesn't matter if you have over 2 million pixels or less then 900,000 if you can't display half of them cleanly. I have a 720p PDP and regardless of it's source , it still beats my 1080p LCD when it comes down to over all picture quality.
http://www.avsforum.com/t/1066429/moving-picture-resolution
http://reviews.cnet.com/hdtv-resolution/
Ian

Originally Posted by oztech 

We all like to justify what we purchase but the simple fact if you supply 1080i/p source and your set is native 720/768p it will have to scale it down you do not get the whole enchilada and yes I still have my 42 panny plasma 768p and my new 55ST50 trumps it in ever aspect .

Originally Posted by eeee87 

nonsense..
http://forum.beyond3d.com/showthread.php?t=46241

Originally Posted by ctviggen 

Why not a 720p?......

Originally Posted by PlasmaPZ80U 

simply put, all else being equal, a 1080p set will have a sharper and clearer picture than a 720p set
and since all 720p sets at this point are entry-level only, they will not only have less resolution but worse overall PQ as well
so, even if some old 720p sets could outperform some old 1080p sets, that's not the case with the current 720p plasmas vs. current 1080p plasmas
all the best plasmas this year are 1080p: Panasonic ST/GT/VT50 and Samsung E8000/7000/6500

Originally Posted by sonyfan 

.... look at all the 720 Pioneer KURO 5080 that were sold.
Rave reviews and happy buyers. But oh, how can that be it's only a 720?

Originally Posted by mailiang 

My point was very simple. There has been too much weight put on static resolution. It has been used as marketing tool ever since the advent of HD and yet it's the least important aspect of picture quality according to the ISF. I have seen 1080p LCD panels that looked like crap. However, I do concur that the current line of 720p plasmas are of lower quality, which is likely due to a trend that advocates replacing better processors and panels for more features on a product that cost less.

Cheers!
Ian

Originally Posted by homerging 

Panasonic is selling a P42ST50 outside the US and was selling a P42VT30 in their 2011 lineup. You could import from overseas if you're desperate and don't care about costs.

Originally Posted by RandyWalters 

But like all the other Plasmas of that era, the otherwise excellent 5080 was crippled by the dreaded SDE. SDE was a way of life back then, and i was one of the big complainers about it on my 42" PX50U. I came very close to buying a Pioneer 4280 several times in early 2007 but despite it's great colors and excellent processing the one single reason why i didn't buy one is because i could see the pixel structure (SDE) at my 9 foot viewing distance. It was unacceptable and it was a deal breaker. Still is.
A few months later Panasonic released their first 42" and 50" 1080p models (the PZ700U series) and the difference/improvement in screen smoothness was astounding. I ended up buying my 42PZ700U instead of the 4280 based solely on it's 1080p screen. Now if my viewing distance were 12 feet instead of 9 feet, i would have been beyond the range that SDE is visible to me and i would have bought the 4280.

Originally Posted by PlasmaPZ80U 

At this point, there are no downsides to getting a 1080p set instead of a 720p one. So, why opt for a 720p one unless you really want to keep costs really low? I guess I don't understand why anyone would want a 720p set at this point when so many 1080p sets are available at very affordable prices.

Originally Posted by mailiang 

That may be so, but if given the choice between a 40/42'' 1080p LCD or a 42'' 720p PDP, I think you know what my answer would be.

Cheers!
Ian