or Connect
AVS › AVS Forum › Display Devices › Display Calibration › CalMan 5 Release Notes and Discussion
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

CalMan 5 Release Notes and Discussion - Page 33

post #961 of 2247
Quote:
Originally Posted by p5browne View Post

On my LGs, using Game Mode, you have no Backlight, and no Option to turn it On or Off. Leads to Milky Blacks. Now Calibrating with Expert Mode that has Backlight.
Apparently, there's some kind of Auto Colour Mode in THX that affects the Lumagens. Maybe this is why, despite moving all the THX settings to the Expert Modes, we could never quite get the PQs to look the same - THX always looked better! I was told the Pros know about this, and don't use THX in association with the Lumagens. Us Amateur Calibrators - we don't know, so just spreading the word.

The Calman 5.1 Ver 1100 - Best Skin Tones Ever! That is until the next New Beta? My TV is getting so conceited as to how good it looks, it soon be impossible to live with!

you mean no backlight control, not no backlight (which would imply no picture as Doug mentioned)
post #962 of 2247
Quote:
Originally Posted by PlasmaPZ80U View Post

you mean no backlight control, not no backlight (which would imply no picture as Doug mentioned)

Game Mode - NO Backlight, meaning that you don't have the Black Blacks, but instead Milky Blacks because of it. Just because there's no Backlight, doesn't mean No Picture.
post #963 of 2247
Quote:
Originally Posted by p5browne View Post

Game Mode - NO Backlight, meaning that you don't have the Black Blacks, but instead Milky Blacks because of it. Just because there's no Backlight, doesn't mean No Picture.

This is so wrong. When the crystals on a LCD display are fully twisted maximum available light is allowed to pass through. When completely untwisted no light is passed through resulting in a black image at that crystal location. So no backlight at all would result in the entire display being black. And having milky blacks would not be possible unless light was contaminating the displayed black image.
post #964 of 2247
My guess would be that in Game Mode, this TV sets the Backlight to the maximum setting to make the picture very bright... but that raises the black level. And while there is normally a slider in the user menu to set the Backlight higher or lower, in Game Mode there is either no slider or it is disabled (grayed-out). If that's the case, Game Mode would never be particularly useful for anything... typically the purpose of Gam Mode is to elminate as much internal processing of the image as possible to get images to display and change from frame to frame as quickly as possible to reduce lag between what you do with the game controller and what happens on the screen. The more extra processing you do to the images in the TV, the more lag you incur (processing slows-down display of frames slightly) and gamers hate lag, especially in games where timing is highly critical. Game Modes are often screwed up in ways that make them inappropriate for watching movies, but I never heard of one that sets the backlight to maximum then doesn't allow you to adjust it... until this one.

The Backlight is the light source that makes LCD images visible. If there was "no backlight," the LCD TV would emit no light and you would have no images (black screen, just like if the TV was turned-off)... as we have been trying to describe all along. LCD panels must have a light source to make the images visible... the backlight is the light source. So "no backlight" is nonsensical.
post #965 of 2247
My mistake, what I should have said is that Game Mode leaves the Backlight ON all the time and Never shuts Off, creating the Milky Blacks, Therefore is not a good Mode to run the XE 125 Point. (Been trying to remove too many Clients' Malware lately - head has gone to mush!)
Expert Mode allows the On/Off of the Backlight without any THX Mode Interferences.
Same with LG Brightness, go over 50 on the New Sets, or 52 on the Old, Backlight always stays on, killing the Blacks. therefore we stay at, or below those settings.
Edited by p5browne - 2/4/13 at 2:04pm
post #966 of 2247
My wife's laptop's back-light recently died.

I can vouch for the fact that no back-light means that the image is illegible. If we shined a flashlight on the display we could make out enough to see that the display and computer where on, just no light was being emitted. It did do wonders for her black level though.
post #967 of 2247
Hi,

I'm new to the Radiance stuff and need some help with 3D color cube. Got a Radiance Mini with latest firmware, running Calman 5.04b993 Enthusiast Licence. System is Win7 x64 SP1 with Framework 4.5, complete new install.
21p greyscale was running fine with very good results.
But autocal doesn not work with the 3D color cube. When I hit the autocal button nothing happens.
Settings are as follows:


Is there something wrong with the settings? also strange that the drop-down-menu "Lum. points per color" is empty.
post #968 of 2247
think I found a bug in the level editor. created a new level 5% to 100% with 5% steps. safed everything, closed and opened the editor to verify the new level and the editor added 0,2 at 30% and 70%.
post #969 of 2247
For the color cube you must choose your radiance as display in the display section. Have you done this?

Edit:
Be careful, there are two Lumagen display, choose the one with cube.
post #970 of 2247
yes, choosed Radiance as display and as pattern generator. Otherwise greyscale failed too but autocal did work on greyscale.
post #971 of 2247
Sorry, if it was the right Lumagen display, I can´t help you anymore. Then you must wait for a more experience user.
post #972 of 2247
Quote:
Originally Posted by DrFaxe View Post

Hi,

I'm new to the Radiance stuff and need some help with 3D color cube. Got a Radiance Mini with latest firmware, running Calman 5.04b993 Enthusiast Licence. System is Win7 x64 SP1 with Framework 4.5, complete new install.
21p greyscale was running fine with very good results.
But autocal doesn not work with the 3D color cube. When I hit the autocal button nothing happens.
Settings are as follows:


Is there something wrong with the settings? also strange that the drop-down-menu "Lum. points per color" is empty.

You have to select "Lumagen-Radiance 3D LUT fw 091612 or later" in the Direct Display Control dropdown menus. "Radiance CMS" won't do it.

If you have set this, and the Cube Autocal still doesn't work, you'll first need to verify that your Mini's firmware is indeed 091612 or newer. Although you just got it, unless you received it directly from Lumagen, it could still have older pre-Cube firmware.
Edited by Rolls-Royce - 2/5/13 at 3:55pm
post #973 of 2247
OK, got it! Will try tomorrow. Used Radiance CMS. Thanks a lot !!

are my posted Calman settings OK for 3D color cube?
post #974 of 2247
Quote:
Originally Posted by DrFaxe View Post

OK, got it! Will try tomorrow. Used Radiance CMS. Thanks a lot !!

are my posted Calman settings OK for 3D color cube?

They look good to me! Good luck on the cal tomorrow.
post #975 of 2247
In the Radiance menu you must enable it like this:
Output - CMS's - CMS# - Color Gamut - Options:
3D Color Gamut Options
Enabled: Yes
Points: 125
Edited by AVfile - 2/5/13 at 8:54pm
post #976 of 2247
yes, this was enabled by default. thanks to all !!
post #977 of 2247
This might be the wrong place for this post, if so I am sorry.

I am wondering if there is a trial version of Calman? I am trying to decide if I can get by with HCFR or if I want to step into Calman or Chromapure or something like that....
post #978 of 2247
Quote:
Originally Posted by marcojames View Post

This might be the wrong place for this post, if so I am sorry.

I am wondering if there is a trial version of Calman? I am trying to decide if I can get by with HCFR or if I want to step into Calman or Chromapure or something like that....

Yes there is at the link below. You will not be able to use an actual meter but all features are available with the built-in simulated meter.

http://store.spectracal.com/downloads.html
post #979 of 2247
Quote:
Originally Posted by DrFaxe View Post

yes, this was enabled by default. thanks to all !!

Huh? You mean DISabled? You got it working?
post #980 of 2247
Quote:
Originally Posted by AVfile View Post

Huh? You mean DISabled? You got it working?

No, when we connect to a radiance we set all those options automatically. wink.gif
post #981 of 2247
Hi,

finished the my first color cube with the Radiance Mini. Some colors improved, some getting worse, overall slightly better. But greyscale, especially gamma gets messed up after running the color cube.
How come? Thanks for comments!
chosed target dE 0,5 for greyscale and 1.0 for cube


calibrated greyscale before cube cal.


greyscale after cube cal.


colorchecker pre cal.


colorchecker post cal.


sweep pre cal.


sweep post cal.
post #982 of 2247
One thing is your dispaly looks to be very good in it's precalibrated state, so you aren't going to see huge changes with the 3D LUT.

That said we've been refining many of the AutoCal algorithims for CalMAN 5.1, which just hit RC.

You'll likely see better results with 5.1, since we increased the efficiency of AutoCal, we've also been able to use the extra time to tighten up our calibration targets. We also made some tweaks that allow us to do a better job of figuring out which direction those last few bits should be flipped.

http://www.spectracal.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=101&t=4576
post #983 of 2247
Quote:
Originally Posted by sotti View Post

One thing is your dispaly looks to be very good in it's precalibrated state, so you aren't going to see huge changes with the 3D LUT.

That said we've been refining many of the AutoCal algorithims for CalMAN 5.1, which just hit RC.

You'll likely see better results with 5.1, since we increased the efficiency of AutoCal, we've also been able to use the extra time to tighten up our calibration targets. We also made some tweaks that allow us to do a better job of figuring out which direction those last few bits should be flipped.

http://www.spectracal.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=101&t=4576

You guys are working late tonight.

btw, I don't know why this is but when using a full DDC reset with 5.1 Beta for my VT50's ISF mode the picture is dimmer than custom mode. Last night I used Controlcal to reset my ISF modes in my VT50 and enter my setup settings in my VT50 for a LUT cube calibration, now my picture is back to normal as far as contrast and brightness goes.

You may remember I said I was seeing a dimmer picture in the lower IRE's when the first Beta 5.1 came out. I always reset my VT50's ISF setting until last night using Calman to reset.

ss
post #984 of 2247
actually was pretty suprised that the gamut was so good before cal. Will try 5.1RC and see the outcome. Have to watch some more reference movies and than will decide.
But based on the current results I consider not to use color cube, to have as less image processing as possible, and prefer the better greyscale and gamma.


BTW: did You notice my post here?
http://www.avsforum.com/t/1423111/calman-5-release-notes-and-discussion/960#post_22927926
post #985 of 2247
Just ran 5.1 RC1, 3D Luminance chart looks a little better as does the Gamma/grayscale/RGB ballance, but the LUT Cube Gamut needs to be reworked.
Mine, VT50, C6/I1pro, CM 5E.



ss
,
post #986 of 2247
2 or 3 Betas, Light Skin Colour was close to Reference Line. Now with 1109. back to a Spike for Light Skin. Also see the same in sillysally's above printout.
post #987 of 2247
Quote:
Originally Posted by DrFaxe View Post

Hi,

finished the my first color cube with the Radiance Mini. Some colors improved, some getting worse, overall slightly better. But greyscale, especially gamma gets messed up after running the color cube.
How come? Thanks for comments!
chosed target dE 0,5 for greyscale and 1.0 for cube

During the CMS Cube operations, if the luminance of one or more of the colors is too low, Peak White (100%) will be lowered to reduce the luminance target for the color(s). The rest of the existing grayscale isn't readjusted, so some of its points can change, particularly gamma, which is calculated using the luminance for 100% White.
Edited by Rolls-Royce - 2/8/13 at 9:44am
post #988 of 2247
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rolls-Royce View Post

During the CMS Cube operations, if the Radiance finds luminance of one or more of the colors too low, it will reduce Peak White (100%) to reduce the luminance target for the color(s). The rest of the existing grayscale isn't readjusted, so some of its points can change, particularly gamma, which is calculated using the luminance for 100% White.

The rest of the grayscale is re-adjusted, but we only have 25%, 50%, 75%, and 100% controls (you can only do so much with 4 points instead of 20) and the tri-linear filtering of the points in between those nodes can also effect grayscale.

Not adjusting grayscale at all, but adjusting the nearest saturation points will also effect grayscale.
post #989 of 2247
Quote:
Originally Posted by sotti View Post

The rest of the grayscale is re-adjusted, but we only have 25%, 50%, 75%, and 100% controls (you can only do so much with 4 points instead of 20) and the tri-linear filtering of the points in between those nodes can also effect grayscale.

Not adjusting grayscale at all, but adjusting the nearest saturation points will also effect grayscale.

Thanks, Sotti. I had read somewhere but forgotten (getting old is a bear) that you do readjust grayscale but only have 4 points to do so instead of 11 or 21 or...
post #990 of 2247
RC1, doesn't work for a Mini 3D and VT50.
One step forward two steps back.



ss
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: Display Calibration
AVS › AVS Forum › Display Devices › Display Calibration › CalMan 5 Release Notes and Discussion