AVS › AVS Forum › Display Devices › Digital Hi-End Projectors - $3,000+ USD MSRP › NEW EPSON HOME CINEMA 3020, 5020 and 6020 AVAILABLE IN OCTOBER AND NOVEMBER 2012
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NEW EPSON HOME CINEMA 3020, 5020 and 6020 AVAILABLE IN OCTOBER AND NOVEMBER 2012 - Page 18

post #511 of 740
12/7/12 at 7:10am
Quote:
Originally Posted by buddhamus View Post

Well I got my replacement today...and got it home connected it all up!......................SAME ISSUE!. Convergance was horrible again!...........I just emailed Epson saying I have tried 2 projectors within 2 weeks with the exact same problem. I would pretty much prefer a refund and I dont want to play "lucky duck" with getting a 3rd.
New units misconvergance!
http://imageshack.us/g/1/9907331/

Yeah, I'd suggest you try the Panasonic 8000. Epson just can't get the convergence right.
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post #512 of 740
12/7/12 at 12:23pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by buddhamus View Post

Well I got my replacement today...and got it home connected it all up!......................SAME ISSUE!. Convergance was horrible again!...........I just emailed Epson saying I have tried 2 projectors within 2 weeks with the exact same problem. I would pretty much prefer a refund and I dont want to play "lucky duck" with getting a 3rd.
New units misconvergance!
http://imageshack.us/g/1/9907331/
Sorry to hear that. I returned my second unit, and will receive the third one on Monday, but it is a sad feeling that I am almost sure that it will be again the same story. Are we to anal about this issue, none of the reviews mention it or barley touch this issue, but personally I find it quite disturbing. Don’t know what to think.

The pic is from my second unit.....
Edited by mjugen - 12/7/12 at 12:29pm
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post #513 of 740
12/7/12 at 12:38pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by mjugen View Post

Sorry to hear that. I returned my second unit, and will receive the third one on Monday, but it is a sad feeling that I am almost sure that it will be again the same story. Are we to anal about this issue, none of the reviews mention it or barley touch this issue, but personally I find it quite disturbing. Don’t know what to think.
The pic is from my second unit.....

It looks just like my friend's 5020. The convergence and CA are really bad !
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post #514 of 740
12/7/12 at 12:50pm
sorry for my english but somebody please can tell me what is a convergence problem? does it effect watching blurays -image quality-?
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post #515 of 740
12/7/12 at 4:05pm
My 9100W (6020) will arrive in a week time and now I'm concerned. eek.gif
Several reports of bad convergence, not able to be corrected with built-in panel alignment and replacement units have same issue. Bad luck?! Epidemic fault?!

Question: Is this only verified when ceiling mounting the pj?!
That may probably explain why it was not detected in expert reviews....

Advice on whether I should keep the Epson order is most welcome. Still on time to cancel and go for a HW50.

Cheers,
///Rui
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post #516 of 740
12/7/12 at 4:07pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by rufilo View Post

My 9100W (6020) will arrive in a week time and now I'm concerned. eek.gif
Several reports of bad convergence, not able to be corrected with built-in panel alignment and replacement units have same issue. Bad luck?! Epidemic fault?!
Question: Is this only verified when ceiling mounting the pj?!
That may probably explain why it was not detected in expert reviews....
Advice on whether I should keep the Epson order is most welcome. Still on time to cancel and go for a HW50.
Cheers,
///Rui
For my two units, the convergence was the same, regardless the mounting position, on shelf or under the celling, tried both positions.
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post #517 of 740
12/7/12 at 4:51pm
@mjugen - thanks for the clarification. Now I'm scared!

Looking forward to having more reports of 6020 units convergence and if possible some advice on if I should take the risk to keep the pj order (lots of €€€ at stake).
I would hate to have the feeling in the coming years .... I warned you!

Cheers,
///Rui
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post #518 of 740
12/7/12 at 5:35pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by mjugen View Post

For my two units, the convergence was the same, regardless the mounting position, on shelf or under the celling, tried both positions.

Im gonna try and box mount mine on an ironing board tonight and see if CA and convergance is any better?..if It is better...obviously would be a firmware bug or something. But why would they have the same bug that was fixed on 9000???....So my guess its not going to do ****. I emailed Epson to just get a refund, so hopefully hear back Monday.

Might just go the JVC.
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post #519 of 740
12/8/12 at 4:26am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ranger View Post

Yeah, I'd suggest you try the Panasonic 8000. Epson just can't get the convergence right.

I could be wrong, but don't Panasonic and Epson use the same optical block (manufactured by Epson). But currently there seems to be more reports of convergence issues with the Epsons - I wonder if its just down to less rigorous QC with this spec by Epson. I've got to admit I now do most of my assessments/adjustments from the viewing postion and can live with the less than perfect convergence of my TW9100 unit. But these days it seems all projectors have some sort of inherent issues that can lure you into a replacement cycle with increasing frustration as expectation is not met.
Edited by davestan - 12/8/12 at 4:38am
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post #520 of 740
12/8/12 at 4:46am
Could someone explain what the " Inverse 3D Glasses" function means in the User section of the menu. The manual seems a bit vague as to what the difference is in a viewing context. Should it be activated if the projector is ceiling mounted?
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post #521 of 740
12/8/12 at 5:03am
Not sure if this is useful for owners, but I reviewed the European version (Epson EH-TW9100).

I requested a second unit because of convergence issues. Both units had issues.

http://www.hdtvtest.co.uk/news/epson-eh-tw9100-201211242375.htm
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post #522 of 740
12/8/12 at 5:26am
Quote:
Originally Posted by lyris View Post

Not sure if this is useful for owners, but I reviewed the European version (Epson EH-TW9100).
I requested a second unit because of convergence issues. Both units had issues.
http://www.hdtvtest.co.uk/news/epson-eh-tw9100-201211242375.htm

Yup, I read that review...great review! smile.gif.

I got my 2nd unit and the convergence was the about the same as the first unit. Im just gonna push for a refund now as I cant be bothered playing lucky duck and it is not a suitable product for me.
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post #523 of 740
12/8/12 at 5:33am
sorry for my english but somebody please can tell me what is a convergence problem? does it effect watching blurays -image quality-?
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post #524 of 740
12/8/12 at 5:49am
@cemo62 - look at pictures posted in this thread. Good examples posted by buddhamus.
Basically it relates with color miss alignment. Seeing it is better than explaining...
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post #525 of 740
12/8/12 at 6:56am
Has someone noticed if convergence degradation increases by using lens shift or zoom?
I'll be ceiling mounting mine. No HShift, almost all Vshift , zoom almost at minimum, 106" screen.
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post #526 of 740
12/8/12 at 7:25am
Quote:
Originally Posted by rufilo View Post

Has someone noticed if convergence degradation increases by using lens shift or zoom?
I'll be ceiling mounting mine. No HShift, almost all Vshift , zoom almost at minimum, 106" screen.

I tried that....and it pretty much was the same. Bad Chromatic abberation and Misconvergance frown.gif. Epson has some really bad QA.
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post #527 of 740
12/8/12 at 7:36am
Quote:
Originally Posted by cemo62 View Post

sorry for my english but somebody please can tell me what is a convergence problem? does it effect watching blurays -image quality-?

Yes it can affect blurays. Due to the color not aligning properly, your PJ will not be as sharp if all 3 colors was converged or close to converged properly. You can also see some artifacts like I have seen "refer back to my pics"......on HTTYD there is a solid green line down the bottom of the screen between the picture and the black bars.....clearly visible from seating position!!!!.

No 3 panel PJ will ever have perfect convergence except DLP and thats because its a single chip....Epsons lack of QA have basically done nothing to rectify this problem.
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post #528 of 740
12/8/12 at 2:15pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by davestan View Post

I could be wrong, but don't Panasonic and Epson use the same optical block (manufactured by Epson). But currently there seems to be more reports of convergence issues with the Epsons - I wonder if its just down to less rigorous QC with this spec by Epson. I've got to admit I now do most of my assessments/adjustments from the viewing postion and can live with the less than perfect convergence of my TW9100 unit. But these days it seems all projectors have some sort of inherent issues that can lure you into a replacement cycle with increasing frustration as expectation is not met.

FWIW, the Panny 8000U I received had pretty good convergence, though for whatever reason the blue & red channels seem out of focus or 'bloom' in comparison to the green channel (also saw this on Epsons). Not the case with my Sony HW50. Here's a horizontal convergence test pattern on both the Panny & Sony:



Cheers.
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post #529 of 740
12/10/12 at 7:22am
So I'm picking up a 6020 this week and am wondering if I can get some recommendations on how far to set the projector from the screen. It's a 160" Vutec with the Brite white fabric (larger than I wanted but it was free). My room is blacked out. I have had one person tell me to mount the projector in the middle of the recommendations and another say to put it as close as possible, who is right?
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post #530 of 740
12/10/12 at 8:07am
Quote:
Originally Posted by ryno9999 View Post

So I'm picking up a 6020 this week and am wondering if I can get some recommendations on how far to set the projector from the screen. It's a 160" Vutec with the Brite white fabric (larger than I wanted but it was free). My room is blacked out. I have had one person tell me to mount the projector in the middle of the recommendations and another say to put it as close as possible, who is right?

If your plan is to ceiling mount the pj or shelf mount why not simply use a portable table or shelf rack and test the PQ distance out yourself with your particular screen to find the sweetspot. I have a 120" 1.3 gain screen using an old Sanyo Z5 shelf mounted with a 19ft. throw distance in a light controlled room and the Sanyo is probably not 1/2 as bright as the new Epson 5020 or 6020. When i do upgrade to the 5020 it will sit in the exact spot as the Sanyo 19ft. away and do just fine.

Regards & Good Luck, wink.gif
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post #531 of 740
12/10/12 at 9:15am
Quote:
Originally Posted by ryno9999 View Post

So I'm picking up a 6020 this week and am wondering if I can get some recommendations on how far to set the projector from the screen. It's a 160" Vutec with the Brite white fabric (larger than I wanted but it was free). My room is blacked out. I have had one person tell me to mount the projector in the middle of the recommendations and another say to put it as close as possible, who is right?

You lose some light output with more zoom (farther away from screen). Below I've pasted an excerpt from a review (http://www.projectorreviews.com/epson/home-cinema-5020/performance.php):

Quote:
Originally Posted by ProjectorReviews.com 
Efect of zoom on lumen output (Dynamic mode):

In all the talk above about lumens, remember that how you place your projector has a lot of impact on brightness. This Epson with its wide range zoom, loses brightness the further back you place it from your screen.

Effect of zoom on lumen output (Dynamic mode):

Zoom out: 2142
Mid-zoom: 1890
Zoom in: 1438

Put that projector as close to the screen as you can, and you've got over 2100 lumens to work with, but lose just over 10% by moving back to the mid-range of the zoom, and for those of you putting the projector on a shelf at the far end of the range, you get about 30 percent less. This is typical of projectors that have zoom lenses with tons of range (2:1 or greater).

This is why we do all our measurements except this one, with the projector at mid-zoom. I normally have most projectors set up near their mid-points when I'm watching them. If you are at the short end of the range, you've got a few more lumens - a little extra juice. If you are way back, my declarations of bright enough, are a touch optimistic. Have fun with all that.
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post #532 of 740
12/10/12 at 2:28pm
Just received today third TW9100W, test it at sellers dark room, and immediately the system menus where horrid, convergence was very bad, white font in menu have large green and purple "edge", just bad, was not even interested to test further. Canceled Epson and already ordered SONY HW50.
Edited by mjugen - 12/10/12 at 2:33pm
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post #533 of 740
12/10/12 at 2:39pm
After all of the glowing reviews on the 5020, I had decided that this was the projector I'd get when my construction was finished. Now all of these convergence comments have me worried. Should I be worried? I'll be using a 150 inch screen and sit about 17 feet back.
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post #534 of 740
12/10/12 at 5:04pm
I have a 8700ub is it worth getting the 5020 will I see an improvement on 2d?

Thanks
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post #535 of 740
12/10/12 at 6:28pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by JeffreyJonesBSME View Post

After all of the glowing reviews on the 5020, I had decided that this was the projector I'd get when my construction was finished. Now all of these convergence comments have me worried. Should I be worried? I'll be using a 150 inch screen and sit about 17 feet back.

I think you would be much better with the Sony HW50.
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post #536 of 740
12/10/12 at 6:29pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by JeffreyJonesBSME View Post

After all of the glowing reviews on the 5020, I had decided that this was the projector I'd get when my construction was finished. Now all of these convergence comments have me worried. Should I be worried? I'll be using a 150 inch screen and sit about 17 feet back.

Ditto confused.gif
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post #537 of 740
12/10/12 at 6:32pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by dylansongs View Post

I have a 8700ub is it worth getting the 5020 will I see an improvement on 2d?
Thanks

I have a 8500ub and I didn't see a huge improvement over my friend's 5020. The Sony HW50 on the other hand is a huge improvement. The dynamic contrast is excellent.
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post #538 of 740
12/10/12 at 10:31pm
Thanks for the feedback, I allready have the projector wired to be ceiling mounted at 20' back. In using Epsons specs I'm only about 2' back from the minimum distance. The bigger question at this point is every one having the convergence issue? Starting to second guess my projector choice.
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post #539 of 740
12/11/12 at 7:11am
Quote:
Originally Posted by ryno9999 View Post

Thanks for the feedback, I allready have the projector wired to be ceiling mounted at 20' back. In using Epsons specs I'm only about 2' back from the minimum distance. The bigger question at this point is every one having the convergence issue? Starting to second guess my projector choice.

IMHO, i bet you will be very satisfied with your choice and a 20` ft. throw distance in a relatively light controlled environment will work just fine with the Epson light cannon. The additional 1.5 K for the Sony is hard to justify without first testing the Epson out when most all projectors have flaws.
Sony VPL-HW50ES Projector: Cons

Lacks lens memory for the small slice of people who would prefer a 2.35:1 screen instead of the standard 16:9 screens
Others offer lamps with longer claimed life, so you have a higher cost of operation
I still don't like the Reset button where it is on the remote control
Could use a third HDMI input, could offer wireless HDMI... (and other wish list items)
And of course, this projector could be brighter - I'm thinking primarily for 3D, but also for non-theater placement
Lens shift controls a little stiff, not real smooth (picky, picky)
Sony need new, more comfortable, lighter weight 3D glasses. These just don't cut it anymore!

Keep us informed of your independent analysis.

Regards & Good Luck, wink.gif
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post #540 of 740
12/11/12 at 1:55pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Silverfox1 View Post

IMHO, i bet you will be very satisfied with your choice and a 20` ft. throw distance in a relatively light controlled environment will work just fine with the Epson light cannon. The additional 1.5 K for the Sony is hard to justify without first testing the Epson out when most all projectors have flaws.
Sony VPL-HW50ES Projector: Cons
Lacks lens memory for the small slice of people who would prefer a 2.35:1 screen instead of the standard 16:9 screens
Others offer lamps with longer claimed life, so you have a higher cost of operation
I still don't like the Reset button where it is on the remote control
Could use a third HDMI input, could offer wireless HDMI... (and other wish list items)
And of course, this projector could be brighter - I'm thinking primarily for 3D, but also for non-theater placement
Lens shift controls a little stiff, not real smooth (picky, picky)
Sony need new, more comfortable, lighter weight 3D glasses. These just don't cut it anymore!
Keep us informed of your independent analysis.
Regards & Good Luck, wink.gif

Others have recently told me to buy the Sony HW50 over the Epson 5020.

I would have put under your Cons that it seems to cost $1500 more than the 5020.
Unless others can persuade me otherwise, it appears I'll still be buying a 5020 or 6020. $1500 is more than I paid for my last projector.
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