Official OPPO BDP-103/BDP-105 Anticipation Thread - Page 70

You can buy IEC shielded power cables for a fraction of what 'audiophile' esoteric cables cost.

-- Ron

The question still remains: what source material can you play on that "older DVD player" that is 24/192? And if that source material exists, can't it also be played on the Oppo?

There's quite a bit of source material that is 24/192 and even more that is simply greater than 24/96. But the OPPO requires a TV to be in use to even use and it's just 'akward' trying to find your files on the OPPO so many have other devices or their computers to select material. Plus, there is material that is streamed so those absolutely can't be played directly on the OPPO. I wound up buying another media player so I could use my iphone to find/play music and whether is was smart or not I have been buying albums that were mastered and available at >24/96 and I'd like to be able to play them. I'm sure I'll wind up replacing my old OPPO with a 105 and I wish the 105 could replace my media player and external DAC but I don't think that's going to happen.

Hi,
can't wait to get the 105, are there any news when they will start shipping? Hopefully it comes to Europe at the same time as in the US:

I would like to use the 105 as a pre-amp, is this a reasonable approach? Since the pre-amp of the AVR is by-passed, the sound quality could be improved?

Or would a high end pre-amp between the AVR power section and the Oppo be better than feeding the Oppo analog outs directly into the power amp?

If a high end pre amp would be better, then:
Does a High end Pre-amp "improve" or does the Oppo "worsen" the analog signal before it is fed into the power amp.
Since I never had a high end pre-amp/power-amp combo, I was always curious what a good pre amp really is doing, since the volume can be modified with a variable analog out of the Oppo,

Regards
Thorix

You could also try a Eastern Electric Minimax Dac Plus if you like the sabre chip. It's around the same price as the Mytek and for reasons unknown sounds quite a bit better than the BDP-95 in my opinion. If you upgrade the opamps the gap widens further to a level that I thought near impossible for the price. I think it really depends on how much you want to spend and how much two channel listening you do.

Having said that, the BDP - 95 is no slouch at all and beat many so called highly rated dacs. It can also do many other things a 2 channel dac cannot do.

I think it also depends on the system you have as well. For example I have two systems, one a highly resolving 4 way active horn system and another more "normal" system. The sonic differences between dacs are much more noticeable on the 4 way active system.

Bear in mind Oppo has a 30 day return policy so you could try the BDP 105 and if you don't like the 2 channel sound return it and go the BDP 103 route and buy an external dac
Edited by djkiwi - 11/4/12 at 11:26am

Totally agree with the Blue Jeans cable recommendation. I use them for everything in our system (google for martin logan system 420). They are inexpensive, very well made, and attractive. Plus the company is a joy to work with.

Again agree, but if one feels they simply must "upgrade", the Neotech cords from Take Five Audio in Canada are a comparative bargain. You can see examples in the photos of our system.

I have no financial or other interest in either company, just a happy consumer.

Nope! Certainly not in the current firmware.

When the player is set to use either HDMI input, then the only audio/video it sees is what is coming in on that HDMI input. When set to use a Digital Audio Input (the USB DAC or the Optical/Coax inputs all found only on the 105), then the only audio it sees is the audio coming in on the selected input, and it sees no video input from anywhere.

When the player is set to operate as normal -- i.e., when Blu-ray Player is selected as "input" -- then the player does not see anything coming in on the HDMI Inputs (103/105) or the Digital Audio Inputs (105 only) inputs.

The only "multi-tasking" you can do is what is inherent in the media file playback portion of the Blu-ray Player. For example, you can set music playing from a media file and then also view a slide show of photo media files.
--Bob

Well said Neuromancer ...obviously the 105 has been a beta product for a while and design changes are expected as part of its maturing process. It also seems that the headphone amplifier was a late addition to the feature set, of which i am very glad. Had a screaming female neighbor recently yelling at me on a friday night(9pm) to turn down my music in my small 750sq.ft 1-bedroom apartment room. I guess having dual 1000W subs as part of a 5.2 audio system doesn't help either(I was having fun anyways).

 

Headphones will help me get along with my neighbors a little better. Since headphones are a new world to me, this is yet another purchase i'll have to deal with soon. I hear magneplanar and electrostatic types sound the best overall?

 

Do they sound better overall? It's a matter of taste.

 

I've been using the Sennheiser HD 650. I'm quite pleased with the sound.

all personal preference but the Oppo doesn't have an electrostatic amp in it so the electrostat phones wont even remotely work with it

Sorry, bat your explanations about SATA interface er either wrong or misleading.
eSATA (external SATA) is an interface which support hot swapping and is rated much higher for data transfer. eSATAp is the interface which support hot swapping too, and have power on it.

You can read this here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Serial_ATA

" both SATA and eSATA support hot-swapping by design. However, this feature requires proper support at the host, device (drive), and operating-system levels. In general, all SATA devices (drives) support hot-swapping (due to the requirements on the device-side), also most SATA host adapters support this command."

When an interface is named SATA then it have to have specifications as SATA and not as USB. I will do a research about the buses of the Oppo processor (if I will find infos on it) , but I seriously doubt that they who created/designed that processor used the same bus for both SATA and USB interfaces. This is a mess which no any chip producer will accept it... Else such compromise will be specified very clear in the chip datasheet or documentation.

About the corrections from Oppo on those mentioned statements in that my post, it was not necessary further comments and explanations. The explanations were also out earlier than your answer/post. I just pointed out as it were come out (corrected) from Oppo himself...
Edited by Coris - 11/4/12 at 11:50pm

 

I hear electrostats have the best midrange/treble but are weak in bass. The other types might have have the midrange/treble magic of the electrostats but have much stronger bass.

 

 

     Probably true IF the efficiency is too low which is typical of some or most electrostatic headphones. The Hifiman HE-6 is rated at about 83dB/mW efficiency which is low hence requires an amp.

 

 

   Wow, highly efficient at 91dB/mW and many superb top notch reviews. How do you like their deep bass response? Is it abundant or merely satisfactory? The $1K price gives me some pause though, but as they are planar magnetics with superb frequency response, the price should be warranted. Something new to drool after...

Edited by dmusoke - 11/5/12 at 2:09am

OK! Get it...

I am sure they will work with the BDP-105, but I suspect they are compressing the dynamics. Here is what Audeze have to say about choosing an amplifier on their own website.

The Oppo is only delivering barely a 10th of the minimum that Audeze recommend at the operating impedence. Even if Oppo have been "tight" with their specifications and its nearer double that, its still far away from providing the dynamic range that these headphones have.

Just on a side note, we are talking about magnetic planar headphones which have become increasingly popular in recent years as audiophile solutions. However I suspect the limited power output will have a similar impact on other more demanding headphones as well (normal speaker cone).

Electostatics are different again and require a completely different system to drive them. Right now the only major player in this field producing units is Stax and those headphones typically are bought with a companion amplifier of their own to drive them.
Edited by JonStatt - 11/5/12 at 5:01am

Jon:

 

The LCD2 is rated at 60ohms of which Oppo outputs a stated 91mW continous into that impedance. With an stated LCD2 efficiency of 91dB/mW, it means the maximum the Oppo would produce into the LCD2 is  [91mW + 10* log(91mW/1mW)] = 110.6dB which is plenty loud enough. and this isn't peak power but continuos power. The number is higher depending onthe headroom Oppo allows is TPA6120 headphone amplifier to have. This agrees well with Oppo's assertion to me that they've tested many headphone types and have yet to find those that cannot be driven to satisfactory levels.

 

Have you tried to listen to 110dB spl with normal speakers? If not, you will not do so for long to protect your hearing, let alone incur the wrath of your family and/or neighbors. This is simply way too loud and infact dangerous to your hearing mechanism for any prolonged amount of time.

 

I found this snippet on the net...

 

How loud is too loud?

Experts agree that continued exposure to noise above 85 dBA will cause hearing loss. To know if a sound is loud enough to damage your ears, it is important to know both the loudness level (dBA) and the length of exposure to the sound. In general, the louder the noise, the less time required before hearing loss will occur. According to the National Institute for Occupational Safety and Health (1998), the maximum exposure time at 85 dBA is 8 hours. At 100 dBA, the maximum exposure time is one minute and 29 seconds.

 

The following are decibel levels of common noise sources around us. These are typical levels – actual noise levels may vary depending on the particular item. Remember, noise levels above 85 dBA will harm hearing over time, anything above 140 dBA can cause damage to hearing after just one exposure.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited by dmusoke - 11/5/12 at 9:56am

Well, I know that I`ve been criticised Oppo quite much on different things about design and so on. So maybe is the time to let you know something else than critics... I just remembered that I`ve done an experiment almost a year ago on BDP95... It were not the Oppo`s original analogue design after the DAC chip, but before it it were unchanged. The DAC were clocked with an 128Mhz oscillator.

I`ve generated an 80Khz digital sound file. I`ve used Audition - Tone generator which (on my computer) it gave me the opportunity to generate a "sound" whit such frequency. At last it worked and I had an sinus signal 80Khz on that (mono) file. This were stated by the software itself, and I had to trust it. I put it that file on a USB stick and set it in into BDP 95 port. Played that file as usual WAV file. I was very surprised to see on the RCA output, on oscilloscope, that 80 Khz sinus signal... Not any distortion, just fine sinus measured 80Khz! The level it were approx. 60% of normal audio signal...
I still think that is quite amazing that the whole digital and analogue hardware (even the software) inside the player could pass such test.

More about this test is to be seen here: http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/digital-line-level/196474-ess9018-try-new-try-more-14.html

LCD-2's are not electrostatic headphones and the oppo cannot play electrostatic headphones.

Yes I hope you are right. I was simply quoting what Audeze suggest on their own website. I have to admit I was thinking if I would be listening continuously at 90dB with odd peaks up to 120dB. However the hearing damage concerns are dependent on continuous stimulus and not milli-second peaks. When I use my home cinema, it is normally set such that it peaks around 100dB at moments of "dramatic circumstance", but typically is somewhere around 75dB. I am actually also trying to understand the maths here, because Audeze are asserting to produce 120dB would require 1000 times the power to produce 90dB, hence the need for 1W. But you are suggesting 110.6dB from 91mW. On the face of it what you describe is more than sufficient and that Audeze themselves are misdirecting what you really need, which could hamper sales of their own headphones!

LCD-2's are Planer not electrostatic. Stax are Electrostatic and require a specific amp type....I would expect the 105 to work fine with Ortho or Planer HP's. BTW, I'll drop in another vote for the Sennheiser HD650's!

Have not seen any recommendations for the Audio-Technica ATH-AD900 headphones on this AVS thread. They are highly recommended by Stereophile. I have compared them to the Sennheiser HD600 (predecessor to the 650), and find Sennheiser more recessed by comparison. The AD900 have a powerful punch and I would think they will be adequately powered by the BDP-105.

Any views on performance / ability of the Oppo headphone amp to drive the Beyerdynamic headphones such as their new T90: http://north-america.beyerdynamic.com/shop/hah/headphones-and-headsets/at-home/music-pleasure/t-90.html or the HiFiMAN HE-500 http://hifiman.us/Products/?pid=102 ?

Brian:

 

For the HE-500, maximum continuous power from the Oppo would be 89dB + 10*log(137mW/1mW) =  110.4dB! actually more since the 137mW power rating from the Oppo is spec'd into 32  ohms and it doesn't include the dynamic headroom of the headphone amplifier. The 89db is the manufacturer's listed spec for sensitivity at 1mW into 38 ohms impedance.

 

The Beyerdynamic T90 is very efficient at 102dB for 1mW input into its 250 ohm impedance. So the maximum continuous spl from the Oppo would be approx 102 + 10*log(23m!/1mW) = 115.6dB or more! The 23mW power spec i've listed in the equation is for a 300 ohm load(as Oppo doesn't power spec a 250ohm load).

 

Either headphones should be plenty loud and dynamic enough as the Oppo can produce greater than 110dB continuous power outputs from them, assuming they can handle these spls w/o breaking up or distorting. If you account for the amplifier's dynamic headroom, the peak levels would even be greater.

Edited by dmusoke - 11/5/12 at 10:49am

Neuro ...Is OK to discuss headphone stuff in this thread since its part of the 105 feature set?

 

I also suggest a list be made up for HQ headphones that seem to work well with 105 once its released?

Edited by dmusoke - 11/5/12 at 10:32am

As Neuromancer has indicated, his Audeze LCD2 are driven to satisfactory levels by the 105...