The **OFFICIAL** DENON AVR-4520CI thread - Page 85

Originally Posted by DonH50 

That would annoy anyone using an external amp... I assume the adapter has a high-impedance input? If so using the R/L pre outputs should be fine. If it loads the outputs, the preamp outputs are not designed to drive headphones directly. Another issue is that using the preamp outputs probably does not disable the amplifiers so you will have to turn off the speakers, which might disable the preamp outputs (I donot know, depends on the switching in the AVR). It would probably be simplest to just use the adapter; you can get one that is just a small plastic or metal body with two RCAs on one side and a 1/4" TRS plug on the other.

Originally Posted by DonH50 

That would annoy anyone using an external amp... I assume the adapter has a high-impedance input? If so using the R/L pre outputs should be fine. If it loads the outputs, the preamp outputs are not designed to drive headphones directly. Another issue is that using the preamp outputs probably does not disable the amplifiers so you will have to turn off the speakers, which might disable the preamp outputs (I donot know, depends on the switching in the AVR). It would probably be simplest to just use the adapter; you can get one that is just a small plastic or metal body with two RCAs on one side and a 1/4" TRS plug on the other.

Originally Posted by batpig 

Yes, the "analog only" restriction applies to any of the analog outputs (excepting the pre-outs of course). Note of course that this does include network streams.

The only way to output digital audio to other zones is by activating the "All Zone Stereo" feature, which will broadcast the same stereo audio to ALL zones (including main zone) but does bypass the "analog only" restriction.

Originally Posted by SergeantYnot 

While the 1.5db volume difference means little in the scheme of things, where the 70wpc vs 110wpc debate will be huge will depend on how efficient (or inefficient) your speakers are.

That said, I do miss the days when the wpc figure was taken seriously by manufacturers. I remember the beefy 5803 tested out at 167wpc x 7 at 4 ohms, where it was rated at 170. Denon certainly put its money where its mouth is, even if the results were 2% off. The 4520 is supposedly rated at 150wpc x 9 channels. I will be very curious to read results of the actual output.

Originally Posted by Dreamliner 

I'm trying to decide if it's worth getting a XPA-3 to power the fronts with all channels being driven on the 4520. Though I've read there's no actual audible difference.

Originally Posted by SergeantYnot 

While the 1.5db volume difference means little in the scheme of things, where the 70wpc vs 110wpc debate will be huge will depend on how efficient (or inefficient) your speakers are.

That said, I do miss the days when the wpc figure was taken seriously by manufacturers. I remember the beefy 5803 tested out at 167wpc x 7 at 4 ohms, where it was rated at 170. Denon certainly put its money where its mouth is, even if the results were 2% off. The 4520 is supposedly rated at 150wpc x 9 channels. I will be very curious to read results of the actual output.

Originally Posted by nsaldanh 

This has happened to my unit once. I unplugged the unit for about two minutes and then it worked. I did not do any type of microprocessor or network reset.

I am also seeing another problem - for the last two days The Denon doesn't show up as an Airplay device. I have to unplug it and plug it back in for it to work. The Apple TV units show up just fine. Anyone else seeing this issue?

Edit: I do see the denon as an airplay device from a PC that is connected to the router using a cable. I can't see it from any wireless device though - iPhone, iPad, laptop wirelessly connected, etc.

Edit2: After searching on an Apple Forum I found this thread :

https://discussions.apple.com/thread/4087880?start=15&tstart=0

A user on that forum suggests enabling IGMP proxy on my router - I happen to have the same router that he has, and that worked. I can now see the Denon from my iPhone.

Odd thing though is that I have not made any changes to my router for a few months and I haven't touched the Denon either. I don't know what changed to cause this problem.

Originally Posted by Mark1000 

I had some irregular freezes too. At first I linked it to the last firmware upgrade. No response at all, not with the remote, not with the power button on the device itself. Only removing the power cable worked. I tried different things (and made some other adjustment too, so I am not completely sure it is only this), but since I turned off Network Always On, it never happened again. Maybe give it a try?

Originally Posted by avatar9 

Just got my new 4520, this is my second one, the first one got a little drop by the loading guy on the way out of my local Best Buy. After my other unit started having problems, I explained to the manager what happened and she ordered me a new one to exchange with mine when it came in. It was really surprisingly cool of them, plus they gave me $50 for my trouble which was nice too. I don't know if any one else has noticed but, it seems to me like Best Buy has gotten better than they used to be. I was really surprised this whole ordeal was relatively painless and easy (helps to have banana plugs).

Originally Posted by avatar9 

Just got my new 4520, this is my second one, the first one got a little drop by the loading guy on the way out of my local Best Buy. After my other unit started having problems, I explained to the manager what happened and she ordered me a new one to exchange with mine when it came in. It was really surprisingly cool of them, plus they gave me $50 for my trouble which was nice too. I don't know if any one else has noticed but, it seems to me like Best Buy has gotten better than they used to be. I was really surprised this whole ordeal was relatively painless and easy (helps to have banana plugs).

Originally Posted by bootman_head_fi 

This is good to hear and they should promote this fact.

When you drop $2K on something it is not crazy to want to "touch it" first.
It is something I miss from the old HiFi brick and mortar days.

Originally Posted by EVT 

BTW, I can't recall ever seeing any lab tests with 7 channels driven at 4 ohms - do you have a link? Such a resource would be quite useful especially if whoever did the test makes a regular practice of such tests with all AVRs reviewed.

Originally Posted by jdsmoothie 

Keep in mind that regardless of how many channels the AVR features, the marketed power rating generally only applies to 2CH and then @ 8-ohm. The 5803 was marketed as 170W @ 8-ohms, not 4-ohms, which means it more likely tested out at closer to 110W into 7CH @ 8-ohms.

Originally Posted by petetherock 



Thanks guys, just to report back.
After I switched off the Network Always On, the problem vanished...
Previously sometimes when I turned on the amp nothing happened and I had to do a power reset...

Hope this helps others. Cheers.

Originally Posted by riverphoenix123 

Can someone tell me if the Denon 4520 can handle the M&K 750THX speaker package (5.1) bearing in mind i like to crank it up and these speakers are 4 ohms.

Originally Posted by SergeantYnot 

From the specs they appear to require 200wpc into 4ohms. I would recommend external amplification that is rated to deliver that.

Originally Posted by avatar9 

Do you all setup your fronts as small speakers during Audyssey setup, I changed it after setup and lost my Audyssey settings. Is this normal for Audyssey to be so picky about little changes.

Originally Posted by rms8 




If one has a stand alone 3 channel amp which would be used for the LCR, can the 4520's internal LCR amps be reassigned to the Wide or Height channels so one can have a true 11.1 channel setup?

Thanks!

...true in the sense that the 4520 can provide an 11.1 sound field via DSX or DTS NeoX...

Originally Posted by JHAz 

The speakers' power handling is rated at 200 watts. That means they won't melt the voice coils at 200 watts. It's not a quantification of what they need in order to use the speakers. If you grasp the idea that a bigger power amp can drive speakers louder, then you know, whether you know you know it or not, that more power = louder and less power = less loud. If any of your content has any dynamics at all, even if you cranked things to the max all the time, you'd never use full power all the time. If you ever turn down, or simply never listen at make-my-ears-ring forever-levels, you actually use something like a watt or two for the vast majority of your listening pleasure with typically sensitive speakers in typical rooms. Dynamic peaks can of course call for much more (a 16 dB-above-average peak needs 40 times the power as the average sound level).

It's usually safe to assume that speakers are compressing by the time they reach half their rated power handling, which means that somewhere around 100 watts the speakers stop getting 1 dB ouder for each 1 dB hotter the signal gets. They're also probably, if still linear, somewhere around 105 to 110 dB at one meter at that level). Thus, reasonably safe to assume that if you don't want to compress the sound, 100 watts is the max power you can actually use with the speakers and have a chance of remaining linear.

I can't find a sensitivity spec on these speakers, so it's not easy to guess what it would take to drive them to reference levels. Others can chime in on whether the Denon's output at 4 ohms has been tested. My guess, based on past testing of higher-in-the-line Denon receivers (let alone the flagship like this) is that it will handle 4 ohm impedance just fine and unless these are very insensitive speakers, will not sufer audible distortion even at high levels with real multichannel content (versus steady state test signals . . .)

Originally Posted by JHAz 

It's usually safe to assume that speakers are compressing by the time they reach half their rated power handling, which means that somewhere around 100 watts the speakers stop getting 1 dB ouder for each 1 dB hotter the signal gets. They're also probably, if still linear, somewhere around 105 to 110 dB at one meter at that level). Thus, reasonably safe to assume that if you don't want to compress the sound, 100 watts is the max power you can actually use with the speakers and have a chance of remaining linear.

Originally Posted by 235 

The center channel can't be driven from an external amp? I will have 9 speakers (wides) and I have 7 channels of external amplification. Can I use 2 of the internal amps in the 4520 plus my 7 external channels? I would really prefer to have the external amps drive the LCR.

Originally Posted by 235 

The center channel can't be driven from an external amp? I will have 9 speakers (wides) and I have 7 channels of external amplification. Can I use 2 of the internal amps in the 4520 plus my 7 external channels? I would really prefer to have the external amps drive the LCR.