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The **OFFICIAL** DENON AVR-4520CI thread - Page 146

post #4351 of 7696
Quote:
Originally Posted by PepperOne View Post

I'm confused about the LED power light on the 4520. When I push the power button, the 4520 turns on and blinks red, then I hear a relay or two click and then the LED turns to a solid green. When I go to turn off the 4520, the unit will turn off and the red LED will be a solid red. Does this signify that the AVR is in stand by mode?

I remember a post by jdsmoothie that mentioned that a solid red LED in standby means that there are two possible items in the setup menu that are active. I don't remember what those two are.

Your help would be appreciated.

Gerry

Depends on whether the network is set to "Always On" or "Off in Standby" mode. If the former, then the power LED will remain red when the unit is in standby. If the latter, then the power LED is dark in standby.
post #4352 of 7696
Quote:
Originally Posted by SergeantYnot View Post

Just wanted to clarify, is the UPA-7 or UPA-700 being discussed? If the UPA-7, then that is actually rated at 125wpc (8ohm) and 185wpc (4ohm). If I remember correctly, that was the conservative rating as well as it is was higher than the stated results.

I have the UPA-700, which is rate at 80W/Channel into 8Ohms and 100W/Channel into 4 Ohms. The test reports they published actually showed it going to 109-111 per channel into 4 Ohms.
post #4353 of 7696
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by AustinJerry View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by PepperOne View Post

I'm confused about the LED power light on the 4520. When I push the power button, the 4520 turns on and blinks red, then I hear a relay or two click and then the LED turns to a solid green. When I go to turn off the 4520, the unit will turn off and the red LED will be a solid red. Does this signify that the AVR is in stand by mode?

I remember a post by jdsmoothie that mentioned that a solid red LED in standby means that there are two possible items in the setup menu that are active. I don't remember what those two are.

Your help would be appreciated.

Gerry

Depends on whether the network is set to "Always On" or "Off in Standby" mode. If the former, then the power LED will remain red when the unit is in standby. If the latter, then the power LED is dark in standby.

And HDMI CEC (HDMI Contol) is the other one.
post #4354 of 7696
And HDMI passthrough too I believe.
post #4355 of 7696
Quote:
Originally Posted by PepperOne View Post

I'm confused about the LED power light on the 4520. When I push the power button, the 4520 turns on and blinks red, then I hear a relay or two click and then the LED turns to a solid green. When I go to turn off the 4520, the unit will turn off and the red LED will be a solid red. Does this signify that the AVR is in stand by mode?

I remember a post by jdsmoothie that mentioned that a solid red LED in standby means that there are two possible items in the setup menu that are active. I don't remember what those two are.

Your help would be appreciated.

Gerry

Although there are two for the majority of the models, with the 4520 there are actually (4) reasons the "red" LED will display in Standby mode .....

post #4356 of 7696
Thank you, AustinJerry, batpig and SergeantYnot for the info on this. I guess I missed this part in the manual.

Regards,
Gerry
post #4357 of 7696
Quote:
Originally Posted by kertofer View Post

...Yes, I have the other sub (Vandersteen V2W) hooked up via the Sub 1 Out on the Denon.
OHH! Then consider this idea: Leave sub1 as it is and set all speakers that were Autosetup set to large, 40 or 60 to small/80Hz.

Take the sub 2 preout, connect it to a Y RCA connector and run it into 2 chs of the Emo. Run the output to the sub ins banana connectors using speaker wire. Adjust sub controls to reasonably match sub one SP, preferably using an SPL meter and using a test disc sub track with Audyssey off, but you could rough it by ear with the AVR int test tones. Rerun Audyssey.


***Pls check with VanD CS to make sure I'm not telling you something that will cause smoke and tears.*****
post #4358 of 7696
Holy crap SoundOfMind, I had not even thought of that! I will touch base with Vandy and see if that will work!
post #4359 of 7696
How much space is needed at the back of a 4520 for ac cord, hdmi connectors, speaker wire etc? My cabinet is 17.5 inches deeb but open at the front and side. Thanks.
post #4360 of 7696
Quote:
Originally Posted by robert555 View Post

How much space is needed at the back of a 4520 for ac cord, hdmi connectors, speaker wire etc? My cabinet is 17.5 inches deeb but open at the front and side. Thanks.

Of course, it depends on the type of cables you have. The 4520 is 15" deep, and when I push my unit back on the shelf, the cables will not allow the rear of the AVR closer than 4" from the back. So, in my case, the overall depth requirement is 19". The feet on the 4520 are approximately 1.5" back from the front, so I would estimate that your unit would need to extend 1.5" past the front of your shelf.

I am fortunate to have a 21" deep shelf.
post #4361 of 7696
I have mine on a shelf in a closet, but looking at the back of mine i would say that I have 3" that would be taken up by cables so AustinJerry's assessment of an additional 4" at the back will work fine unless you just have a ton of cables bundled up at the back.
post #4362 of 7696
The 4520 is 17-1/8"W x 7-5/8"H x 17-3/4"D.

Regards,
Gerry
post #4363 of 7696
Actually, per spec sheet depth is 16.66 inches.
post #4364 of 7696
Thread Starter 
Hmm, that doesn't agree with the detailed diagram in the manual:




It clearly specifies 422.7mm complete depth including the knobs and binding posts, which works out to 16.64 inches. If you allow the front knobs to hang off the front that deducts 18.5mm, leaving 15.9 inches of depth to the tips of the binding posts.
post #4365 of 7696
feet should allow for some overhang in the front; may need to buy slim hdmi cables & use 16 gauge speaker wire
post #4366 of 7696
Can you leave the back off, or modify it?
post #4367 of 7696
Thread Starter 
I think the gauge of the speaker wire will be less important than the depth the banana plugs (if used). Even 14awg wire shouldn't have much problem bending in a tight space. 12awg might be a problem though, that stuff gets pretty thick.

I think as long as he's willing to let the front overhang an inch or so he'll be fine.
post #4368 of 7696

I was measuring front of the case to the back of the case, which is 15".  This does not include the knobs on the front.  The 4" clearance I have in back is just enough clearance for binding posts, speaker banana plugs, power cord, and some BlueJeans audio cables, which have hefty (deep) connectors.

 

I use 10-gauge speaker wire, but those connections are on the XPA-3, which sticks out even further than the 4520.

post #4369 of 7696
Here's my dilemma. Room size is 20x15 but is open to kitchen area for a total size of 20x26. I want to spend about $2000. What is best among these choices.

1. denon 4520 for all 5.1 speakers. Powered sub.

2. denon x4000. If I find I need more power add 3 outlaw mono 2200 amps at 200 watt each for lcr. Denon x4000 for surround.

3. denonX4000. With 2 outlaw mono 2200 amps at 200 watts for lr. Use denon x4400 for center and surround.

4 denon x4000. With outlaw 7125 7 channel amp at 125 watts per channel. Use denon x4000 as preamp.

Love to hear your comments as everyone seems pretty knowledgeable.
post #4370 of 7696
Robert, any of those would be very workable solutions. Not knowing what kind of speakers and what impedance they are limits how good of an opinion you will get here because it is hard to gauge how power hungry your speakers are. The Monoblock amps are awesome, but do you really need that much power per channel?
post #4371 of 7696
The lr speakers are Von Schweikert vr-22 {8 omn} 90 sensitivity. The center and surrounds Von Schweikert lcr-2 at 8 omn.
post #4372 of 7696
Quote:
Originally Posted by robert555 View Post

Here's my dilemma. Room size is 20x15 but is open to kitchen area for a total size of 20x26. I want to spend about $2000. What is best among these choices.
1. denon 4520 for all 5.1 speakers. Powered sub.
2. denon x4000. If I find I need more power add 3 outlaw mono 2200 amps at 200 watt each for lcr. Denon x4000 for surround.
3. denonX4000. With 2 outlaw mono 2200 amps at 200 watts for lr. Use denon x4400 for center and surround.
4 denon x4000. With outlaw 7125 7 channel amp at 125 watts per channel. Use denon x4000 as preamp...

1a Either AVR is an exc choice for 5.1, just compare feature to feature and price diff. and make a choice. Call AVS to get a great discount from an authorized dealer.

1b Absolutely (and especially with those speakers) I recommend you use a good powered sub or two!

2. If you follow 1b, I doubt you'll need any ext amp of any sort (but can be added later)
3. If you follow 1b, I doubt you'll need any ext amp of any sort (but can be added later)
4. There is no significant advantage to preamp mode
post #4373 of 7696
^^
SOM or whomever,
What does the 4520 have that the X4000 doesn't, other than a couple more amps and bit more wattage per channel?

From a description on the Denon website, for people with conventional uses for an AVR that want XT32 + Sub HT (i.e. AVR as A/V switcher, VP with 3D passthrough & 4K upscaling, a 5.1 or 5.2 setup, and the usual Denon goodies), the differences appear subtle.

Not in the market with my 4311, just curious.
post #4374 of 7696
Thread Starter 
I compare the two in the FAQ at the beginning of the E/X Series owner's thread: http://www.avsforum.com/t/1465528/the-official-2013-denon-e-series-x-series-avr-model-owners-thread-faq

Quote:
Wow, the X4000 sounds amazing! Is there any reason to fork over the extra coin for the 4520CI now??

While the X4000 appears to be a "baby 4520" with most of the important features, there are still some things the 4520 has that may entice people to step up to the flagship model:

1. The 4520 is larger and heavier, with a superior amp section rated to drive 4-ohm speakers.
2. The 4520 has better build quality; it's built in Japan (not China) and has higher quality speaker binding posts for example
3. The 4520 has 9 amps built in, and can expand to 11 channels (instead of 7/9 on the X4000)
4. The 4520 has 4 zones instead of 3; the HDMI Zone output is dedicated to Zone 4, leaving Zones 2/3 independent. On the X4000, the HDMI Zone output shares Zone 2.
5. The 4520 can output component video to Zones 2 and 3, meaning it's possible to distribute HD video to all 4 zones.
6. The 4520 has full 32-bit processing architecture, including 32-bit DAC's and AL32 processing (vs. the 24-bit analogues on the X4000).
7. The 4520 has more legacy (analog) input/output connectivity, including 7.1 multichannel analog inputs, and an extra component video input and output.
8. The 4520 has a built-in 4-port ethernet hub
9. The 4520 has an incredibly flexible Amp Assign configuration, including a "Custom" free assign mode which allows any reassignment of 6 out of the 9 amps. The X4000 has the standard Amp Assign template where only 2 out of the 7 amps are reassignable according to predetermined options.

That said, for most users, the X4000 will be a smarter choice and is really an amazing value, especially considering the critical additions of XT32/SubEQ calibration and the digital multizone options.


IMO, Robert should go for the X4000 and spend the savings on subwoofers, speakers, room treatments, etc. And then worry about an external amp later on if he decides he needs one. For only a straightforward 5ch setup I don't see much reason to get the 4520, and I doubt he will lack for power given his room size and speaker specs.
post #4375 of 7696
^bp, does the X4000 have Audyssey Pro capable, custom installer, DenonLinkHD?
post #4376 of 7696
Quote:
Originally Posted by sdrucker View Post

^^
SOM or whomever,
What does the 4520 have that the X4000 doesn't, other than a couple more amps and bit more wattage per channel?

From a description on the Denon website, for people with conventional uses for an AVR that want XT32 + Sub HT (i.e. AVR as A/V switcher, VP with 3D passthrough & 4K upscaling, a 5.1 or 5.2 setup, and the usual Denon goodies), the differences appear subtle.

Not in the market with my 4311, just curious.

You are right, the differences are subtle. The 4520 has improved Burr Brown 32bit DACs over the 4311, which most will argue are not discernible and make no difference (these are typically the non-owners though). I might agree that for home theater, the differences are probably negligible. However, I will mention that my old Pioneer had 24bit Wolfson DACs, and I do not miss them one bit for stereo music that I am familiar with.

More importantly is the 4520 is the only receiver/processor (other than its brother Marantz 8801) to have the newer Audyssey feature LFC; never tested it so I have no idea if it is beneficial or not. Also, this is the only Denon to have DTS NEO:X. In my opinion, this is a BIG deal if you plan to do 11.2. I have tried Audyssey DSX as well, which is more commonly found on receivers that do 11.2, and have found DSX colors the audio track too much, especially in lower frequencies. There are a few movies out that have a native DTS NEO:X formatting (Expendables 2 comes to mind), so we are starting to see actual content for that sound codec, whereas DSX is still just matrixing.

With that said, if you are doing just 5.1, you will not benefit at all from just about all of the features listed above.
post #4377 of 7696
Thread Starter 
The X4000 has LFC as Neo:X as well. Although only goes up to 9 channels, not 11.

@ SoM -- the X4000 (like the 3313 it replaces) has DenonLinkHD and is Pro capable as well.
post #4378 of 7696
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill Mac View Post

I just posted the below in the Emotiva XPA-5 owners thread. I thought I would also post this here in the 4520 owners thread. Any thoughts from 4520 owners on whether there is a need for external amps and if one was added were there SQ improvements as mentioned in the post below?

Below is a link to a thread over at the Emotiva Lounge. The thread is discussing the addition of an XPA-5 to a Denon 4520. The interesting part of the discussion are the thoughts that with the addition of the XPA-5 that overall SQ is improved. In that certain aspects of music have better clarity and that the soundstage is improved. It has been a very civil and respectful exchange of differing opinions. My main question is that if the volume levels are matched between using the 4520's amp section and then with the addition of the XPA-5 how does the SQ improve with just the addition of the XPA-5. Also how can one really do an accurate comparison when it takes a fair amount of time to add the XPA-5 or remove it for the comparison. I also asked if these differences happened at low to moderate volume levels and several in the discussion said that they heard SQ improvement at these volume levels as well.

So I would like to ask those in this thread what could the XPA-5 be doing to the signal to improve SQ in both clarity of specific instruments and improve the soundstage? I'm under the assumption that an amp like the XPA-5 should be transparent and not add anything to the signal or alter the SQ of the music one is listening to. But maybe I'm wrong in that assumption. With that I would like to know what in fact an external amp such as the XPA-5 could be doing to improve upon the SQ of the amp section of the 4520. I also would have to believe that the amp section in the 4520 is quite good and not lacking unless driven really hard with challenging speakers. So any thoughts on this discussion would be appreciated smile.gif.


http://emotivalounge.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=amps&action=display&thread=30377
In theory an amp shouldn't add or take away anything from the signal it is amplifing. One amp may boost certain frequencies or cut others due to manufacturing tolerances and quality of parts used. No an amp should be as transparent as possible but in the real world two identical amps from the same manufacturer could sound different. An amp should be amplify no more no less
Edited by ray587 - 5/10/13 at 3:07pm
post #4379 of 7696
Quote:
Originally Posted by ray587 View Post

In theory an amp shouldn't add or take away anything from the signal it is amplifing. One amp may boost certain frequencies or cut others due to manufacturing tolerances and quality of parts used. No an amp should be as transparent as possible but in the real world two identical amps from the same manufacturer could sound different. An amp should be amplify no more no less

Agree, I also think if the extra 100W or so is not needed, those XPA-3 or 5 they talked about won't do much better if at all. Sure they are heavy, but if you look at their specs carefully they aren't that much more powerful. The 4520 should be fine for a lot of people without external amps.
post #4380 of 7696
I added an XPA 3 mainly to allow me to use an 11 channel system and have three channels driven by the same amp.
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