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post #6091 of 7686
Based on my experiments last night, Doug, I can control the HDMI input on the display with the Harmony easily. But I can't control the Monitor Out setting on the AVR. Here is an example of the connections I am trying to establish:

Blu-ray ---> AVR Monitor2 (up-scale to 4K) ---> Display HDMI2

DirecTV DVR ---> AVR Monitor1 (no up-scaling) ---> Darblet ---> Display HDMI1
post #6092 of 7686
Quote:
Originally Posted by AustinJerry View Post

Based on my experiments last night, Doug, I can control the HDMI input on the display with the Harmony easily. But I can't control the Monitor Out setting on the AVR. Here is an example of the connections I am trying to establish:

Blu-ray ---> AVR Monitor2 (up-scale to 4K) ---> Display HDMI2

DirecTV DVR ---> AVR Monitor1 (no up-scaling) ---> Darblet ---> Display HDMI1

 

Jerry, it seems from batpigworld's excellent info on such things that it is possible to use a discrete Harmony code for the monitor1 and 2 options.

 

You could instruct the Harmony to switch to either monitor setting by creating two new Activities (Upscale and No Upscale) using the various HDMI ports etc as required.

 

Info on the discrete codes is here:

 

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/34124823/AVR4520_IR_CODE_V01.pdf

 

It is a huge document so you will need to do a browser 'page search' command for 'monitor' to locate what you need. You will then need to contact Logitech and ask them to add the discrete codes to your account. Once they have done this you can log in, make the changes and then update the remote.

 

While you are asking Logitech to add these codes, it may be worthwhile to look through batpig's document to see if there are any others you might want to add. Discrete codes, for example, to enable DSX or PLIIz or whatever....

post #6093 of 7686
Jerry,
I understand that you don't have the discrete code for changing from Monitor 1 to Monitor 2 but I must be missing something. It still seems to me that all you'd need to do is change the input on your display from HDMI 1 to HDMI 2 and associate those inputs with your corresponding activity? I don't use Monitor 2 on my AVR so I'm assuming that the AVR senses which source to output if you have a certain input selected on your display. If that's not the case you're back to trying to find the discrete code for the Monitor outputs.
When I get home I'll see if I kept records of where I've found the discrete codes that I've needed. If memory serves, I think I might have called Logitech and they put the codes in for me but I'll check when I get back.
post #6094 of 7686
I've recently purchased the Denon AVR-4520ci and have a quick question about the standby/power. Is this unit supposed to turn off completely when you press the power button on the remote or front panel? When I press either button, the display toggles between main zone on and main zone off.

I'm sorry if this has been answered before. I couldn't find anything in my searches. This unit replaces my Denon 5803 from long dragging my feet to avoid upgrading. Thanks for any help.
post #6095 of 7686
Quote:
Originally Posted by kbarnes701 View Post
 

 

Jerry, it seems from batpigworld's excellent info on such things that it is possible to use a discrete Harmony code for the monitor1 and 2 options.

 

You could instruct the Harmony to switch to either monitor setting by creating two new Activities (Upscale and No Upscale) using the various HDMI ports etc as required.

 

Info on the discrete codes is here:

 

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/34124823/AVR4520_IR_CODE_V01.pdf

 

It is a huge document so you will need to do a browser 'page search' command for 'monitor' to locate what you need. You will then need to contact Logitech and ask them to add the discrete codes to your account. Once they have done this you can log in, make the changes and then update the remote.

 

While you are asking Logitech to add these codes, it may be worthwhile to look through batpig's document to see if there are any others you might want to add. Discrete codes, for example, to enable DSX or PLIIz or whatever....

 

Thanks, Keith, I'll take a look at this and report back.

post #6096 of 7686
Quote:
Originally Posted by kbarnes701 View Post

You could instruct the Harmony to switch to either monitor setting by creating two new Activities (Upscale and No Upscale) using the various HDMI ports etc as required.

Hi kbarnes, +1, as the i/p scaler settings is per input (unless 4520ci is different then other Denon model).
post #6097 of 7686
Quote:
Originally Posted by DougReim View Post

Jerry,
I understand that you don't have the discrete code for changing from Monitor 1 to Monitor 2 but I must be missing something. It still seems to me that all you'd need to do is change the input on your display from HDMI 1 to HDMI 2 and associate those inputs with your corresponding activity? I don't use Monitor 2 on my AVR so I'm assuming that the AVR senses which source to output if you have a certain input selected on your display. If that's not the case you're back to trying to find the discrete code for the Monitor outputs.
When I get home I'll see if I kept records of where I've found the discrete codes that I've needed. If memory serves, I think I might have called Logitech and they put the codes in for me but I'll check when I get back.

 

If, for example, I have things configured so the AVR is outputting on Monitor2 and the display is receiving on its HDMI2, and I key in the activity "Watch DirecTV DVR", the TV switches to HDMI1, but the AVR stays on Monitor2, resulting in a "No Signal" message from the TV.  So, what I am saying is that if you don't set the AVR Monitor Out setting to "Auto", the AVR only outputs to one monitor connection or the other.  Am I making any sense?  What I haven't tested yet is the behavior of the connection if I leave the AVR setting on "Auto", which I will do later today.

post #6098 of 7686
If you have the display configured to switch to HDMI 2 in the activity it should switch to HDMI 2, no?
post #6099 of 7686
Quote:
Originally Posted by DougReim View Post

If you have the display configured to switch to HDMI 2 in the activity it should switch to HDMI 2, no?

It is the Denon that doesn't switch.
post #6100 of 7686
Here's a link to the 4520's codes:::http://www.audioproducts.com.au/downloadcenter/products/Denon/AVR4520BK/Manuals/AVR4520_IR_CODE_V01.pdf
About half way down it has Monitor select codes, maybe that will help.
Jerry, I'm still not getting why the "One" won't change inputs on either the AVR or the display. That's one it's most basic functions. I must be missing something but hopefully the codes above will help.
post #6101 of 7686
Thread Starter 
I'm confused Jerry. Perhaps I'm misunderstanding. But... Why are you NOT using the Auto feature on the Denon, when what you want is for it to switch automatically?
post #6102 of 7686

For the display, Harmony asks the question, "What input does the TV be on?".  For the AVR, it asks "What device needs to be playing?".  Harmony never asks the question, "What display output does the AVR need to be on?".  At least not that I am aware of.  Give me a chance to dig deeper later today.

post #6103 of 7686
Thread Starter 
The Harmony will never ask that, it requires customization on your end. You need to add the discrete Monitor 1/2 commands to the database and then add them to a given Activity at the end of the power/input process.

But again, I'm confused as to why you are NOT using AUTO. What you want is automatic switching based upon which HDMI input on the TV you are using. That's what the AUTO setting does.

There is no way to "assign" Monitor 1/2 out to a given input on the Denon, those HDMI settings are global. So if you don't use the AUTO setting, or use the discrete commands from the Harmony, it will always stay on the output you have selected until you manually switch the "Video Output" setting.
post #6104 of 7686
Yea I bought the X4000 and pulled the front flap down and noticed the USB dongle was a tad misaligned with the front plate. It worked fine and I could plug in my ipod but.....naturally this has me wondering about quality control and other potential issues in the receiver that could pop up

Since the 4520 is Made in Japan, does this mean quality control is well better? If so...It might consider getting that depsite the extra $1000 price different because it would help me feel more at ease and not worry if you know what i mean
post #6105 of 7686
Hopefully Japan is better........but who knows. I am 50 and have started to think that some issues can be due to a younger generation of workers (or just maybe the quality of the worker).......and how they feel about the need to do it right......do a good job......pride in their work. This would also carry over to whoever is responsible for quality control and what they actually do??

Also, the quality of the parts are important......to the user, but, maybe not to the supplier......selling to the receiver manutacturer (cheaper = more profit).

I recently bought a Paradigm speaker with the gloss black real wood finish and even though it was Made in Canada......it came scratched and scuffed........all kinds of marks on it..........and it was brand new and factory sealed.

I would be pissed off if I was you......can you change it for a replacement? It would make me uncomfortable for sure....wondering about how the thing was built...........in fact I don't think there is one receiver co that I trust right now.......man it is sad.

I still prefer Made in Japan or North America but it does not mean what it used to!!
post #6106 of 7686
Quote:
Originally Posted by JKR1963 View Post

Hopefully Japan is better........but who knows. I am 50 and have started to think that some issues can be due to a younger generation of workers (or just maybe the quality of the worker).......and how they feel about the need to do it right......do a good job......pride in their work. This would also carry over to whoever is responsible for quality control and what they actually do??

Also, the quality of the parts are important......to the user, but, maybe not to the supplier......selling to the receiver manutacturer (cheaper = more profit).

I recently bought a Paradigm speaker with the gloss black real wood finish and even though it was Made in Canada......it came scratched and scuffed........all kinds of marks on it..........and it was brand new and factory sealed.

I would be pissed off if I was you......can you change it for a replacement? It would make me uncomfortable for sure....wondering about how the thing was built...........in fact I don't think there is one receiver co that I trust right now.......man it is sad.

I still prefer Made in Japan or North America but it does not mean what it used to!!

I hear ya, I maybe half your age but I still agree with the older generation wanting to do their job the right way. Could it be pride? Could it be their mentality? I dont know, but stuff made 20-30 years ago was unbreakable. I remember when I was really young, like 6 or 7 ,my dad bought a Panasonic VCR player. It had a top loading catridge that sprang up. Really cool. Anyways, though the rewind mechanism stopped working, the player itself worked for atleast 10-12 years. It was built like a tank. On the other hand, when dvd players first came out circa 1999-2000, our $300 jvc dvd player worked for a couple of years barely got past the 10 year mark. Must;ve been atleast 8 years or so. Soo sad.

Hopefully Made in Japan means Made to Last a lifetime or its a sad time for consumer electronics
post #6107 of 7686
Thread Starter 
This is straying way off topic, but I would suspect the root cause is much more top down (corporate leadership cutting corners to increase margin) than bottom up (workers not having pride like they used to). I find it kinda hard to blame a Chinese laborer working in poor conditions with minimal pay and benefits for not "taking pride" in soldering a transistor to a circuit board as well as a more well-payed US worker with union protected benefits and pension from a generation or two ago.
post #6108 of 7686
Quote:
Originally Posted by crutch85 View Post

I've recently purchased the Denon AVR-4520ci and have a quick question about the standby/power. Is this unit supposed to turn off completely when you press the power button on the remote or front panel? When I press either button, the display toggles between main zone on and main zone off.

I'm sorry if this has been answered before. I couldn't find anything in my searches. This unit replaces my Denon 5803 from long dragging my feet to avoid upgrading. Thanks for any help.
This has been covered before but what you need are discrete codes for your remote that just turn on and off the main zone and not all zones on and off. You can do this by learning the codes directly to your remote or if you have a Logitech Harmony remote I think you can get the discrete codes if you don't want to learn them in.
post #6109 of 7686
Does anyone know how many volts the sub output will do? I am wondering if it will overload a minidsp.
tia,
Ron
post #6110 of 7686
Quote:
Originally Posted by ellisr63 View Post

Does anyone know how many volts the sub output will do? I am wondering if it will overload a minidsp.
tia,
Ron

Sub outputs on most if not all AVRs are adjustable by means of internal menus. Some are rated to produce up to 4 volts. I recommend becoming familiar with these adjustments! ;-)

Seems like some people posting in this thread need to discover the existence of User Manuals... Wonderful things, they are!
post #6111 of 7686
Quote:
Originally Posted by arnyk View Post

Sub outputs on most if not all AVRs are adjustable by means of internal menus. Some are rated to produce up to 4 volts. I recommend becoming familiar with these adjustments! ;-)

Seems like some people posting in this thread need to discover the existence of User Manuals... Wonderful things, they are!
The reason I was asking is apparently there is a problem with the minidsp and some receiver amp combinations... Some amps are overloading the DSP into clipping before the sub amp reaches its max power. I scoured the internet last night looking for the sub out voltage specs but was unable to find the info. I understand that they are adjustable via internal inputs but nowhere can I find out what the volts output is for the sub outputs. As an example someone had a Pioneer avr that would drive the minidsp into clipping before the sub amp was anywhere near max power.


Here is why I am asking...
http://www.avsforum.com/t/1497765/mini-dsp-input-voltage-and-its-limitations


Is anyone else running the minidsp with their denon 4520?


tia,
Ron
Edited by ellisr63 - 11/3/13 at 2:54pm
post #6112 of 7686
I have a question for anyone on the forum on recommendations for adding 2 new Front speakers.
I have currently added a second subwoofer to my existing 5.1 system , so now 5.2 and have been really impressed by the improvement in the quality of the bass sound and extra clarity in the whole movie experience and music.

I have 2 new speakers to add to the "Front" and was wondering on what is the preferred/recommended option when going to a 7.2 configuration, adding Front Heights or Front Wides?

Any guidance will be greatly appreciated.

Phil
post #6113 of 7686
Phil what speakers do you have now?
post #6114 of 7686
Quote:
Originally Posted by batpig View Post

If you are concerned about clipping the input stage, then you could just turn up the gain on the sub a bit so the channel level gets set to a negative value. For example, if you end up with a -6dB subwoofer trim, it's unlikely the output voltage will come anywhere close to clipping the input stage of the minidsp, even at extremely loud volumes.
Will it still allow max output of the sub or will it be limited if you do this? I will be using the PSA Triax and I am worried about the minidsp being able to do the job with my setup.

tia,
Ron
post #6115 of 7686
Quote:
Originally Posted by pmcduie View Post

...I have 2 new speakers to add to the "Front" and was wondering on what is the preferred/recommended option when going to a 7.2 configuration, adding Front Heights or Front Wides?

Audyssey recommends wides before heights.  Remember the angles off the centerline (drawn from MLP to the CC) are what's important= 60 degrees+/-10.   I like wides for film, they push the walls back while enhancing the surroun run Autosetup and try them outd bubble.  I never tried heights but if you were so inclined, you could do a temp setup of heights, run Autosetup and give a listen.  Then change them to wides position, run Autosetup and give that a listen. 

700

post #6116 of 7686
Quote:
Originally Posted by SanchoPanza View Post

Phil what speakers do you have now?

I have the following speakers:

Front L/R - VAF i33 Signature Floostander
Centre - B&W HTM62
Surround L/R - B&W M1 (Satellites)

Subwoofer #1 - REL T1
Subwoofer #2 - VAF MPB SW2

The 2 new speakers for use in either Front Height or Wide are - VAF i49 Signature

Note : I will eventually be replacing the B&W speakers with VAF replacements.
post #6117 of 7686
Quote:
Originally Posted by SoundofMind View Post

Audyssey recommends wides before heights.  Remember the angles off the centerline (drawn from MLP to the CC) are what's important= 60 degrees+/-10.   I like wides for film, they push the walls back while enhancing the surroun run Autosetup and try them outd bubble.  I never tried heights but if you were so inclined, you could do a temp setup of heights, run Autosetup and give a listen.  Then change them to wides position, run Autosetup and give that a listen. 
700
Thanks for the response, not sure I can easily try both options, I have concrete walls and adding the speakers to both front and wide as a test is not viable. I expect to commit to one or the other and then attach them to the walls and rerun Audyssey on my 4520.
I understand the 60 degree recommendation, but it is not clear to me about the height of the wide speakers ( relative to the Fronts). The existing fronts are 1100 mm high ( 3 ft 7" imperial). Any recommendations appreciated. Also should they be angled towards the MLP?
Is there a "published" reference by Audyssey on this, that can be downloaded?

Phil
post #6118 of 7686
Quote:
Originally Posted by pmcduie View Post

Thanks for the response, not sure I can easily try both options, I have concrete walls and adding the speakers to both front and wide as a test is not viable. I expect to commit to one or the other and then attach them to the walls and rerun Audyssey on my 4520.
I understand the 60 degree recommendation, but it is not clear to me about the height of the wide speakers ( relative to the Fronts). The existing fronts are 1100 mm high ( 3 ft 7" imperial). Any recommendations appreciated. Also should they be angled towards the MLP?
Is there a "published" reference by Audyssey on this, that can be downloaded?

Phil
You could get some 2x4s and make your self a temporary shelf for the heights or even a couple of ladders might work... Neither of which would require making any holes for testing.
post #6119 of 7686
Quote:
Originally Posted by pmcduie View Post

Thanks for the response, not sure I can easily try both options, I have concrete walls and adding the speakers to both front and wide as a test is not viable. I expect to commit to one or the other and then attach them to the walls and rerun Audyssey on my 4520.
I understand the 60 degree recommendation, but it is not clear to me about the height of the wide speakers ( relative to the Fronts). The existing fronts are 1100 mm high ( 3 ft 7" imperial). Any recommendations appreciated. Also should they be angled towards the MLP?
Is there a "published" reference by Audyssey on this, that can be downloaded?

Phil

The diagram that SoundofMind provided states that Height speakers should be at a 45 degree elevation. In my room, that places the Heights about 9" below my 10' ceiling. They are mounted approximately halfway between the Wides and the Mains (my mains are at approximately 27 degrees, and the Wides are at 55 degrees, so the Heights are probably at 40 degrees).
post #6120 of 7686
Quote:
Originally Posted by pmcduie View Post

Thanks for the response, not sure I can easily try both options, I have concrete walls and adding the speakers to both front and wide as a test is not viable. I expect to commit to one or the other and then attach them to the walls and rerun Audyssey on my 4520.
I understand the 60 degree recommendation, but it is not clear to me about the height of the wide speakers ( relative to the Fronts). The existing fronts are 1100 mm high ( 3 ft 7" imperial). Any recommendations appreciated. Also should they be angled towards the MLP?
Is there a "published" reference by Audyssey on this, that can be downloaded?

Phil


Right, I meant putting your "heights" on a step ladder or some such very temporary rig.

The wides' tweeters should be about the same height as the FR/L and CC, IOW about seated ear height, and they should be aimed right at MLP.   

 

Not sure if there's a guide but here's the official website stuff:

http://www.audyssey.com/technologies/dsx

 with this link to more details:

http://www.audyssey.com/blog/practical-guide-audyssey-dsx

And here's some more practical info from Chris:

https://audyssey.zendesk.com/entries/81436-dsx-speaker-placement

 

And here's a kinda general guide-just scroll way down to the section on wides

http://www.build-home-theater-systems.com/home-theater-speaker-placement.html

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