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Stereo Integrity's new HT Subwoofer - Page 61

post #1801 of 2212
The Crown XTis are not good for sub-sonic content as they have a non-defeatable HPF at about 20Hz so your current sub would probably go lower. The iNukes supposedly have a HPF at 10Hz so are quite a bit better for subs. If you are really after the deepest notes a pair of EP4000s (tested and proven) or a single CV-5000 (not measured, but popular and speced to have a HPF at 5Hz) might be two good options.

My 2c

Gear mentioned in this thread:

post #1802 of 2212
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hyrlyfrm View Post

I'm hoping to have enough scholarship money left over this fall to build a pair of DO SI 18's this fall. I'm going to have to do a bit of research on how to design and build some decent cubes for the job. I could use a bit of advice on what kind of internal volume I should be shooting for.

I don't need a lot of power in my very small 1700cu ft apartment, but I want to be able to go very low without clipping or excursion issues. I've been thinking about the iNuke series for one. My first idea was to run 1500 per cab at 2 ohms each with the inuke 3000dsp. The other amp I was looking at is the crown xti 4002, running 1600 per cab. Do any of you guys think the crown is worth the extra coin? And do you think that either option would provide sufficient power to hit reference levels at 10Hz, or better yet 5Hz? And if those power levels would be sufficient, could it be done with say 26" cubes?

I do get pretty some decent room gain that helps my SB13-Ultra hit about 97dbs at 10Hz so I'm hoping that a pair of DO's would get me where I want to be, for now. Any advice is appreciated and if nothing else this will bump this thread. I at least have to do that knowing how long it took me to read the entire thing.

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Avgass View Post

The Crown XTis are not good for sub-sonic content as they have a non-defeatable HPF at about 20Hz so your current sub would probably go lower. The iNukes supposedly have a HPF at 10Hz so are quite a bit better for subs. If you are really after the deepest notes a pair of EP4000s (tested and proven) or a single CV-5000 (not measured, but popular and speced to have a HPF at 5Hz) might be two good options.

My 2c

 

 

I wonder if this a bit too much amp for (2) drivers?

 

I am planning to use (2) for EP4000 for (4) drivers (@ 4 Ohm), but I am a still a noobie when it comes to DIY subs, so some guidance is greatly appreciated!

____

Axel

post #1803 of 2212
There needs to be a ported sub kit for these things!

DIY is great if you can cut the wood right but for a lot of us its not that easy. It's sort go with of sealed or purchase a pre-made sub.
post #1804 of 2212
Thanks Avgass. Axel, by pair of DO Si 18's I mean using 2 drivers per cabinet. That would get me 1000w per driver which, according to more learned folks in this thread, seems to be perfectly fine with 4cu ft internal volume per driver. I realize that the system wouldn't be drawing that much power very often, but I still wonder if it'll trip a breaker when it does.
post #1805 of 2212
My experience has been that two SI 18s can eat up just a little more than one EP4000 in bridged 4 ohm can dish out, but things are pretty close.

I ended up switching to one SI per channel of a clone FP10kQ (4 channels x 8 ohm), and that's a pretty darn good match. I think that's something like 1350 watts per channel, and if I want to upgrade, I can add more subs and wire for 4 ohm loads with close to the same output per sub. I tested two SI 18s wired for 4 ohms total on a single channel of the clone, and it still put plenty of hurt on them.
post #1806 of 2212
Quote:
Originally Posted by Avgass View Post

The Crown XTis are not good for sub-sonic content as they have a non-defeatable HPF at about 20Hz so your current sub would probably go lower. The iNukes supposedly have a HPF at 10Hz so are quite a bit better for subs. If you are really after the deepest notes a pair of EP4000s (tested and proven) or a single CV-5000 (not measured, but popular and speced to have a HPF at 5Hz) might be two good options.

My 2c

I think you should just look at the classifieds, and scoop up Gorilla83's crown xls5000 he is selling...Perfect for two DO SI boxes.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hyrlyfrm View Post

Thanks Avgass. Axel, by pair of DO Si 18's I mean using 2 drivers per cabinet. That would get me 1000w per driver which, according to more learned folks in this thread, seems to be perfectly fine with 4cu ft internal volume per driver. I realize that the system wouldn't be drawing that much power very often, but I still wonder if it'll trip a breaker when it does.

I have been running 4 per channel on my fp14k since I built them out. They are kicking with 1100 watts each, and I am running a 6dB LT boost down low smile.gif
post #1807 of 2212
Quote:
Originally Posted by beastaudio View Post


and I am running a 6dB LT boost down low smile.gif

Did you do this with a miniDSP?
If yes can I ask how you did it?
Thanks
post #1808 of 2212
Quote:
Originally Posted by beastaudio View Post

I think you should just look at the classifieds, and scoop up Gorilla83's crown xls5000 he is selling...Perfect for two DO SI boxes.
I have been running 4 per channel on my fp14k since I built them out. They are kicking with 1100 watts each, and I am running a 6dB LT boost down low smile.gif

Hey Brandon, its been a while since I've seen new pics of your room. What's it look like these days?
post #1809 of 2212
Quote:
Originally Posted by Freniata View Post

Did you do this with a miniDSP?
If yes can I ask how you did it?
Thanks

From what I have been told it is quite easy to do on a miniDSP. I used the DCX2496 to do something similar to what LTD is talking about with a how HPF, but I just did it backwards basically to gain the boost down low smile.gif

Quote:
Originally Posted by Scott Simonian View Post

Hey Brandon, its been a while since I've seen new pics of your room. What's it look like these days?

Nothing new to report really. The Danleys are currently stacked on top of the SEOS horns turned sideways and I am down 4 subs as I sold the boxes they were in to Coach and installed his new drivers in them for him. Just kind of a mess right now. But it certainly is the most beautiful sounding mess I have ever heard biggrin.gifbiggrin.gif

I have plans to start on some stands for the Danleys that will get them right at ear height which will help, and possibly incorporate the 18's into the stands, but the jury is out on that thus far. I can't decide between forward facing or side facing for the DO config still. For a while I was just going to do two more Sono's but now with the Danleys I need more space left to right and the sono's take up too much of that. I Once it's all said and done, I will basically have one big 3 foot tall box all the way from one side of the screen to the other. Lotta wood.
post #1810 of 2212
Quote:
Originally Posted by beastaudio View Post

The Danleys are currently stacked on top of the SEOS horns turned sideways and I am down 4 subs as I sold the boxes they were in to Coach and installed his new drivers in them for him. Just kind of a mess right now. But it certainly is the most beautiful sounding mess I have ever heard biggrin.gifbiggrin.gif

Which Danley's did you get and how do the SEOS compare? I have been swamped lately so have not been keeping up around here, any threads were you talk about the Danley's and how they compare?
post #1811 of 2212
Quote:
Originally Posted by mjaudio View Post

Which Danley's did you get and how do the SEOS compare? I have been swamped lately so have not been keeping up around here, any threads were you talk about the Danley's and how they compare?

I got a pair of the sm60f's. Couldn't quite chew off the price of the sh50's but after hearing this version of the unity, I am almost 100% on devoting what I can to getting some SH50's in as near future as I can manage. I mean if the biggest movie director of them all and a TV talk show host/top selling magazine owner/has her own tv station now person runs these in their own personal theaters, I couldn't have imagined trying anything else until I at least get to hear them...

The SEOS up against them is astounding at how close they are able to get in many aspects, for close to half the price of a single sm60F I was able to build out the entire LCR set too so there is that cool.gif I love what the SEOS are capable of, but the sm60f's are just more refined, more direct, and seamless. I haven't really drawn any direct comparisons, but the no audyssey graphs completely threw me off when I first ran an OM sweep of the danleys. I had no idea they could run as flat as they were with ZERO adjustments, be that EQ or placement. I literally popped them on top of the SEOS's fired em up and ran a sweep. It was insane. With the Audyssey and a little tweaking this is what I have been able to accomplish:

post #1812 of 2212
Very nice beast!

Somebody said that a well designed controlled/constant directivity speaker should need little-no in room EQ..... Who was that? ;-)

Was the midbass that flat or did you have to tweak to get that flat!?
post #1813 of 2212
Beast you still have the XXX 18's?

And where are those Qtc.4 24's SI? biggrin.gif
post #1814 of 2212
Very nice Beast and thanks for the info.
post #1815 of 2212
Quote:
Originally Posted by beastaudio View Post

I got a pair of the sm60f's. Couldn't quite chew off the price of the sh50's but after hearing this version of the unity, I am almost 100% on devoting what I can to getting some SH50's in as near future as I can manage. I mean if the biggest movie director of them all and a TV talk show host/top selling magazine owner/has her own tv station now person runs these in their own personal theaters, I couldn't have imagined trying anything else until I at least get to hear them...

The SEOS up against them is astounding at how close they are able to get in many aspects, for close to half the price of a single sm60F I was able to build out the entire LCR set too so there is that cool.gif I love what the SEOS are capable of, but the sm60f's are just more refined, more direct, and seamless. I haven't really drawn any direct comparisons, but the no audyssey graphs completely threw me off when I first ran an OM sweep of the danleys. I had no idea they could run as flat as they were with ZERO adjustments, be that EQ or placement. I literally popped them on top of the SEOS's fired em up and ran a sweep. It was insane. With the Audyssey and a little tweaking this is what I have been able to accomplish:


Was your mic at the main LP for this measurement? If so, was the mic pointed at the ceiling or forward towards the speakers?
post #1816 of 2212
Quote:
Originally Posted by NicksHitachi View Post

Very nice beast!

Somebody said that a well designed controlled/constant directivity speaker should need little-no in room EQ..... Who was that? ;-)

Was the midbass that flat or did you have to tweak to get that flat!?

No tweaking at all. The red line is with an 80hz XO and the blue is with a 100hz. I kinda like 100hz XO for music to really get that kick in the chest feel from the boosted sub range. At least I thought that until I moved it back down to 60hz where audyssey set it on its own, and now I almost think I like it this way best. Depends on my mood I guess. Haha

Quote:
Originally Posted by chrapladm View Post

Beast you still have the XXX 18's?

And where are those Qtc.4 24's SI? biggrin.gif

Sure do smile.gif Not in, but maybe soon. IB, in the rear. Gotta at least try it and I have some wood to spare so still thinkin' why not?

Quote:
Originally Posted by carp View Post

Was your mic at the main LP for this measurement? If so, was the mic pointed at the ceiling or forward towards the speakers?

At MLP, pointed vertically.
post #1817 of 2212
Quote:
Originally Posted by beastaudio View Post

I literally popped them on top of the SEOS's fired em up and ran a sweep. It was insane. With the Audyssey and a little tweaking this is what I have been able to accomplish:


Quote:
Originally Posted by carp View Post

Was your mic at the main LP for this measurement? If so, was the mic pointed at the ceiling or forward towards the speakers?

Quote:
Originally Posted by beastaudio View Post


At MLP, pointed vertically.



Wow, that is impressive! I went back and the only full range measurement I could find for my speakers/subs was this:






However, I think the above is 1/6th smoothing at least and your graph looks like less smoothing than that, and you have 5 db increments on the left and I have 10 so you are kicking my butt. smile.gif I haven't taken full range measurements since I put up some acoustic panels on the side walls and since I moved the main LP forward almost 3 feet.

I don't use Audyssey (don't have it... ) so this is no eq. How big of a difference did Audyssey make?
post #1818 of 2212

SI18”D2 versus SI18”D4 versus RSS460HO-4

 

 

I am planning to build (4) sealed subs (Erich’s 4 ft3 flat packs) with 18” drivers. They will be powered by (2) EP4000. For stability reasons running them on 4 Ohm seems to be the preferred route. The subs are for my HT, probably supplementing (2) SVS PC13 Ultras. 95% movies / 5% music

 

I am looking for some guidance about what drivers to get: SI18” D2 or D4… and the reasons behind.  

 

Along those lines, from what I understand, the PE Dayton RSS460HO-4 will sound very similar to above SI. Pricing differences between them are negligible. So would the DVC of the SI bring any advantage (flexibility?) over the Dayton’s SVC?

 

Thanks!

_____

Axel

post #1819 of 2212
Get the dual 4's and wire them like this:

http://www.the12volt.com/caraudio/woofer_configurations.asp?Q=2&I=42#results

And you will then have a dual 4 ohm load, where you can run a bridged ep4000 to each pair of boxes.
Edited by beastaudio - 7/30/13 at 1:49pm
post #1820 of 2212
Quote:
Originally Posted by beastaudio View Post

Get the daul 4's and wire them like this:

http://www.the12volt.com/caraudio/woofer_configurations.asp?Q=2&I=42#results

And you will then have a dual 4 ohm load, where you can run a bridged ep4000 to each pair of boxes.

 

 

Why bridged and not stereo?  The RMS power for an EP4000 on 4 ohm is rated at 950 W stereo versus 2,400 W bridged. From what I understand 950 W / driver should be more than sufficient. With 1,200 W / driver I am a bit worried I could damage the driver.

 

____

Axel 

post #1821 of 2212
Quote:
Originally Posted by Axel View Post


Why bridged and not stereo?  The RMS power for an EP4000 on 4 ohm is rated at 950 W stereo versus 2,400 W bridged. From what I understand 950 W / driver should be more than sufficient. With 1,200 W / driver I am a bit worried I could damage the driver.

____
Axel 

You're talking less than a decible difference between 950 and 1200, chump change really. I have been running 1,100 to each of my 8 for months now without ANY bad sounds or hiccups biggrin.gif
post #1822 of 2212
Quote:
Originally Posted by carp View Post



Wow, that is impressive! I went back and the only full range measurement I could find for my speakers/subs was this:






However, I think the above is 1/6th smoothing at least and your graph looks like less smoothing than that, and you have 5 db increments on the left and I have 10 so you are kicking my butt. smile.gif I haven't taken full range measurements since I put up some acoustic panels on the side walls and since I moved the main LP forward almost 3 feet.

I don't use Audyssey (don't have it... ) so this is no eq. How big of a difference did Audyssey make?

I had a slightly boosted bottom end from about 3-400hz down to the XO point to the subs but other than that, Audyssey didn't need to do much at all to the top end. The 212's CD and the sm60f's are both BMS offerings so I am not surprised, I am just using a coaxial horn loaded type and you are using a two way CD which in the end, having a quality horn on either is what makes them work so well. Two obviously different design techniques, but same end result, two ECSTATIC owners biggrin.gifbiggrin.gif It just amazes me that servo had the talent of Jeff, Mark, and Tom all at the same time. Talk about a dream team of developers, well that was it!!!!
post #1823 of 2212
I finally got around to doing some compressions sweeps. To me it looks like weak sauce. I kept bumping up the volume by 5db's and pretty soon it got scary so I didn't do averages I just hit the pause button really quickly. Maybe the loudest sweep I didn't time hitting the pause button right, but I don't think so. I think this is as good as it gets before I start seeing tons of compression.

Wow, that seems week.

Now, in order to get this nice flat curve in my new LP I am not only using a LT but also pulling down 12 dbs centered in the mid 20 hz area. I think having to pull down that much and then crank everything up puts a ton of stress on the drivers.

I'm thinking I'll try it again sometime with a 10 hz HPF and see how much higher I can go before I see compression.





Ok, so on bass heavy scenes in movies I've recorded over 130 db's at my LP (I think 133 was the highest I've seen). Does this just mean that sure I can hit 130 at say 30 hz and above but from around 15hz and below the most I can hit is 110db's? If that's the case I really don't like that....
post #1824 of 2212
Oh, also when I do demo's I don't run the eq this flat, I have a nice house curve peaking out around 18hz before it starts to drop off. It seems much more impressive that way.

Also, all those graphs are no smoothing I'm really happy how smooth the freq response is, even up around the 80hz crossover.
post #1825 of 2212
Hey guys, SI does not communicate that well. I emailed, PM'd(today) and tried calling several times and I never get a hold of anyone. What's up? I need info!
post #1826 of 2212
Quote:
Originally Posted by MKtheater View Post

Hey guys, SI does not communicate that well. I emailed, PM'd(today) and tried calling several times and I never get a hold of anyone. What's up? I need info!

We have been moving our facility an hour away from our previous location for the past week. We have also had email issues and of course phone problems. I do not respond to PM's hardly at all - everything needs to be emailed so it can be kept track of. Other than international shipping quotes (I must call FedEx International to obtain those) all other emails have been responded to.
post #1827 of 2212
I will check the junk email folder.
post #1828 of 2212
Ok communication is now good, email works!
post #1829 of 2212
Thanks for the info re: you moving, electro, I think I emailed about a week ago regarding an international shipping quote so will sit tight and try not to be an impatient child waiting for christmas / bug you for a response till you're settled tongue.gif lol
post #1830 of 2212
Hey electro,

The impatient child in me wants to post this to ask if you've received my email re: shipping for 4 x SI18s to the UK wink.gif

I appreciate you have a lot on your plate so emails may be waiting! tongue.gif lol
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