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Marantz AV8801 Preamp/Processor Official Owner's thread - Page 150

post #4471 of 11290
I called the Marantz service center today to see the status on my 8801. I dropped it off this past Monday. It turns out they had to remove the main board and send it back to Marantz. I guess it will be a little while until I get it back. Hopefully I can get the newest firmware installed before I get my hands on it.

So, to those who worry about updating via their network. I'd say you have good reason to be concerned.
post #4472 of 11290
Quote:
Originally Posted by WestCoastD View Post

just curious how much something like this cost's? (installing 4, 20A circuits) that is? My home has some issues tripping breakers, engaging a hair-dryer or even the garbage disposal.
Materials likely around $200-400, depending on type of breakers required, length of run. Labor and what construction they have to deal with is the big unknown. My rough guess, $1-2K$. I ran two circuits but did it with my son's help (he is an electrician) but I knew how to do it as I've done this stuff in the past. Oh, and this assumes you have open capacity in your panels.
post #4473 of 11290
Quote:
Originally Posted by wse View Post

Yes it is, I have a Classé SSP-800 bought about two years ago so I should be good for an other year,

I just got rid of my Parasound amp which was 18 years old smile.gif



Classe makes some nice gear. Technology changes so fast anymore, I just hope I'm good for awhile with the Marantz. I just bought new fronts and a center and now I need a different sub or two. I have a Parasound also that's probably close to ten years old but stored half the time. I tried it with my fronts but it just wasn't a good match. Have a good night.
post #4474 of 11290
Quote:
Originally Posted by jima4a View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by WestCoastD View Post

just curious how much something like this cost's? (installing 4, 20A circuits) that is? My home has some issues tripping breakers, engaging a hair-dryer or even the garbage disposal.
Materials likely around $200-400, depending on type of breakers required, length of run. Labor and what construction they have to deal with is the big unknown. My rough guess, $1-2K$. I ran two circuits but did it with my son's help (he is an electrician) but I knew how to do it as I've done this stuff in the past. Oh, and this assumes you have open capacity in your panels.

I just thought I should point out that most people should not be doing this on their own. You don't want your house to burn down because of a poor connection, nor do you want to accidentally expose people to fatal voltage levels. A licensed electrician needs to be involved. It might be appropriate to contact your home insurance company, too.
post #4475 of 11290
Just ordered an 8801(Open Box from Distributor) Got a Great Price!
Now I need to select an amp. my room is about a 30x20
Will be running Episode in walls-ES-HT700-IWLCR-6 for LCR and 700 Series In-Ceilings for side and rear surrounds.
was looking into emotiva upa-700 but that may not be enough power also considering an outlaw, maybe the 7125.
Any recommendations?
post #4476 of 11290
Quote:
Originally Posted by Selden Ball View Post

I just thought I should point out that most people should not be doing this on their own. You don't want your house to burn down because of a poor connection, nor do you want to accidentally expose people to fatal voltage levels. A licensed electrician needs to be involved. It might be appropriate to contact your home insurance company, too.
Good point. The labor I indicated would be for a licensed electrician in our area, other areas might be higher.
post #4477 of 11290
Quote:
Originally Posted by Selden Ball View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by jima4a View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by WestCoastD View Post

just curious how much something like this cost's? (installing 4, 20A circuits) that is? My home has some issues tripping breakers, engaging a hair-dryer or even the garbage disposal.

Materials likely around $200-400, depending on type of breakers required, length of run. Labor and what construction they have to deal with is the big unknown. My rough guess, $1-2K$. I ran two circuits but did it with my son's help (he is an electrician) but I knew how to do it as I've done this stuff in the past. Oh, and this assumes you have open capacity in your panels.

I just thought I should point out that most people should not be doing this on their own. You don't want your house to burn down because of a poor connection, nor do you want to accidentally expose people to fatal voltage levels. A licensed electrician needs to be involved. It might be appropriate to contact your home insurance company, too.

I have a quote for $1,200.

Assumptions: This will add 8 new plugs in the wall (2 clusters of 4-plugs each) - with each pair of plugs being on its own 20-amp circuit. They're all running to the same wall, not scattered all over the house. At the location on the wall where they're being added - it's in the middle of the house - near the highest point of the roof - so it has easy attic access. And my panel/fuse-box has 4 empty circuit spots, so the electrician can just add to the existing box.

On top of that, I will have to pay a handyman to repair/repaint the two holes the electrician is going to cut into the wall while bringing the wire down from the attic to the plugs.
Edited by Bill222 - 3/28/13 at 2:28pm
post #4478 of 11290
Quote:
Originally Posted by Darrel McBane View Post

I called the Marantz service center today to see the status on my 8801. I dropped it off this past Monday. It turns out they had to remove the main board and send it back to Marantz. I guess it will be a little while until I get it back. Hopefully I can get the newest firmware installed before I get my hands on it.

So, to those who worry about updating via their network. I'd say you have good reason to be concerned.


I have updated mine twice over wireless, including the 3-20 update. It did take a while, and it said it would shutdown when finished. I started the update and went to bed, and the next day the unit was still on. I checked and the update took, so maybe it restarted instead of turning off.
post #4479 of 11290
Quote:
Originally Posted by scotto2 View Post

Just ordered an 8801(Open Box from Distributor) Got a Great Price!
Now I need to select an amp. my room is about a 30x20
Will be running Episode in walls-ES-HT700-IWLCR-6 for LCR and 700 Series In-Ceilings for side and rear surrounds.
was looking into emotiva upa-700 but that may not be enough power also considering an outlaw, maybe the 7125.
Any recommendations?


I have an Outlaw 7700, 7 ch amp @ 200 wpc. Outlaw has great hi quality amps at very reasonable prices, and excellent customer service!
post #4480 of 11290
Quote:
Originally Posted by comfynumb View Post

Classe makes some nice gear. Technology changes so fast anymore, I just hope I'm good for awhile with the Marantz. I just bought new fronts and a center and now I need a different sub or two. I have a Parasound also that's probably close to ten years old but stored half the time. I tried it with my fronts but it just wasn't a good match. Have a good night.

Thanks when Classe incorporate ATMOS & MDA, then I will upgrade in the mean time. I am am staying put!
post #4481 of 11290
Quote:
Originally Posted by audiofan1 View Post

Might I suggest 10 awg wire, I have one 10awg and one 12awg both 20 amp lines but if I had to do it again both would be 10awg as it has a least to my ears better sound quality and dynamics!

I would second the 10 AWG suggestion especially depending on the length of the run. In regards to running amps off of 240 volts I had that recommendation made to my a Crown engineer 20+ years ago, and I had positive results from it at the time so I have continued to run my amps off of 240 volt circuits over the years.
post #4482 of 11290
Quote:
Originally Posted by wse View Post

Thanks when Classe incorporate ATMOS & MDA, then I will upgrade in the mean time. I am am staying put!


I'll have to read up on that.
post #4483 of 11290
Quote:
Originally Posted by exm View Post

I am not crazy about the Onkyo sound... Having said that, what are your reasons to upgrade?

hmm

First off..I have never thought the Onkyo was very musical....to my ears they built it for someone who listens to HT 90% of the time

I have old Pioneer elite receiver that I think sounds more musical..VSX47TX

then there are minor details.....the clicking the unit does between sound modes is starting to bother me like nails on a chalkboard

It can be a little too "live" sounding and the center channel too forward.....if its possible for something to be too detailed the Onkyo is it

granted some of these are just my taste...someone else could have the exact opposite statements

But the comments the salesman told me about "head and shoulders" differences( over what I have) raise my eyebrows

especially after doing the A/B Integra to Anthem statement demo two years ago....that was not a head and shoulders difference in sound especially in HT

on another I see that A4L has the 8801( refurbed) in stock


Warren
post #4484 of 11290
In regards to 240V outlets, this can be really easy if you already have a dedicated 120V outlet. You can convert that 120V outlet without having to replace the romex as your white wire becomes the second hot and you should label it as such. It's a simple matter of buying an appropriate outlet and switching to a double pole breaker provided your service panel has the room. The white wire from your dedicated 120V circuit will be rerouted from the neutral bus to the second pole of your 2 pole breaker. If you understand exactly what I'm explaining you can do this yourself. If you have doubts I'd contract an electrician.

Three of my circuits are 20 amp capacity via 12 gauge line. The fourth is a 30 amp circuit with the necessary 10 gauge line. I can't hear the difference but it's only about a 20 foot run from the room to the service panel. The 120V conversion transformer providing balanced 120v power is on the 30 amp run along with one front monoblock. Line sag is minimal no matter the volume.
post #4485 of 11290
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill222 View Post


I am just about to install 4 separate 20-amp circuits - to give each Aragon amp and the subwoofer its own circuit. When I talked to Aragon support, they said this would give me more reserve power if needed - but they don't really think I need it - since I'm never tripping any breakers. I'll have to ask them about 240v performance vs 120v performance. Since I'm renting - I'm not sure it makes sense to run multiple 240v circuits to the living room compared to running the more standard 120v, 20 amp circuits.

Way, way overkill on the circuits, but it's your coin.
post #4486 of 11290
Why is it way overkill? I'm using the Aragon 8008-line amps. A single Aragon 8008BB amp is rated for 1,500 watts max power usage. Isn't that using most-or-all of a single 15-amp circuit line all by itself?

I'm currently running 12-gauge or 14-gauge extension cords to the amps. I realized the extension cord is only rated for 1,800 watts. So in theory the extension cord could only support one of my amps. Right now, it might be supporting two...

I haven't pulled the trigger on the new circuits yet. But I can't believe that it's a good idea to run all of the gear that I'm currently running off a single 15-amp circuit.
post #4487 of 11290
it is way overkill because, presumably, you are not running full power continuous test tones. The duty cycle of music/movies results in considerably less average power demand, even if you're running the system WFO, easily handled by one or two dedicated circuits for your whole system.
post #4488 of 11290
Quote:
Originally Posted by whoaru99 View Post

It is better to run longer interconnects than longer speaker wires. This is one of the very reasonsfor balanced signals...to facilitate running long low level interconnects without problems vs long, lossy (relatively speaking) high power/high current speaker wires. Your low level signals are not as delicate as many say. It is basically a voltage signal with extremely low current so the losses over long runs is virtually nonexistent. Considering too, balanced runs and shielding on top of that, long low level instead of long speaker cable is the way to go.

Thanks, good to know. I know XLR's are much better at noise rejection than RCA's, but I hadn't looked into speaker wire vs xlr's. But being that they are shielded it makes sense.
post #4489 of 11290
Quote:
Originally Posted by whoaru99 View Post

it is way overkill because, presumably, you are not running full power continuous test tones. The duty cycle of music/movies results in considerably less average power demand, even if you're running the system WFO, easily handled by one or two dedicated circuits for your whole system.

Yes. If you're not tripping breakers then there is no problem.
post #4490 of 11290
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill222 View Post

I have a quote for $1,200.

Assumptions: This will add 8 new plugs in the wall (2 clusters of 4-plugs each) - with each pair of plugs being on its own 20-amp circuit. They're all running to the same wall, not scattered all over the house. At the location on the wall where they're being added - it's in the middle of the house - near the highest point of the roof - so it has easy attic access. And my panel/fuse-box has 4 empty circuit spots, so the electrician can just add to the existing box.

On top of that, I will have to pay a handyman to repair/repaint the two holes the electrician is going to cut into the wall while bringing the wire down from the attic to the plugs.
interesting, thanks. Yeah this is what I had in mind. $1200.00 is reasonable (I guess), especially if they're considering physically cutting and mounting new boxes into dry-wall. I would only want to add new lines to one room as well.
post #4491 of 11290
Quote:
Originally Posted by whoaru99 View Post

It is better to run longer interconnects than longer speaker wires. This is one of the very reasonsfor balanced signals...to facilitate running long low level interconnects without problems vs long, lossy (relatively speaking) high power/high current speaker wires. Your low level signals are not as delicate as many say. It is basically a voltage signal with extremely low current so the losses over long runs is virtually nonexistent. Considering too, balanced runs and shielding on top of that, long low level instead of long speaker cable is the way to go.

Not going to side track this thread any further after this, but....

I'll just agree to (somewhat) disagree I suppose.

in a HOME climate it's unlikely anything in an HT will be run over 50ft and with a 12-14g wire one can COUNT on virtually ZERO signal loss and/or RI or EMI.

With a low current high impedance run of xlr one can also anticipate a very much usable signal, but I and other would argue that the very nature of that signals leaves it MORE vulnerable to RI and EMI. Fact is though I would be willing to bet in 99.99% of home installs the resulting sound would be identical- but there would almost certainly be a savings in buying "x" number of feet of speaker wire over 7-11 quality 30/50ft XLRS. I'm pretty much convinced that the inclusion of xlrs on home components whose users are- 99% of the time- connecting amplifiers 6 feet away or less is purely to add to the "hi end allure" of the component- not to offer any real sonic benefits although I will agree that the xlr connection methodology is a plus over typical single ends. smile.gif

End: XLRs were introduced as a more equitable solution over single ended connections for "pro" installations which require runs of HUNDREDS of feet- similarly though, I can also assure anyone that theaters and auditoriums not running powered speakers ALSO see hugely long runs of speaker cable from amplifiers to surround/main speakers with no issues. I wouldn't and won't say that either methodology is perfect and both can have their own very specific issues.

James
post #4492 of 11290
Quote:
Originally Posted by cp1966 View Post

I have an Outlaw 7700, 7 ch amp @ 200 wpc. Outlaw has great hi quality amps at very reasonable prices, and excellent customer service!

thanks, I am looking at that one also, nice that its balanced.
I'd like to keep it all under one chassis, due to rack space.
post #4493 of 11290
Quote:
Originally Posted by Darrel McBane View Post

I called the Marantz service center today to see the status on my 8801. I dropped it off this past Monday. It turns out they had to remove the main board and send it back to Marantz. I guess it will be a little while until I get it back. Hopefully I can get the newest firmware installed before I get my hands on it.

So, to those who worry about updating via their network. I'd say you have good reason to be concerned.

That is consistent with others I have spoken to as well. Now knowing this has happened to more than a couple people I plan to not ever use the network when it comes to upgrading Denon or Marantz components. It is like a crap shoot or pulling and praying....
post #4494 of 11290
Quote:
Originally Posted by mastermaybe View Post

Not going to side track this thread any further after this, but....

I'll just agree to (somewhat) disagree I suppose.

in a HOME climate it's unlikely anything in an HT will be run over 50ft and with a 12-14g wire one can COUNT on virtually ZERO signal loss and/or RI or EMI.

With a low current high impedance run of xlr one can also anticipate a very much usable signal, but I and other would argue that the very nature of that signals leaves it MORE vulnerable to RI and EMI. Fact is though I would be willing to bet in 99.99% of home installs the resulting sound would be identical- but there would almost certainly be a savings in buying "x" number of feet of speaker wire over 7-11 quality 30/50ft XLRS. I'm pretty much convinced that the inclusion of xlrs on home components whose users are- 99% of the time- connecting amplifiers 6 feet away or less is purely to add to the "hi end allure" of the component- not to offer any real sonic benefits although I will agree that the xlr connection methodology is a plus over typical single ends. smile.gif

End: XLRs were introduced as a more equitable solution over single ended connections for "pro" installations which require runs of HUNDREDS of feet- similarly though, I can also assure anyone that theaters and auditoriums not running powered speakers ALSO see hugely long runs of speaker cable from amplifiers to surround/main speakers with no issues. I wouldn't and won't say that either methodology is perfect and both can have their own very specific issues.

See the summary at the end. http://bryston.com/PDF/newsletters/Bryston_Newsletter_V5_3.pdf

The point isn't what you do when you have no choice except to run long speaker cable, the point is what you should do when you do have a choice....and that choice should be long interconnects and short speaker cables.p
Edited by whoaru99 - 3/29/13 at 8:18am
post #4495 of 11290
Quote:
Originally Posted by joerod View Post

I plan to not ever use the network when it comes to upgrading Denon or Marantz components. It is like a crap shoot or pulling and praying....

and there are some who insist they want to do FW updates over wifi eek.gif
Joe, I'm still in the Pioneer camp but want to know if Denon & Marantz make their updates available by web download for USB sticks?
post #4496 of 11290
Quote:
Originally Posted by steve71 View Post

Yes. If you're not tripping breakers then there is no problem.

There is potentially a concern with voltage drop under heavy load even if the breaker doesn't trip, but one or two dedicated circuits using properly-sized cable is plenty for all but really big systems using those multi kW amps for their subs.
post #4497 of 11290
Quote:
Originally Posted by joerod View Post

That is consistent with others I have spoken to as well. Now knowing this has happened to more than a couple people I plan to not ever use the network when it comes to upgrading Denon or Marantz components. It is like a crap shoot or pulling and praying....

OK, so NO NETWORK UPDATE with the Marantz since you run a chance of bricking it. Where can I find instructions for a safer update to the 8801?

Why is Marantz so risky for network updates? I have done so many network updates on other devices without this issue.
post #4498 of 11290
Quote:
Originally Posted by denaliman View Post


The Marantz rack ears make the unit sit flush in the rack. There is a small vented filler piece that fits in under the unit to take up the left over rack space (1/2 U) where the feet are. it fits perfect in the rack spaces. I am not sure if the MA faceplate comes in far enough on each side to cover the curvature of the 8801. If it does IMO I think it would look out of place. I attached a couple of pics using the rack ears. Sorry for the poor quality.

Does the unit come with these rack ears?
post #4499 of 11290
^^^

the Marantz rack ears do not come with...and they don't seem to be available anymore

nice thing about this mount is it takes up only 4U with feet removed: I think the M/A RSH is 5U
post #4500 of 11290
Since we are talking power:

I reported earlier that the Furman Elite 15 PFI and Panamax 5400 amplifier outlets were limiting the performance of my Sunfire 7400 and Outlaw 7500 amps.
It should be noted the those with the ultra high-end power conditions with transformers have a completely different animal.

Many, especially those with high class-A bias, cannot replicate this.
I also use a Leviton Whole house surge protector.
Recently, I discovered that I am only protecting half the house since I have a 400 Amp service with two boxes.

So, I decided to pick up one of these Leviton 20 amp surge suppressor receptacle.

It uses MOV's but has an LED to show that the MOVs are operational and has an audible alarm (defeatable) when protection is no longer working. I.E. the MOVs sacrificed themselves.

I have 4 plugs and it could have been wired to protect them all but I decided to leave 2 straight and see if there are any adverse effects (I doubt it though). Then I may pick up another because those 12 gauge wires are tough to deal with.

Anyway, this is a nice $45 options that takes 15 minutes to install.

FYI,

Rich
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