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Marantz AV8801 Preamp/Processor Official Owner's thread - Page 278

post #8311 of 11320
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pxgarbar View Post

Hello,
I recently got 8801 , had Onkyo 886 preamp.
Wow...the8801 is a vast improvement in sound quality. I never could get the Onkyo 886 to achieve sufficient SPL's for some reason.
With the 8801 I can achieve SPL's beyond what I need.
(using Emotiva 2 channel amp and rotel rmb 1095 5 channel amp),
the overall stereo and surround sound of the 8801 is discernibly improved.
One thing is with the Onkyo I could switch between multiple sound processing modes whereas with the Marantz 8801 it limits me to default 'music', 'movie', 'game'....modes.
I had initial problems with internet connectivity , but last firmware update resolved this?

Regards,
Paul

The key is to press and HOLD either the MOVIE, MUSIC, or GAME buttons (and then select the new mode desired) as just pressing and releasing will simply display the current mode selected.
post #8312 of 11320
Quote:
Originally Posted by jdsmoothie View Post

The key is to press and HOLD either the MOVIE, MUSIC, or GAME buttons (and then select the new mode desired) as just pressing and releasing will simply display the current mode selected.

strangely this doesnt work for me. Im holing movie button and pushing cursor up and down but I see no changes.
post #8313 of 11320
Quote:
Originally Posted by goodkat View Post

strangely this doesnt work for me. Im holing movie button and pushing cursor up and down but I see no changes.



It should, are you holding down the colored movie and music buttons for a couple seconds? You can also try the Marantz app from the app store or on the Google store. If you have istuff the deremote app for $5 works very good and was just updated a few days ago and works even better now.
post #8314 of 11320
Quote:
Originally Posted by comfynumb View Post

It should, are you holding down the colored movie and music buttons for a couple seconds? You can also try the Marantz app from the app store or on the Google store. If you have istuff the deremote app for $5 works very good and was just updated a few days ago and works even better now.

exactly those buttons. but when I hold the button and push up and down I see no change in modes. If it says Dolby PLII, the sound goes for a second and comes back again with same mode
post #8315 of 11320
Quote:
Originally Posted by comfynumb View Post

I know setting the LPF to 120 Hz has been suggested before. Right now mine is set to 100 Hz, is this a subtle change for most? Right now I'm having subwoofer malfunctions, and about to pull the trigger on a new sub, replace the 10" driver in my def tech supercube 1 and move that behind my couch, I don't think it's recommended to have two different subs on the front wall.

Yes it is subtle, not a brick wall, but starts the rolloff a little lower so it technically IS dropping the signal sooner than leaving it at 120hz. Some people prefer it this way as they feel it cleans up the bass a little, I on the other hand disagree.

Quote:
Originally Posted by be83663 View Post

I found an interesting comment from Chris Kyriakakis, he works for the Audyssey Company:
" If it's MultEQ XT then change all speakers to Small (set xovers to 80 Hz). If it's MultEQ XT32 then you can leave everything as is because the subwoofer and speaker filters have much higher resolution and there is no added benefit in setting speakers to Small".
What do you think?

Quote:
Originally Posted by treky11 View Post

i just read that page and found this quote from Chris a few posts down "For XT32 we recommend leaving the crossover as found in the measurements, unless this results in your AVR setting the speakers to Large"

a bit confusing

I would, and have always set all settings to small, and I think all others should do the same unless they experience EXCELLENT integration with subs to mains and no phase/cancellation issues. Chris almost always suggests setting everything to small, not sure why he slipped up in that last response to you be83663.
post #8316 of 11320
Quote:
Originally Posted by goodkat View Post

exactly those buttons. but when I hold the button and push up and down I see no change in modes. If it says Dolby PLII, the sound goes for a second and comes back again with same mode



Ok understood, to me it sounds like it could be a setting in your source, player or other. I can change sound no problem via my Oppo 93 via HDMI to the 8801. Make sure you assigned the proper input for your player or other source in the Marantz's input assign also.
post #8317 of 11320
Quote:
Originally Posted by bigguyca View Post


First a little clarification:

I use the Direct/Pure Direct setup of the AV8801 with the BDP-105 connected via XLR's to the AV8801 for stereo, typically using CD's in the BDP-105 for a source. I use the DAC's in the AV8801 for multichannel audio associated with video with input via HDMI. I use the AV8801 in this case because I like to use the various audio processing capabilities of the AV8801, such as Audyssey, for video. I find the BDP-105 too limiting as a AV control center. I really like both of these setups.

...

Likely current outputs are used from both DAC chips. How well these currents are converted to voltages has an import effect on audio quality. The picture of the inside of the BDP-105 on the OPPO's website shows that this conversion is done with some rather extensive circuitry employing IC op-amps. I don't know anything more specifically about this circuitry. The Marantz uses HDAM discrete circuits for analog output buffers but again I don't know any other details of their analog design. (Using the XLR inputs to connect the OPPO to the Marantz uses these same output buffers of course.) Based on what is visible of the analog circuitry, the two component carry out the current to voltage conversion using different designs.

These are different and personal preference rules.
I recommend you connect atleast the front dedicated RCA outputs to the 8801 analog inputs.
Make sure the Oppo speakers are not set to Downmix. The main outputs should be set to Front L/R for full range.

The XLRs can be put through an A/D conversion and processed and it is unclear to what extent this is bypassed by Pure Direct Mode. However, the 7.1 analog inputs cannot be redigitized.

I find the XLRs from the 105 processed via the 8801 are brighter from the XLR outputs than from the RCA but the RCA have a more balanced sound so I prefer them.

- Rich
post #8318 of 11320
Type of sound (stereo, 5 channel,etc) affects what codecs are available. Pliix will work with all.
post #8319 of 11320
Quote:
Originally Posted by beastaudio View Post

Yes it is subtle, not a brick wall, but starts the rolloff a little lower so it technically IS dropping the signal sooner than leaving it at 120hz. Some people prefer it this way as they feel it cleans up the bass a little, I on the other hand disagree.

I would, and have always set all settings to small, and I think all others should do the same unless they experience EXCELLENT integration with subs to mains and no phase/cancellation issues. Chris almost always suggests setting everything to small, not sure why he slipped up in that last response to you be83663.
But what does "More Filters having Higher Resolutions" mean, as Chris put it?
Such that if there are as many Filters for the Satellites speakes as for the Subwoofers, then the Speaker settings between the "Small" and the "Large" do not matter?
Thanks.
post #8320 of 11320
The settings "Small" and "Large" always matter. The low frequency woofers in floor standing speakers simply cannot match the low frequency output of a quality subwoofer, no matter how much EQ has been applied. "Small" means "enable bass management", which redirects the low frequencies from the main speaker channels to the subwoofer.
post #8321 of 11320
^^^^^What Selden said. The higher resolution Chris was referring to is there are much more data points so the response can be EQ'd much more resulting in a more refined sound, but this won't matter anyways since your subs will still outperform the woofers in your floors standers as Selden said, in the first place.
post #8322 of 11320
Quote:
Originally Posted by beastaudio View Post

^^^^^What Selden said. The higher resolution Chris was referring to is there are much more data points so the response can be EQ'd much more resulting in a more refined sound, but this won't matter anyways since your subs will still outperform the woofers in your floors standers as Selden said, in the first place.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Selden Ball View Post

The settings "Small" and "Large" always matter. The low frequency woofers in floor standing speakers simply cannot match the low frequency output of a quality subwoofer, no matter how much EQ has been applied. "Small" means "enable bass management", which redirects the low frequencies from the main speaker channels to the subwoofer.

So Having More Filters=Higher Resolutions=More EQ'd/EQ Applied.
But the Woofers in the Mains or any Speakers simply Physically CANNOT produce what a quality subwoofer can Physically produce?
So, set all the Speakers to "SMALL", even if you have an Audyssey MultEQ XT32 version, with equal Speaker and Subwoofer Filter Resolution of 512x of them.
Thanks again for clarifying!
smile.gif
post #8323 of 11320
You're exactly right.
post #8324 of 11320
I think I was just impatient, hold it little more and it worked.

What is the difference between direct and pure direct ? When I chose pure direct in network 8801 doesn't give any image from neither hdmi 1-2 outputs, but carry on playing the song.
Quote:
Originally Posted by comfynumb View Post

Ok understood, to me it sounds like it could be a setting in your source, player or other. I can change sound no problem via my Oppo 93 via HDMI to the 8801. Make sure you assigned the proper input for your player or other source in the Marantz's input assign also.
post #8325 of 11320
PURE DIRECT is the same as DIRECT (ie. bass management and Audyssey are disabled) but also cuts out the video processing (front panel display and conversion).
post #8326 of 11320
Quote:
Originally Posted by jdsmoothie View Post

PURE DIRECT is the same as DIRECT (ie. bass management and Audyssey are disabled) but also cuts out the video processing (front panel display and conversion).

They sound quite different on my system.
Video Conversion, IP Scaler, etc all remain in effect in Pure Direct mode.

There seems to less audio processing in Pure Direct versus direct that has nothing to do with the front display.
I have not found much in the manual that gives detail about the difference.

- Rich
post #8327 of 11320
Quote:
Originally Posted by goodkat View Post

I think I was just impatient, hold it little more and it worked.

What is the difference between direct and pure direct ? When I chose pure direct in network 8801 doesn't give any image from neither hdmi 1-2 outputs, but carry on playing the song.



Glad it's working, there are a TON of features just give yourself some time and you will figure it all out.
post #8328 of 11320
After writing up a few questions to this forum lately, I have a feeling that for the Multi-Channel setup for the Home Theatre System, or even for the 2-Channel Music Listening, there really are no benefits in investing on a pair of huge 3- or 4-Way Main Front Speakers.
You can just get a pair of Satellite or Bookshelf speakers for your Front Mains, set the HPF to 80 Hz, and get an awesome ultra-fancy Subwoofer or two, such as $4,500 Velodyne Digital Drive PLUS 18 Inch Subwoofer, instead of a fancy 3- or 4-Way Floorstanding Speakers; of course, you should get a ultra-fancy Bookshelf speakers for your Front Mains, such as B&W 805 Diamonds.
I mean, what is the purpose of getting a pair of B&W 800 Diamonds for you Mains for $24,000 and an additional Subwoofer VS. a pair of their Bookshelf 805 Diamonds for $5,000 and one or two Subwoofers for $4,500-9,000.
Probably there will be reasons......
post #8329 of 11320
Plenty of reasons, although I find it asinine to consider any type of speaker that expensive as the floor standing diamonds. Just plain silly. The biggest reason here is IMD, Intermodular distortion. The more low end frequencies you dump into a single driver, coupled with the upper midrange frequencies, the harder that driver has to work to reproduce all the frequencies. it is trying to play your bass guitar notes (yes even at 80hz XO) along with your female vocals. This is a problem, and really the only way to fix it is to move to a 3 way design, and if a speaker TRULY wants to reproduce free of a subwoofer for certain dedicated audiophiles that shun their properties, then you need multiple low-frequency transducers to really have enough displacement to do it properly anyways...All of a sudden, you have now arrived at the B&W floor standers, or legacy focus type designs. They do it for a reason, even if I still think they are grossly overpriced.
post #8330 of 11320
Quote:
Originally Posted by be83663 View Post

After writing up a few questions to this forum lately, I have a feeling that for the Multi-Channel setup for the Home Theatre System, or even for the 2-Channel Music Listening, there really are no benefits in investing on a pair of huge 3- or 4-Way Main Front Speakers.
You can just get a pair of Satellite or Bookshelf speakers for your Front Mains, set the HPF to 80 Hz, and get an awesome ultra-fancy Subwoofer or two, such as $4,500 Velodyne Digital Drive PLUS 18 Inch Subwoofer, instead of a fancy 3- or 4-Way Floorstanding Speakers; of course, you should get a ultra-fancy Bookshelf speakers for your Front Mains, such as B&W 805 Diamonds.
I mean, what is the purpose of getting a pair of B&W 800 Diamonds for you Mains for $24,000 and an additional Subwoofer VS. a pair of their Bookshelf 805 Diamonds for $5,000 and one or two Subwoofers for $4,500-9,000.
Probably there will be reasons......

Indeed one could wink.gif but for me I have an old 2ch habit I can't let go of eek.gif and that requires big 4 way floorstanders + subs when the mood requires them or it biggrin.gif
post #8331 of 11320
Personally, I think a lot of the desire for full-range speakers is just prejudice (and I have them myself), but...

Quite a few people, for one reason or another, don't use audio systems which include room EQ. For them, a set of full-range speakers is a good choice. Others can't (or don't want to for a variety of valid reasons) put subwoofers into their listening rooms.

Even if a speaker is not capable of reaching the lowest frequencies, it should be as accurate as possible in the frequencies that it does reproduce. The higher the quality of the speakers (i.e. the more accurate they are) and the better your room's acoustics, the better the final audio will be after electronic room equalization has been applied. The algorithm doesn't have to expend as much of its resources (filters) on gross problems. You're right that one does not really need speakers which can reach the lowest frequencies if you're willing to use the EQ software with a quality subwoofer or two, and if the EQ software does its job properly.

Unfortunately, some people have found that automated room EQ simply does not work well for them in their rooms. Sometimes it works well for movies, but not so well for music. Too often, why that happens hasn't been determined. A lot of work has to be expended in order to measure a room's acoustics properly, and often it's much easier to simply run in "Direct" mode and enjoy the results.

In a few cases, I have to believe that personal prejudices against digital signal manipulation are part of the problem. In others, doubtless failing to follow to the letter the detailed instructions provided in the Audyssey 101/FAQ here on AVS has been to blame, since other people have reported significant improvements over already good EQs after following them.

In the end, though, home entertainment systems are just that: devices which are supposed to entertain us. If room EQ doesn't meet that goal for some people, then they shouldn't use it.
post #8332 of 11320
Quote:
Originally Posted by beastaudio View Post

Plenty of reasons, although I find it asinine to consider any type of speaker that expensive as the floor standing diamonds. Just plain silly. The biggest reason here is IMD, Intermodular distortion. The more low end frequencies you dump into a single driver, coupled with the upper midrange frequencies, the harder that driver has to work to reproduce all the frequencies. it is trying to play your bass guitar notes (yes even at 80hz XO) along with your female vocals. This is a problem, and really the only way to fix it is to move to a 3 way design, and if a speaker TRULY wants to reproduce free of a subwoofer for certain dedicated audiophiles that shun their properties, then you need multiple low-frequency transducers to really have enough displacement to do it properly anyways...All of a sudden, you have now arrived at the B&W floor standers, or legacy focus type designs. They do it for a reason, even if I still think they are grossly overpriced.
Thank you all for responding and giving your thoughts on my assumption.

What would be the best way to connect my Front Mains with a Built-in Subs, namely Polkaudio 3-Way LSi25s, using the Marantz AV8801.
The AV8801 has two LFE outs, SW1 and SW2; I am using both outlets each to my Velodyne DSL-5000R Dedicated Subs.
The LSi25 Subwoofer sections have both the LFE in and the Line in; since I am using both of my AV8801 LFE outs to go to both of my Velodynes, I am using the AV8801's Front L/R unbalanced RCA outs to each of my Main LSi25 Subs, one on the Left side and one on the Right side, both in the front next to the corresponding Mains.
Should I just not use any direct connections to the Main LSi25 Sub sections and just use the Binding Posts behind my Main speakers?
What would be the best way of Connection to use its True 3-Way capability.
Thanks.
Ken.
smile.gif
post #8333 of 11320
Another spambot possibly?
post #8334 of 11320
Beginner question biggrin.gif I just ordered a new subwoofer that has a crossover bypass switch on it, allowing me to set the crossover from an AVR or pre. Can I set the crossover for the sub via the 8801?
post #8335 of 11320
Let the Marantz via Audyssey set the xover by using the subs by pass. You will need to rerun Audyssey after you get the sub. what sub did you choose?
post #8336 of 11320
Quote:
Originally Posted by jmschnur View Post

Let the Marantz via Audyssey set the xover by using the subs by pass. You will need to rerun Audyssey after you get the sub. what sub did you choose?



Ahhh ok I see, thanks. I ran Audyssey one time and must have missed that. I bought the HSU VTF-15h.
post #8337 of 11320
Nice. Be sure to spend some time optimizing the position of the sub prior to Audyssey . Hsu will give you good suggestions I suspect as will people on the avs forum .
post #8338 of 11320
Quote:
Originally Posted by jmschnur View Post

Nice. Be sure to spend some time optimizing the position of the sub prior to Audyssey . Hsu will give you good suggestions I suspect as will people on the avs forum .



Thanks, even though I have a big room my sub placement is limited, but I'm going to see how it sounds along the front wall near but not right in the corner. Hsu has been a big help already and I know I can reach out to them anytime for advice. I had a tracking # six hours after I ordered it, that alone was impressive.
post #8339 of 11320
Quote:
Originally Posted by comfynumb View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by jmschnur View Post

Nice. Be sure to spend some time optimizing the position of the sub prior to Audyssey . Hsu will give you good suggestions I suspect as will people on the avs forum .



Thanks, even though I have a big room my sub placement is limited, but I'm going to see how it sounds along the front wall near but not right in the corner. Hsu has been a big help already and I know I can reach out to them anytime for advice. I had a tracking # six hours after I ordered it, that alone was impressive.

Congrats on the new purchase, comynumb; be sure to share a photo image of the new sub when you finally get it located into your space.
post #8340 of 11320
Quote:
Originally Posted by be83663 View Post

Thank you all for responding and giving your thoughts on my assumption.

What would be the best way to connect my Front Mains with a Built-in Subs, namely Polkaudio 3-Way LSi25s, using the Marantz AV8801.
The AV8801 has two LFE outs, SW1 and SW2; I am using both outlets each to my Velodyne DSL-5000R Dedicated Subs.
The LSi25 Subwoofer sections have both the LFE in and the Line in; since I am using both of my AV8801 LFE outs to go to both of my Velodynes, I am using the AV8801's Front L/R unbalanced RCA outs to each of my Main LSi25 Subs, one on the Left side and one on the Right side, both in the front next to the corresponding Mains.
Should I just not use any direct connections to the Main LSi25 Sub sections and just use the Binding Posts behind my Main speakers?
What would be the best way of Connection to use its True 3-Way capability.
Thanks.
Ken.
smile.gif



IF the polks have a way to use the subs full range via the line in, I would go that route. If not you have several options, You could get Y splitters and put on on the SW1 and two cables from there to each of the Velo's and make them "one" sub, while y splitting the Polk subs as another "single" sub. If the way you are doing it now sounds fine, I would just leave it as is. I can't imagine there isnt a switch or setting on the polks to allow them full range signal from just the "line in" without having to have a separate input for the subs.
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