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Official OPPO BDP-103 Owner's Thread - Page 476

post #14251 of 16420
Quote:
Originally Posted by SeeMoreDigital View Post

Try using ImgBurn to 'Create image file from disc'. And use ImgBurn again to 'Write image file to disc'...

ImgBurn locked up. I just ordered a new copy of the disc.
post #14252 of 16420
Quote:
Originally Posted by macnewbie View Post

What confuses me the most is that the Oppo main menu does not display either. Any ideas what kind of output the menu is?

My display says 1080@60, but doesn't specify progressive or interlaced.
Quote:
If I bypass the receiver and connect directly to the TV everything works as expected.

That's a clue the problem is some setting in the receiver.

Could you answer my other question: You are in North America and are playing domestic DVDs, not imports?

You don't have the player TV System set to PAL, do you?

Does your display have an info On Screen Display that will show the resolution and frame rate of the incoming signal? What does it show for the signal that does work when the player is connected directly to the display, but does not work when going through the receiver?

-Bill
post #14253 of 16420
Quote:
Originally Posted by macnewbie View Post

What confuses me the most is that the Oppo main menu does not display either. Any ideas what kind of output the menu is?

If I bypass the receiver and connect directly to the TV everything works as expected.
Quote:
Originally Posted by wmcclain View Post

My display says 1080@60, but doesn't specify progressive or interlaced.
If I set the Oppo's 'TV System' option to 'NTSC', my LG TV reports 1080p 60Hz. If I set the Oppo's 'TV System' option to 'PAL', my LG TV reports 1080p 50Hz. And if I set the Oppos 'TV System' option to 'Multi-system', my LG TV reports 1080p 50Hz.

EDIT: If your Denon AVR-X4000Your receiver is anything like my Onkyo, it offers a whole host of post-processing options 'by default'... If so, try turning them off?
Edited by SeeMoreDigital - 1/13/14 at 7:28am
post #14254 of 16420
I just updated my 103 to the latest official FW (BDP10X-67-1204). I have a question on the new "Auto" setting for DSD. I had my 103 set to DSD for stereo SACD playback using the analog output. For multichannel SACD playback I use the HDMI 1 output so it would force the setting to PCM. But with the new FW with the DSD setting I get no audio signal from the HDMI 1 output. When I use the Auto setting it works fine and defaults to PCM for multichannel playback. When I switched over to my activity for stereo SACD playback (Parasound 2100 preamp with the 103 analog output) it appears that it is in DSD mode as the PCM icon is not showing on the 103's display.

So my question for the "Auto" DSD mode is that if one is using the analog outputs of the 103 does it default to DSD automatically? In the FW notes for item #5 it states "Added the "Auto" mode when choosing the SACD output audio format. This mode is available at the Setup Menu -> Audio Format Setup -> SACD Output". This doesn't really go into much detail so it makes me wonder how the "Auto" DSD mode actually works. Everything seems to be working fine but I was just curious as to the "Auto" mode smile.gif.

Bill
post #14255 of 16420
Hi Bill,

The standard BDP-103 passes DSD via HDMI output #2 only. What happens if you use this connection?
post #14256 of 16420
Quote:
Originally Posted by SeeMoreDigital View Post

Hi Bill,

The standard BDP-103 passes DSD via HDMI output #2 only. What happens if you use this connection?

Hi SMD,

I'm not sure but I can try it. Before the update the 103 would default to PCM when using HDMI 1. This is what I wanted so it worked fine. My 4311 has low LFE issues when it receives a DSD signal so PCM is the best setting for multichannel SACDs. I'm just curious as to how the "Auto" mode works.

Bill
post #14257 of 16420
The auto mode will be able to detect if your receiving unit can decode DSD.
If it can't, then it will send PCM. For the ~103, HDMI-1 will always be PCM, so the auto detection is basically for HDMI-2 output only.
The restriction of DSD through HDMI-1 is removed on the newer ~103D player, so with that player the auto feature will work on both HDMI-1 & 2.
post #14258 of 16420
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill Mac View Post

So my question for the "Auto" DSD mode is that if one is using the analog outputs of the 103 does it default to DSD automatically? In the FW notes for item #5 it states "Added the "Auto" mode when choosing the SACD output audio format. This mode is available at the Setup Menu -> Audio Format Setup -> SACD Output". This doesn't really go into much detail so it makes me wonder how the "Auto" DSD mode actually works. Everything seems to be working fine but I was just curious as to the "Auto" mode smile.gif.

Bill

I believe the "Auto" DSD mode works similar to the other "Auto" modes in that it uses the HDMI handshake to connected devices to determine what their capabilities are and select the appropriate mode accordingly. DSD is never output on HDMI 1, so just as with the manual settings if DSD is selected (based on something connected to HDMI 2 that is DSD compatible) there will be no audio output on HDMI 1. I'm a little confused by your former results, because with DSD selected there should have been no audio output on HDMI 1 when the source material is DSD.

From the User Manual:
Quote:
NOTE
Due to the hardware limitation, DSD output is only available from the HDMI 2 OUT port. To listen to SACD using the HDMI 1 OUT port, please set SACD Output to PCM.

To the best of my recollection, using HDMI 1 didn't force the setting to PCM. It simply would not output audio on HDMI 1 if DSD was selected as the setting. Additionally, what is or is not connected to the analog outputs should have no effect on the mode activated when Auto is selected. This setting has NO effect on any source material that is not DSD.
post #14259 of 16420
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill Mac View Post

When I switched over to my activity for stereo SACD playback (Parasound 2100 preamp with the 103 analog output) it appears that it is in DSD mode as the PCM icon is not showing on the 103's display.

This may be the case if you have turned off the connected device on the HMDI 1 port when you do this. I'm assuming that is your Denon 4311 preamp. It may also be the case if the preamp is not selected to the HDMI input from the Oppo. If the connected HDMI device's HDMI port is not active then it will not communicate it's capabilities via the HDMI handshake. It's as if HDMI is not connected at all. I would assume that the BDP-103 would switch to DSD output if DSD Auto is selected and no HDMI ports are connected or active so that DSD without PCM conversion would be available for the analog outputs.
post #14260 of 16420
Quote:
Originally Posted by Smarty-pants View Post

The auto mode will be able to detect if your receiving unit can decode DSD.
If it can't, then it will send PCM. For the ~103, HDMI-1 will always be PCM, so the auto detection is basically for HDMI-2 output only.
The restriction of DSD through HDMI-1 is removed on the newer ~103D player, so with that player the auto feature will work on both HDMI-1 & 2.

My 4311 is DSD capable and with my 103 set to DSD the 4311 indicates no signal is present when using HDMI 1. Which is correct as the 103 will not send DSD over HDMI 1. When I switch the DSD setting to "Auto" then I get a PCM audio. So I guess with this new DSD setting DSD will not default to PCM as it did before. My question remains that when using the "Auto" setting will the 103 default to DSD when using the analog output to an analog preamp. It seems that it does because when I switch to using my Parasound 2100 the PCM icon is not on. If I turn on my 4311 the signal changes to PCM. This is even with my 2100 set to play. So it appears that the 103 is detecting that the output signal is analog (to the 2100) and is allowing the 103 to convert DSD to an analog signal. So it looks like I answered my own question smile.gif. Once again Oppo makes improvements with their players in a way that works quite well.

Bill
post #14261 of 16420
Quote:
Originally Posted by wmcclain View Post

My display says 1080@60, but doesn't specify progressive or interlaced.
That's a clue the problem is some setting in the receiver.

Could you answer my other question: You are in North America and are playing domestic DVDs, not imports?

You don't have the player TV System set to PAL, do you?

Does your display have an info On Screen Display that will show the resolution and frame rate of the incoming signal? What does it show for the signal that does work when the player is connected directly to the display, but does not work when going through the receiver?

-Bill

Yes North America and playing domestic DVD's - Disney & other kid stuff.
Quote:
Originally Posted by SeeMoreDigital View Post

If I set the Oppo's 'TV System' option to 'NTSC', my LG TV reports 1080p 60Hz. If I set the Oppo's 'TV System' option to 'PAL', my LG TV reports 1080p 50Hz. And if I set the Oppos 'TV System' option to 'Multi-system', my LG TV reports 1080p 50Hz.

EDIT: If your Denon AVR-X4000Your receiver is anything like my Onkyo, it offers a whole host of post-processing options 'by default'... If so, try turning them off?

I'll try turning the AVR's processing off and report back.

I also have a call into Denon support as I agree with Bill that the problem seems to be in the receiver.
post #14262 of 16420
Quote:
Originally Posted by KC-Technerd View Post

I believe the "Auto" DSD mode works similar to the other "Auto" modes in that it uses the HDMI handshake to connected devices to determine what their capabilities are and select the appropriate mode accordingly. DSD is never output on HDMI 1, so just as with the manual settings if DSD is selected (based on something connected to HDMI 2 that is DSD compatible) there will be no audio output on HDMI 1. I'm a little confused by your former results, because with DSD selected there should have been no audio output on HDMI 1 when the source material is DSD.

From the User Manual:
To the best of my recollection, using HDMI 1 didn't force the setting to PCM. It simply would not output audio on HDMI 1 if DSD was selected as the setting. Additionally, what is or is not connected to the analog outputs should have no effect on the mode activated when Auto is selected. This setting has NO effect on any source material that is not DSD.

I am 100% positive that with the earlier FW when the 103 was set to DSD it would default to PCM when using HDMI 1. I found this by accident when I moved some cables around a few months ago. It actually worked very well for me as I no longer had to go into the 103's menu to change the setting to DSD or PCM depending on which SACDs I was listening to (MCH or stereo).
Quote:
Originally Posted by KC-Technerd View Post

This may be the case if you have turned off the connected device on the HMDI 1 port when you do this. I'm assuming that is your Denon 4311 preamp. It may also be the case if the preamp is not selected to the HDMI input from the Oppo. If the connected HDMI device's HDMI port is not active then it will not communicate it's capabilities via the HDMI handshake. It's as if HDMI is not connected at all. I would assume that the BDP-103 would switch to DSD output if DSD Auto is selected and no HDMI ports are connected or active so that DSD without PCM conversion would be available for the analog outputs.

I believe your thoughts are correct. With both the 4311 and the 2100 on the signal is PCM which is indicated on the 103's display. As soon as I turn off the 4311 the PCM icon on the 103 is gone. So it does appear dependent on a handshake with HDMI. If none is present then the 103 defaults to DSD when the "Auto" mode is selected. Nice detective work KC smile.gif!

Bill
Edited by Bill Mac - 1/13/14 at 9:19am
post #14263 of 16420
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill Mac View Post

So I guess with this new DSD setting DSD will not default to PCM as it did before.

I think PCM was the old default setting for SACD output. I don't think this had anything at all to do with what was connected to the BDP-103. Auto is the new default. PCM is still a selection option, just not the default.
post #14264 of 16420
OK, I am officially irritated. Can someone verify which OPPO app I need to control my 103? The Remote Control or the Media Control? I didn't have any luck getting either to work when I have my network adapter plugged into the back. It would scan for the device but I got nothing.

I can download both of these apps my Samsung Galaxy S4. However, I cannot download the Remote Control (silver icon) on my iPad (not in App Store) and I cannot download EITHER app on a Kindle Fire. They are not available in the Kindle (Amazon) Store from what I hear. Has anyone on this thread had any success getting an OPPO app on a Kindle? If I can't do it, I may scrap using the Kindle down there altogether...

Screenshots of both apps on my Android:

Media Control:


Remote Control:
post #14265 of 16420
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill Mac View Post

I am 100% positive that with the earlier FW when the 103 was set to DSD it would default to PCM when using HDMI 1. I found this by accident when I moved some cables around a few months ago. It actually worked very well for me as I no longer had to go into the 103's menu to change the setting to DSD or PCM depending on which SACDs I was listening to (MCH or stereo).

I didn't try it on every firmware version, so it's possible that there was a version (or versions) where selecting DSD functioned like Auto does now. Some of the beta testers might be able to verify if that was the case.
post #14266 of 16420
Anybody else experiencing lip sync issues for the first time after newest beta firmware? I have had 103 for over a year with zero lip sync issues until updating to new beta firmware. It seems to be happening to everything I play, Blu-ray and MKV.
post #14267 of 16420
Quote:
Originally Posted by KC-Technerd View Post

I think PCM was the old default setting for SACD output. I don't think this had anything at all to do with what was connected to the BDP-103. Auto is the new default. PCM is still a selection option, just not the default.

It might have been the default for HDMI 1 but not for HDMI 2 as you could select either DSD or PCM if your processor was DSD capable.

Quote:
Originally Posted by KC-Technerd View Post

I didn't try it on every firmware version, so it's possible that there was a version (or versions) where selecting DSD functioned like Auto does now. Some of the beta testers might be able to verify if that was the case.

Believe me DSD defaulted to PCM when using HDMI 1 with a DSD capable processor with the earlier FW.

Bill
post #14268 of 16420
Quote:
Originally Posted by AnnapolisSony View Post

OK, I am officially irritated. Can someone verify which OPPO app I need to control my 103? The Remote Control or the Media Control? I didn't have any luck getting either to work when I have my network adapter plugged into the back. It would scan for the device but I got nothing.

I can download both of these apps my Samsung Galaxy S4. However, I cannot download the Remote Control (silver icon) on my iPad (not in App Store) and I cannot download EITHER app on a Kindle Fire. They are not available in the Kindle (Amazon) Store from what I hear. Has anyone on this thread had any success getting an OPPO app on a Kindle? If I can't do it, I may scrap using the Kindle down there altogether...

Either should work. The remote app does nothing more than duplicate the BDP-103's remote control on your smart phone. The Media Control App adds a direct media access menu. You are correct that the Remote Control app is not available for the iPad, and I don't believe either is available for the Kindle.

Make sure that the BDP-103 is either turned on, or is in Quick Start Standby Mode before you allow the apps to scan for it. If the BDP-103 is turned off and is in Energy Efficient Standby Mode, then it is not active on your network and the apps won't find it when they scan. Additionally you won't be able to turn the BDP-103 on with the apps unless it is in Quick Start Standby Mode.
post #14269 of 16420
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill Mac View Post

It might have been the default for HDMI 1 but not for HDMI 2 as you could select either DSD or PCM if your processor was DSD capable.

Bill

I don't think you understand what I mean by default. By default, I mean when the unit was first delivered, or when a reset was done (such as following a firmware update), the setting would be set to PCM. Default doesn't mean that you can't select other options. You could always set DSD or PCM. The setting itself was never limited by what was or was not connected to each of the HDMI ports.

Default simply means what the unit will set itself to during a reset. You can always set it to something else afterwards.
Quote:
default - a preselected option adopted by a computer program or other mechanism when no alternative is specified by the user or programmer.

Edited by KC-Technerd - 1/13/14 at 9:43am
post #14270 of 16420
Quote:
Originally Posted by KC-Technerd View Post

I don't think you understand what I mean by default. By default, I mean when the unit was first delivered, or when a reset was done (such as following a firmware update), the setting would be set to PCM. Default doesn't mean that you can't select other options. You could always set DSD or PCM. The setting itself was never limited by what was or was not connected to each of the HDMI ports.

Default simply means what the unit will set itself to during a reset. You can always set it to something else afterwards.

[default - a preselected option adopted by a computer program or other mechanism when no alternative is specified by the user or programmer.

I misunderstood your earlier post. No need to post a meaning for the term, I get it.

Bill
post #14271 of 16420
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill Mac View Post

Believe me DSD defaulted to PCM when using HDMI 1 with a DSD capable processor with the earlier FW.

Bill

I may very well be mistaken about this, but everything I have seen leads me to believe that the PCM and DSD options of the SACD Output setting work no differently than they did before. When SACD Output is or was set by the user to PCM (or defaulted to PCM because the user didn't change the setting) both HDMI 1 and HDMI 2 output PCM converted from DSD. When SACD Output was is or was set by the user to DSD, HDMI 1 outputs no audio and HDMI 2 outputs DSD.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill Mac View Post

It might have been the default for HDMI 1 but not for HDMI 2 as you could select either DSD or PCM if your processor was DSD capable.

You could always select DSD or PCM regardless of any processor. Both selections were and are available regardless of what is connected to either the HDMI 1 port or HDMI 2 port.
post #14272 of 16420
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill Mac View Post

I misunderstood your earlier post. No need to post a meaning for the term, I get it.

Bill

I just needed to be sure we were both using the term in the same manner so we could effectively communicate about the questions you had. Your previous post implied that you were applying a very different meaning to the word than what I understand the meaning of the word to be.
post #14273 of 16420
Quote:
Originally Posted by KC-Technerd View Post

I may very well be mistaken about this, but everything I have seen leads me to believe that the PCM and DSD options of the SACD Output setting work no differently than they did before. When SACD Output is or was set by the user to PCM (or defaulted to PCM because the user didn't change the setting) both HDMI 1 and HDMI 2 output PCM converted from DSD. When SACD Output was is or was set by the user to DSD, HDMI 1 outputs no audio and HDMI 2 outputs DSD.

You are mistaken. Here I am using the 103 in my system for quite awhile in a way that I described earlier regarding the DSD setting. Now you are trying to tell me I must be mistaken even though you never tried what I was doing with a previous FW. No offense but this really frustrates me when someone like youself tries to tell someone they are wrong when they have no experience with what is being discussed.

Bill
Edited by Bill Mac - 1/13/14 at 10:46am
post #14274 of 16420
Quote:
Originally Posted by KC-Technerd View Post

I just needed to be sure we were both using the term in the same manner so we could effectively communicate about the questions you had. Your previous post implied that you were applying a very different meaning to the word than what I understand the meaning of the word to be.

I got your point. The need to post the terminology is condescending IMO.

Bill
post #14275 of 16420
Quote:
Originally Posted by KC-Technerd View Post

Either should work. The remote app does nothing more than duplicate the BDP-103's remote control on your smart phone. The Media Control App adds a direct media access menu. You are correct that the Remote Control app is not available for the iPad, and I don't believe either is available for the Kindle.

Make sure that the BDP-103 is either turned on, or is in Quick Start Standby Mode before you allow the apps to scan for it. If the BDP-103 is turned off and is in Energy Efficient Standby Mode, then it is not active on your network and the apps won't find it when they scan. Additionally you won't be able to turn the BDP-103 on with the apps unless it is in Quick Start Standby Mode.

Thanks so much for the feedback. The painters are in my basement for the next 3 days so I probably will not get everything put back together until the end of the week to give it a shot.

It's interesting. I own a couple of iPads that I use but I really like the feel of the Kindle Fire as a remote in my media room. Not too big and not too small. Since I cannot get either of the OPPO apps in the Kindle/Amazon store, I am attempting to sideload the apps on my Kindle Fire. It's been done with hundreds of Android apps...so hopefully it will work for the OPPO app as well. If anyone is interested in how to sideload apps on a Kindle Fire, here is the article:

HOW TO SIDELOAD ANDROID APPS ON A KINDLE FIRE
post #14276 of 16420
Quote:
Originally Posted by wmcclain View Post

My display says 1080@60, but doesn't specify progressive or interlaced.
That's a clue the problem is some setting in the receiver.

Could you answer my other question: You are in North America and are playing domestic DVDs, not imports?

You don't have the player TV System set to PAL, do you?

Does your display have an info On Screen Display that will show the resolution and frame rate of the incoming signal? What does it show for the signal that does work when the player is connected directly to the display, but does not work when going through the receiver?

-Bill
Quote:
Originally Posted by macnewbie View Post

Yes North America and playing domestic DVD's - Disney & other kid stuff.
I'll try turning the AVR's processing off and report back.

I also have a call into Denon support as I agree with Bill that the problem seems to be in the receiver.

So I have been playing with this for the past two hours trying to isolate the source of the problem. If I bypass my in-wall HDMI cable and hook up the AVR output directly to the TV (still using HDMI), everything works as expected, so the culprit is obviously the cable. But I am floored that some types of signals would work and others would not, even if originating from the same source. Is this even possible?
post #14277 of 16420
Quote:
Originally Posted by macnewbie View Post


So I have been playing with this for the past two hours trying to isolate the source of the problem. If I bypass my in-wall HDMI cable and hook up the AVR output directly to the TV (still using HDMI), everything works as expected, so the culprit is obviously the cable. But I am floored that some types of signals would work and others would not, even if originating from the same source. Is this even possible?

Yes, some signals are higher bandwidth than others, which can cause problems with the cabling. 1080p60 is higher bandwidth than 1080p24.

Do you know how long your in-wall cabling is?

-Bill
post #14278 of 16420
It is 50ft. The one I used to test outside the wall is also 50ft.

Isn't Blu-ray the more demanding application, though?
post #14279 of 16420
Quote:
Originally Posted by macnewbie View Post

It is 50ft. The one I used to test outside the wall is also 50ft.

Isn't Blu-ray the more demanding application, though?

With the in-wall cable, are you using any jack plates?
Is there one cable involved, or several?
Perhaps one from the tv to the wall, one inside the wall, one from the wall to the AVR?
post #14280 of 16420
Quote:
Originally Posted by LairdWilliams View Post

With the in-wall cable, are you using any jack plates?
Is there one cable involved, or several?
Perhaps one from the tv to the wall, one inside the wall, one from the wall to the AVR?

One cable TV to AVR.
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