Official OPPO BDP-103 Owner's Thread - Page 157

Thanks bob for all your input, highly appreciated. Can't wait to hear oppo's response to your reported finding.

I actually used a 105 for testing this, but we're keeping firmware discussions in here unless they are unique to the 105.

The suggestion to compare vs Source Direct is a good one, but I've not done that yet.
--Bob

Foobar is another controller application which will play gapless (to players/renderers supporting that feature) but unfortuately the BDP-103 does not have the ability to play gapless files no matter which controller application you use.

I also contacted Oppo regarding the lack of a "last active" input setting and they responded that their engineers are working on it. Until a firmware update is available, I am just leaving my 103 powered-up 24/7 and leaving the input setting on "HDMI- In Back" which is where my Tivo is connected. With the 103 always on, we can turn on the TV and AVR... and were watching cable.

Thanks for the suggestion, Bob. I tried unplugging everything and didn't get any response. I'm sending OPPO this email:

 

----------

 

 

The conventional wisdom with Kuro displays is -15 for Sharpness, but I ended up with -12 on my Kuro 500M with the 103. Using the pixel/gamma pattern at the center of the S&M Image Cropping test pattern as a guide, changing Sharpness in the Kuro definitely affects gamma. I found a setting of -12 causes no noticeable artifacts, but gets the gamma in line. I never even considered changing the settings in the Oppo because that's generally a no-no in my opinion, but like Bob says, it might be a bug in the 103.


Interesting, have you mentioned this elsewhere in the thread? I wonder if my gripes about Netflix and Vudu on HDMI 1 at 1080p would be resolved with Sharpness at +1 in the Oppo. I'm going to give this a try and report back. I'm assuming this issue began with the latest official firmware.

I can say for certain that Source Direct is clearly the best for streaming 1080p on Netflix and Vudu. I've done extensive comparisons between HDMI 1 and HDMI 2 at both 1080p and Source Direct, and 1080p is clearly softer in both cases. I haven't done any Blu-ray comparisons because I've only watched a few discs and was generally pleased with the image quality, but they were discs I hadn't watched before and wouldn't have caught any issues caused by the player unless they were blatantly obvious. I did watch an episode of ST:TNG on Blu-ray and remember thinking that it looked softer than other episodes. I assumed it was an anomaly. Perhaps not. I'm going to do some further testing tonight. Sounds like Bob is on to something.
Edited by thirdkind - 1/19/13 at 9:06am

The Oppo is capable of being a Digital Media Renderer, which means that content can be pushed to it from a Digital Media Controller. Many of the DMCs will be iphones, androids, tablets, etc. The current beat of Media monkey (4.1) adds support for DMC. It does work, but I am finding that it only plays about 60% of my flacs (they are working on it). Gapless and cross-fading are supported although I don't use either. I am really surprised that JRiver doesn't support gapless -- you might want to google that.

Thanks Bob. I wanted to let you know I read this and to thank you for your help. I won't be able to experiment with this until this coming Tues. I appreciate the willingness and time of individuals to help each other on this forum and especially for the more experienced people, such as yourself, to share their knowledge. Bob, you are coming up on 25,000 messages! That is a lot of help. Very Well Done!

Sorry, just saw this. I would have thought that since the DMC is controlling the Oppo that the DMC would push gapless, crossfade or whatever. I could not confirm in my system, because MM is only playing one track at a time at the moment.

I just purchased this remarkable media player and am having a challenge configuring my system. I am running a dual HDMI output to my Sharp LC-52D92U monitor and the other output to my Denon AVR-990. The Set-up menu has been assigned to "Split A/V". The AVR, with several other components providing AV signal inputs, outputs to the Sharp monitor through a separate HDMI connection.

The problem for me is that when I select the Sharp HDMI input that originated from the Oppo, I see the video signal on the monitor, but the audio does not work. If I then change the input on the Sharp from HDMI 1 (the oppo) to HDMI 2 (the AVR), then I get audio and video, but the video has been degraded by the unnecessary routing through the AVR.

Somehow, the Sharp monitor seems to be effecting the behavior of the AVR audio based upon which HDMI input to the monitor is active.

My questions:

(a) Does this description of the problem make sense?

(b) Does anyone know how to correct the problem so that the AVR audio will be audible while the video input to the monitor is from the Oppo?

I can't help with your overall setup, but I can give you some background with OPPO and Denon. I've run a Denon 3806 and the OPPO 83 and OPPO 93 going through the AVR via HDMI. I'm now running a Denon 3312 with the OPPO 93 going through the Denon via HDMI. Both Denon AVRs were connected via HDMI to our Panasonic 8G Kuro display. All other external sources are also connected directly to the Denon AVR.

Our audio and video has been calibrated twice by Jeff Meier (UMR at AVS), and there has never been any problem with the 1080p output from our OPPO players being degraded by the Denon AVRs. You may have some Denon settings that need modification, but I doubt that the video is being degraded due to passing through the Denon. If that were the case, Jeff would have suggested using both HDMI outputs on the OPPO 93.

I'm only interested in blu ray PQ my current player is a 2009 Sony bdp s360 if I upgrade to the bdp 103 how much better PQ can I expect is there any cheaper players I could get that would give me same blu eay PQ as the bdp 103 since I don't need all the other features like Netflix theres a lot of talk about Netflix isn't Netflix filled with old played out movies that everyone has already seen WHATS THE BIG DEAL? I don't get it...

I know blu ray PQ is pretty much same on all blu ray players but i'm looking for the "extra pop or wow factor, be it contrast or colour boost, or sharpness or noise reduction." noise reduction for blu ray is not needed I was reading online also I think my tv has almost all these options

the bdp 103 reviews on amazon is what got my attention and I like the HDMI inputs I can connect my laptop to it and get better PQ for youtube and pictures

my tv is a 46" Sony KDL-46V4100 with AMAZINGPQ when it comes to blu rays


thanks in advance for advice and recommendations
Edited by ace54 - 1/19/13 at 2:01pm

There no video "degradation" from routing through the AVR, unless the AVR is not appropriately set up. Unless you have a specific need to bypass the AVR with video (like 3D support), then you should stick with a single connect through the AVR. Some folks might argue that the Denon's ABT 2010 processor is superior to the Oppo's Qdeo, so you do have a choice which to use. But either way there's no need to bypass it, just set it up appropriately depending on whether you wish to do scaling in the player or AVR.

That said, your issue sounds like one that might be helped with an update to the latest firmware if you haven't already done so. But it sounds like the player is sending a video format that the AVR doesn't support. That causes a loss of audio too.

Following up on my earlier post, and addressing Bob's suspicions, I'm not of the belief that boosting Sharpness in the Oppo to +1 results in the "correct" output. Based on my tests with the S&M disc, there's no difference in detail between 1080p and Source Direct with Blu-ray content, which tells me that the current Sharpness setting is right where it should be. When I boost Sharpness to +1, there is slight ringing/shadowing around bright objects (the Image Cropping test pattern is great for this because it has single-pixel white lines and white numbers on screen). I'd certainly prefer the results of the +1 setting not be the default output; I'd consider that unacceptable from a reference player.

Also, boosting Sharpness to +1 did nothing to improve Netflix with the Oppo set to 1080p. Source Direct is still the best option for streaming content in my opinion. Setting the Oppo to 1080p for Netflix introduces heavy noise reduction that's removing film grain (yes, newer HD transfers on Netflix are quite capable of resolving grain at High / HD).

OPPO has a 30 day return. The extra cost to you is only return shipping. You could try it and see for yourself if it is worth it to you.

-Bill

I got the "your TV does not support this program's content protection" message tonight after using my Oppo for about 2 months now.

My TV only has 1 HDMI input so I have to run Directv through the Oppo unless I want to manually switch cables for different device usage.

When HDMI goes straight from Directv box to my TV everything is fine, when I run it through the Oppo I get that message on the HD movie channels and then the Oppo freezes or if I can get it to change channels it is choppy and out of synch until I restart the Oppo.

I read that other people have had this message too, I was wondering what is the latest on this issue? My unit has the latest firmware (1220) update. I tried some different video output resolution settings, but that didn't help.

Is there a reason you don't use deep color?

I believe oppo is aware of the issue and is looking at improving the overall hdcp handshake process when using the oppo input.

My display does not support Deep Color input, and although my Anthem D2v DOES support it, the combo tests better with the OPPO sending out 24-bit video.
--Bob

As I stated above, like the original poster with this idea -- the guy with the calibrated Kuro display -- I'm seeing ZERO ringing on Spears & Munsil using HDMI Sharpness +1.

Also, I've now completed testing HDMI 1 1080p vs. Source Direct for VUDU HDX streams and I can not duplicate your report. (This is with Sharpness 0.) Both look equally good without the plastic skin surfaces you mentioned.

I've not been able to test this with Netflix yet as the Netflix server farm serving my area is playing games again -- sending supposed "HD" streams as "SD" instead.

Now the fact that we've come up with different results doesn't necessarily mean either of us got it wrong. There may be other differences in our setups which affect the answer. For example, I don't use Deep Color, and I use YCbCr 4:4:4 output. If you use Deep Color or a different Color Space output the results could conceivably be different.

That's what makes it so hard to make hard and fast recommendations about this stuff.

As I stated in my post above (responding to the other fellow who started this Sharpness +1 chain of thought), there may be something else underlying these findings than the "simple" answer that OPPO selected the wrong default for Sharpness.

As I stated, in my testing, so far I've not found a down-side to using Sharpness +1. You have, and that's useful additional information.
--Bob

We here at "Bob Pariseau" thank you for your kind words, and have been told we may even be allowed some time outside to celebrate when the 25K mark is reached.
--Bob

I've been quietly testing this since RICKYDENIM's original report some time back. Making a recommendation like this is not something I would normally do without compelling (to me) evidence. I know what OPPO goes through to make sure their defaults are properly chosen, and that the HDMI results using the default settings truly are "reference" results. I finally decided I had reached that point last night. I.e., that there is a bug.

The real trick here is to find the underlying cause. I doubt it is as simple as OPPO just having picked the wrong default value. But so far, I've found no issues with using Sharpness +1 as a "workaround" while that's still being sorted out.
--bob

Thanks, Bob. It's always interesting comparing results.

I'm using RGB Video with Deep Color enabled (36-bit). Kuros don't play well with YCbCr, unfortunately, and I get a bit of banding that's smoothed out with Deep Color on.

With Sharpness +1, the artifact I see is very slight. At a normal viewing distance, I can't see it on a test pattern, but it's normal for me to press my nose to the screen and flip back and forth between 0 and +1 while looking for problems

It took a lot of comparisons using the same source material for me to find that HDMI 1 at 1080p is softer than Source Direct on Netflix. My first report was definitely laden with hyperbole; faces aren't completely waxed over. However, film grain is definitely the first casualty. I've been using an episode of Twin Peaks that has a shot of the moon set against a black sky as test material. On Source Direct, it has a fair amount of natural film grain that's very active. On 1080p, the grain is pretty much gone. I've also been using Sherlock Holmes and The Tudors, which have very good HD transfers on Netflix. The Tudors has some great old age makeup in the final episodes that has a lot of fine detail, some of which gets lost at 1080p output.

Whatever Oppo finds, I'm sure they'll be thorough and the end result of any tweaks to the firmware will be a good one.

After using the 103 in my system for a week I finally got around to trying the HDMI input. Here is what i did:

HDMI cable that was plugged into HDMI input on receiver moved to the HDMI input on the Oppo.

After I selected the HDMI back input from the Oppo's remote,I received a static picture from a program (as if on pause) and no sound.

My receiver is a Pioneer Elite VSX-33 and my cable box is a Cisco RNG-200N

Not sure if I am hooking something wrong, or something else. Any ideas?

Just to add the confusion, I've noticed that I get video results when streaming over network compared to direct from USB. I have ripped Prometheus to my HD and when streaming over DNLA I was getting a few banding issues,flickering rocks/floor grates type of thing. I disconnected the HDD and connected it via USB and replayed the same scenes and the issues weren't there!

@thirdkind - When testing on the Spears disc I played around with using Oppo sharpness +1 and Kuro sharpness from -15 up to -8 etc. When shifting the Kuro sharpness I definitely got issues when getting past 10 as you mentioned yourself, and ended up changing my -15 to -13 as it showed no issue at all. When I then shifted my Oppo sharpness to +1 I noticed that the lines were bolder and more pronounced but no ringing at all.

For me, the Oppo sharpness to +1 is night and day to all 1080p content I've played. +2 is definitely too much. I do still get banding and some flicker on certain high detail frequency but changing the sharpness to 0 doesn't make this any less. I think that's the Kuro possibly showing it's age!

I've been happily using my BDP-83 strictly as a Blu Ray player. I have a few key questions I need answered before making the decision to replace it with a BDP-103.

1) Will I see a discernable improvement in Blu Ray picture quality if I move to a BD-103?

2) Can the HDMI input on the 103 be used to connect to the output of my Comcast cable box/dvr and then upscale the output of the cable box to 1080P with good results?

3) Is the interface and ease of use of the 103 for streaming Netflix, etc. well done enough that I can skip purchasing an Apple TV I was going to purchase for that purpose?


Thanks very much for any help.


John

The HDMI handshake when multiple HDMI-enabled devices are involved in a relay is still rather fragile. Very often the sequence of power on/off helps (you need to experiment to decide which one is crucial to be "power on last" or "power off first").

But when you are using the HDMI input of the 103 to relay through it to the AVR, you might try changing the input on your AVR to be some other HDMI input (no matter whether it's actually connected to anything), wait a few seconds, and then switch back to the Oppo's HDMI input on the AVR. These actions trigger a re-handshake, and almost always when you come back to the Oppo you'll now be able to see the external input relaying through the HDMI input on the back.

Or, when you do come back to the Oppo's input on your AVR you may still have to use the Oppo remote to re-select BluRay movie (even if you don't have a disk in), wait a few seconds, and then re-select HDMI input on the back. Once again, this action has a high probability of finally getting the HDMI handshakes to all work properly and you'll finally see your DVR relayed through the 103 relayed through the AVR and finally out on your HDTV.


You're not alone. I go through this same nonsense sequence when I want to use my Windows Media Center Extender (Linksys DMA2100) input to the back of my 103 relaying through the 103 to my Yamaha RX-V867 and out to my HDTV. And don't forget, your HDTV is yet one more HDMI-enabled device in this multiple HDMI device chain which also participates in the overall handshake.

Has any one ever had any audio issues with the Pixar movie "Brave". Weirdly after I fast forwarded it the audio all sounded robotic and unintelligible. I've a also had an issue with Snow White and the huntsman where the dialogue just cut out. Just the dialogue though no other audio. Once i stop the movie Brave and start it again it works fine though. This is clearly a player issue. I know it's new but it seems very abnormal and extremely annoying. I never had 1 issue with my OPPO 83. Seems odd I now have had 2 audio related issues within 1 month now with the 103 and on two fairly older movies. Firmware isn't the issue because other wise the movie works.

No problem here with either disc. Get in touch with OPPO Tech Support as your player may need warranty service.

They will likely ask you to do a firmware re-install and complete reset of the player just to get the player into a known state for diagnosing this:

1) Download a fresh copy of the Official 1220 firmware for USB install and put it on your USB stick.

2) Remove any disc, power cycle the player and re-install the firmware. Accept all 3 parts of the firmware as offered.

3) When the player powers down at the end of that, remove the USB stick, power up and do a complete Reset Factory Defaults. Also Erase Persistent Storage.

4) Power down and pull the power plug for about 10 seconds. Do not skip this step.

5) Power up and re-enter your personal settings.

6) Power down once more (settings are saved during power down).

Now see if the problem still happens.

How are you cabled for audio? Using HDMI audio or Analog? One HDMI cable or two? HDMI LPCM or HDMI Bitstream? It sounds like your sound processor is unhappy with what it's getting on the Center speaker channel (which is where the dialog lives). If using HDMI audio, try both LPCM and Bitstream output and see if the problem happens with both.
--Bob

Well for Snow White it was a center channel issue. Once I stopped and started the disc again it worked fine. But the weird thing is the dialogue cut out at the exact same part of the disc every time I rewound to the minute before it happened, tricking me into thinking it was a disc issue, but then worked properly when I shut it down and restarted it. With Brave I was fast forwarding and then when I hit play all of a sudden all channels had a very robotic sound not just the center channel. The issue with Snow White happened before the most recent firmware update and Brave happened with the most recent firmware update. So an audio issue occurred on two different updates. I reset to factory settings all the time after every update and also erase Persistent Storage. I am using one HDMI cable, the same one that came with my 83 and bit streaming the audio. All other electronics work fine connected to my receiver (Onkyo 709) this is clearly an OPPO compatibility issue or player/firmware issue. I'll call OPPO but its not something that is just reproduced and has now produced two separate audio issues. I'm assuming they're going to walk me through some pointless steps and then I'll just sit and use my player until the issue occurs again when I will need to call them and send it in for a warranty repair. I'm honestly dissappointed. After the bullet proof 83 I feel like the 103 is having a little QC control issues. I do love the player and I know OPPO will rectify all issues free of charge. I'm just disappointed since I've had a few other issues with this player since I purchased it and never had one with the 83 in 3 years of use. I guess these are the issues with buying first batch electronics.
Edited by Semp1 - 1/19/13 at 11:22pm