Official OPPO BDP-103 Owner's Thread - Page 183

Originally Posted by Bob Pariseau 


There are two possibilities here. Either the AVR is not properly initializing the new digital audio stream processing or the HDMI handshake has left the processor confused as to what form of digital audio is coming in.

I recommend you try HDMI Audio LPCM instead of either Bitstream or Auto. AVRs that have problems initializing a newly started Bitstream will often not have problems when the digital audio input is LPCM.

I also recommend you try some experiments with lowering the bandwidth on the HDMI cable. This would include turning off Deep Color in the OPPO and temporarily trying a lower resolution (1080i or 720p -- don't go lower, as the high bit rate audio tracks can not be carried on HDMI when the video resolution is lower than 720p).

If the audio works without problems at 720p or 1080i, but still fails at 1080p (or 1080p plus Deep Color), than that is strong evidence of marginal cabling. Try upgrading your HDMI cables. Keep in mind that HDMI is an end to end protocol so the problem could be the HDMI cable on the OUTPUT side of the AVR. If you have any adapters, wall plates, daisy-chained cables, HDMI switches, or other gizmos in the HDMI path, they alone could be the cause of the problem. Also note that for HDMI, too *SHORT* of a cable can give just as much problem as too *LONG* of a cable. The sweet spot length for HDMI between any two devices is 6 feet (2 meters). So an 18 inch HDMI cable could very well cause problems, as non-intuitive as that must seem. This has to do with how the HDMI chips "equalize" the signal on the cable to try to make longer cables work more reliably.
--Bob

Originally Posted by rickydenim 

I did some tests on the S&M disc and tried going from -15 sharpness on the Kuro back to -10 and leaving it at -15 and using the Oppo sharpness +1. What I found was that even when changing Kuro to -10 it wasn't as sharp as the Oppo and created halo's around the lines etc. Using the Oppo -1 created sharpness and more detailed lines and had no halos or errors. I could get the Kuro to -12 and Oppo sharpness +1 without any issues.
So adding more sharpness on the Kuro isn't the fix I'm afraid, they aren't doing the same thing.

Originally Posted by Bob Pariseau 

You are saying that the sliders in Picture Adjustment did not match the numeric values shown? That's not normal.

First check that you have current firmware. Check Setup > Device Setup > Firmware Information. Your "Main" firmware version should end "1220".

Next, do a complete reset of the player. NOTE: You will need to re-enter your Wifi information and account credentials for things like Netflix. Do it like this:

1) Remove any disc

2) Go into Setup and Erase Persistent Storage. Then Reset Factory Defaults > Erase Accounts and Settings

3) Power down the player. Then pull the power plug for about 10 seconds. Do not skip this step.

4) Power up and re-enter your personal settings.

5) Power down once more. Settings are saved during the power down cycle.

Check to see that your Picture Adjustment settings are now showing correctly. Keep an eye on them from time to time to see that the problem does not recur. If it DOES recur, call OPPO Tech Support as the settings memory may be failing in your unit.
--Bob

Originally Posted by rickydenim 

I did some tests on the S&M disc and tried going from -15 sharpness on the Kuro back to -10 and leaving it at -15 and using the Oppo sharpness +1. What I found was that even when changing Kuro to -10 it wasn't as sharp as the Oppo and created halo's around the lines etc. Using the Oppo -1 created sharpness and more detailed lines and had no halos or errors. I could get the Kuro to -12 and Oppo sharpness +1 without any issues.
So adding more sharpness on the Kuro isn't the fix I'm afraid, they aren't doing the same thing.

Originally Posted by bokes 

. The ability to reduce the intensity between
Off and Low is something that we are looking into, but based on the register data for this chipset, it is an all or nothing type of solution."

Originally Posted by rickydenim 

I did some tests on the S&M disc and tried going from -15 sharpness on the Kuro back to -10 and leaving it at -15 and using the Oppo sharpness +1. What I found was that even when changing Kuro to -10 it wasn't as sharp as the Oppo and created halo's around the lines etc. Using the Oppo -1 created sharpness and more detailed lines and had no halos or errors. I could get the Kuro to -12 and Oppo sharpness +1 without any issues.
So adding more sharpness on the Kuro isn't the fix I'm afraid, they aren't doing the same thing.

Originally Posted by bokes 

. The ability to reduce the intensity between
Off and Low is something that we are looking into, but based on the register data for this chipset, it is an all or nothing type of solution."

Originally Posted by subavision212 

Thanks for the steps, Bob. Did what you outlined and no change. Showing the exact same thing. Just to be sure here a pics and I will be checking with OPPO support to see what they have to say. oppo a.jpg 94k .jpg file oppo b.jpg 41k .jpg file oppo c.jpg 46k .jpg file

Originally Posted by Bob Pariseau 

That's backwards. RGB Video Level encodes Black as 16 and Reference White as 235. The values below 16 are the "blacker than black" values, and the values from 236 to 255 are the "peak white" values. The OPPO preserves the entire range from 0-255 with that encoding -- no clipping.

RGB PC Level encodes Black as 0 and Reference White as 255. There's no place to put "blacker than black" or "peak white" values so they are clipped to Black and Reference White.

Video for home theater uses RGB Video Level, which has the same data range as YCbCr (i.e., including "blacker than black" and "peak white" ranges). The data on the discs is YCbCr.

The reason for the two ranges outside of the Black to Reference White range is to provide headroom and footroom for video processing. This avoids artifacts that might occur by putting a hard cutoff at either end. This includes video processing both before the data is put on the disc and during playback.

RGB PC Level is used for computer graphics sent directly to a computer monitor. It doesn't need the extra ranges because the pixel values are being created on the fly by the graphics card instead of being produced through a video chain from film production through to disc transfer through to decoding, processing, and display. RGB PC Level is also used for video games for the same reason. The value of course is that it includes more "steps" between Black and Reference White. But again, video for home theater is encoded using the RGB Video Level = YCbCr format ranges so that's the one you want to use for reproduction, since otherwise the "fewer" steps of the home theater format must get converted to the "more" steps of RGB PC Level -- which produces rounding errors and banding (false contours) -- and any pixels with values in the "blacker than black" or "peak white" ranges get clipped.
--Bob

Originally Posted by Bob Pariseau 

Those 3 pictures look "normal" presuming you shifted Color Enhacement to +4 yourself for the 2nd picture.
--Bob

Originally Posted by subavision212 

I haven't changed any settings in picture adjustment since the day I hooked my 103 up. Followed your steps and just re-entered my Netflix and VUDU accounts. I have been using all the settings recommended in the BDP-103 Settings Checklist here since I bought the 103. At least until I changed the sharpness setting yesterday. The photo with +4 on the left is when I ran the slider all the way to the right. The 0 is untouched but it still has the +4 on the right. If you say that's normal that's good enough for me. Like I said, everything looks and is running fine when using it. thanks again.

Originally Posted by musicalfox 

First, I have not purchased the unit yet, but would it be fair to say that I will see a marked picture improvement over the Panasonic DMP-BD30 (my existing player)?

Originally Posted by Dickeymint 

I have recently had my 8g THX calibrated if I push YCbCr 4:2:2 to 4:4:4 and Deep Color on am I going to mess things up as he said to switch off deep color and keep 4:2:2?

Originally Posted by Bob Pariseau 

OK, I think you've just gotten confused by how to read those sliders. Each slider has a minimum number on the left (0 in this case), and a maximum number on the right (+4 in this case). The vertical line inside the slider and the number TO THE LEFT of the "minimum" number represent the currently selected value.

When you slide the slider all the way to the left, the +4 "maximum" possible value will still show to the right of the slider, just as when you slide the slider all the way to the right, the 0 "minimum" possible value will still show to the left of the slider. But the vertical bar inside the slider and the current value number to the left of the "minimum" number reflect the current setting.
--Bob

Originally Posted by jerreed 

"Also keep in mind that to get the real benefit of the OPPO in such a setup you need to set your Cable box to send 480i video to the OPPO. If the cable box is sending 1080i or 1080p when you watch an SD channel then it is the Cable box which is doing the de-interlacing and upscaling of that SD channel content. And the video processing in many of these Cable and Satellite boxes is frighteningly bad."

To achieve the above would I be correct in stating that I should have the cable box set to "Native"? Are there any other selections on the cable box or the Oppo that I should make?

I have another issue if you would be so kind to address. My Yamaha RX-V1300 receiver is old enough to not have HDMI inputs or outputs. Therefore, I have it connected to the Oppo via the analog 6 CH INPUT. This setup works great for DVDs and Blu-rays through the Oppo set on 5.1 downmix. However, when I play a CD, all I get is sound from the 2 front speakers. I suppose I could run a digital optic cable from the Oppo to the dedicated CD digital optical slot on the Yamaha but I was hoping to be able to test the sound difference of the analog playback. I called Oppo and was told to select "Music" in the NEO:6 audio setup section but that does not work because when I have the Yamaha on 6 CH INPUT that selection automatically turns off the DSP programs which I believe includes NEO:6. Any ideas?

Thanks!

Originally Posted by musicalfox 

I have a couple of questions about the 103, which I wondered if I could get some help with?

First, I have not purchased the unit yet, but would it be fair to say that I will see a marked picture improvement over the Panasonic DMP-BD30 (my existing player)?

Second, my plan is to run Split A/V mode from the Oppo direct to my display device (Epson 6010) and send audio direct to a DTC-9.8 via HDMI 2 Out (which I know many of you on this thread have done). Some people use Split A/V to enable 3D, but my chief desire would be to by-pass the SO video processor in the Integra in order to take full advantage of the Qdeo video processor in the Oppo. I called Integra and asked if there was a way of disabling the video processor in the 9.8, but apparently not, hence this proposition. Are there others on this thread who are doing the same, i.e. running direct to display device to take advantage of the Qdeo?

Originally Posted by Bob Pariseau 

I did some more experimentation with Netflix High/HD streams and HDMI 1 video output from the 105 (which is the same as with the 103). I can still spot no reason to prefer Source Direct over explicit 1080p with Sharpness 0. But explicit 1080p with Sharpness +1 looks better than either.

This is with YCbCr 4:4:4 and no Deep Color. I wonder whether the folks reporting excessive noise reduction for Netflix (cured by going to Source Direct) might be using a different video format (e.g., with Deep Color enabled)?
--Bob

Originally Posted by airborn007 

Changing my Kuro sharpness to -12 and keeping the Oppo at Default "0" works for me. Does this pass the S&M disc testing, I'm not sure since I didn't tested it but I was going base on what looks good to my eyes and Oppo +1 is too drastic of a jump from default 0 to +1. Some users noticed no softness issue and others like +1 so at the end it's what looks good to you until we hear from Oppo.
By this does Oppo mean- based on the chipset- there really isn't an acceptable fix?

Originally Posted by thirdkind 

I have Deep Color enabled, YCbCr 4:2:2. I'll try turning off Deep Color and see if there's any difference, not that it should have any effect. I also tried Sharpness +1 at 1080p and it didn't help.

Originally Posted by jerreed 

This is good news since I have yet to calibrate the tv (I'll be using a Disney WOW blu ray). By the way, when I mentioned that I saw no dramatic difference in SD picture quality I was speaking in terms of Comcast cable broadcasts which, I suppose, are going to be lacking regardless (?). Again, I was probably expecting the impossible: that the Oppo would make the SD channels magically look nearly as good as HD channels. I will say that when I did SD-DVD comparisons with the Oppo versus my old Samsung BD2500, I did discern at least a certain amount of improvement via the Oppo. And if the PQ on that particular source gets even better after a calibration, then I'll be a happ(ier) camper. Now if I could just figure out how to get the Oppo to do my dishes for me. . .

Thanks!

Originally Posted by mominayal 

I couldn't get my oppo 103 to broadcast anything when passing the Comcast box through it, got the error message and a green low def image on any channel

Originally Posted by Sidetracked 

My hope is that, as Bob Pariseau postulated when this all first started, and he did some testing, that this may not simply an issue of the
sharpness setting levels, but something more complex and subtle that Oppo might address. (Bob, I hope I'm not putting words in your mouth).


But Oppo my also declare there's no problem (which would be disappointing given the number of us seeing something), or
they may indeed say there is no fix, which would also be disappointing. In those cases I might be going back to my 83 as my
primary blu-ray player.