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Official OPPO BDP-103 Owner's Thread - Page 27

post #781 of 16400
Quote:
Originally Posted by gadgtfreek View Post

I run audio from the 103 to the AVR via HDMI 2, and Video direct to HDMI 1 on the display, from HDMI 1 on the 103. So no, there is no display. Since I need it every now and then, I have an HDMI cable running from the AVR to HDMI 2 on my display, so I can swap to that if I need to rerun Audyssey, etc.
Thanks, I guess the only work around is to change the dual display settings to off......when you do need to make adjustments ect.
post #782 of 16400
When in Split A/V, audio and video are sent to both HDMI outputs on the Oppo. Only through handshake will the Oppo sense you are using video from one output and audio on the other, at which time it will mute what isn't being used. So if you use HDMI 2 for audio to your processor, using an output of the processor to the monitor will still give you a video feed.

Here is how I have mine set-up:

HDMI1-->TV Input #1
HDMI2-->Processor--->TV Input #2

If the processor isn't turned on I will get audio and video from HDMI1 on my tv. Once the processor is turned on and confirms handshake with both outputs, the tv audio is muted by the Oppo in favor of the processor.
post #783 of 16400
Quote:
Originally Posted by x43x View Post

When in Split A/V, audio and video are sent to both HDMI outputs on the Oppo. Only through handshake will the Oppo sense you are using video from one output and audio on the other, at which time it will mute what isn't being used. So if you use HDMI 2 for audio to your processor, using an output of the processor to the monitor will still give you a video feed.
Here is how I have mine set-up:
HDMI1-->TV Input #1
HDMI2-->Processor--->TV Input #2
If the processor isn't turned on I will get audio and video from HDMI1 on my tv. Once the processor is turned on and confirms handshake with both outputs, the tv audio is muted by the Oppo in favor of the processor.
Interesting cheers.
post #784 of 16400
Heavy sigh , I can't find this in the FAQ and the Manual simply states the basics , but will the HDMI input signal be processed by the internal Scaler ?
i.e. will a 480i over HDMI be available for processing or is it bypassed ?
Shields up ! here goes.........I'm wondering if I pass an S-Video signal from a VCR to an S-Video to HDMI converter then plumb it into the Oppo....will it process the Video signal ?
Call it the WAF !

Scott...................confused.gif
post #785 of 16400
Thread Starter 
Yes. Anything passing through the player will be processed by the player (unless you are using Source Direct) so if you are feeding it 480i the player will de-interlace and scale this to 1080p (or your Output Resolution).
post #786 of 16400
Yep. What comes in on the HDMI Inputs is processed. But don't expect much in the way of quality from something coming in that originated as S-video.

Also, S-video doesn't carry audio, and the OPPO can't play video from an HDMI Input along with audio from any other method. So if your converter doesn't also accept and combine in some audio you'll need to go around the OPPO for your audio connection.
--Bob
post #787 of 16400
Just did an A/B test on DVD up-conversion between my old 983 and my brand new 103. I tested a film
I was involved in making and was a part of mastering, so I was as familiar as possible with the intention
of the look.

To my eye the 983 still beat the 103, although it was close, and there were individual shots I thought
the 103 handled better.

But there was just the right amount of shadow detail in the 983, a little less on the 103. The 103 in general
seemed to have a bit more contrast, which made the image striking, but ended up with loss of shadow detail
and some harshness in high contrast black and white scenes that looked a little less film-like.

In a few shots I also noticed what looked like edge enhancement on the 103, something that
wasn't there in the 983.

That said the 103 still did an excellent job, but side by side the 983 was more accurate to intent.

So, so for those of us who still have a large collection of DVDs (as there are many great films yet to come
out on blu-ray; Bergman, Woody Allen, etc) if you have an old 983 or BDP-83 you might want to hang onto
it for DVD duty, even if you use the 103 for BR, streaming, etc. (At least that's what I'm planning on doing in
my system).

Hope that's helpful.
post #788 of 16400
Proper setting for connecting the 103 to 2 AVRs? Dual Display or Split A/V? Does it matter?

Only 1 will be active at a time HDMI1 to Denon AVP for 1 room handling both audio and video and HDMI2 to Denon AVR for 2nd room handling both audio and video. Just curious which setting to get the best A/V from both HDMI outs.

Thanks
post #789 of 16400
Sidetracked,
For a comparison like that, be sure you do an independent check on the "best" combination of HDMI Color Space and HDMI Deep Color settings for output from the 103. It may not be the case that the choices you made for the 983 remain the "best" choices for use with the 103. There may be no difference, but it should still be checked since the processor is different (not to mention the advent of Deep Color output as an option).

By the way, I think it's great that you are able to bring your mastering experience to this. Thanks for posting!
--Bob
post #790 of 16400
Quote:
Originally Posted by pentium7 View Post

Proper setting for connecting the 103 to 2 AVRs? Dual Display or Split A/V? Does it matter?

Only 1 will be active at a time HDMI1 to Denon AVP for 1 room handling both audio and video and HDMI2 to Denon AVR for 2nd room handling both audio and video. Just curious which setting to get the best A/V from both HDMI outs.

Thanks

If only one connection is live at a time, then the Split A/V vs. Dual Display choice is ignored.
--Bob
post #791 of 16400
Quote:
Originally Posted by Neuromancer View Post

Could be restricted by region, DNS, or even the application itself (YouTube Leanback is separate from YouTube proper which has things like paid-for-ads). I personally do not use YouTube as I find it very restrictive, but I would not be surprised if content is restricted on YouTube LeanBack because there is no way to monetize your time.

Interesting.
post #792 of 16400
Quote:
Originally Posted by boe View Post

Interesting.
It would be a shame if youtube is that limited.
post #793 of 16400
Quote:
Originally Posted by Doug Blackburn View Post

??? I don't think Oppo is even making that claim. The '83 was an accurate disc player when playing Blu-ray discs, so is/was the '93. Once you get to "accurate" there is nothing else the disc player can or should do to images... an accurate image is the best possible result from a disc player.............................The only processing a good (and accurate) disc player does is to read the YCbCr 4:2:0 data encoded on the disc (plus audio of course), convert the 4:2:0 data to 4:2:2 data (which Oppo clearly knows how to do accurately because the previous models were among the most accurate disc players available at any price), and send the 4:2:2 data to the video display. You don't want the disc player messing with anything or attempting to "improve" the image with unspecified "processing". So Blu-ray images should be identical in appearance from any accurate Blu-ray disc player. There are 6.2+ million pixels per frame. An accurate disc player gets all of them right 24 or 30 times per second. Once all those pixels are accurate, you can't make them better.
So I just don't understand the comment -- I have 3 player models here right now and Blu-ray images look identical on all of them... 2 are Oppo models, one is a new Pioneer Elite.
The oppo BDP 103 is dong something right when decoding my 3D Blu-ray's. My experience has been that it has made a dramatic improvement out of my Panasonic VT-25.. 3D clarity is now as good IMO, as the 2D version of BD movies, and ghosting is not present. With the oppo, my 65" VT25 is now equivalent in IMO, to 3D theatrical rendition quality. Three Panasonic 3D Blu-ray players have been used with my 65VT25. A Panasonic DMP-BDT300 player, DMP-BDT 110 and a SC-BTT750, and I have noticed zero improved quality that I now see with the Oppo.
post #794 of 16400
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sidetracked View Post

Just did an A/B test on DVD up-conversion between my old 983 and my brand new 103. I tested a film
I was involved in making and was a part of mastering, so I was as familiar as possible with the intention
of the look.
To my eye the 983 still beat the 103, although it was close, and there were individual shots I thought
the 103 handled better.
But there was just the right amount of shadow detail in the 983, a little less on the 103. The 103 in general
seemed to have a bit more contrast, which made the image striking, but ended up with loss of shadow detail
and some harshness in high contrast black and white scenes that looked a little less film-like.
In a few shots I also noticed what looked like edge enhancement on the 103, something that
wasn't there in the 983.
That said the 103 still did an excellent job, but side by side the 983 was more accurate to intent.
So, so for those of us who still have a large collection of DVDs (as there are many great films yet to come
out on blu-ray; Bergman, Woody Allen, etc) if you have an old 983 or BDP-83 you might want to hang onto
it for DVD duty, even if you use the 103 for BR, streaming, etc. (At least that's what I'm planning on doing in
my system).
Hope that's helpful.
It certainly is. It's what I've been doing ever since I got my 983 a little over two years ago. Tonight I watched the DVD of Speed Racer using the 103 just to see what it looked like and boy was it impressive (this is the first DVD I've played in the 103). I'll have to throw it into the 983 and compare.
post #795 of 16400
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Pariseau View Post

Sidetracked,
For a comparison like that, be sure you do an independent check on the "best" combination of HDMI Color Space and HDMI Deep Color settings for output from the 103. It may not be the case that the choices you made for the 983 remain the "best" choices for use with the 103. There may be no difference, but it should still be checked since the processor is different (not to mention the advent of Deep Color output as an option).
By the way, I think it's great that you are able to bring your mastering experience to this. Thanks for posting!
--Bob

An excellent point, and one I have to admit I didn't think of. Thank you!

I also want to do more tests on more films, I picked the one that has the most difficult and wide ranging
visual styles (both color and B+W, very high contrast scenes, very low light scenes where actor's eyes
are barely visible, etc). That's generally my 'reference' DVD, since it's really easy for it to look 'off''.

But I should also look at some of my other films, along with trying your suggestions. When I have some time
I'll do some more complete subjective but informed testing and report back.
post #796 of 16400
Quote:
Originally Posted by subavision212 View Post

It certainly is. It's what I've been doing ever since I got my 983 a little over two years ago. Tonight I watched the DVD of Speed Racer using the 103 just to see what it looked like and boy was it impressive (this is the first DVD I've played in the 103). I'll have to throw it into the 983 and compare.

Please let us know what you think if you do compare. There's a certain amount of subjectivity involved and I'm very curious to hear what
other people see.
post #797 of 16400
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sidetracked View Post

Just did an A/B test on DVD up-conversion between my old 983 and my brand new 103. I tested a film
I was involved in making and was a part of mastering, so I was as familiar as possible with the intention
of the look.
To my eye the 983 still beat the 103, although it was close, and there were individual shots I thought
the 103 handled better.
But there was just the right amount of shadow detail in the 983, a little less on the 103. The 103 in general
seemed to have a bit more contrast, which made the image striking, but ended up with loss of shadow detail
and some harshness in high contrast black and white scenes that looked a little less film-like.
In a few shots I also noticed what looked like edge enhancement on the 103, something that
wasn't there in the 983.
That said the 103 still did an excellent job, but side by side the 983 was more accurate to intent.
So, so for those of us who still have a large collection of DVDs (as there are many great films yet to come
out on blu-ray; Bergman, Woody Allen, etc) if you have an old 983 or BDP-83 you might want to hang onto
it for DVD duty, even if you use the 103 for BR, streaming, etc. (At least that's what I'm planning on doing in
my system).
Hope that's helpful.

Great and very helpful post sidetracked!

post #798 of 16400
Just to clarify, the 103 will send 5.1 audio over its analog audio outs when playing designated content in the netflix app, correct? This 5.1 netflix capability isn't limited to the hdmi output?
post #799 of 16400
^ Correct. Analog, too.
--Bob
post #800 of 16400
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Pariseau View Post

^ Correct. Analog, too.
--Bob

Awesome. Now we just need confirmation on that sacd-r/dvda-r compatibility, and we're golden!
post #801 of 16400
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Pariseau View Post

New, V1.4, User Manual Posted for OPPO BDP-103:
http://www.oppodigital.com/blu-ray-bdp-103/blu-ray-BDP-103-Support.aspx
OPPO has just posted an updated version of the User Manual for the BDP-103 (PDF file).
--Bob

I found a wonderful piece of freeware that you can use to compare 2 different versions of pdf docs: http://www.guidingtech.com/11811/two-pdf-files-side-by-side-comparison-diffpdf/
post #802 of 16400
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Pariseau View Post

Sidetracked,
For a comparison like that, be sure you do an independent check on the "best" combination of HDMI Color Space and HDMI Deep Color settings for output from the 103. It may not be the case that the choices you made for the 983 remain the "best" choices for use with the 103. There may be no difference, but it should still be checked since the processor is different (not to mention the advent of Deep Color output as an option).
By the way, I think it's great that you are able to bring your mastering experience to this. Thanks for posting!
--Bob

Hi all,

Did some more DVD up-scaling testing, a/b ing another film of mine, adjusted Color Space and Deep Color per your suggestion, but the bottom line was, regardless of those adjustments, the 103 - to my eye - was adding a little too much contrast and over-saturating colors slightly in comparison with the old ABT chip. We're talking very slight differences, but the 103 had the slightly more poppy, eye catching image. But that doesn't mean it was as accurate. If I went into picture adjustment on the 103, pulled the contrast down about 6 points (the controls on the 103 are pretty subtle) , color saturation 2 or 3 and sharpness 1 or 2, I could just about match the 983's more accurate image, But, as has long been discussed here, you don't really want to be making those kind of adjustments in your player.

It seemed like the 103 was pushing contrast/brightness/color/sharpness a bit (and just a bit) in every color space and deep color variation.

For example in a scene in a dark room, where the 2 actors are back-lit with a bright source, on the 103 the light behind the actors came off as brighter, and thus a little distracting. It pulled your eye to the light more, and was almost uncomfortably bright. Obviously, I'm being very picky. We're talking about a scene I've probably watched literally 200 times from making the film years ago, color timing the prints, seeing it in theaters, mastering it for video. So I'm sure the differences jump out at me far more distinctly than they would someone else. But they are there.

I also noticed a very slight color difference. The 103 added just a bit of warmth to the color temperature. Very, very subtle, not bad looking, but again, not quite as accurate.

Last, but perhaps most important, to my eye (and again, this is very personal, subjective stuff) the 983 just looked a tiny touch more 'cinematic' while the 103 had a tiny bit more of what I think of as a video look. The 983 just felt closer to the image in a good theater. The film grain seemed right, the edges clean but not over sharp, contrast smoother, so the picture overall felt more 'integrated'.

Again, this is one person, on one set up (direct from players into Jeff Meier calibrated Pio 151). And it's still better up-conversion than most I've seen. (e.g. it's clearly better than the 93, and my old Pio 51 - neither of which were bad at all). But, at least to these pair of eyes the Oppo/ABT combo on the 983 (and I'd assume on the BDP-83 - haven't tested that yet, but always found it very close to the 983) is still my favorite way to make SD DVDs look 'right'.

But I look forward to other opinions.
post #803 of 16400
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sidetracked View Post

Hi all,
Did some more DVD up-scaling testing, a/b ing another film of mine, adjusted Color Space and Deep Color per your suggestion, but the bottom line was, regardless of those adjustments, the 103 - to my eye - was adding a little too much contrast and over-saturating colors slightly in comparison with the old ABT chip. We're talking very slight differences, but the 103 had the slightly more poppy, eye catching image. But that doesn't mean it was as accurate. If I went into picture adjustment on the 103, pulled the contrast down about 6 points (the controls on the 103 are pretty subtle) , color saturation 2 or 3 and sharpness 1 or 2, I could just about match the 983's more accurate image, But, as has long been discussed here, you don't really want to be making those kind of adjustments in your player.
It seemed like the 103 was pushing contrast/brightness/color/sharpness a bit (and just a bit) in every color space and deep color variation.
For example in a scene in a dark room, where the 2 actors are back-lit with a bright source, on the 103 the light behind the actors came off as brighter, and thus a little distracting. It pulled your eye to the light more, and was almost uncomfortably bright. Obviously, I'm being very picky. We're talking about a scene I've probably watched literally 200 times from making the film years ago, color timing the prints, seeing it in theaters, mastering it for video. So I'm sure the differences jump out at me far more distinctly than they would someone else. But they are there.
I also noticed a very slight color difference. The 103 added just a bit of warmth to the color temperature. Very, very subtle, not bad looking, but again, not quite as accurate.
Last, but perhaps most important, to my eye (and again, this is very personal, subjective stuff) the 983 just looked a tiny touch more 'cinematic' while the 103 had a tiny bit more of what I think of as a video look. The 983 just felt closer to the image in a good theater. The film grain seemed right, the edges clean but not over sharp, contrast smoother, so the picture overall felt more 'integrated'.
Again, this is one person, on one set up (direct from players into Jeff Meier calibrated Pio 151). And it's still better up-conversion than most I've seen. (e.g. it's clearly better than the 93, and my old Pio 51 - neither of which were bad at all). But, at least to these pair of eyes the Oppo/ABT combo on the 983 (and I'd assume on the BDP-83 - haven't tested that yet, but always found it very close to the 983) is still my favorite way to make SD DVDs look 'right'.
But I look forward to other opinions.

There has been a few opinions stating this.
post #804 of 16400
Good to know my old 83 is still pulling its weight in the PQ arena
post #805 of 16400
Sidetracked,
I suspect there is still a calibration difference (or a bug). The fact that you see bright highlights from the 103 as brighter is the tipoff.

By default the 103 will output the entire Luma range, including the Blacker than Black pixel values (Luma 0-15), which will not be visible in a properly calibrated Display, but also the Peak White pixel values above Reference White (Luma 236-255), which WILL be visible if your display is set to reproduce them. Do you know if your 983 is set to include Peak Whites in its output? Or does it clip those to Reference White (Luma 235)?

The HDMI outputs of the 103 accurately match the Luma values coming off the disc. So if you see bright highlights as brighter from the 103, there must be something like this going on.
--Bob
post #806 of 16400
Sidetracked,

If you don't mind doing an additional experiment, could you check some of your key scenes using the HDMI 2 output of the 103? The HDMI 2 output does not use the Marvell video processor, but it has the same calibration levels as the HDMI 1 output (I.e., when using the default (0) Picture Adjustment values, it too matches the pixel values coming off the disc). If you still see some or all of the subtle differences (such as the brighter highlights) that would eliminate the Marvell as the cause for those.
--Bob
post #807 of 16400
no amazon app?
post #808 of 16400
Quote:
Originally Posted by airgas1998 View Post

no amazon app?

No
post #809 of 16400
Quote:
Originally Posted by airgas1998 View Post

no amazon app?

Not native to the player. (Amazon has not been eager to expand their app to a wide range of devices yet.)

However, Amazon Instant Video is available via the Roku Streaming Stick plugged into the OPPO, if you choose to get that.
--Bob
post #810 of 16400
Bob,
While I appreciate your invaluable contribution to the oppo thread, what you posted about Amazon is completely wrong. They absolutely want to expand their service to as many devices and platforms as possible. HOWEVER, as you know there are many many things that need to be worked out to have this done. Suffice it to say that the "big dog" in this arena has considerable pull and influence.

On another note I have about 40 hours on my new 103. Newest configuration is having my 93 plugged into the hdmi input and playing an ISO file from the 93 to the 103.
Not sure if I see any quantifiable difference, but fun to play anyway.
Still have yet to put a disc in it yet though... :-)
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