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Official Sony VPL-HW50ES Owners Thread - Page 41

post #1201 of 1897
After slogging through 40 pages of comments, I had to post a few comments. The VPL-HW50ES is only my third projector in my home theater since I built it in 1997. I started with a Runco CRT, but since 2005 I have had a VPL-SW100ES centered on the ceiling of my 30x12 foot space. The 100 has worked flawlessly for seven years, but frankly, was never bright enough for me, even though the image was awesome.

I have auditioned projectors for the last year, and for a an under 4K investment--no I want to say for an under 8K investment--the 50 is the best projector you can buy, if you want to hang it and forget it instead of endlessly tweaking. It beats the 95 on brightness and 3D handily and has a better RC circuit and nearly as good blacks.I find the image brighter than I need and use the lamp mode on low all the time in 2D, and the iris set to auto-limited. I have no problem getting intense deep blacks that have detail but are nearly as black as the bezel; of my Stewart Studio-tec 1.3 gain 120 inch screen even though I have set the gamma in Reference mode to 1.8 to maximize shadow detail and the color temp to D75, which gives me the most neutral whites.

Like many posters, I have had problems with the emitter but I tried a kludge that seems to work pretty well: I taped a small 4x4 mirror to the bottom of the projector (it's hanging upside down from the ceiling) that sticks out over the emitter by 3 inches and I have had few synch problems since then. I am not a big 3D fan, but sitting 8 feet from the screen can be very exciting. Of course the 3D image is not awesome, but then it seldom is in the movie theater either. My projector is in the upper 300s and I hear no buzz at all.

I have tweaked every setting on the projector, and leaving most NR things off or very low works best with most material. The RC seems to work as well as the Darbee, and who needs more junk in the signal path? The dirty little secret (and oh how I am reminded of my audiophile obsession) most of the stuff you watch varies in color temperature, black setting, noise and sharpness. Unless you refuse to watch anything but Blu-rays (and many of them are awful too--check out the Adele concert disk) the projector is TOO revealing of source flaws. My goal has always been to set it and forget it, but there is just too much temptation to fiddle. I try to limit it to brightness and contrast, but the Motionflow is so weirdly fascinating on film material, it has become a guilty pleasure.

So, until a worthy 4K projector under 10 grand rears its ugly head (I am talking to YOU, RED) I think I will be pretty happy.
post #1202 of 1897
Where cah I buy one of these VPL-HW50ES now? There seems to be a dearth of them.
post #1203 of 1897
Quote:
Originally Posted by robsugar View Post

After slogging through 40 pages of comments, I had to post a few comments. The VPL-HW50ES is only my third projector in my home theater since I built it in 1997. I started with a Runco CRT, but since 2005 I have had a VPL-SW100ES centered on the ceiling of my 30x12 foot space. The 100 has worked flawlessly for seven years, but frankly, was never bright enough for me, even though the image was awesome.

I have auditioned projectors for the last year, and for a an under 4K investment--no I want to say for an under 8K investment--the 50 is the best projector you can buy, if you want to hang it and forget it instead of endlessly tweaking. It beats the 95 on brightness and 3D handily and has a better RC circuit and nearly as good blacks.I find the image brighter than I need and use the lamp mode on low all the time in 2D, and the iris set to auto-limited. I have no problem getting intense deep blacks that have detail but are nearly as black as the bezel; of my Stewart Studio-tec 1.3 gain 120 inch screen even though I have set the gamma in Reference mode to 1.8 to maximize shadow detail and the color temp to D75, which gives me the most neutral whites.

Like many posters, I have had problems with the emitter but I tried a kludge that seems to work pretty well: I taped a small 4x4 mirror to the bottom of the projector (it's hanging upside down from the ceiling) that sticks out over the emitter by 3 inches and I have had few synch problems since then. I am not a big 3D fan, but sitting 8 feet from the screen can be very exciting. Of course the 3D image is not awesome, but then it seldom is in the movie theater either. My projector is in the upper 300s and I hear no buzz at all.

I have tweaked every setting on the projector, and leaving most NR things off or very low works best with most material. The RC seems to work as well as the Darbee, and who needs more junk in the signal path? The dirty little secret (and oh how I am reminded of my audiophile obsession) most of the stuff you watch varies in color temperature, black setting, noise and sharpness. Unless you refuse to watch anything but Blu-rays (and many of them are awful too--check out the Adele concert disk) the projector is TOO revealing of source flaws. My goal has always been to set it and forget it, but there is just too much temptation to fiddle. I try to limit it to brightness and contrast, but the Motionflow is so weirdly fascinating on film material, it has become a guilty pleasure.

So, until a worthy 4K projector under 10 grand rears its ugly head (I am talking to YOU, RED) I think I will be pretty happy.

completly agree
post #1204 of 1897
We're is everyone placing the emitter for the Sony 50esat the screen or on the projector?
post #1205 of 1897
Quote:
Originally Posted by buckley44 View Post

We're is everyone placing the emitter for the Sony 50esat the screen or on the projector?

My projector is ceiling mounted. I have the emitter on top of the projector facing the screen.
post #1206 of 1897
Thank you..
post #1207 of 1897
Quote:
Originally Posted by cemo62 View Post

@plasmaowner do you have a chance to test 3d games bro? i heard sony has a weakness in that area

Played some RE5 on the computer, 1920 x 1080 @ 24hz, it looked great but was unplayable IMO. With projector set to game mode and Darbee off, movement was very choppy. There also seemed to be alot of lag. Ghosting wasn't too bad and I didn't notice any flicker. Same game at 720p 120hz (Acer h5360) game ran very smooth with no noticeable lag. I didn't get to try on my w1070 so can't compare. I don't have any xbox/ps3 games to try, are there any 3d demos I can download? I have a few other pc games I can try, (NFS Shift and Batman AA ), but if it's anything similar to RE5, If I cared (don't like 3d gaming) I'd be very disappointed with 3d gaming on the Sony. On the Acer the few times I did play (before feeling sick) it was very good, no lag, no ghosting, very smooth.
Edited by plasmaowner - 1/30/13 at 2:58pm
post #1208 of 1897
Quote:
Originally Posted by plasmaowner View Post

Played some RE5 on the computer, 1920 x 1080 @ 24hz, it looked great but was unplayable IMO. With projector set to game mode and Darbee off, movement was very choppy. There also seemed to be alot of lag. Ghosting wasn't too bad and I didn't notice any flicker. Same game at 720p 120hz (Acer h5360) game ran very smooth with no noticeable lag. I didn't get to try on my w1070 so can't compare. I don't have any xbox/ps3 games to try, are there any 3d demos I can download? I have a few other pc games I can try, (NFS Shift and Batman AA ), but if it's anything similar to RE5, If I cared (don't like 3d gaming) I'd be very disappointed with 3d gaming on the Sony. On the Acer the few times I did play (before feeling sick) it was very good, no lag, no ghosting, very smooth.

thank you bro for review, i am not a hardcore gamer i rarely play games with ps3 (not online) i just would like to learn if if buy sony hw50 can i play uncharted 3 etc 3d games nicely or not, and i got my reply but its not a big deal for me thank you again

Kind Regards

Cemo
post #1209 of 1897
Quote:
Originally Posted by plasmaowner View Post

Played some RE5 on the computer, 1920 x 1080 @ 24hz, it looked great but was unplayable IMO. With projector set to game mode and Darbee off, movement was very choppy. There also seemed to be alot of lag. Ghosting wasn't too bad and I didn't notice any flicker. Same game at 720p 120hz (Acer h5360) game ran very smooth with no noticeable lag. I didn't get to try on my w1070 so can't compare. I don't have any xbox/ps3 games to try, are there any 3d demos I can download? I have a few other pc games I can try, (NFS Shift and Batman AA ), but if it's anything similar to RE5, If I cared (don't like 3d gaming) I'd be very disappointed with 3d gaming on the Sony. On the Acer the few times I did play (before feeling sick) it was very good, no lag, no ghosting, very smooth.

RE5, NFS Shift, etc. are not natively stereoscopic 3D games... are you using Nvidia's 3D software to get it stereoscopic?

It was probably choppy b/c of 24Hz.

If I understand you correctly & you actually played it in stereoscopic 3D (with glasses) at 24p on the Sony & there wasn't much ghosting, then it'd support my aforementioned hypothesis that it's the 60Hz that's killing 3D on the Sony projector by adding too much ghosting since the panels can't actually respond that fast.

P.S. cemo62: Uncharted 3 & Crysis 2 are unplayable in 3D on the Sony due to ghosting. Again, my hypothesis is that since they're outputting 720/60p, the required 120Hz switching for stereoscopic 3D is just too fast for the liquid crystals to respond properly, leading to ghosting.
post #1210 of 1897
Can someone please give me the model number for the 3d transmitter for the sony 50es, i have sony on the line and they say it's not available anymore,so they don't know which way is up,,,,,
post #1211 of 1897
so is it a shame for sony or not?
post #1212 of 1897
Quote:
Originally Posted by satfam View Post

My projector is ceiling mounted. I have the emitter on top of the projector facing the screen.

what model number is your emitter?
post #1213 of 1897
Quote:
Originally Posted by buckley44 View Post

Can someone please give me the model number for the 3d transmitter for the sony 50es, i have sony on the line and they say it's not available anymore,so they don't know which way is up,,,,,

TMR-PJ2
Reply
Reply
post #1214 of 1897
Quote:
Originally Posted by cemo62 View Post

so is it a shame for sony or not?

I don't know; we really need confirmation from plasmaowner that he was actually doing stereoscopic 3D on the Sony at 24p, and that there was not much ghosting in that mode. Would help if he also then ran the same game at 720/60p from his computer, and confirmed increased ghosting.

That'd then point to the increased frame rate causing the ghosting, which'd most likely be due to the faster required switching times, placing far too high demands on the panels.

Epson may have gotten around this with their 480Hz processing/line-doubling method, which helps to clear afterimages from the previous image (reducing ghosting).

But right now this is all speculation. If it is true, there's not much we can do about it, other than request Sony to allow 1080/24p or 720/24p frame-packed stereoscopic 3D output for their 3D games on the PS3. Take the frame-rate hit, but get less ghosting.

Or, they'd just have to use better panels or some other technology that helps clear the panels faster for fast switching rates (some form of dark frame insertion with 3D? though the brightness cost would be hard to swallow).

I wouldn't really hold my breath on either of those happening smile.gif

OTOH, I think it behooves Sony to address the issue quickly/thoroughly, since they seem to be the ones pushing stereoscopic 3D games.
post #1215 of 1897
Quote:
Originally Posted by AV Science Sales 5 View Post

TMR-PJ2

Sony sent me a tmr - pj1 which is not working when mounted on the projector, still will not stay in sync, actually it's worse than it was than without it. They are basically telling me they can not do anything about it, that i should mount the pj1 at the screen which i do not want to do.
will the pj2 work off the top of the projector if it is mounted on the ceiling?
post #1216 of 1897
Quote:
Originally Posted by buckley44 View Post

what model number is your emitter?

Sony sent me a TMR-PJ2. It works great, no synch issues. AVS store had them as well.
post #1217 of 1897
Quote:
Originally Posted by buckley44 View Post

Sony sent me a tmr - pj1 which is not working when mounted on the projector, still will not stay in sync, actually it's worse than it was than without it. They are basically telling me they can not do anything about it, that i should mount the pj1 at the screen which i do not want to do.
will the pj2 work off the top of the projector if it is mounted on the ceiling?

Going from memory, I recall Zombie10k stating the old emitter wasn't that powerful and that it had to be installed near the front of the screen. I have the newer emitter that you mentioned and my projector is shelf mounted and the emitter is on top of it. The only time I lose sync is if I look downwards but once I look back up the glasses automatically sync.

When I had my problem initially I chatted online with Sony support and the person I spoke with was clueless. He asked me several times about my projector model and early on I knew I was wasting my time with him. Thankfully Mike at AVS took care of this issue for me. You might try calling back and getting a different person.

Good luck!
post #1218 of 1897
Quote:
Originally Posted by sarangiman View Post

RE5, NFS Shift, etc. are not natively stereoscopic 3D games... are you using Nvidia's 3D software to get it stereoscopic?

It was probably choppy b/c of 24Hz.

If I understand you correctly & you actually played it in stereoscopic 3D (with glasses) at 24p on the Sony & there wasn't much ghosting, then it'd support my aforementioned hypothesis that it's the 60Hz that's killing 3D on the Sony projector by adding too much ghosting since the panels can't actually respond that fast.

P.S. cemo62: Uncharted 3 & Crysis 2 are unplayable in 3D on the Sony due to ghosting. Again, my hypothesis is that since they're outputting 720/60p, the required 120Hz switching for stereoscopic 3D is just too fast for the liquid crystals to respond properly, leading to ghosting.

What are RE5 and NFS Shift natively? I'm using a Geforce GTX 670 and running the latest version of Nvidias software v.310.90. The nvidia control panel shows stereoscopic 3d display type: 3d tv play and it's set to 1080p @ 24hz. Default depth is set to 15%. RE5 compatibility shows "3d vision ready". From memory there wasn't much ghosting with these setting but movement was VERY choppy. I'll try it again to make sure. I'll also try it out at 720p 60hz and report back.
post #1219 of 1897
Quote:
Originally Posted by xb1032 View Post

Going from memory, I recall Zombie10k stating the old emitter wasn't that powerful and that it had to be installed near the front of the screen. I have the newer emitter that you mentioned and my projector is shelf mounted and the emitter is on top of it. The only time I lose sync is if I look downwards but once I look back up the glasses automatically sync.

When I had my problem initially I chatted online with Sony support and the person I spoke with was clueless. He asked me several times about my projector model and early on I knew I was wasting my time with him. Thankfully Mike at AVS took care of this issue for me. You might try calling back and getting a different person.

Good luck!

Thanks everyone for your help...I know the emitter is not alot of money but it's the point of the matter, Thanks again.
post #1220 of 1897
Okay just tried RE5 again at both 1080p 24hz and 720p 60hz. RE5 allows you to change system settings without having to leave your current game so I was able to make direct comparisons. I didn't see ANY difference with ghosting, both the exact same. Ghosting overall is worst then 3d movies but not terrible. I see more ghosting of far away objects and less the close the object is. On objects close up I didn't see any ghosting. Motion and Lag at 1080p 24hz is just unplayable IMO, at 720p 60hz it's lag free and motion is great. I would say just as good as the acer 5360 (minus the ghosting). I also noticed that there's practically no eye strain/fatigue at 720p 60hz. I checked what the projector was getting each time I switched resolutions to verify. I'll try out NFS Shift in a bit to see if there's any difference.

Question for anyone using an AMD/ATI card in a HTPC setup. Are they better for 3d then nvidia? Also do they use stereoscopic 3D as well?
post #1221 of 1897
Where cah I buy one of these VPL-HW50ES now? There seems to be a dearth of them.

I bought mine from right here at AV Science. I would highly recommend that you give them a call.
post #1222 of 1897
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stoney35 View Post

Where cah I buy one of these VPL-HW50ES now? There seems to be a dearth of them.

I bought mine from right here at AV Science. I would highly recommend that you give them a call.


+1
post #1223 of 1897
Quote:
Originally Posted by plasmaowner View Post

Okay just tried RE5 again at both 1080p 24hz and 720p 60hz. RE5 allows you to change system settings without having to leave your current game so I was able to make direct comparisons. I didn't see ANY difference with ghosting, both the exact same. Ghosting overall is worst then 3d movies but not terrible. I see more ghosting of far away objects and less the close the object is. On objects close up I didn't see any ghosting. Motion and Lag at 1080p 24hz is just unplayable IMO, at 720p 60hz it's lag free and motion is great. I would say just as good as the acer 5360 (minus the ghosting). I also noticed that there's practically no eye strain/fatigue at 720p 60hz. I checked what the projector was getting each time I switched resolutions to verify. I'll try out NFS Shift in a bit to see if there's any difference.

Question for anyone using an AMD/ATI card in a HTPC setup. Are they better for 3d then nvidia? Also do they use stereoscopic 3D as well?

Bro what about sports? did u watch any soccer from a hd tv channel with ur proj? tell us the performance ( not 3d soccer)
post #1224 of 1897
I have been keeping up with this and the other various threads on this PJ as well as several others.

A question for you guys that have seen both of these PJs: Sony 50ES and JVC RS48 or RS4810

Which one would work out best in the following conditions?

Media room with dark walls and carpet but light ceiling...no windows...dedicated room (more or less).
Room size is 16X18X10 feet.
Screen will be a white 1.0-1.4 gain 2.40 aspect. (Still debating this one)
Throw about 15-16 feet.

Seating distance 10-12 feet

Mostly movies...we will have a decent LCD TV in the Great Room so TV is not a priority on this one.
3D will be only a novelty...I find it makes me get motion sick and gives me a headache very quickly so it will be a very low priority.
Sports...only very infrequently. TV only for very special stuff or maybe Dish movies on HD.

No anamorphic lens.

My priority is a great movie experience.

Thanks
post #1225 of 1897
Quote:
My priority is a great movie experience.

I think it's hard to go wrong with either the Sony or the JVC RS4810. They are both great projectors !
post #1226 of 1897
Quote:
Originally Posted by plasmaowner View Post

Okay just tried RE5 again at both 1080p 24hz and 720p 60hz. RE5 allows you to change system settings without having to leave your current game so I was able to make direct comparisons. I didn't see ANY difference with ghosting, both the exact same. Ghosting overall is worst then 3d movies but not terrible. I see more ghosting of far away objects and less the close the object is. On objects close up I didn't see any ghosting. Motion and Lag at 1080p 24hz is just unplayable IMO, at 720p 60hz it's lag free and motion is great. I would say just as good as the acer 5360 (minus the ghosting). I also noticed that there's practically no eye strain/fatigue at 720p 60hz. I checked what the projector was getting each time I switched resolutions to verify. I'll try out NFS Shift in a bit to see if there's any difference.

Question for anyone using an AMD/ATI card in a HTPC setup. Are they better for 3d then nvidia? Also do they use stereoscopic 3D as well?

Thanks plasmaowner. Very interesting that you see no difference in ghosting between 24Hz & 60Hz. There goes my hypothesis :-P

The difference in ghosting between near vs. far objects is suspicious... points to something other than the display device as the problem.

But, in the end, I just don't understand how the Sony has similar performance to the Epson with 3D movies (maybe a slight advantage to Epson according to Zombie?), yet pales in comparison to Epson for 3D gaming.

Unless the reports from the Epson people are colored by people who are not susceptible to ghosting/have low standards in terms of ghosting. I doubt that, though, b/c Crysis 2 & Uncharted 3 have so much ghosting that it almost looks like you forgot to put your 3D glasses on :-P

Color me completely confused.
post #1227 of 1897
So I am selling my JVC RS46 to get the Sony HW50ES. The input lag on the JVC has become frustrating, I didn't expect it to be that noticeable but playing Black Ops 2 online, it was noticeable and bringing in an LCD TV to test next to it to confirm showed me a big difference in me moving the character and the response on screen.

I think overall the Sony is a better fit for me anyway as I like to have people over for MMA fights and sports....so I think the extra bit of lumens on the Sony and the low input lag will be of benefit....

Just waiting for the JVC to sell so I can call Mike and get it ordered!
post #1228 of 1897
if any of you guys are having sync issues or buzzing you need to call Sony. They will give you the external emitter. I literally called Sony was on the phone maybe 5 minutes and I had the external emitter in less than a week. Since then I have had no sync issues and no buzzing. All you need to give Sony is your serial number and explain the problem
post #1229 of 1897
^^^^Depends on your serial number. Get your dealer or whoever sold it to you involved if at first you don't succeed!
post #1230 of 1897
Quote:
Originally Posted by natas777 View Post

if any of you guys are having sync issues or buzzing you need to call Sony. They will give you the external emitter. I literally called Sony was on the phone maybe 5 minutes and I had the external emitter in less than a week. Since then I have had no sync issues and no buzzing. All you need to give Sony is your serial number and explain the problem

I sent Sony an email with my S/N asking for an emitter due to synch issues (no buzzing). I received it overnight FedEx about 5 days later. No questions or return email.
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