or Connect
AVS › AVS Forum › Display Devices › Digital Hi-End Projectors - $3,000+ USD MSRP › Official Sony VPL-HW50ES Owners Thread
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

Official Sony VPL-HW50ES Owners Thread - Page 41

post #1201 of 3345
Thank you..
post #1202 of 3345
Quote:
Originally Posted by cemo62 View Post

@plasmaowner do you have a chance to test 3d games bro? i heard sony has a weakness in that area

Played some RE5 on the computer, 1920 x 1080 @ 24hz, it looked great but was unplayable IMO. With projector set to game mode and Darbee off, movement was very choppy. There also seemed to be alot of lag. Ghosting wasn't too bad and I didn't notice any flicker. Same game at 720p 120hz (Acer h5360) game ran very smooth with no noticeable lag. I didn't get to try on my w1070 so can't compare. I don't have any xbox/ps3 games to try, are there any 3d demos I can download? I have a few other pc games I can try, (NFS Shift and Batman AA ), but if it's anything similar to RE5, If I cared (don't like 3d gaming) I'd be very disappointed with 3d gaming on the Sony. On the Acer the few times I did play (before feeling sick) it was very good, no lag, no ghosting, very smooth.
Edited by plasmaowner - 1/30/13 at 2:58pm
post #1203 of 3345
Quote:
Originally Posted by plasmaowner View Post

Played some RE5 on the computer, 1920 x 1080 @ 24hz, it looked great but was unplayable IMO. With projector set to game mode and Darbee off, movement was very choppy. There also seemed to be alot of lag. Ghosting wasn't too bad and I didn't notice any flicker. Same game at 720p 120hz (Acer h5360) game ran very smooth with no noticeable lag. I didn't get to try on my w1070 so can't compare. I don't have any xbox/ps3 games to try, are there any 3d demos I can download? I have a few other pc games I can try, (NFS Shift and Batman AA ), but if it's anything similar to RE5, If I cared (don't like 3d gaming) I'd be very disappointed with 3d gaming on the Sony. On the Acer the few times I did play (before feeling sick) it was very good, no lag, no ghosting, very smooth.

thank you bro for review, i am not a hardcore gamer i rarely play games with ps3 (not online) i just would like to learn if if buy sony hw50 can i play uncharted 3 etc 3d games nicely or not, and i got my reply but its not a big deal for me thank you again

Kind Regards

Cemo
post #1204 of 3345
Quote:
Originally Posted by plasmaowner View Post

Played some RE5 on the computer, 1920 x 1080 @ 24hz, it looked great but was unplayable IMO. With projector set to game mode and Darbee off, movement was very choppy. There also seemed to be alot of lag. Ghosting wasn't too bad and I didn't notice any flicker. Same game at 720p 120hz (Acer h5360) game ran very smooth with no noticeable lag. I didn't get to try on my w1070 so can't compare. I don't have any xbox/ps3 games to try, are there any 3d demos I can download? I have a few other pc games I can try, (NFS Shift and Batman AA ), but if it's anything similar to RE5, If I cared (don't like 3d gaming) I'd be very disappointed with 3d gaming on the Sony. On the Acer the few times I did play (before feeling sick) it was very good, no lag, no ghosting, very smooth.

RE5, NFS Shift, etc. are not natively stereoscopic 3D games... are you using Nvidia's 3D software to get it stereoscopic?

It was probably choppy b/c of 24Hz.

If I understand you correctly & you actually played it in stereoscopic 3D (with glasses) at 24p on the Sony & there wasn't much ghosting, then it'd support my aforementioned hypothesis that it's the 60Hz that's killing 3D on the Sony projector by adding too much ghosting since the panels can't actually respond that fast.

P.S. cemo62: Uncharted 3 & Crysis 2 are unplayable in 3D on the Sony due to ghosting. Again, my hypothesis is that since they're outputting 720/60p, the required 120Hz switching for stereoscopic 3D is just too fast for the liquid crystals to respond properly, leading to ghosting.
post #1205 of 3345
Can someone please give me the model number for the 3d transmitter for the sony 50es, i have sony on the line and they say it's not available anymore,so they don't know which way is up,,,,,
post #1206 of 3345
so is it a shame for sony or not?
post #1207 of 3345
Quote:
Originally Posted by satfam View Post

My projector is ceiling mounted. I have the emitter on top of the projector facing the screen.

what model number is your emitter?
post #1208 of 3345
Quote:
Originally Posted by buckley44 View Post

Can someone please give me the model number for the 3d transmitter for the sony 50es, i have sony on the line and they say it's not available anymore,so they don't know which way is up,,,,,

TMR-PJ2
Reply
Reply
post #1209 of 3345
Quote:
Originally Posted by cemo62 View Post

so is it a shame for sony or not?

I don't know; we really need confirmation from plasmaowner that he was actually doing stereoscopic 3D on the Sony at 24p, and that there was not much ghosting in that mode. Would help if he also then ran the same game at 720/60p from his computer, and confirmed increased ghosting.

That'd then point to the increased frame rate causing the ghosting, which'd most likely be due to the faster required switching times, placing far too high demands on the panels.

Epson may have gotten around this with their 480Hz processing/line-doubling method, which helps to clear afterimages from the previous image (reducing ghosting).

But right now this is all speculation. If it is true, there's not much we can do about it, other than request Sony to allow 1080/24p or 720/24p frame-packed stereoscopic 3D output for their 3D games on the PS3. Take the frame-rate hit, but get less ghosting.

Or, they'd just have to use better panels or some other technology that helps clear the panels faster for fast switching rates (some form of dark frame insertion with 3D? though the brightness cost would be hard to swallow).

I wouldn't really hold my breath on either of those happening smile.gif

OTOH, I think it behooves Sony to address the issue quickly/thoroughly, since they seem to be the ones pushing stereoscopic 3D games.
post #1210 of 3345
Quote:
Originally Posted by AV Science Sales 5 View Post

TMR-PJ2

Sony sent me a tmr - pj1 which is not working when mounted on the projector, still will not stay in sync, actually it's worse than it was than without it. They are basically telling me they can not do anything about it, that i should mount the pj1 at the screen which i do not want to do.
will the pj2 work off the top of the projector if it is mounted on the ceiling?
post #1211 of 3345
Quote:
Originally Posted by buckley44 View Post

what model number is your emitter?

Sony sent me a TMR-PJ2. It works great, no synch issues. AVS store had them as well.
post #1212 of 3345
Quote:
Originally Posted by buckley44 View Post

Sony sent me a tmr - pj1 which is not working when mounted on the projector, still will not stay in sync, actually it's worse than it was than without it. They are basically telling me they can not do anything about it, that i should mount the pj1 at the screen which i do not want to do.
will the pj2 work off the top of the projector if it is mounted on the ceiling?

Going from memory, I recall Zombie10k stating the old emitter wasn't that powerful and that it had to be installed near the front of the screen. I have the newer emitter that you mentioned and my projector is shelf mounted and the emitter is on top of it. The only time I lose sync is if I look downwards but once I look back up the glasses automatically sync.

When I had my problem initially I chatted online with Sony support and the person I spoke with was clueless. He asked me several times about my projector model and early on I knew I was wasting my time with him. Thankfully Mike at AVS took care of this issue for me. You might try calling back and getting a different person.

Good luck!
post #1213 of 3345
Quote:
Originally Posted by sarangiman View Post

RE5, NFS Shift, etc. are not natively stereoscopic 3D games... are you using Nvidia's 3D software to get it stereoscopic?

It was probably choppy b/c of 24Hz.

If I understand you correctly & you actually played it in stereoscopic 3D (with glasses) at 24p on the Sony & there wasn't much ghosting, then it'd support my aforementioned hypothesis that it's the 60Hz that's killing 3D on the Sony projector by adding too much ghosting since the panels can't actually respond that fast.

P.S. cemo62: Uncharted 3 & Crysis 2 are unplayable in 3D on the Sony due to ghosting. Again, my hypothesis is that since they're outputting 720/60p, the required 120Hz switching for stereoscopic 3D is just too fast for the liquid crystals to respond properly, leading to ghosting.

What are RE5 and NFS Shift natively? I'm using a Geforce GTX 670 and running the latest version of Nvidias software v.310.90. The nvidia control panel shows stereoscopic 3d display type: 3d tv play and it's set to 1080p @ 24hz. Default depth is set to 15%. RE5 compatibility shows "3d vision ready". From memory there wasn't much ghosting with these setting but movement was VERY choppy. I'll try it again to make sure. I'll also try it out at 720p 60hz and report back.
post #1214 of 3345
Quote:
Originally Posted by xb1032 View Post

Going from memory, I recall Zombie10k stating the old emitter wasn't that powerful and that it had to be installed near the front of the screen. I have the newer emitter that you mentioned and my projector is shelf mounted and the emitter is on top of it. The only time I lose sync is if I look downwards but once I look back up the glasses automatically sync.

When I had my problem initially I chatted online with Sony support and the person I spoke with was clueless. He asked me several times about my projector model and early on I knew I was wasting my time with him. Thankfully Mike at AVS took care of this issue for me. You might try calling back and getting a different person.

Good luck!

Thanks everyone for your help...I know the emitter is not alot of money but it's the point of the matter, Thanks again.
post #1215 of 3345
Okay just tried RE5 again at both 1080p 24hz and 720p 60hz. RE5 allows you to change system settings without having to leave your current game so I was able to make direct comparisons. I didn't see ANY difference with ghosting, both the exact same. Ghosting overall is worst then 3d movies but not terrible. I see more ghosting of far away objects and less the close the object is. On objects close up I didn't see any ghosting. Motion and Lag at 1080p 24hz is just unplayable IMO, at 720p 60hz it's lag free and motion is great. I would say just as good as the acer 5360 (minus the ghosting). I also noticed that there's practically no eye strain/fatigue at 720p 60hz. I checked what the projector was getting each time I switched resolutions to verify. I'll try out NFS Shift in a bit to see if there's any difference.

Question for anyone using an AMD/ATI card in a HTPC setup. Are they better for 3d then nvidia? Also do they use stereoscopic 3D as well?
post #1216 of 3345
Where cah I buy one of these VPL-HW50ES now? There seems to be a dearth of them.

I bought mine from right here at AV Science. I would highly recommend that you give them a call.
post #1217 of 3345
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stoney35 View Post

Where cah I buy one of these VPL-HW50ES now? There seems to be a dearth of them.

I bought mine from right here at AV Science. I would highly recommend that you give them a call.


+1
post #1218 of 3345
Quote:
Originally Posted by plasmaowner View Post

Okay just tried RE5 again at both 1080p 24hz and 720p 60hz. RE5 allows you to change system settings without having to leave your current game so I was able to make direct comparisons. I didn't see ANY difference with ghosting, both the exact same. Ghosting overall is worst then 3d movies but not terrible. I see more ghosting of far away objects and less the close the object is. On objects close up I didn't see any ghosting. Motion and Lag at 1080p 24hz is just unplayable IMO, at 720p 60hz it's lag free and motion is great. I would say just as good as the acer 5360 (minus the ghosting). I also noticed that there's practically no eye strain/fatigue at 720p 60hz. I checked what the projector was getting each time I switched resolutions to verify. I'll try out NFS Shift in a bit to see if there's any difference.

Question for anyone using an AMD/ATI card in a HTPC setup. Are they better for 3d then nvidia? Also do they use stereoscopic 3D as well?

Bro what about sports? did u watch any soccer from a hd tv channel with ur proj? tell us the performance ( not 3d soccer)
post #1219 of 3345
I have been keeping up with this and the other various threads on this PJ as well as several others.

A question for you guys that have seen both of these PJs: Sony 50ES and JVC RS48 or RS4810

Which one would work out best in the following conditions?

Media room with dark walls and carpet but light ceiling...no windows...dedicated room (more or less).
Room size is 16X18X10 feet.
Screen will be a white 1.0-1.4 gain 2.40 aspect. (Still debating this one)
Throw about 15-16 feet.

Seating distance 10-12 feet

Mostly movies...we will have a decent LCD TV in the Great Room so TV is not a priority on this one.
3D will be only a novelty...I find it makes me get motion sick and gives me a headache very quickly so it will be a very low priority.
Sports...only very infrequently. TV only for very special stuff or maybe Dish movies on HD.

No anamorphic lens.

My priority is a great movie experience.

Thanks
post #1220 of 3345
Quote:
My priority is a great movie experience.

I think it's hard to go wrong with either the Sony or the JVC RS4810. They are both great projectors !
post #1221 of 3345
Quote:
Originally Posted by plasmaowner View Post

Okay just tried RE5 again at both 1080p 24hz and 720p 60hz. RE5 allows you to change system settings without having to leave your current game so I was able to make direct comparisons. I didn't see ANY difference with ghosting, both the exact same. Ghosting overall is worst then 3d movies but not terrible. I see more ghosting of far away objects and less the close the object is. On objects close up I didn't see any ghosting. Motion and Lag at 1080p 24hz is just unplayable IMO, at 720p 60hz it's lag free and motion is great. I would say just as good as the acer 5360 (minus the ghosting). I also noticed that there's practically no eye strain/fatigue at 720p 60hz. I checked what the projector was getting each time I switched resolutions to verify. I'll try out NFS Shift in a bit to see if there's any difference.

Question for anyone using an AMD/ATI card in a HTPC setup. Are they better for 3d then nvidia? Also do they use stereoscopic 3D as well?

Thanks plasmaowner. Very interesting that you see no difference in ghosting between 24Hz & 60Hz. There goes my hypothesis :-P

The difference in ghosting between near vs. far objects is suspicious... points to something other than the display device as the problem.

But, in the end, I just don't understand how the Sony has similar performance to the Epson with 3D movies (maybe a slight advantage to Epson according to Zombie?), yet pales in comparison to Epson for 3D gaming.

Unless the reports from the Epson people are colored by people who are not susceptible to ghosting/have low standards in terms of ghosting. I doubt that, though, b/c Crysis 2 & Uncharted 3 have so much ghosting that it almost looks like you forgot to put your 3D glasses on :-P

Color me completely confused.
post #1222 of 3345
So I am selling my JVC RS46 to get the Sony HW50ES. The input lag on the JVC has become frustrating, I didn't expect it to be that noticeable but playing Black Ops 2 online, it was noticeable and bringing in an LCD TV to test next to it to confirm showed me a big difference in me moving the character and the response on screen.

I think overall the Sony is a better fit for me anyway as I like to have people over for MMA fights and sports....so I think the extra bit of lumens on the Sony and the low input lag will be of benefit....

Just waiting for the JVC to sell so I can call Mike and get it ordered!
post #1223 of 3345
if any of you guys are having sync issues or buzzing you need to call Sony. They will give you the external emitter. I literally called Sony was on the phone maybe 5 minutes and I had the external emitter in less than a week. Since then I have had no sync issues and no buzzing. All you need to give Sony is your serial number and explain the problem
post #1224 of 3345
^^^^Depends on your serial number. Get your dealer or whoever sold it to you involved if at first you don't succeed!
post #1225 of 3345
Quote:
Originally Posted by natas777 View Post

if any of you guys are having sync issues or buzzing you need to call Sony. They will give you the external emitter. I literally called Sony was on the phone maybe 5 minutes and I had the external emitter in less than a week. Since then I have had no sync issues and no buzzing. All you need to give Sony is your serial number and explain the problem

I sent Sony an email with my S/N asking for an emitter due to synch issues (no buzzing). I received it overnight FedEx about 5 days later. No questions or return email.
post #1226 of 3345
Quote:
Originally Posted by SteveR1952 View Post

I have been keeping up with this and the other various threads on this PJ as well as several others.

A question for you guys that have seen both of these PJs: Sony 50ES and JVC RS48 or RS4810

Which one would work out best in the following conditions?

Media room with dark walls and carpet but light ceiling...no windows...dedicated room (more or less).
Room size is 16X18X10 feet.
Screen will be a white 1.0-1.4 gain 2.40 aspect. (Still debating this one)
Throw about 15-16 feet.

Seating distance 10-12 feet

Mostly movies...we will have a decent LCD TV in the Great Room so TV is not a priority on this one.
3D will be only a novelty...I find it makes me get motion sick and gives me a headache very quickly so it will be a very low priority.
Sports...only very infrequently. TV only for very special stuff or maybe Dish movies on HD.

No anamorphic lens.

My priority is a great movie experience.

Thanks

That's going to be a tough call. I'll give my opinion but it's probably nothing that anyone else hasn't stated already. It sound like 2D movie watching is your priority.

The JVCs are going to have the better black levels and contrast. I have the RS45 (haven't tried selling it yet but plan on it very soon) and the HW50 and despite what reviewers say the difference is noticeable. I have a 119" screen with a 17.5' throw onto a Dalite HP screen. I am also only about 9' from the screen.

On the flip side the question is will you use frame interpolation? If so you'll find that with FI motion is a bit smoother on the Sony and this really makes a difference. Also, the RC on the Sony make the image a bit sharper than what I am seeing on my JVC. My assumption is that this will be true of the RS48 as well. Reviewers noted that e-shift gives similar sharpness on the RS4810 to Sony's RC and if true that might make the difference with the RS4810 worth the upgrade. I wouldn't have said that several months ago before I received my HW50. The image is also cleaner on my HW50 than it was on my RS45.

So if I were only concerned about 2D picture quality and if I didn't use FI, then I would likely choose the RS48 or RS4810 over the HW50 merely because contrast will be better. However, being one that uses FI the smoothness of motion in combination with RC makes a nice improvement over the JVCs (but the assumption is the RS4810 will display similar sharpness to the Sony). The Sony is also brighter which might be a consideration if you have a larger screen.

Lastly, if your only viewing of 3D is in the theater you might find 3D in home projection different. I've had friends who were turned off to 3D only to like it much better even when viewing on my RS45 with all the issues it displayed with 3D and the Sony is MUCH better in comparison.

Good luck in whatever you choose!
post #1227 of 3345
xb1032,
Thank you for taking the time to do the full response to my question. I am not sold any either yet...still evaluating my options so all data is good data at this point.
post #1228 of 3345
Quote:
Originally Posted by xb1032 View Post

That's going to be a tough call. I'll give my opinion but it's probably nothing that anyone else hasn't stated already. It sound like 2D movie watching is your priority.

The JVCs are going to have the better black levels and contrast. I have the RS45 (haven't tried selling it yet but plan on it very soon) and the HW50 and despite what reviewers say the difference is noticeable. I have a 119" screen with a 17.5' throw onto a Dalite HP screen. I am also only about 9' from the screen.

On the flip side the question is will you use frame interpolation? If so you'll find that with FI motion is a bit smoother on the Sony and this really makes a difference. Also, the RC on the Sony make the image a bit sharper than what I am seeing on my JVC. My assumption is that this will be true of the RS48 as well. Reviewers noted that e-shift gives similar sharpness on the RS4810 to Sony's RC and if true that might make the difference with the RS4810 worth the upgrade. I wouldn't have said that several months ago before I received my HW50. The image is also cleaner on my HW50 than it was on my RS45.

So if I were only concerned about 2D picture quality and if I didn't use FI, then I would likely choose the RS48 or RS4810 over the HW50 merely because contrast will be better. However, being one that uses FI the smoothness of motion in combination with RC makes a nice improvement over the JVCs (but the assumption is the RS4810 will display similar sharpness to the Sony). The Sony is also brighter which might be a consideration if you have a larger screen.

Lastly, if your only viewing of 3D is in the theater you might find 3D in home projection different. I've had friends who were turned off to 3D only to like it much better even when viewing on my RS45 with all the issues it displayed with 3D and the Sony is MUCH better in comparison.

Good luck in whatever you choose!

The JVC will have a better black level, but I don't know about on/off contrast. Considering the Sony is a lot brighter (100+ lumens calibrated) I would say they are probably very close to each other depending on the settings you use on either.
post #1229 of 3345
Well the JVC will have the higher intrascene contrast in darker scenes, regardless of absolute black level in an on/off reading. The on/off reading only tells us white to black rather than the intrascene ramp in actual viewing. Even on my Benq w7000, the intrascene ramp beats my Viewsonic, but the VS measures slightly higher or depending on calibration about the same on/off. I'm really starting to think some of these projectors intrascene's ramp does not match either the on/off or ANSI reading or any combination thereof, though suspiciously could be calibration and gamma variances, but it sure seemed to be more uppity than normal on the Benq as more stars came visible in a starfield, given how low the on/off reading is.

That said, you also have to consider how much more accurate the Sony color is across the sat tracking (at least compared to the RS-45),and the gamut errors on the Sony have less visible effect to the image than the JVC so I hear.

I think given the Sony has better color, better 3D, better brightness, better FI, better motion, and RC sharpening, I'd pick the Sony even after losing some black levels. It sounds like the more exciting projector this year.
post #1230 of 3345
Quote:
Originally Posted by SteveR1952 View Post

I have been keeping up with this and the other various threads on this PJ as well as several others.

A question for you guys that have seen both of these PJs: Sony 50ES and JVC RS48 or RS4810

Which one would work out best in the following conditions?

Media room with dark walls and carpet but light ceiling...no windows...dedicated room (more or less).
Room size is 16X18X10 feet.
Screen will be a white 1.0-1.4 gain 2.40 aspect. (Still debating this one)
Throw about 15-16 feet.

Seating distance 10-12 feet

Mostly movies...we will have a decent LCD TV in the Great Room so TV is not a priority on this one.
3D will be only a novelty...I find it makes me get motion sick and gives me a headache very quickly so it will be a very low priority.
Sports...only very infrequently. TV only for very special stuff or maybe Dish movies on HD.

No anamorphic lens.

My priority is a great movie experience.

Thanks

I've had both these projectors side by side. If your sitting this close, the RS4810 should be a consideration. Mainly due to the e-shift vs. the reality creation.

The e-shift is a more subtle way of enhancing the PQ at a close seating distance vs. the reality creation process. The JVC has an analog 'film-like' appearance with the e-shift whereas the HW50 is a bit more digital. It still looks very good, I just have a preference for the e-shift process. A good BD transfer like the Dark Knight Rises looks great on both projectors.
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
AVS › AVS Forum › Display Devices › Digital Hi-End Projectors - $3,000+ USD MSRP › Official Sony VPL-HW50ES Owners Thread