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Official Sony VPL-HW50ES Owners Thread - Page 9

post #241 of 1865
10/19/12 at 4:25am
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Originally Posted by giudante View Post

Rick, what about xpand104 glasses? Do they work good with the sony 50? In europe they are less expensive then monstervision, and easier to find.

They work better than the Sony (less ghosting) and they are lighter. The only "problem" is the glasses have a small tint that you can see in the image.

I take a photo of the glasses tint... The MonsterVision, is the glasses that exibit less tint. The Sony also have a tint but somehow less visible with real material.

5E82B480-8CD8-4F5A-81B9-745FDD7E6806-4700-00000966A46244E1.jpg

16990E31-3288-482D-A294-0E304187C193-4700-000009669AC6F88D.jpg
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post #242 of 1865
10/19/12 at 8:19am
Rick. Did you find a good place for Monstor Vision glasses in Canada? I think I may pick some up. Projector should be here anyday biggrin.gif

Also, would you say that from going from the VW95 to HW50 was an improvement overall for 2D?
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post #243 of 1865
10/19/12 at 8:37am
Quote:
Originally Posted by RickAVManiac View Post

They work better than the Sony (less ghosting) and they are lighter. The only "problem" is the glasses have a small tint that you can see in the image.

I take a photo of the glasses tint... The MonsterVision, is the glasses that exibit less tint. The Sony also have a tint but somehow less visible with real material.

The Sony glasses are one of the few that looks quite difference once they are activated vs. looking at the tint when they are off. They have a noticeable yellow tint when off, but becomes more neutral once activated.

I've been experimenting with color calibration behind the glasses to offset the tint. The results were excellent on my W7000 with 'through the glasses' colors looking very natural when I watched Avengers 3D recently. I'll give it a shot with the Sony glasses, MV3D's and the Xpand 104's on the HW50.
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post #244 of 1865
10/19/12 at 10:40am
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by conan48 View Post

Rick. Did you find a good place for Monstor Vision glasses in Canada? I think I may pick some up. Projector should be here anyday biggrin.gif

Also, would you say that from going from the VW95 to HW50 was an improvement overall for 2D?

Great to here I will have some friend soon smile.gif

For the MonsterVision, I did not find any place that sell MonsterVision in Canada.

I buy a couples of pairs from a Ebay guy. I have one pair extra... If you want one, PM me.

Has for the 95 vs the 50 in 2D. I will say the 95 as better black but if I had to choose I will take the HW50 without any hesitation.

The "reality creation" is just amazing, the brightness is great and the 3D with the MonsterVision is awesome...
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post #245 of 1865
10/20/12 at 8:35am
Good to hear. Can't wait to get it early next week hopefully. I'll send u a PM, and how do the monster vision connect? Do I need to use some adapter like Zombie was using when he combined different types of glasses?
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post #246 of 1865
10/20/12 at 5:02pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Projector Lad View Post

Ooh you are making me go weak at the knees tongue.gif
I'm on the preorder list and am soooo excited. But am just hanging out to see projectorreviews review of the Panasonic AE8000 which is due out be the 23rd.

Hate to be jaded but don't bother with Evan's review...he'll say the Panny 8000 is only a half notch below the Sony 1000ES and Sim2 Lumis (at $25K and $30K each) I'm not saying a reviewer can't have a brand preference or be band loyal...be he should disclose this up front (like Art from www.projectorreviews.com did last year) Look to Scott Wilkinson and Geoff Morrison (Sound and vision mag), Thomas Norton and Kris Deering (Hometheatermag.com) and Chris Heinonen (www.hometheaterhifi.com)...these guys call it like it is, make no more for favorable reviews and often times trash their favorite brands when something better comes along.

In full disclosure...I collect an occasional check from www.hometheaterhifif.com , but, I have cited many other sources for reputable reviews.

-Cory
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post #247 of 1865
10/20/12 at 8:59pm
Just wanted to report a quick fix if you have the buzzing sound when in 3D mode on the HW50, I have found the source of the buzz and its coming from the integrated 3D sensor on the projector. Since I have the HW30 as well here is a quick fix, take the external sensor that comes with the HW30 and plug it into the HW50 and that seems to bypass the sensor on the HW50 and eliminates the buzzing. It's a band aid approach but does show a faulty sensor is the problem on the HW50. I have recorded the noise but not sure how to attach it to the post so if someone could let me know I can add that as well. I can also now report this to Sony and hopefully they can find a fix a lot quicker so I hope this helps everyone who has a HW50.
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post #248 of 1865
10/21/12 at 9:51am
Thanks for the update...Zombie says the sound does vary based on the 3D brightness like I had thought, I wonder if the modulation circuit is in the same vicinity as the built in emitter. The weird thing is.. you say if you plug in the external emitter it goes away? Did you check to see if the 3D Brightness settings default when you plug that in, so the sound going away is a byproduct of the other action?

I wish I had mine here so I could help with the testing.

Here is the sound again: HW50 buzzing artifact

http://soundcloud.com/tj-demonte/hw50-buzzing
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post #249 of 1865
10/21/12 at 10:00am
Quote:
Originally Posted by tehotaone View Post

Thanks for the update...Zombie says the sound does vary based on the 3D brightness like I had thought, I wonder if the modulation circuit is in the same vicinity as the built in emitter. The weird thing is.. you say if you plug in the external emitter it goes away? Did you check to see if the 3D Brightness settings default when you plug that in, so the sound going away is a byproduct of the other action?

I wish I had mine here so I could help with the testing.

Here is the sound again: HW50 buzzing artifact

http://soundcloud.com/tj-demonte/hw50-buzzing

great sound capture, that is exactly what I am hearing as well. Do we have any HW50 owners that claim they cannot hear the sound in 3D mode (using the built in emitter)?
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post #250 of 1865
10/21/12 at 10:17am
The irony of this is the "buzzing" actually sounds like the colorwheel in my old H79. How do they miss this.... a really quiet projector with a buzzing artifact? I will still take delivery to see how it sounds behind the drywall, it may not be a issue for me, but for others....?

I will bet a beer that this sound is not coming from any IR emitter.... the more I listen and isolate it....it sounds like a ballast from a neon sign or fluorescent bulb... which falls in line with the modulation scheme of the bulb.
Edited by tehotaone - 10/21/12 at 10:26am
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post #251 of 1865
10/21/12 at 10:54am
Yeah sounds like the ballast from a fluorescent bulb and I don't think it's from the sensor itself but from some electronic part behind the sensor because when I plug the external sensor in it bypassed the internal one eliminating the buzz. As far as when the external sensor was plugged in I had max brightness set and depth at zero.
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post #252 of 1865
10/21/12 at 11:08am
Well..it does make sense that the emitter and bulb timing are in sync...so if the emitter is driving a heavy duty IR blaster and the circuit is flawed it would sound it "time" with a modulating ballast as well.
I am a bit discouraged from this development. I don't like the idea of having to buy the external emitter to correct a QC flaw in the internal one.
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post #253 of 1865
10/21/12 at 11:20am
Quote:
Originally Posted by tehotaone View Post

Well..it does make sense that the emitter and bulb timing are in sync...so if the emitter is driving a heavy duty IR blaster and the circuit is flawed it would sound it "time" with a modulating ballast as well.
I am a bit discouraged from this development. I don't like the idea of having to buy the external emitter to correct a QC flaw in the internal one.

I agree with you, I was wondering if one went into the service menu and looked to see if he internal sensor strength could be turned down if that might have an effect on it.
The only reason why I tried the external emitter was that I still have it from my HW30 before I sell it and its only a bandaid fix for now, no reason to keep exchanging for a new projector if they all have this flaw and the one that I have right now as excellent convergence and focus.
It's very disappointing that a simple QC problem like this isn't caught, but now when I call back on Monday it will be easier to explain and having proof of the buzz will hopefully help, hell until they have a fix the should give an external sensor for free.
Thanks again for posting the sound that I made and providing the link to everyone else so it can be heard.
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post #254 of 1865
10/21/12 at 11:32am
I agree the external emitter will need to be part of the package for me to buy this. It is my pleasure to help troubleshoot... my day job is Advanced troubleshooting / Engineering / Deployment for a large MSO
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post #255 of 1865
10/22/12 at 10:46am
Hi there from Germany,

as I just wrote in zombies thread I had a preproduction sample of the HW50 for some review at home (thanks to my dealer..) and we heard the same buzzing noise in 3D. It was actually pretty loud in my room, it seemed louder than the fan..
Interestingly when I brought the unit back to my dealer we checked it there again and it didn't seem to be that loud, I don't know why.

One other dealer in Germany that has a preproduction sample at the moment checked this, he said it was audible but not very loud. I told him that the workaround found here in the forum was to use the external emitter and he tried it and confirmed that the noise has been gone by using the external emitter!

He informed Sony and they said that they're aware of the problem and that it's only with the preproduction samples and will not be with the serial production units. I'll see in about 10 days..

So my question is to all of you who had the buzzing noise: Are your units serial production ones or still preproduction?
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post #256 of 1865
10/22/12 at 10:47am
sorry, double post. can i delete it?
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post #257 of 1865
10/22/12 at 10:47am
Okay, here is the scoop on the buzzing. The noise is caused by the vibrating of two capacitors. There are two solutions. You can reduce the IR output strength in the service mode or use an external IR emitter. Sony will furnish an external IR emitter to those that have this issue once Sony verifies the serial number on your projector. Not all units will have this problem and that is why Sony will need to verify the serial number. Customers that have purchased from us that have this issue, please get in touch with us.
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post #258 of 1865
10/22/12 at 12:33pm
Is Sony going to correct the problem with the internal component? Esthetically and operationally some of us do not want the external emitter (or have the cabling run to facilitate the mount of the external one)

The alternative is to lower the strength of the internal emitter and possibly lower it's effectiveness, this option does not even sound right, trade buzz for sync?

I am happy it has been identified but some questions remain.

I for one will possibly wait until the unit has the correct part installed where it can function as intended. If the part is out of spec and buzzing.. does is share any peripheral
circuity that can be impacted by the overload or condition that is causing this?

Otherwise... these first ship units may have to take the trip to a service depot to be updated with the good part. I say that because if there is a date range and set of serials impacted... then they have identified a part that was either manufactured
improperly or outfitted with some bad components. None of us here like the idea of shipping our properly converged..operable units through the standard shipping services, especially when brand new.

This most certainly would prompt Sony to offer the emitter, which is of course cheaper in the long run, over warranty service and round trip fare.

I think it best to wait, or source another "lot".... band-ads always sting when they come off.
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post #259 of 1865
10/22/12 at 12:41pm
I doubt anything is bad parts wise. I am not going to try and explain the electrical circuit but circuits can have a resonant frequency and normally this can be changed by changing part values, it has nothing to do with a defective part, just a change in a value.
Edited by mark haflich - 10/22/12 at 7:08pm
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post #260 of 1865
10/22/12 at 12:43pm
The service menu allows the strength of the IR signal to be adjusted. One shouldn't use more than is needed to savoid the potential for IR interference with other IR equipment.
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post #261 of 1865
10/22/12 at 12:54pm
In my opinion ...

The fact that reducing the output of the internal IR blaster cuts the noise... points more to an electrical load condition more than anything. If it was simply resonance, which it still may be...adjusting it to a higher value should remove it as well.

Like having a tire vibrate at 60 Mph but not at 70 Mph

Sony would not be offering the external emitters for free if the service menu change was the best option, it may just be a one of them, the emitter is a nice convenient option for the customer from Sony Support.

All this aside... kudos to Sony for identifying this and providing clear options so quickly.

Mine ships tomorrow....just in time for the Halloween party.... a Nightmare Before Christmas in 3d will be playing....
Edited by tehotaone - 10/22/12 at 2:08pm
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post #262 of 1865
10/22/12 at 7:02pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by tehotaone View Post

Is Sony going to correct the problem with the internal component? Esthetically and operationally some of us do not want the external emitter (or have the cabling run to facilitate the mount of the external one)
The alternative is to lower the strength of the internal emitter and possibly lower it's effectiveness, this option does not even sound right, trade buzz for sync?
I am happy it has been identified but some questions remain.
I for one will possibly wait until the unit has the correct part installed where it can function as intended. If the part is out of spec and buzzing.. does is share any peripheral
circuity that can be impacted by the overload or condition that is causing this?
Otherwise... these first ship units may have to take the trip to a service depot to be updated with the good part. I say that because if there is a date range and set of serials impacted... then they have identified a part that was either manufactured
improperly or outfitted with some bad components. None of us here like the idea of shipping our properly converged..operable units through the standard shipping services, especially when brand new.
This most certainly would prompt Sony to offer the emitter, which is of course cheaper in the long run, over warranty service and round trip fare.
I think it best to wait, or source another "lot".... band-ads always sting when they come off.
We have three roles identified here: the manufacture, the dealer and the consumer.
Notice how the perspectives differ.
You quite eloquently make the consumer's case.
To us, the exact nature of the problem is irrelevant.
The Sony design team is to be commended for identifying and fixing the issue so quickly.

Thanks!
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post #263 of 1865
10/23/12 at 5:05am
Tanks rick for the reply:)
I'll buy the expand soon, because I'm a new owner finally!tongue.gif
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post #264 of 1865
10/23/12 at 6:56am
Quote:
Originally Posted by tehotaone View Post

In my opinion ...
The fact that reducing the output of the internal IR blaster cuts the noise... points more to an electrical load condition more than anything. If it was simply resonance, which it still may be...adjusting it to a higher value should remove it as well.
Like having a tire vibrate at 60 Mph but not at 70 Mph
Sony would not be offering the external emitters for free if the service menu change was the best option, it may just be a one of them, the emitter is a nice convenient option for the customer from Sony Support.
All this aside... kudos to Sony for identifying this and providing clear options so quickly.
Mine ships tomorrow....just in time for the Halloween party.... a Nightmare Before Christmas in 3d will be playing....

No way for Sony to know which would be the best method. If you have a large theater, then reducing the strength of the emitter in the service menu may be a problem. If you have a small theater then reducing the strength of the emitter in the service menu may be the best solution. Adding the external emitter will mean the system will work as designed, but for those with a small theater, reducing the strength still may be the best option. On top of that you will have variables in where the emitter is placed and how well it is aimed.
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post #265 of 1865
10/23/12 at 7:48am
If it's a problem of resonance then maybe one test would be to change the frequency. With 24p FP material I think sync frequency is 96 hz, with 60p material sync frequency would be 120 hz. Has someone tried those different frequencies?
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post #266 of 1865
10/23/12 at 12:15pm
Has anyone else got this PJ yet? Im wondering how this compares to the JVC RS45? i FIGURE YOU WILL STILL SAY THE 45 DOES 2D BETTER WHILE THE sONY 50 DOES 3D BETTER. iS THAT ABOUT IT?
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post #267 of 1865
10/23/12 at 12:25pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by kutlow View Post

Has anyone else got this PJ yet? Im wondering how this compares to the JVC RS45? i FIGURE YOU WILL STILL SAY THE 45 DOES 2D BETTER WHILE THE sONY 50 DOES 3D BETTER. iS THAT ABOUT IT?
i HEARD IT IS SO BLINDINGLY BRIGHT, IT WILL MAKE YOU ACCIDENTALLY HIT THE CAPS LOCK. biggrin.gif
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post #268 of 1865
10/23/12 at 12:29pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by kutlow View Post

Has anyone else got this PJ yet? Im wondering how this compares to the JVC RS45? i FIGURE YOU WILL STILL SAY THE 45 DOES 2D BETTER WHILE THE sONY 50 DOES 3D BETTER. iS THAT ABOUT IT?

you're a little late to the party, but still invited. cool.gif
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post #269 of 1865
10/23/12 at 12:31pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by kutlow View Post

Has anyone else got this PJ yet? Im wondering how this compares to the JVC RS45? i FIGURE YOU WILL STILL SAY THE 45 DOES 2D BETTER WHILE THE sONY 50 DOES 3D BETTER. iS THAT ABOUT IT?

For my part, I prefer the 2D and 3D on the HW50 over the JVC RS45 I have own. The color and the motion is better on the Sony and the RC is very impressive (use at the minimum setting). As for the black level, the HW50 is not as good as the JVC but very close.
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post #270 of 1865
10/23/12 at 12:58pm
I should be getting my HW50ES this week. It is replacing a JVC RS1 which has served me well these past years. I expect the Sony to be better in every way. The native on-off contrast of the 50 and the RS1 should be very close. I have a 10' wide Screen Research CP2 screen, and the extra lumens of the Sony was a major consideration over the upcoming JVCs.
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