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Official Sony VPL-HW50ES Owners Thread - Page 30

post #871 of 3345
The reason to use whole pixel adjustment if possible is that the zonal method involves scaling which will lower the resolution and may ironically cause the softness which you might be hoping to avoid by 'improving' the convergence.
post #872 of 3345
I assume doing the full screen with the 1/10th pixel adjustment also does this but maybe to a lesser degree? For a full pixel the adjustment would have to be 10 correct?

Here is the post I refered to earlier:

http://www.avsforum.com/t/1434826/sony-hw50-benq-w7000-epson-5020-jvc-rs55-jvc-rs-46-jvc-rs4810-jvc-rs56-mini-shootout-2012-2013/750#post_22570266
Edited by fingersdlp - 1/3/13 at 9:01am
post #873 of 3345
I recently received my HW50 and I need to get a few extra pairs of 3D glasses. Is it best to get the Sony glasses or is there another brand that works better/same? I have a young daughter so I need one pair to be a small size.
Thanks
post #874 of 3345
I have a minor issue, looking for suggestions:

120" 16:9 screen mounted with the top almost 16 inches from the 8 foot ceiling.
Projector is ceiling mounted in a traffic area with center of lens about 9 inches from the ceiling.
Projector is currently 16 feet from the screen.

This is within range of the image adjustments of the projector, but because of the downward path of the image it results in a \_/ shaped image on the screen (with both screen and projector level and plumb). When I was testing the placement for the projector I had it on my old RPTV as a stand with the lens about 2.75 feet from the ceiling and did not have the trapezoidal issue.

My 'quick and dirty' solution was to shim the bottom of the screen outward by .75 inch. This gives a noticeable slant to the screen (with the lights up and moving around the room), but it works fine with the lights out and a movie on.

My options as I see them are:
Get a longer pole for the mount, and move the projector downward - reducing the clearance from 7' to something more prone to get bumped.
Move the projector even further back (about 3-4 more feet) and shelf mount on the back wall in a lower location. Even if within range of the zoom (I don't think it would be), it would be near the limit so I don't like that idea.
Move the screen up higher, but if anything I would prefer it be even lower.
I tried using the built in correction feature, but that resulted in noticeable loss of resolution.
Just leave it the way it is with the screen angled upwards to match the image.

Am I missing something?
post #875 of 3345
Quote:
Originally Posted by BartMan01 View Post

I tried using the built in correction feature, but that resulted in noticeable loss of resolution.
Which built in correction feature did you use? There are two knobs on the bottom of the projector that allow for horizontal and vertical adjustment that do not cause loss of resolution. (At least it doesn't appear that way when I use them) These are manual, unfortunately, so are not located in the menu. Did you try those, or are you just using the adjustments in the menu?
post #876 of 3345
Quote:
Originally Posted by blipszyc View Post

Which built in correction feature did you use? There are two knobs on the bottom of the projector that allow for horizontal and vertical adjustment that do not cause loss of resolution. (At least it doesn't appear that way when I use them) These are manual, unfortunately, so are not located in the menu. Did you try those, or are you just using the adjustments in the menu?

The manual knobs just move the image projection left/right up/down, they don't do anything about geometry. The in-menu correction is for geometry but results in loss of resolution since it can't make the actual pixels on the panel larger/smaller.

The knobs were able to get the image centered on the screen, but being near the limits of the 'down' adjustment physics have taken over.
post #877 of 3345
Quote:
Originally Posted by BartMan01 View Post

The manual knobs just move the image projection left/right up/down, they don't do anything about geometry. The in-menu correction is for geometry but results in loss of resolution since it can't make the actual pixels on the panel larger/smaller.
The knobs were able to get the image centered on the screen, but being near the limits of the 'down' adjustment physics have taken over.
Right, you should adjust your mount so that the geometry is square, then use the knobs to center the image. If you are saying that the lens shift doesn't get you all the way down to screen, then I would first try to get a longer pole. Even if you get a pole that is only 1-2" longer, you'd be surprised how that will affect the image. And you'll only lose 1-2" taking your clearance from 7' to 6'10. Unless you're hosting a basketball team, you should be OK! tongue.gif

Basically, I'm saying, don't put it back any more as you might not get the brightness needed for good 3D.
post #878 of 3345
Started with:
The projector is level front to back and side to side.
The screen is plumb (straight up and down) and level.
Lens shift gets the image completely on the screen.
Image on screen is shaped like \___/ (top fits the width of the screen, bottom is narrower than the screen by just less than an inch on each side evenly).

Changed:
Shimmed the bottom of the screen out vs the top of the screen. From the side the screen is now angled like \
Image on screen is now shaped like |___|

The only thing I haven't tried was intentionally angling the projector away from level. Are you saying that to get the image square on the screen the projector should NOT be level? Should I angle it downward towards the screen?

Edit: I guess it is possible that I am measuring 'level' wrong on the projector. How do you tell that this projector is truly 'level'? Right now, hung upside down the bottom (facing the top) is level. if I hold a level against the lens assembly (not touching the lens itself), it appears that it may actually be pointing slightly downward "\" which might explain my problem.
Edited by BartMan01 - 1/3/13 at 7:19pm
post #879 of 3345
Who ever says that convergeing more than the course adjustment needs to stop smoking the pipe!!! If you do the total adjusment for the 144 zones the picture will be sharper period. It has convergence correction ALREADY PERIOD. Before we do anything to it.There are no perfect devices. All you are doing is changing it a little WOW. unbeliveable.
post #880 of 3345
I just installed my new HW50ES which replaced an Epson 1080UB with only 800 hours. I am throughly impressed! I do have a 3D synch issue. I am sitting about 12' from a 110" Dalite HCCV screen. The glasses won't synch from that distance. If I stand up and walk about 2' feet closer then they synch. Of course the simplest solution is to move the seats closer but that seems too close for normal 2D viewing. Has anyone used the external emitter? If so, do they put out a stronger signal? Any other suggestions?

Thanks.
post #881 of 3345
Quote:
Originally Posted by satfam View Post

I just installed my new HW50ES which replaced an Epson 1080UB with only 800 hours. I am throughly impressed! I do have a 3D synch issue. I am sitting about 12' from a 110" Dalite HCCV screen. The glasses won't synch from that distance. If I stand up and walk about 2' feet closer then they synch. Of course the simplest solution is to move the seats closer but that seems too close for normal 2D viewing. Has anyone used the external emitter? If so, do they put out a stronger signal? Any other suggestions?
Thanks.
Awesome projector isn't it. I am surprised you are having sync issues. I have only watched about 6 hours of 3d but never any sync issues. My projector is mounted 15 feet from a 110" Stewart Firewawk and primary seating is about 13 feet for 28 ft of total travel.
post #882 of 3345
Quote:
Originally Posted by ksbarnz View Post

If you are looking to view 3D on a 150 inch screen and still want it to be bright you might check out a Da-Lite High Power Screen. I have a 133" one with a gain of 2.4 and love it. On my Epson 6010, which the HW50 is replacing, I was able to still run the lamp in Economy mode and have a bright image in 3D. The downside of High Power screens is that it has very limited placement flexibility. In order have maximum gain the projector needs to be shelf mounted behind your seating position at roughly viewing height. Pricing is in between the monoprice and Black Diamond, I think I picked mine up for for around $1100.

Thanks for the quick reply I'll check into the Da-Lite High Power screen.. Any has tried the contour screens? I was told by a local dealer, that would give me a sharper picture quality.. but then again..I really can't tell since this would be my first HT project.. Thank you everyone for all your input..
post #883 of 3345
Quote:
Originally Posted by DrZaus View Post

Thanks for the quick reply I'll check into the Da-Lite High Power screen.. Any has tried the contour screens? I was told by a local dealer, that would give me a sharper picture quality.. but then again..I really can't tell since this would be my first HT project.. Thank you everyone for all your input..

Are you talking about 'Cinema Contour'? That's just a type of frame from Da-Lite; has no bearing on image quality (other than it masks image bleeding extremely well).
post #884 of 3345
Quote:
Originally Posted by BartMan01 View Post

Shimmed the bottom of the screen out vs the top of the screen. From the side the screen is now angled like \
Image on screen is now shaped like |___|
If this works for you and you don't mind the screen coming out a bit, it might well be the easiest solution.
Quote:
Originally Posted by BartMan01 View Post

Edit: I guess it is possible that I am measuring 'level' wrong on the projector. How do you tell that this projector is truly 'level'? Right now, hung upside down the bottom (facing the top) is level. if I hold a level against the lens assembly (not touching the lens itself), it appears that it may actually be pointing slightly downward "\" which might explain my problem.
I don't know if there is a "good" way to measure if the projector is level, but it sounds to me that if you adjust the projector to have a square image ( |__| ) then you will need to lengthen your pole to allow lens shift to get the image completely on the screen. As I said above, shimming the screen might be good enough and you should just leave it then.
post #885 of 3345
Which projector offers a better overall package the vpl vw95es or the vpl hw50es?
post #886 of 3345
Quote:
Originally Posted by BartMan01 View Post

Started with:
The projector is level front to back and side to side.
The screen is plumb (straight up and down) and level.
Lens shift gets the image completely on the screen.
Image on screen is shaped like \___/ (top fits the width of the screen, bottom is narrower than the screen by just less than an inch on each side evenly).
Changed:
Shimmed the bottom of the screen out vs the top of the screen. From the side the screen is now angled like \
Image on screen is now shaped like |___|
The only thing I haven't tried was intentionally angling the projector away from level. Are you saying that to get the image square on the screen the projector should NOT be level? Should I angle it downward towards the screen?
Edit: I guess it is possible that I am measuring 'level' wrong on the projector. How do you tell that this projector is truly 'level'? Right now, hung upside down the bottom (facing the top) is level. if I hold a level against the lens assembly (not touching the lens itself), it appears that it may actually be pointing slightly downward "\" which might explain my problem.

The main thing is getting the image square. Don't worry about the projector - it may be off a little bit by your measurements, but a square image is the goal, so that should be the focus of your efforts.

You said your screen is (or was) plumb - that's how it should be. Don't sacrifice by shimming your screen. There's no need. Square the image properly, then just lens shift it in to position. If your bubble's not dead-centre, who cares? The goal should always be squaring the image, not centering the bubble.
post #887 of 3345
Quote:
Originally Posted by KDH View Post

Who ever says that convergeing more than the course adjustment needs to stop smoking the pipe!!! If you do the total adjusment for the 144 zones the picture will be sharper period. It has convergence correction ALREADY PERIOD. Before we do anything to it.There are no perfect devices. All you are doing is changing it a little WOW. unbeliveable.

I played around with this for some time last night. I had done a minor adjustment to red by 2 for the full image. In the large grid display that the projector produces when you make the correction this adjustment removed a slight red fringe that was only visible from a few feet away. However, when I displayed busier test patterns (such as the NEC text pattern that is very busy with repeating text of of alternating backgrounds) I noticed that the sub pixel panel corrections introduced a blue fringe above some of the elements that was noticable from normal seating. Based on this I am no longer using this feature.

Obviously if it is adjusting by a sub pixel it is not physically changing the panel alignment but is re-scaling the image with the adjustment somehow factored in. I don't know if seeing a bad side effect on a busy test pattern is justification for not using it and my knowledge is only based on the post I linked to above. Those are some smart guys and if they indicate it should be used in moderation I believe them. I don't think doing sub pixel adjustments will make it sharper in all cases. It depends on the amount of the adjustment and apparently the content to some extent based on my observations. I am not complaning about this and there is nothing wrong with seeking better convergence but understanding how it is modifying the image is important in my decision to use it or not.
Edited by fingersdlp - 1/4/13 at 10:18am
post #888 of 3345
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fat Dave View Post

The main thing is getting the image square. Don't worry about the projector - it may be off a little bit by your measurements, but a square image is the goal, so that should be the focus of your efforts.
You said your screen is (or was) plumb - that's how it should be. Don't sacrifice by shimming your screen. There's no need. Square the image properly, then just lens shift it in to position. If your bubble's not dead-centre, who cares? The goal should always be squaring the image, not centering the bubble.

Thanks (for both you and blipszyc). Projector is now visibly slanted pointed up towards the ceiling slightly, but the image is square on the screen with the screen plumb. First time projector owner, and just fighting through the little things.
post #889 of 3345
Quote:
Originally Posted by gonzalc3 View Post

Which projector offers a better overall package the vpl vw95es or the vpl hw50es?
This is a very loaded question. 2 totally different price ranges. Better overall what? 2d, 3d. Total blackened theater room, multi use room. What content? Etc, etc.
post #890 of 3345
Could anyone please tell me what the minimum throw distance is for HW50, I know the zoom lens ratio is 1.6, but what about throw distance.
If my calculations is somewhere close, I guess it would be something between 1.35-2.15 but I'm not certain.
I've a 110" screen and only 145" to the lens, that would give me a throw distance of 1.52.
I find the info for X35 to be 1,4-2,8 a ratio of 2.0, but not for HW50, so please help.
post #891 of 3345
Quote:
Originally Posted by Future Vision View Post

Could anyone please tell me what the minimum throw distance is for HW50, I know the zoom lens ratio is 1.6, but what about throw distance.
If my calculations is somewhere close, I guess it would be something between 1.35-2.15 but I'm not certain.
I've a 110" screen and only 145" to the lens, that would give me a throw distance of 1.52.
I find the info for X35 to be 1,4-2,8 a ratio of 2.0, but not for HW50, so please help.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jkasanic View Post

Max distance is not really a good indicator as your screen size relative to the throw distance (and screen gain for brightness) is what matters. 19ft = 228in so that gives you a ratio of 1.71 with a 133in diagonal 16x9 screen (228/133). Pretty much mid zoom for the HW50 (advertised to be 1.41 - 2.13). Sounds like you have a high gain screen so this should be no problem in terms of FtL's.

1.41 - 2.13
post #892 of 3345
Are you sure about that? 1,41-2,13 is a zoom ratio of 1,51 and I'm quite sure it's 1,6 on HW50.
However, I'm not interested in max throw distance, rather minimum throw distance since I only have 145" from lens to screen.
Nope, I got a high contrast screen, but only 0.8 gain.
post #893 of 3345
Well, i believe 1.41 - 2.13 may have been based off the HW30 and some forum members have reported a max throw ratio of 2.16 so either way you're safe with 1.52. Sorry for the confusion, the previous post was just to let you know the throw ratio had been discussed a few posts earlier.
post #894 of 3345
Sorry, I see that now, stupid me.
Thanks for helping me.
post #895 of 3345
Quote:
Originally Posted by The BigRalf View Post

No,
the HW50 does not do it in 3D. I have the Oppo 93 and it stretches in 2D with no problem, likewise the 50. But with 3D it's not working. Strange enough with non-2.4:1 content at least the Oppo does stretch it, but not with true 2.4:1 material. I tested that with Prometheus 3D and Brave 3D, both european versions. For a 16:9 BD for an exampel Jean-Michel Cousteau's film trilogy Sharks, Dolphins and Whales and Ocean Wonderland, the HW50 does still not stretch, but the Oppo.
I'm still looking for a solution. Maybe the Oppo 103 works?
Or is there a magic button on the Sony somewhere?
Regards,
The BigRalf :-)

Has this been worked out, does or does it not work?

I planned to mount my lens permently but if the projector doesn't squeeze in 3D, I'll have to go with a moveable mount.
post #896 of 3345
Quote:
Originally Posted by satfam View Post

I just installed my new HW50ES which replaced an Epson 1080UB with only 800 hours. I am throughly impressed! I do have a 3D synch issue. I am sitting about 12' from a 110" Dalite HCCV screen. The glasses won't synch from that distance. If I stand up and walk about 2' feet closer then they synch. Of course the simplest solution is to move the seats closer but that seems too close for normal 2D viewing. Has anyone used the external emitter? If so, do they put out a stronger signal? Any other suggestions?
Thanks.

I am having sync issue with my projector that I just received over a week ago as well. The projector is throwing a 119" pic at 18' away and I sit between 9-10' away. The Sony glasses sync but the slightest movement can cause them to lose sync. With my Xpand glasses I almost have to look directly at the projector just to get the glasses to sync. I called AVS and Sony is having an external emitter shipped to me at no cost to me. Hopefully this fixes my issue. I should see it on Monday.
post #897 of 3345
What does the external emitter do?
Eliminate "the buzz?
Reduce "sync" problems?
post #898 of 3345
Quote:
Originally Posted by timatraw View Post

What does the external emitter do?
Eliminate "the buzz?
Reduce "sync" problems?


I hope it reduces synch issues. I should have called my dealer. I ordered an external unit from avs.
post #899 of 3345
Is anyone else getting 'image drift'? Mine seems to drift to the right a little when the lamp is hot vs cold. It's maybe a 1/4" (or eve less) on my 120" screen but it definitely happens.
post #900 of 3345
Quote:
Originally Posted by BartMan01 View Post

Is anyone else getting 'image drift'? Mine seems to drift to the right a little when the lamp is hot vs cold. It's maybe a 1/4" (or eve less) on my 120" screen but it definitely happens.
Then you should wait till the projector warms up and put the picture in place.
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