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post #31 of 226
Quote:
Originally Posted by darthray View Post

Hey all
Nobody reply to my last, so I will take it as no-one knows.
What would you guys do if ordering this new line?
Glossy or real black oak vineer?
The way I see it is;
Glossy look beautiful but get reflection from the front projector.
Black oak vineer has much less reflection from the front projector but look (i would assume) good.
Wish one would you buy if was for you in an dictaded home theater with control light enviroment?
I would very much appreciate all opinions just to see what would the majority would do!
I personelly leaning toward the glossy since the finish look so nice.
Ray

Hey Ray, form follows function.
post #32 of 226
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gary Gleave View Post

Hey Ray, form follows function.

Sorry Gary,

I do not quite follow what you mean.
Born french and live in various province for the last 28 years (B-C,Ontario and Alberta) but , never did I ever hear that expression.

I just don't quite get-it.
Do you mean the Glossy?

Ray
post #33 of 226
I don't know how they will be distributed, but I'd imagine eventually at least they would be available through their distributors.

As for finish, if they are going in a light controlled room with a front projector, I'd go with the black oak as it is probably less reflective.

If they are going into a room/system where aesthetics/appearance, or into a system where the reflectivity aren't going to be an issue, then the gloss.
post #34 of 226
Quote:
Originally Posted by darthray View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gary Gleave View Post

Hey Ray, form follows function.

Sorry Gary,

I do not quite follow what you mean.
Born french and live in various province for the last 28 years (B-C,Ontario and Alberta) but , never did I ever hear that expression.

I just don't quite get-it.
Do you mean the Glossy?

Ray

Choose the speakers based on performance/sound quality, instead of how they look.
post #35 of 226
Quote:
Originally Posted by Snowmanick View Post

I don't know how they will be distributed, but I'd imagine eventually at least they would be available through their distributors.
As for finish, if they are going in a light controlled room with a front projector, I'd go with the black oak as it is probably less reflective.
If they are going into a room/system where aesthetics/appearance, or into a system where the reflectivity aren't going to be an issue, then the gloss.

Thanks for the reply

I wish they had some pictures of the black oak
You have to understand where I'm coming from!

Spend 100 hours at a kitchen table about budget (military days) then best design for DIY ,and no hold bars using materials and bracing giving by Madison who devolop the crossover for the Vifa drivers drivers .

I built these Speakers with love and devotion about 12-15 years ago. Still sound great.
But I think it is time for a change.

And this why I value the follow AVS members oppinion.
Why?
From here i got
SVS Subs
JVC front projector
Carada Screen
Outlaw Audio
Blue Jeans cables

You learn from fellow brothers and some sisters of the Audio/Vidio word a few new tricks ( too many people, don't care now a day).
And this is why I come here as many others about desision that make take a while to pay back.

Sorry if sounded like a rant(Proper grammer?).

I just want people to unterstand it is a big desision for me and yes emmotion one too.

Ray
post #36 of 226
Quote:
Originally Posted by Norske View Post

Choose the speakers based on performance/sound quality, instead of how they look.

I agree with the sentiment generally, but it is not always an option (WAF, among other things such as size/placement/budget, etc).


Spoiler Alert: Random & Tangential Info Ahead.

On a side note, while we are hopefully buying speakers based off of the sound and how much we enjoy it, appearance may affect the enjoyment aspect. Some interesting behavioral economics/behavior psychology research has been performed over the years regarding "enjoyment" of an item based off of various non-intrinsic factors (such as price, appearance, and how people interpret those). Prof. Baba Shiv of Stanford had some widely distributed tests on how much people enjoyed various wines (link). The subjects were hooked up to an fMRI and were given samples of wine, and then told the price of the bottle. When the test subjects sampled the higher priced wines, the pleasure receptors in their brains showed much greater activity. The kicker was, it was the same wine. That, however, did not change how peoples brains deciphered the experience. Based off of the fMRI scans, it is quite possible the people did enjoy the "expensive" wine more. Others have done variations of the test with similar results, including the appearance of a wine bottles label, its name, or stories of the vineyard the wines supposedly came from.

Relating this to audio equipment, it may be that the much derided placebo effect can have an actual impact on how people enjoy various audio equipment, even though the differences do not tangibly exist. People may actually enjoy the sound of one speaker over another equal speaker due to the appearance. While the differences may not be perceivable in a DBX test, in the real world, we don't listen to our systems in a DBX environment.

IDK, to me that kind of twists the old noodle a bit. To others, hopefully it wasn't too boring.

Back to the speakers. smile.gif
Edited by Snowmanick - 10/20/12 at 11:06pm
post #37 of 226
Quote:
Originally Posted by darthray View Post

Thanks for the reply. I wish they had some pictures of the black oak.
You have to understand where I'm coming from! Spend 100 hours at a kitchen table about budget (military days) then best design for DIY ,and no hold bars using materials and bracing giving by Madison who devolop the crossover for the Vifa drivers drivers.

Ray,

I think many/most of us understand. Hopefully by the end of next month more info will be presented as SVS gets these ready to sell. As of right now though, I don't think a pair has even been made in the black oak for SVS to take a picture of. At RMAF, I was told the Ultra speakers they were demonstrating were the only ones they had built to date (as in, the 7 speakers in the room were the only 7 in the world so far).
post #38 of 226
Quote:
Originally Posted by Norske View Post

Choose the speakers based on performance/sound quality, instead of how they look.

Pardon my French;)

Thanks,

Now, I know what it mean!

By the way do not feel you offend me, about my spelling by correcting me .
So far only one members corrected me and he was also a French guy from Quebec.

It is the only way to learn

My supervisor like to say
Learn from others mistakes. Because your life is too short to learn everethings that could go wrong!

And it is so true from any industries.

Ray
post #39 of 226
Quote:
Originally Posted by Snowmanick View Post

I agree with the sentiment generally, but it is not always an option (WAF, among other things such as size/placement/budget, etc).
Spoiler Alert: Random & Tangential Info Ahead.
On a side note, while we are hopefully buying speakers based off of the sound and how much we enjoy it, appearance may affect the enjoyment aspect. Some interesting behavioral economics/behavior psychology research has been performed over the years regarding "enjoyment" of an item based off of various non-intrinsic factors (such as price, appearance, and how people interpret those). Prof. Baba Shiv of Stanford had some widely distributed tests on how much people enjoyed various wines (link). The subjects were hooked up to an fMRI and were given samples of wine, and then told the price of the bottle. When the test subjects sampled the higher priced wines, the pleasure receptors in their brains showed much greater activity. The kicker was, it was the same wine. That, however, did not change how peoples brains (unconsciously) deciphered the experience. Based off of the fMRI scans, it is quite possible the people did enjoy the "expensive" wine more. Others have done variations of the test with similar results, including the appearance of a wine bottles label, its name, or stories of the vineyard the wines supposedly came from.
Relating this to audio equipment, it may be that the much derided placebo effect can have an actual impact on how people enjoy various audio equipment, even though the differences do not tangibly exist. This may also explain some peoples insistence that $$$ amps or cables make such a difference in their systems. While I think wasting money on expensive cables should be recommended against, people may actually enjoy the sound of one speaker over another equal speaker due to the appearance. While the differences may not be perceivable in a DBX test, in the real world, we don't listen to our systems in a DBX environment.
IDK, to me that kind of twists the old noodle a bit. To others, hopefully it wasn't too boring.
Back to the speakers. smile.gif

Quote:
Originally Posted by Snowmanick View Post

Ray,
I think many/most of us understand. Hopefully by the end of next month more info will be presented as SVS gets these ready to sell. As of right now though, I don't think a pair has even been made in the black oak for SVS to take a picture of. At RMAF, I was told the Ultra speakers they were demonstrating were the only ones they had built to date (as in, the 7 speakers in the room were the only 7 in the world so far).

Totally agree

Also with the Augustine's Law: "The last 10% of performance generates one-third of the cost and two-thirds of the problems."


I call it chasing the White Rabitt:)

Ray
post #40 of 226
Quote:
Originally Posted by Snowmanick View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Norske View Post

Choose the speakers based on performance/sound quality, instead of how they look.

I agree with the sentiment generally, but it is not always an option (WAF, among other things such as size/placement/budget, etc).


Spoiler Alert: Random & Tangential Info Ahead.

On a side note, while we are hopefully buying speakers based off of the sound and how much we enjoy it, appearance may affect the enjoyment aspect. Some interesting behavioral economics/behavior psychology research has been performed over the years regarding "enjoyment" of an item based off of various non-intrinsic factors (such as price, appearance, and how people interpret those). Prof. Baba Shiv of Stanford had some widely distributed tests on how much people enjoyed various wines (link). The subjects were hooked up to an fMRI and were given samples of wine, and then told the price of the bottle. When the test subjects sampled the higher priced wines, the pleasure receptors in their brains showed much greater activity. The kicker was, it was the same wine. That, however, did not change how peoples brains deciphered the experience. Based off of the fMRI scans, it is quite possible the people did enjoy the "expensive" wine more. Others have done variations of the test with similar results, including the appearance of a wine bottles label, its name, or stories of the vineyard the wines supposedly came from.

Relating this to audio equipment, it may be that the much derided placebo effect can have an actual impact on how people enjoy various audio equipment, even though the differences do not tangibly exist. People may actually enjoy the sound of one speaker over another equal speaker due to the appearance. While the differences may not be perceivable in a DBX test, in the real world, we don't listen to our systems in a DBX environment.

IDK, to me that kind of twists the old noodle a bit. To others, hopefully it wasn't too boring.

Back to the speakers. smile.gif

Appearance is important for sure. I was just explaining the "form follows function" from an earlier post. It's no doubt that with me, I need to like the way it looks for me to completely enjoy it. (I'm actually looking for speakers currently, and yes, they must be visually appealing and sound good).
post #41 of 226
If anyone is interested, HTS is conducting a poll about potential future finishes on the Ultra series speakers as SVS asked for some input.

Here is a link if you want to chime in. SVS Ultra Speakers Finish Options.
post #42 of 226
Does anybody have any idea when these finishes will be available? And a bit of a more pointed question, does anybody know why there aren't finish choices as the WAF goes up dramatically when finishes match the furniture. If it's a choice of a hundred or two hundred dollars more, most will be happy to pay the extra costs of finish upgrades. Blending into the home environment is a very important consideration and today, in the case of subwoofers, with few exceptions, it seem one can get their subwoofers in any color of their choice, as long as it's black. In my opinion, quality issues aside, that's what makes Hsu subwoofers so attractive, the rosewood finishe. From the Hsu subs, it seems one needs to step up to the +$2k range to get aesthetically appealing subwoofers and our budget cannot absorb $4k worth of subs, just for the finish.

Anybody is welcome to jump in on my above with suggestions and insight as to quality and finishes as I'd prefer the SB12-NSD's to be in a cherry or rosewood finish.

Currently, our budget, when budgeted for, can afford a pair of SVS, SB12-NSD's. Realistically, that's our price limit, $1.5k for the delivered pair. And further investigation shows that we don't need more sub.

(My research says these are the top dogs at this price point. To be clear, I'm asking about finish suggestions as opposed to questions surrounding sound quality issues.)

What I'd really like is a pair of Martin Logan, Depth i's for both quality of finish and quality of sound but a pair of Depth i's are, by comparison, too expensive and fiscally a long way away from a pair of SB12-NSD's. Too far away to justify the purchase of.
post #43 of 226
Quote:
Originally Posted by BeeMan458 View Post

Does anybody have any idea when these finishes will be available? And a bit of a more pointed question, does anybody know why there aren't finish choices as the WAF goes up dramatically when finishes match the furniture. If it's a choice of a hundred or two hundred dollars more, most will be happy to pay the extra costs of finish upgrades. Blending into the home environment is a very important consideration and today, in the case of subwoofers, with few exceptions, it seem one can get their subwoofers in any color of their choice, as long as it's black. In my opinion, quality issues aside, that's what makes Hsu subwoofers so attractive, the rosewood finishe. From the Hsu subs, it seems one needs to step up to the +$2k range to get aesthetically appealing subwoofers and our budget cannot absorb $4k worth of subs, just for the finish.
Anybody is welcome to jump in on my above with suggestions and insight as to quality and finishes as I'd prefer the SB12-NSD's to be in a cherry or rosewood finish.
Currently, our budget, when budgeted for, can afford a pair of SVS, SB12-NSD's. Realistically, that's our price limit, $1.5k for the delivered pair. And further investigation shows that we don't need more sub.
(My research says these are the top dogs at this price point. To be clear, I'm asking about finish suggestions as opposed to questions surrounding sound quality issues.)
What I'd really like is a pair of Martin Logan, Depth i's for both quality of finish and quality of sound but a pair of Depth i's are, by comparison, too expensive and fiscally a long way away from a pair of SB12-NSD's. Too far away to justify the purchase of.

I agree that nice finishes can make speakers a much more attractive proposition, not just for WAF, but in general. Gary Yacoubian told me at RMAF that they would only sell a handful of subs in colors other than black, which is why they reduced or eliminated the other options. But speakers are a different story, as they are front and center visually, rather than hidden like subs. Hopefully they will add one or two nice wood options besides the gloss and flat black finishes announced so far.
post #44 of 226
Quote:
Currently, our budget, when budgeted for, can afford a pair of SVS, SB12-NSD's. Realistically, that's our price limit, $1.5k for the delivered pair. And further investigation shows that we don't need more sub.

Have you looked at the powersound xs15? They're $749 each w/shipping (Assuming you live in the US). Right on your price point.
http://www.powersoundaudio.com/products/xs15

I don't know if they're better than the SVS, but seems like they might be worth a look.
post #45 of 226
Just finished with a long conversation with Jack of SVS and currently, no plans for finishes as there's not enough continuing interest on the part of customers to keep finish choices on the menu. Obviously it can change but currently, no plans. Boo, hoo, hoo. smile.gif
post #46 of 226
Quote:
Originally Posted by KidHorn View Post

Have you looked at the powersound xs15? They're $749 each w/shipping (Assuming you live in the US). Right on your price point.
http://www.powersoundaudio.com/products/xs15
I don't know if they're better than the SVS, but seems like they might be worth a look.

Thanks for the suggestion. Yes, I did and the charts and graphs and I'm wanting a forward firing sub, keeps me pointed in the direction of SVS subs. I'm not knocking the Power Sound XS15's in my comments. So far, after all my research, nothing in a forward firing sub seems to turn my head so I figure, with the exception of a lack in color choices, I must be happy.

Despite wanting a forward firing sub, I'd love to see some "data-bass" testing of the Power Sound subs.

-
Edited by BeeMan458 - 10/25/12 at 9:32am
post #47 of 226
Quote:
Originally Posted by darthray View Post

Hey all
I love SVS sound, started with 1 PB2 than added a second one.
Then I switch them for 2 PB13 Ultra.
This new line look very promising.
But, and this a big BUT.
The description go as fellow
1" aluminum dome UltraSonic tweeter.
Dual 6.5" UltraSonic midrange drivers.
Dual 8" UltraSonic woofers.
Also cast driver, not stamp.
The UltraSonic sound something like BOSE would use!!!
Cast mean it has to be a quality driver.
But the wording UltraSonic sound like a marqueting gizmo.
Is it just me?
They look beautifuf but I think they just tell us who is the manufacture something like Morel, Vifa, Scanspeak or the like.
I would like to purchase a full 7 set-up if the reviews are good, but coming from DIY speaker UltraSonic does not sit well with me.
Ray

any update on this speakers?
I also want to buy a HT to watch HD satellite TV, movies and Blue ray, little music and games.
I was really considering a sound bar due to simplicity but I guess I can start with a 2.0 and build/finish the system slowly buying speaker each month until a finished 5.1, my goal.

so then from that quote is that something to really think about or no biggie.
I was looking at the Monitor Audio Silver line, and the PSB Image or Imagine.
Thanks!
post #48 of 226
^^^
I believe darthray was pointing out that he didn't like marketing terminology, not to any issues with the speakers. The components/drivers used in the SVS Ultra line, based off of the info released, are of very good quality.

The speakers appear to have been delayed, perhaps to December (speculative date).

As for the SVS Ultra, or any of the other speaker you mentioned, they should have significant performance advantages over a soundbar. Of course, they also will require more space, both physically and in order to sound their best, ie: don't butt them up against the wall.
post #49 of 226
Quote:
Originally Posted by Snowmanick View Post

^^^
I believe darthray was pointing out that he didn't like marketing terminology, not to any issues with the speakers. The components/drivers used in the SVS Ultra line, based off of the info released, are of very good quality.
The speakers appear to have been delayed, perhaps to December (speculative date).
As for the SVS Ultra, or any of the other speaker you mentioned, they should have significant performance advantages over a soundbar. Of course, they also will require more space, both physically and in order to sound their best, ie: don't butt them up against the wall.

You are right on the money Snowmanick.

Too bad, about the delay.


Ray
post #50 of 226
I wonder how these speakers would compare (towers/bookshelves) to the Ascend Sierra 1's and towers. I've been looking at those - now these - both are in the same price range. WIsh I could hear them both. Was Ascend at RMAF? If so, did anyone listen to both?
post #51 of 226
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kpt_Krunch View Post

I wonder how these speakers would compare (towers/bookshelves) to the Ascend Sierra 1's and towers. I've been looking at those - now these - both are in the same price range. WIsh I could hear them both. Was Ascend at RMAF? If so, did anyone listen to both?

Ascend was not at RMAF. But, I am planning to order both the Sierra towers and SVS towers to compare for myself. SVS is offering free shipping both ways on the new Ultra speakers when they are released, so no risk. Ascend does charge for shipping, about $100 each way. To be fair though, I am getting the upgraded Sierra towers with the ribbon tweeters, so not a totally fair fight.
post #52 of 226
thanks now that I re-read it make sence what you say about the terminology.
so this speaker have the Dayton RS28A tweeters and the Peerless HDS glass fiber woofer?
are those suppose to be real good stuff? or no compararition agains the ribbon im new when it comes to this
where are the full spec cant find other than what others have posted on the internet.
post #53 of 226
Any updates on these speakers?
post #54 of 226
Quote:
Originally Posted by metalsaber View Post

Any updates on these speakers?

Just saw this posted by Ed Mullen over at Audioholics

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ed Mullen;929826 
Hi guys -

Sorry for the short news black-out on the Ultra series.

We wanted to make sure the Ultra-series debut was absolutely perfect, so we went through the time and expense of doing a limited-scale production run. This pushed the schedule to the right a few weeks, but it was worth the effort to have 100% confidence the speakers were going to be flawless.

Every model in the Ultra family looks, sounds and measures phenomenal, and we're all super excited with the extreme quality and performance value these new speakers will deliver.

After confirming the pilot production run was perfect, we moved ahead with a full-scale production run, and all models will be in-stock and shipping in mid-January. We'll be getting the product pages up in the interim with full specs, so keep an eye on our website and FB page for additional details over the next few weeks.

We appreciate your patience and interest in the Ultra-series and it won't be much longer now! cool.gif
post #55 of 226
The biggest "knock" I see against this speaker is the use of a metal dome tweeter. Yes, I know all metal domes sound different but IMHO ALL of the metal domes I have heard are detailed but bright and fatiguing. Sure wish they had gone with a silk dome or ribbon.

-Brian
post #56 of 226
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bghead8che View Post

The biggest "knock" I see against this speaker is the use of a metal dome tweeter. Yes, I know all metal domes sound different but IMHO ALL of the metal domes I have heard are detailed but bright and fatiguing. Sure wish they had gone with a silk dome or ribbon.
-Brian
Eh, I disagree. I've had plenty of speakers with metal dome and fabric dome speakers. Either material canbe fatiguing. I think it is all about implementation, not just material.

Think about the widespread use of aluminum, beryllium (metal), titanium, and even diamonds in many of the highest performing speakers on the market , including flagships from Revel, Paradigm, Focal, and B&W. Aluminum tweeters are used in many well regarded (and great sounding) speakers. In the end, if a speaker isn't designed well, any tweeter can be bright, and if designed well, the material isn't going to be the sole factor.

Just my $.02
post #57 of 226
Quote:
Originally Posted by Snowmanick View Post

Eh, I disagree. I've had plenty of speakers with metal dome and fabric dome speakers. Either material canbe fatiguing. I think it is all about implementation, not just material.
Think about the widespread use of aluminum, beryllium (metal), titanium, and even diamonds in many of the highest performing speakers on the market , including flagships from Revel, Paradigm, Focal, and B&W. Aluminum tweeters are used in many well regarded (and great sounding) speakers. In the end, if a speaker isn't designed well, any tweeter can be bright, and if designed well, the material isn't going to be the sole factor.
Just my $.02

Once again, I must agree with Snowmanick:)

It is all about implementation and having the the drivers manufacture doing the driver for a specific speaker manufacture the way it intend to do a specific design.

Two weeks late for the release date and no news. They (SVSound must be working on last minutes change) but it would be nice if they let us know what's the latest news.
Just can't wait to see some review, after all, this SVS Big jump to try to compete agains other speaker in the high end industries (Mid end for the the very few that can afford some super expensive speakers).
But coming from DIY, I know quality and double or triple the price does not equal in double or triple the performance, a few percent point maybe .
I like the best Bang for the buck version better, Nothing agains the few folks that can spend the extra money.

Ray
post #58 of 226
Revel, Focal, B&W, and Pargadigm are all bright, fatiguing speakers IMHO. Like I said, never heard a metal dome I can tolerate. On the other hand there are definately some bright silk domes out there I just find them, by and large, to be less fatiguing.

-Brian
post #59 of 226
Maybe this is a dumb question. But aren't ribbons metal too? Why a they not considers bright? Or, are they?

Also, I bet, the room and room treatments probably make a bigger difference on whether a speaker sonds bright. I guess I will find out for myself when I do my own in home comparison, since the ascend tower and Phil 2 have ribbons, and the SVS is metal.
post #60 of 226
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bghead8che View Post

Revel, Focal, B&W, and Pargadigm are all bright, fatiguing speakers IMHO. Like I said, never heard a metal dome I can tolerate. On the other hand there are definately some bright silk domes out there I just find them, by and large, to be less fatiguing.
-Brian
These were all auditioned in your home?

Quote:
Originally Posted by NewHTbuyer View Post

Maybe this is a dumb question. But aren't ribbons metal too? Why a they not considers bright? Or, are they?
Also, I bet, the room and room treatments probably make a bigger difference on whether a speaker sonds bright. I guess I will find out for myself when I do my own in home comparison, since the ascend tower and Phil 2 have ribbons, and the SVS is metal.
Entirely different dispersion characteristics too.
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