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Projector Mini-Shootout Thread 2013-2014 - Page 35

post #1021 of 8058
Quote:
Originally Posted by zombie10k View Post

is that the same RS45 with the noticeable blue tint on low APL scenes?
I think you meant FI (not DI) on the Sony 3D. On the 5020, I would rather have seen the FI instead of the DI since imo it really doesn't do much. Also the Super Resolution missing in 3D is a mistake that should be fixed in a firmware update if possible. The RC on the HW50 in 3D mode looks very good once it's tamed down a bit. (factory = 50, my preference is 25-30 here).

For the Sony HW50 in 3D mode, Can I activate the FI and RC but not the DI?

Thanks.
post #1022 of 8058
Quote:
Originally Posted by DaGamePimp View Post

The 5020 does have a Color Management System (color gamut control). wink.gif
Jason
Hi Jason, thanks for the reply.

I was referring to ISF certification support (only EH-TW9100 / 6020 support it according to user manual. Available under Image-Advanced-Color Gamut configuration menu).
Sorry for the confusion. rolleyes.gif

So, lack of ISF certification in EH-TW8100 / 5020 compromises color calibration when using the LPE filter?

When comparing EH-TW9100 and EH-TW8100, the last mainly misses anamorphic lens support and ISF certification.
If one does not require anamorphic lens, does EH-TW9100 still worth the price difference?

Thanks!
post #1023 of 8058
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by fpr View Post

For the Sony HW50 in 3D mode, Can I activate the FI and RC but not the DI?

Thanks.

correct. The lack of DI isn't really a big deal. IMO, the HW50 looks as good, if not better than the 5020 in dark scenes in 3D vs. the 5020 with it's iris on.

I would rather have the FI and Super Resolution available on the 5020 than the DI.
post #1024 of 8058
Last night, on my Sony HW50, I test the Sony PS3 3D Glasses vs the Sony TDG-PJ1 and the MonsterVision.

To my surprise, the PS3 glasses work better than the TDG-PJ1 in term of ghosting.

The MonsterVision are still the best one. I did another round of tweak on the MonsterVision and was able to reduce the ghosting even more.

After many testing with patterns and real material here my ranking from best to wrost for ghosting :

1. MonsterVision
2. Xpand 104
3. Sony PS3 (almost equal in terme of ghosting to the Xpand, but the Xpand are more comfortable)
4. Sony TDG-PJ1
post #1025 of 8058
Quote:
Originally Posted by fpr View Post

Yes, the problem is the LCoS panels, but I read that the new models has greatly improved the ghosting over the X30/X70/x90 and still have the same panels. So if the new JVC RF system is the only difference I thought that these could also improve the ghosting in X30/X70/X90.

They have adjusted the chips so that they can switch faster. This will affect how deep the blacks go in 3d. The RF glasses will not make the difference alone. If they did then theoretically you can use these glasses on the older JVC 3d projectors and it would improve the ghosting, But that is not the case.
post #1026 of 8058
Quote:
Originally Posted by RickAVManiac View Post

Last night, on my Sony HW50, I test the Sony PS3 3D Glasses vs the Sony TDG-PJ1 and the MonsterVision.
To my surprise, the PS3 glasses work better than the TDG-PJ1 in term of ghosting.
The MonsterVision are still the best one. I did another round of tweak on the MonsterVision and was able to reduce the ghosting even more.
After many testing with patterns and real material here my ranking from best to wrost for ghosting :
1. MonsterVision
2. Xpand 104
3. Sony PS3 (almost equal in terme of ghosting to the Xpand, but the Xpand are more comfortable)
4. Sony TDG-PJ1

Did you also performed some tests with the Optoma ZF2100 glasses or do you see any difference between the new Optoma and Monster glasses?
post #1027 of 8058
Quote:
Originally Posted by RickAVManiac View Post

Last night, on my Sony HW50, I test the Sony PS3 3D Glasses vs the Sony TDG-PJ1 and the MonsterVision.
To my surprise, the PS3 glasses work better than the TDG-PJ1 in term of ghosting.
The MonsterVision are still the best one. I did another round of tweak on the MonsterVision and was able to reduce the ghosting even more.
After many testing with patterns and real material here my ranking from best to wrost for ghosting :
1. MonsterVision
2. Xpand 104
3. Sony PS3 (almost equal in terme of ghosting to the Xpand, but the Xpand are more comfortable)
4. Sony TDG-PJ1
Rick,
I don't know these PS3 glasses, do you have a link?

And concerning the MV-glasses: What are the settings you made (hopefully with the software and not the joystick..) for duty cycle and delay and what glasses brightness setting in the projector is it based on?

thanks!
post #1028 of 8058
After reading thru lots of this thread sure is a great time to buy a PJ!

You guys buying your 1st 1080p PJ can thank all of us "early" adopters who 4-5 years ago funded the R&D for these truly great PJ's.

My $5k retail, $4.2k then Dec-2007 price Sony VW60, is looking aged compared to any of these........ I can't see how any of these in the shoot out will not satisfy.
post #1029 of 8058
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by RickAVManiac View Post

Last night, on my Sony HW50, I test the Sony PS3 3D Glasses vs the Sony TDG-PJ1 and the MonsterVision.

To my surprise, the PS3 glasses work better than the TDG-PJ1 in term of ghosting.

The MonsterVision are still the best one. I did another round of tweak on the MonsterVision and was able to reduce the ghosting even more.

After many testing with patterns and real material here my ranking from best to wrost for ghosting :

1. MonsterVision
2. Xpand 104
3. Sony PS3 (almost equal in terme of ghosting to the Xpand, but the Xpand are more comfortable)
4. Sony TDG-PJ1

Rick, Hi, are you using the L/R screens for comparison or using a still on a tough 3D movie? The reason I ask is, with a difficult movie like Happy Feet 2, I didn't find any MV3D settings that was able to really exceed the 104's or the PJ1's.

Are you tuning the transmitter with the laptop or manually on the transmiiter? I'll have to go back and revisit this.

thx!
post #1030 of 8058
I usually use this test-picture: http://www.heimkino-blog.de/allgemein/optoma-3d-rf-system/attachment/sbs-testbild-ubersprechen-rgbcymw-weis
Its been created by a guy I know and I think its very good because you have all primary and secondary colors and black and white. Use it in SBS or convert it to an MPO-file using the Stereo Photo Maker
With a Panasonic BD-player MPO 3D-photos can be showan and they're sent to the projector in 1080p24 framepacked.

Here's an example of how the picture can look like behind the glasses (JVC original system, bad ghosting): http://www.heimkino-blog.de/allgemein/optoma-3d-rf-system/attachment/jvc-3d-system-ab-werk_mbr4369
the lower half of the screen should be a complete white area! (this is through one of the glasses; through the other glass you should see complete and clean colored vertical bars from top to bottom; so for checking by eye you have to close on eye or the other!)

Most test pictures only show black on white or white on black, but that's not the complete story of ghosting... so it's better to take into account also the colors.

And you'll even need another test pic with all colors on a black background for example..
post #1031 of 8058
Thread Starter 
it's going to be a long weekend. cool.gif

I don't have the new glasses, only the older EY-3DGS-78U. the new model advertised on their site is the EY-3DGS-80U. I'm not sure how quickly I'll get them, probably at least a week away.

I'll try the Xpand 104 and MV3D's in the meantime.

HC8000D1.jpg
post #1032 of 8058
Quote:
Originally Posted by zombie10k View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by RickAVManiac View Post

Last night, on my Sony HW50, I test the Sony PS3 3D Glasses vs the Sony TDG-PJ1 and the MonsterVision.

To my surprise, the PS3 glasses work better than the TDG-PJ1 in term of ghosting.

The MonsterVision are still the best one. I did another round of tweak on the MonsterVision and was able to reduce the ghosting even more.

After many testing with patterns and real material here my ranking from best to wrost for ghosting :

1. MonsterVision
2. Xpand 104
3. Sony PS3 (almost equal in terme of ghosting to the Xpand, but the Xpand are more comfortable)
4. Sony TDG-PJ1

Rick, Hi, are you using the L/R screens for comparison or using a still on a tough 3D movie? The reason I ask is, with a difficult movie like Happy Feet 2, I didn't find any MV3D settings that was able to really exceed the 104's or the PJ1's.

Are you tuning the transmitter with the laptop or manually on the transmiiter? I'll have to go back and revisit this.

thx!

I am using both (patern and tough scene). I am tuning with the transmitter.

On some high contrast scene (ex: white on black) it is very difficult to reduce the ghosting but on less agressive scene with average ghosting, I was able to reduce quit a bit...

And to complicate thing, on some scene one glasses could do better than the other and vice versa as we watch the movie.

But overall I think the MV is the best for most scene...
post #1033 of 8058
Now I cannot wait for your input on the HC8000 have fun. Where did you get it from because BB stopped carrying Mitsubishi projectors.mad.gif
post #1034 of 8058
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by jsil View Post

Now I cannot wait for your input on the HC8000 have fun. Where did you get it from because BB stopped carrying Mitsubishi projectors.mad.gif

AVScience sells the HC8000. I don't think this model would have shown up in retail anyway, I think there are restrictions on where this specific model is being sold.
post #1035 of 8058
Quote:
Originally Posted by ol2 View Post

However the manual states:
During 3D projection, the following configuration menu functions cannot be changed.
Aspect (set to Normal)
Quote:
Originally Posted by biliam1982 View Post

Is that talking about aspect ratio? As in you cannot do Anamorphic support in 3D mode (I believe it was reported to be the case on the BenQ W7000 too)?

Anyone know the answer to this?
post #1036 of 8058
Zombie -- please check out the 2D to 3D conversion on the Mits. I'm curious as to how good it is. There have been some reports that it is the only 2D to 3D conversion that is worthwhile (PC).
post #1037 of 8058
Zombie,

Are you planning to spend equal time with the 5020 (vs the HW50) or will you now be moving on to the HC8000?

Still curious regarding the colorfacts tracking/phase pattern as we have seen two 5020's here that both had the issue (which is not present on other projectors/displays).

Thank You,
Jason
post #1038 of 8058
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Deja Vu View Post

Zombie -- please check out the 2D to 3D conversion on the Mits. I'm curious as to how good it is. There have been some reports that it is the only 2D to 3D conversion that is worthwhile (PC).

No 3D for me.. I just realized I don't have the 3D emitter. cool.gif

I'll have to wait a few days to get an emitter and hopefully the new high speed shutter glasses, there is a separate setting in the menu specifically for the new glasses.

in the meantime, I have to find that article on Cine4home's site that shows how to wire in the MV3D emitter. The HC8000 has a 5 pin output vs. the 3 pin on the MV3D's side.
post #1039 of 8058
no harm doing some 2D comparisons while you wait biggrin.gif
post #1040 of 8058
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by DaGamePimp View Post

Zombie,

Are you planning to spend equal time with the 5020 (vs the HW50) or will you now be moving on to the HC8000?

Still curious regarding the colorfacts tracking/phase pattern as we have seen two 5020's here that both had the issue (which is not present on other projectors/displays).

Thank You,

Jason

Jason - hi, I'm definitely going back to the Epson 5020, I just wanted to nail down calibrating the HW50 in 3D first. A friend and I just watched Spiderman 3D on the 5020 the other night. This has some decent 3D scenes, but I think they could have done a lot more with it.

my main HTPC setup is tied up with media center duties, I'll grab another machine to test the tracking/phase patterns.
post #1041 of 8058
Thread Starter 
The HC8000 is smaller than I was expecting. It took me about 10 minutes to realize there was no built in 3D emitter. cool.gif

HC8000.jpg

I found the link from Cine4home where they tested the MV3D's with the 7800.


http://www.cine4home.de/tests/projektoren/Mitsubishi_HC7800/Brillen/HC7800%20Brillen.htm


this is straight forward, I should be able to wire it over the weekend.

HC8000-1.jpg


There's also a new pair of RF glasses for the optoma/MV3D transmitter, I'm going to pick up a pair of these to see how they compare to the original glasses.

medium_5f6d39e8606b49c6bf4625284bb750ab.jpg
post #1042 of 8058
Zombie,

Did your HC8000 come with an extra lamp? The PC review states that the extra lamp is one of the differences between that and the HC7900.

Also, what's your impression of the lumen output and lag time for the HC8000?

Thanks a bunch!
post #1043 of 8058
I demand more pictures and feedback immediately! tongue.gifbiggrin.gif
post #1044 of 8058
What about the so lovely "rainbow effect" ? tongue.gif
post #1045 of 8058
Quote:
Originally Posted by zombie10k View Post

stack.jpg

Off topic: Can someone tell me what shelf that is? It looks about perfect for what I could use for my room.

On topic: How does the HW50 handle image noise? I've seen a Sony VW85 in action, and though it has a really good picture, it seemed to show noise, or maybe macroblocking, on sources that my RS1 and 45 did not show. Not a huge deal-breaker, but it's kind of off-putting. I'm considering getting either the HW50 or the RS46 in the coming months, and if the HW50 has the noise problem, I may have to go for the 46.
post #1046 of 8058
Do the MonsterVision glasses without any custom cables etc. on the HW50? Which exact type of MV3D glasses do I need?
post #1047 of 8058
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by sanderdvd View Post

Do the MonsterVision glasses without any custom cables etc. on the HW50? Which exact type of MV3D glasses do I need?

you need to update the firmware on the RF controller and then it will work fine on the HW50 IR emitter. send me your email in a PM, I'll email the firmware update.

these are the glasses:

http://www.amazon.com/MonsterVision-Eyewear-System-Active-Sync/dp/B004443WRG/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1353182129&sr=8-1&keywords=monster+3d+vision

or

http://www.amazon.com/OPTOMA-TECHNOLOGY-BG-ZF2100GLS-Shutter-Glasses/dp/B008PQJXFO/ref=sr_1_2?s=electronics&ie=UTF8&qid=1353182196&sr=1-2&keywords=optoma+3D+glasses

these are relatively new, I'm going to order a pair since they look less fragile than the MV3D's which have to be handled with care.
post #1048 of 8058
Zombie, 3D Now also sells the new Bit Cauldron glasses and they may have a better price than Amazon. Why not give them a call and tell them that you want to test them.
post #1049 of 8058
Zombie, what you mean that it will work on the sony hw50 IR emitter? My hw50 has a internal RF emitter doesn t it?
post #1050 of 8058
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by sanderdvd View Post

Zombie, what you mean that it will work on the sony hw50 IR emitter? My hw50 has a internal RF emitter doesn t it?

correct, you have to place the IR receiver for the MV3D transmitter near the internal IR sender on the HW30.

depending on the firmware, it might not support the Sony's IR signal out of the box. I don't know which firmware works or doesn't, but I have a firmware update that definitely supports the HW50.

let me know if you need it.
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