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Projector Mini-Shootout Thread 2013-2014 - Page 189

post #5641 of 8052
Maybe, but the HW50 was not the Rob Ford of projectors. Maybe the Hugh Jackman of projectors..................
post #5642 of 8052
A little out of context here... But what have people seen with long term Epson quality?

My father has an Epson 6010 and just got his 3rd (!!) replacement (on his fourth 6010). I knew he had a replacement before, but I just heard of others.

1) original wouldn't hold zoom position and would "zoom out" (get bigger) each day

2) 2nd failed when lens motor stopped opening

3) 3rd failed by saying the cinema color filter wasn't working. This was just a couple of weeks ago.

Now he has a forth. Nothing special with his setup ... And it's not like it get excessively used or is in a harsh environment. He got the 6010 in feb of 2012.

Good news? Epson has been good about sending him (refurbished) replacements.
Edited by MadMyers - 12/24/13 at 6:38pm
post #5643 of 8052
Could someone with an Epson 6030 (or 6010 and 6020) please tell me if the vertical stretch works in 3D mode.
Thanks
Joe
post #5644 of 8052
Quote:
Originally Posted by MadMyers View Post

A little out of context here... But what have people seen with long term Epson quality?

My father has an Epson 6010 and just got his 3rd (!!) replacement (on his fourth 6010). I knew he had a replacement before, but I just heard of others.

1) original wouldn't hold zoom position and would "zoom out" (get bigger) each day

2) 2nd failed when lens motor stopped opening

3) 3rd failed by saying the cinema color filter wasn't working. This was just a couple of weeks ago.

Now he has a forth. Nothing special with his setup ... And it's not like it get excessively used or is in a harsh environment. He got the 6010 in feb of 2012.

Good news? Epson has been good about sending him (refurbished) replacements.

I have four Epson projectors -- 7500, 9500, 6010 and 6020. No problems with any of them so far (*). I think the 7500 is from 2008 and has had a lot of use over the last five years or so.

* the lens motor failed to open the lens shield once with the 6020 so I shut it down, unplugged the projector and rebooted it. No issues since then.
post #5645 of 8052
I have had an Epson 6020 for over a year with 2000 plus hours on the original lamp. The picture is excellent and I have had zero problems.
Most of the time when you have no problems a lot of people don't post! So I thought I would share to provide fair balance.
post #5646 of 8052
Just a note on Epson's customer service. I had an Epson 9700UB for two years. Excellent 2D projector. The lamp died after 900+ hours, so I emailed Epson. They responded and sent me a new bulb with no questions asked.

I now have an Epson 6030 which I am very pleased with for both 2D and 3D material.
post #5647 of 8052
Quote:
Originally Posted by MadMyers View Post

A little out of context here... But what have people seen with long term Epson quality?

My father has an Epson 6010 and just got his 3rd (!!) replacement (on his fourth 6010). I knew he had a replacement before, but I just heard of others.

1) original wouldn't hold zoom position and would "zoom out" (get bigger) each day

2) 2nd failed when lens motor stopped opening

3) 3rd failed by saying the cinema color filter wasn't working. This was just a couple of weeks ago.

Now he has a forth. Nothing special with his setup ... And it's not like it get excessively used or is in a harsh environment. He got the 6010 in feb of 2012.

Good news? Epson has been good about sending him (refurbished) replacements.

have owned a couple of epsons in the 5500 and the 9000W, the 5500 fell victim to infant mortality at 30 hour point. epson and local service centre were very good to swap it for a 9000w as the 5500 by that stage was EOL. few niggles on the 9000w, a couple of false alarms and a lens shutter that wouldn't open but in all cases the local service centre were faultless and literally sorting out on the spot ! epsons warranty is best of any brands too, so hard to fault in that regard smile.gif
post #5648 of 8052
Merry X-Mas all and Happy New Year (soon) tongue.gif

I knew I should stayed away from this thread since I can't afford a $3k+ projector, but all these talks about the Sony is making me really itchy for one.

I currently have a BenW W1070 and love it for what I paid for it. I do prefer DLP over LCD for sharpness and motion.

I see that the Sony HW30 and HW50 had dropped in prices. Would I see significant PQ improvements with the HW30/50 over the W1070?

I have a completely light controlled room. Main usage is movies, with occasional Xbox 360 gaming. Don't care much for 3D at this point.

Anyone know what the the going prices are for a B-stock HW30/HW50?

Thanks,
post #5649 of 8052
What is the gaming latency for the 5030 in the regular ("fine") mode? I tried out some games last night and didn't have any issues. My wife would find it impossible to believe that there are people out there pickier than I am.

And what is the JVC's latency? 95ms or something like that?

Anyone know what the actual native contrast (iris off) on the 5030 is?
post #5650 of 8052
O.K. here are my impressions having spent a little more time with the Sharp(30000) and Mits (8000) vs. the Epson (6010 and 6020).

Bottom line first -- If I could only have one of these projectors I would keep the Sharp and here's why:

1) I love the Epson -- it is bright, has good contrast, is easy to place with a HP screen (or any screen), has great support, is relatively cheap, throws a great 2D and 3D* image, has the best contrast of all three, has a good CFI system and Super resolution works well. What's there not to like? * Well ghosting, any amount of it drives me nuts. The Epson is really good in 3D and that's the problem. The little bit of ghosting mars that great image and takes me out of the story. I'm very fussy and most here would probably consider me extremely hard to please, and I am. If it wasn't for the light ghosting I would not have looked at other 3D options.

2) I love the Mits -- great 2D, amazing 3D*, will do a full fade to black (auto iris 3), has a great CFI system and comes with an extra lamp (no 3D glasses or emitter) -- so what's there not to like? Well, placement is a bitch, especially with a hipower screen. You have to compromise with where you place the projector to get the most out of the HP. Also, brightness in 3D is the lowest of all three projectors and it needs the HP screen, yet is hard to place with that screen -- it only has limited vertical adjustment and its lowest throw angle is, IMO, just too high. The special 3D glasses for this projector are extremely expensive. The good news is that you can use other IR glasses, like the Epson and Sony PS3 glasses, but apparently they take a higher toll when it comes to brightness. The Sharp works with these glasses as well.

O.K. that leaves the Sharp -- very good 2D (good motion), good, but not great contrast, and stellar 3D. The Sharp is much easier to use with the HP due to its vertical and horizontal motorized adjustments. It is surprisingly bright on a 120" HP screen in 3D and has detail, depth and clarity in 3D that I've never seen before (due, I believe to its brightness, gamma, and total lack of ghosting -- the Mits just needs more brightness to match the Sharp and maybe a gamma tweak).

The simple solution is the Epson. If Epson fixes the ghosting then I'll probably go back to it full time because it does everything else so well -- especially for the money. The good news for me is that I can have my cake and eat it too! At the moment my HT looks like a equipment testing lab. biggrin.gif
post #5651 of 8052
So, Deja Vu, you must really watch a lot of 3D content huh? (Given how it seems to figure so strongly into your projector preferences). I'm just dipping my toes into 3D at home, myself.
post #5652 of 8052
Quote:
Originally Posted by R Harkness View Post

So, Deja Vu, you must really watch a lot of 3D content huh? (Given how it seems to figure so strongly into your projector preferences). I'm just dipping my toes into 3D at home, myself.

I bought the little Acer about 3 1/2 years ago and started collecting 3D content. I've got a lot of the content that's available and really enjoy it. I put Pacific Rim on the other night using the Mits and although its a pop corn movie and I've seen it twice before it was hard not to watch it all the way through -- I did; however, watch Hugo all the way through and I've seen it several times before. 3D on a DLP using a HP screen is hard to beat when the 3D is well thought out. I still enjoy 2D, but 3D is more immersive in my opinion. I don't know how many times I've watched Dredd -- I love this movie in 3D! One of my all time favourites is Madagascar III -- great in 3D and pretty funny too.

I forgot to mention that the Mits has the best 2D to 3D conversion I've seen yet (better than PowerDVD 13 Ultra's 2D to 3D conversion, which was a step up from other conversions I've seen). I don't experience eye strain with normal 3D, but I do feel a slight strain with 2D converted in real time to 3D.
post #5653 of 8052
We watched A Christmas Carol 3d on Christmas which I think was the first time I had seen it on the DLP and I was just as amazed by it as the family I had over was. eek.gif I don't remember this title being THIS good for 3d, but I had only seen it on the JVCs which had something to do with it. Strong depth throughout and some great pop out moments off and on. The complete and total absence of ghosting AND flicker just cant be overemphasized as well as good 3d brightness and motion (motion is also much better on my DLP in 3d with FI on low vs my RS40/45). I'm with Deja Vu in the fact that 3d really is a considerably better experience on a DLP. cool.gif I actually got to a point where I quit watching 3d on my RS45 due to ghosting and flicker ruining the presentation for me, but ever since getting the 7000 a year ago, my 3d enjoyment is so much more. The vast majority of what I watch is still 2d, but it is nice knowing when I do throw on a 3d disc it will be as good as the transfer allows and my display device is not a limiting factor anymore (I no longer have to worry about where I will notice ghosting and flicker pop up since it doesn't!).
post #5654 of 8052
Zombie,

When you test out the JVC RS57, I'm wondering: Do you have a Lumagen 2041, or some other way of sending the RS57 1080p Blu-Rays upscaled to 4K? I really want to make sure the RS57 accepts such a signal from the Lumagen (or similer..HTPC?), and I'm also very interested how the image will look upscaled first by a "better" scaler like the Lumagen, then MPC added, compared to the JVC doing both upscaling and MPC.

As we know, for the Sony 4K projectors, some report better results first upscaling with the Lumagen to 4K, so I'm curious if we'll see similar results with the new JVC projectors.

Thanks.


(Deja Vu and Toe, I get it. The 3D I've watched on my RS55 was very intriguing, at least at first, but probably because of the duller image and cross-talk, I tended to abandon it over a while. Though admittedly my first attempts tended to be with the projector right after turning it on. A while back when I watched some 3D after the projector had been on for quite a while, it seemed less fatiguing, so maybe some warm-up time helped the cross-talk. I'm hoping for better, not perfect just better, 3D performance from my new JVC)
post #5655 of 8052
Thread Starter 
yes, I definitely plan on testing the 2041 and 4K HTPC scaling to the RS57 to see if it looks different / better vs. the built in scaling.
post #5656 of 8052
You da man!
post #5657 of 8052
Quote:
Originally Posted by Toe View Post

We watched A Christmas Carol 3d on Christmas which I think was the first time I had seen it on the DLP and I was just as amazed by it as the family I had over was. eek.gif I don't remember this title being THIS good for 3d, but I had only seen it on the JVCs which had something to do with it. Strong depth throughout and some great pop out moments off and on. The complete and total absence of ghosting AND flicker just cant be overemphasized as well as good 3d brightness and motion (motion is also much better on my DLP in 3d with FI on low vs my RS40/45). I'm with Deja Vu in the fact that 3d really is a considerably better experience on a DLP. cool.gif I actually got to a point where I quit watching 3d on my RS45 due to ghosting and flicker ruining the presentation for me, but ever since getting the 7000 a year ago, my 3d enjoyment is so much more. The vast majority of what I watch is still 2d, but it is nice knowing when I do throw on a 3d disc it will be as good as the transfer allows and my display device is not a limiting factor anymore (I no longer have to worry about where I will notice ghosting and flicker pop up since it doesn't!).

Hi Toe,

If you haven't seen any ghosting in A Christmas Carol, you must have been distracted. There are at least three instances: past, present and future. They should still be there on your DLP biggrin.gif
post #5658 of 8052
Quote:
Originally Posted by Manni01 View Post

Hi Toe,

If you haven't seen any ghosting in A Christmas Carol, you must have been distracted. There are at least three instances: past, present and future. They should still be there on your DLP biggrin.gif


I just checked again after reading this post Manni and you are right! Not only is this title showing ghosting on the DLP, but it is by FAR the most severe ghosting I have ever seen anywhere! eek.gif I don't know how I missed this the other night!



biggrin.gif
post #5659 of 8052
Quote:
Originally Posted by Toe View Post

We watched A Christmas Carol 3d on Christmas which I think was the first time I had seen it on the DLP and I was just as amazed by it as the family I had over was. eek.gif I don't remember this title being THIS good for 3d, but I had only seen it on the JVCs which had something to do with it. Strong depth throughout and some great pop out moments off and on. The complete and total absence of ghosting AND flicker just cant be overemphasized as well as good 3d brightness and motion (motion is also much better on my DLP in 3d with FI on low vs my RS40/45). I'm with Deja Vu in the fact that 3d really is a considerably better experience on a DLP. cool.gif I actually got to a point where I quit watching 3d on my RS45 due to ghosting and flicker ruining the presentation for me, but ever since getting the 7000 a year ago, my 3d enjoyment is so much more. The vast majority of what I watch is still 2d, but it is nice knowing when I do throw on a 3d disc it will be as good as the transfer allows and my display device is not a limiting factor anymore (I no longer have to worry about where I will notice ghosting and flicker pop up since it doesn't!).

Christmas Carol is the torture test I used to compare 3D between the Epson, Sharp and Mits. It is quite dark with some high contrast scenes and if it looks good on your projector in 3D then rest assured that your projector has passed a very tough test. The Sharp knocked me out with this title! Near the beginning of the story Scrooge is visited by his nephew and the amount of detail revealed along the walls in Scrooge's office by the Sharp had me saying "wow". The Epson also revealed a lot of the detail; however, it got tripped up by some light ghosting. The scenes that are nasty for revealing ghosting are scenes where the men are wearing tuxedos -- near the end of Hugo and second chapter of Gatsby when they're going up the stairs into the house and the male servants are standing to the side as they go past -- ghost city!
post #5660 of 8052
Thread Starter 
darn, I was hoping you weren't going to like the Sharp and sell it to me....cool.gif

Do you have a pair of the G20's yet?
post #5661 of 8052
Quote:
Originally Posted by Deja Vu View Post

Christmas Carol is the torture test I used to compare 3D between the Epson, Sharp and Mits. It is quite dark with some high contrast scenes and if it looks good on your projector in 3D then rest assured that your projector has passed a very tough test. The Sharp knocked me out with this title! Near the beginning of the story Scrooge is visited by his nephew and the amount of detail revealed along the walls in Scrooge's office by the Sharp had me saying "wow". The Epson also revealed a lot of the detail; however, it got tripped up by some light ghosting. The scenes that are nasty for revealing ghosting are scenes where the men are wearing tuxedos -- near the end of Hugo and second chapter of Gatsby when they're going up the stairs into the house and the male servants are standing to the side as they go past -- ghost city!


It is so cool when you have enough 3d brightness through the glasses that you actually squint a little bit. The scene in CC where the first candle looking ghost visits him had me squinting from the brightness against the dark backdrop. cool.gif My family was going NUTS every time it started snowing in the HT room in this movie! I know I am preaching to the choir here with you and Zombie, but isn't the HP amazing for 3d? eek.gif I love it for 2d as well, but it really gives a much needed brightness boost for 3d that a unity gain type screen just cant touch.
post #5662 of 8052
Hey Zombie!

First of all, I just want to thank you again for your continued efforts and contributions here! I consider this thread the single most informative and useful source of information in this forum, perhaps on ANY forum!

Next, I recently measured my HP 2.8 - It it 144" diagonal - 132" wide by 56" high 2.35:1 screen. Are we watching the EXACT same screen, material and size wise? biggrin.gif The difference is that I am about 13' back, and you are somewhat closer, right? I don't have any particular reason for mentioning this other than to figure out if we are watching the same thing or not...tongue.gif

My question is, if I am right and you are using a 2.35:1 CIH setup, AND you are using 2 or more projectors at a time (one for 3D and one for 2D), then how many anamorphic lenses do you own and what are they? I have played with the idea of a 2 projector setup, but the problem for me is not the cost of the second projector, but rather the cost of a second anamorphic lens. I am currently using an ISCO III lens, and back when I bought it, it cost a "measly" $5k, but from what I understand, these days the price has doubled.

So how are you managing 2 projectors with anamorphic lenses?
post #5663 of 8052
Zombie is on 16:9 142" I think?

I agree, great info from Zombie and his tireless efforts are appreciated the world over smile.gif

He must go through a serious amount of caffeine to keep this up!

This next round of testing is going to be very interesting - RS55 - RS57 - VW600 - native 4k, new e-shift and JVC DI. Really looking forward to his analysis cool.gif
post #5664 of 8052
I also watched A Christmas Carol on the Sharp 30k Christmas eve. FANTASTIC 3D, and KILLER BASS!!!
post #5665 of 8052
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Sorel View Post

Hey Zombie!

First of all, I just want to thank you again for your continued efforts and contributions here! I consider this thread the single most informative and useful source of information in this forum, perhaps on ANY forum!

Next, I recently measured my HP 2.8 - It it 144" diagonal - 132" wide by 56" high 2.35:1 screen. Are we watching the EXACT same screen, material and size wise? biggrin.gif The difference is that I am about 13' back, and you are somewhat closer, right? I don't have any particular reason for mentioning this other than to figure out if we are watching the same thing or not...tongue.gif

My question is, if I am right and you are using a 2.35:1 CIH setup, AND you are using 2 or more projectors at a time (one for 3D and one for 2D), then how many anamorphic lenses do you own and what are they? I have played with the idea of a 2 projector setup, but the problem for me is not the cost of the second projector, but rather the cost of a second anamorphic lens. I am currently using an ISCO III lens, and back when I bought it, it cost a "measly" $5k, but from what I understand, these days the price has doubled.

So how are you managing 2 projectors with anamorphic lenses?

Your post reminded me that I still have an anamorphic lens (I used to have two) and it inspired me to blow the dust off and try it with the Mits, which I'm now using with a 92" HP screen. Now I remember why I sold my ISCO II -- for me the lens between the projector and the screen softens the image a little and I actually prefer an image without the stretch or the squeeze, depending on which type of lens you use. Maybe the super duper expensive stuff doesn't do this, but I don't feel I'm missing anything.

I watched Oblivion in 3D with the anamorphic lens and the Mits 2D to 3D conversion -- I thought it looked pretty good. When I went back to 2D to compare, the 2D, which originally looked great now looked flat and lifeless. biggrin.gif
Edited by Deja Vu - 12/29/13 at 8:07am
post #5666 of 8052
Quote:
Originally Posted by Deja Vu View Post

Your post reminded me that I still have an anamorphic lens (I used to have two) and it inspired me to blow the dust off of and try it with the Mits, which I'm now using with a 92" HP screen. Now I remember why I sold my ISCO II -- for me the lens between the projector and the screen softens the image a little and I actually prefer an image without the stretch or the squeeze, depending on which type of lens you use. Maybe the super duper expensive stuff doesn't do this, but I don't feel I'm missing anything.

I watched Oblivion in 3D with the anamorphic lens and the Mits 2D to 3D conversion -- I thought it looked pretty good. When I went back to 2D to compare, the 2D, which originally looked great now looked flat and lifeless. biggrin.gif

You love your 3D. Do you watch many movies in 2D? I know you watch all movies that come out in 3D and bypass the 2D.
post #5667 of 8052
Quote:
Originally Posted by blee0120 View Post

Do you watch many movies in 2D?

I try not to! biggrin.gif
post #5668 of 8052
Quote:
Originally Posted by Deja Vu View Post

I try not to! biggrin.gif

You need to take your glasses off and see the light.smile.gifsmile.gif
post #5669 of 8052
Quote:
Originally Posted by Deja Vu View Post

I try not to! biggrin.gif

Since you have two rooms, have you thought about a passive 3D setup?
post #5670 of 8052
What are the best 3D glasses and emitter for a JVC 4810? Please tell me it's some cheap brand...
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