or Connect
AVS › AVS Forum › Display Devices › Digital Hi-End Projectors - $3,000+ USD MSRP › Projector Mini-Shootout Thread 2013-2014
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

Projector Mini-Shootout Thread 2013-2014 - Page 32

post #931 of 8074
I have a 2011 Cineversum which is based on a JVC D-ILA. I was looking to see a new model was coming based on the new JVC's when I came across this????

http://www.cineversum.com/classic/bw_series/prod_passive3d.htm

Any thoughts?

Ta Dono smile.gif
post #932 of 8074
Thread Starter 
get ready to change the screen... smile.gif

http://www.cineversum.com/homecinema/downloads/manuals/R599812.pdf

In order to enjoy the best quality 3D images, you need a polarization preserving screen. Such a screen is generally called “silver screen” and it is specially designed for 3D projection. Cineversum has developed and optimized a special screen fabric for both 2D projection and passive 3D projection: the “Passive 5D screen”. It is a low gain and high extinction ratio fabric that you can order together with your Passive 3D Kit.
post #933 of 8074
Thanks Mate;)

I think I will stick with shutter glasses.

Ta Dono smile.gif
post #934 of 8074
This is a wonky add-on. It is basically an active polarizer that is placed in front of the lens. You still need a silver screen for it to work and you also lose brightness just like shutter glasses because one field is always blanked out. It might be tempting if it did not require a silver screen and it was similar to Dolby's system. At this point I would rather use dual projection for polarization or super-anaglyph.
post #935 of 8074
Quote:
Originally Posted by mark haflich View Post

That's not correct at the frequencies we are trying not to transmit. At low frequencies one must eat up energy and that means a variety of different things one must do. Having two different sheetrock thicknesses does not give you much over two of the same but with constrained mode damping material such as decidamp of green glue etc. Also needed are resilient channel or the like and isolation from the studs and double walls. It goes on and on.
Re black ceiling tiles. One can order in black grid materials by special order just R andR with ypu existing white ones. If you have humongus bass in your HT, ceiling tiles can rattle but this canbe solved by weighting down the til;e with a cut piece of sheet rock plus stuffing the ceiling cavity with fiberglass insulation.
Back to the subject of this thread. Will the JVC or the Sony be better for sports?
I think its too close to call. Any time you have panning projectors and film has problems. It gets a different answer depending on whether the source is 720p or 1080i. I really don't think there is enough of a difference to say one is much better than the other but the motion handling is better on the Sony but some may not like the motion flow on the Sony even if set to low and then we are back to about equal. These conclusions are based on the Sony 30 and last years JVCs.


What about what I said is incorrect since I made no mention of low octave range damping at all (only general NRC). It's the higher frequencies to go after anyhow (unless your Mr. Moneybags like you!); generally ~1K which is where the impedance mismatch of the two substrates matter quite a bit. Low frequency damping is near impossible without a floating cinder blocked room (and if you're rattling these heavy tiles you have bigger EQ problems at hand). You're getting senile in your old age! tongue.gifbiggrin.gif

Back on topic... I didn't care for Sony's motion control vs. the JVC's but as coder rightfully pointed out this is just conjecture or a feeling if one doesn't have the two going head-to-head in the same room.

wink.gif
Edited by krichter1 - 11/13/12 at 6:00am
post #936 of 8074
Quote:
Originally Posted by zombie10k View Post

get ready to change the screen... smile.gif
http://www.cineversum.com/homecinema/downloads/manuals/R599812.pdf
In order to enjoy the best quality 3D images, you need a polarization preserving screen. Such a screen is generally called “silver screen” and it is specially designed for 3D projection. Cineversum has developed and optimized a special screen fabric for both 2D projection and passive 3D projection: the “Passive 5D screen”. It is a low gain and high extinction ratio fabric that you can order together with your Passive 3D Kit.

You think this could be made compatible with our JVC models? cool.gif
post #937 of 8074
Quote:
Originally Posted by krichter1 View Post

You think this could be made compatible with our JVC models? cool.gif

I don't see why this (or something like it) wouldn't work with current JVC 3D models. But unlike dual projector passive systems, this device looks to me like it replaces active shutter glasses on the viewers' heads with an active LCD panel in front of the projection lens. The LCD panel must change its orientation for each new frame to the appropriate eye. It seems to me that people susceptible to flicker might still see it with this system, because the screen is going dark for each eye at the same frequency as with active glasses. Passive glasses would certainly be cheaper, though.
post #938 of 8074
Crap Joe! That would have been my (and I bet Todd's), main motivation/excitement if it could somehow reduce or eliminate flicker but what you surmise makes sense (as to why it wouldn't). frown.gif We don't even know how much something like this even costs do we (anyone?).
post #939 of 8074
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dragon Reborn View Post

Sorry, can you briefly explain what this means? redface.gif

Apologies... I didn't realize you had the newer XD material which Chris states would represent about a 3% increase over what I have so I would go with what Mike rightfully stated as your ref point. wink.gif
post #940 of 8074
Thread Starter 
The Mitsubishi HC8000 + special 3D glasses should be here in less than a week.
post #941 of 8074
Quote:
Originally Posted by zombie10k View Post

The Mitsubishi HC8000 + special 3D glasses should be here in less than a week.

Grrrrr. Well, not your fault or anyone else's, but my PJ gave up the ghost about a month ago, and I've been waiting for the HC8000 to get to you for initial impressions at least. But last week I got a smoking deal on a NIB HC9000D (w/ warranty) for under $2500, and my GF was grousing a bit about having to watch DWTS on a 46" flat screen, so I took the plunge. Now, your test HC8000 is coming! frown.gif

Ah well, at least in a week or two I'll know if I should be kicking myself or patting myself on the back. I'm guessing I'll have to put on my kickin' shoes.
post #942 of 8074
Quote:
Originally Posted by filecat13 View Post

Grrrrr. Well, not your fault or anyone else's, but my PJ gave up the ghost about a month ago, and I've been waiting for the HC8000 to get to you for initial impressions at least. But last week I got a smoking deal on a NIB HC9000D (w/ warranty) for under $2500, and my GF was grousing a bit about having to watch DWTS on a 46" flat screen, so I took the plunge. Now, your test HC8000 is coming! frown.gif
Ah well, at least in a week or two I'll know if I should be kicking myself or patting myself on the back. I'm guessing I'll have to put on my kickin' shoes.

If it were me, I'd make her watch that on an old 19" LCD you found at a garage sale.
post #943 of 8074
Anybody notice this excerpt from the PC review on the Epson 5020? I haven't seen PR comment on this or anyone here either.
Quote:
Living Room mode is, as the name might suggest, an image mode designed for use in a non-traditional theater space with significant ambient light -- i.e. a living room, family room, or other such gathering area. Contrast is much improved compared to Dynamic mode, and color has an intentional blue tint. Why? Well, most folks' indoor lighting tends towards the warm side, especially if that lighting is from incandescent bulbs. In the additive color system, if you want to cancel out an excess of yellow, you add blue. Living room mode measures 1820 lumens.

However, let's say you just want a very bright picture because you want to use a large screen, and you don't need to cancel out any yellow. In that case, you can still use Living Room mode -- just change the "Abs. Color Temp" control from 7500K to 6500K. The result is a bright, perfectly color-balanced picture at 1725 lumens.

This intrigues me because I'm new to projectors and can't get it calibrated out here (there are no ISF certified calibrators on island, let alone anyone who really knows what they're doing) so it would be nice to find something as accurate as possible OOTB.
post #944 of 8074
Quote:
Originally Posted by zombie10k View Post

The Mitsubishi HC8000 + special 3D glasses should be here in less than a week.

Looking forward to it! In fact, delaying my decision until your review (but currently leaning towards the HW50).
post #945 of 8074
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dragon Reborn View Post

Looking forward to it! In fact, delaying my decision until your review (but currently leaning towards the HW50).

I spent a few hours today doing a full calibration of the HW50 in 2D and 3D. it's looks great overall and is a nice improvement vs. the previous HW30.

I'm curious to see the 3D glasses that are designed for the HC8000. It also looks like it has the 3D port for hooking up external transmitters. I'll check and see if the MV3D's work with it.

HC8000-glasses.jpg

HC8000-glasses1.jpg
post #946 of 8074
Quote:
Originally Posted by zombie10k View Post

it's nice to get a new projector for the warranty, especially if you plan on keeping it for while. The Sony HW50 or the Epson 5020 would work well with this setup. The Sony is at the top of your budget price but you get an extra lamp and a 3 year warranty with the purchase. Both projectors are great all around models that are good with 2D and 3D. I have a slight preference towards to the Sony for my Bluray movies.
The 5020 has a special 'living room' mode that is great for ambient light (in case you decide to watch in the daytime). the colors are a bit off in this mode, but it can throw 2000+ lumens which is fairly bright at this price point. 3D performance is similar between both models with the 5020 being slightly brighter.
You really can't go wrong with either model in this setup. Both projectors ship with 2 pairs of glasses.

Zombie10k, how loud is the Sony HW50 vs. the Epson 5020?

Projector Central shows the Epson 5020 as having an "audible noise" rating of 32dB (22dB in Eco-Mode) while only listing the audible noise of the HW50 as 21dB without specifying if that's a "normal" mode rating or also some sort of "Eco-Mode" rating.

Thanks!
post #947 of 8074
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Metabolic View Post

Zombie10k, how loud is the Sony HW50 vs. the Epson 5020?

Projector Central shows the Epson 5020 as having an "audible noise" rating of 32dB (22dB in Eco-Mode) while only listing the audible noise of the HW50 as 21dB without specifying if that's a "normal" mode rating or also some sort of "Eco-Mode" rating.
Thanks!

The Sony is quieter in it's brightest mode vs. the Epson. I sit with the projectors right behind my head and very close to eye level for my HP. The Sony is practically silent in 2D.

There is a buzzing in 3D that is related to the new built in IR emitter. Sony is providing an external transmitter for those that have the issue. I'm not sure if we've heard of any yet that don't have the buzz, but it will hopefully get corrected on the internal model since this is much more powerful than the external transmitter.
post #948 of 8074
Quote:
Originally Posted by biliam1982 View Post

Anybody notice this excerpt from the PC review on the Epson 5020? I haven't seen PR comment on this or anyone here either.
This intrigues me because I'm new to projectors and can't get it calibrated out here (there are no ISF certified calibrators on island, let alone anyone who really knows what they're doing) so it would be nice to find something as accurate as possible OOTB.

I did a quicky calibration of Living Room mode on my cousins 5020 for gaming use (before we tested the lag and discovered it was slightly higher than THX/Cinema/Natural) and it is indeed very bright. The color that was the most out was Green and I did not bother correcting it (beyond luma) since the unit only had 20 some hours on the lamp and will drift. Using factory presets it's not bad by any means but not truly accurate either so I would be very skeptical of their claim that simply lowering the color temp yields a 'perfectly color balanced' image (I did drop the color temp as well during the cal).

Jason
post #949 of 8074
Quote:
Originally Posted by zombie10k View Post

The Sony is quieter in it's brightest mode vs. the Epson. I sit with the projectors right behind my head and very close to eye level for my HP. The Sony is practically silent in 2D.
There is a buzzing in 3D that is related to the new built in IR emitter. Sony is providing an external transmitter for those that have the issue. I'm not sure if we've heard of any yet that don't have the buzz, but it will hopefully get corrected on the internal model since this is much more powerful than the external transmitter.

Regarding the BUZZ from the IR emitter, according to Sony it's supposed to be an issue with the first 200 projectors. Maybe you guys could check your serial numbers to see if any 200+ projectors have the buzz? I should be getting mine this week and will check it on my unit, I'll let you know what i find.
post #950 of 8074
Quote:
Originally Posted by biliam1982 View Post

Anybody notice this excerpt from the PC review on the Epson 5020? I haven't seen PR comment on this or anyone here either.
This intrigues me because I'm new to projectors and can't get it calibrated out here (there are no ISF certified calibrators on island, let alone anyone who really knows what they're doing) so it would be nice to find something as accurate as possible OOTB.

I dont know about 5020 but the epson 9000w which I have (predecessor to 6020) we found in thx eco setting was about as close to a calibration we performed. probably best out of box projector have come along. and is definitely a bonus I think for those who dont necessarily want to go down the calibration path smile.gif be interesting to know if the new model epsons are the same in this regard smile.gif
post #951 of 8074
zombie, could you briefly describe how you calibrate 3D and with which sensor?
Software is Chromapure isn't it?
post #952 of 8074
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by audiohobbit View Post

zombie, could you briefly describe how you calibrate 3D and with which sensor?
Software is Chromapure isn't it?

Hi, I'm using a display 3 calibrated by Tom Huffman @ Chromapure. I use velcro to hold the glasses over the sensor for the grayscale calibration. I'm basically compensating the best I can for the tint color of the glasses.

One of our members made a 3D ISO with 30, 80, 100 screens so the projector is running in 1080/24 Frame Packed mode. I know this can also be done with the built in 2D -> 3D conversion and a regular 2D calibration disk, but I wanted to keep the conversion out of it just in case there is something different vs. true 3D mode.

I watched a number of movies shot in Native 3D and the flesh tones looks pretty good with this setup.
post #953 of 8074
Hello fellow projector enthusiasts! I have been reading the forum for years, but have not posted yet. How would you describe the black level improvement of the HW50 over the HW30? Is it a better perceived contrast because of the brighter image at the same measured black levels, or has it improved in an absolute manner over the HW30? I read all the available tech site reviews, but somehow I was not quite assured by them in this regard.

i would like to upgrade from a Sanyo PLV-Z2000. In a living room setup IMHO the most tangible improvement in expanding dynamic range is getting as good blacks as possible, because the other end of the scale means more light reflected back to the screen in an untreated room. I have some nice ideas for my next place, but good blacks are a must for me, and moving is a bit further off smile.gif

If I didn't game, the JVC would be perfect. In Europe the prices are higher, one must choose very carefully. Sadly 80-100 ms input lag is simply unacceptable. I wonder if even for just movies lip-sync correction is a must. Other than that I have a serious clamouring for the JVC picture. I saw a HD350, and the natibe blacks amazed me. The HW50 seems to be the jack of all trades and the master of 2 things out of 4 biggrin.gif I am just so impatient waiting for the X35/RS46 to appear here in real world tests on the forum!

Oh, an other thing! When testing input lag with games please use PC games! Console tech has so much input lag embedded into the control chain and internal engine updates that the real input lag of the given projector will be a smaller factor in the overall perceived lag.
post #954 of 8074
I quite enjoy this thread and figured I'd add some info that I've seen. First off, I'm new to the projector world so this is a quite exciting and daunting task to choose one (more exciting, of course). I've been considering the 5020 as I plan to use whatever I end up with as an all-around projector (2D, 3D, Gaming). I know the lag concern on this projector has been strange considering the tests in here are showing 62ish ms, and other sites stating 50. In case no one has seen this yet, projectorreviews put up their review of the 3020 and states this about lag (which also mentions the 5020):

"Last year's Epsons, both the 3010 and 5010 projectors, were considered slow for First Person Shooter type play. Lag times ran around 80ms. Our gamer / projector bloggers - Scott and Pete say that anything around 50 ms or better is acceptable for "fast play" As it turns out, I measured this year's Epson HC3020, testing with my Macbook Pro using FlatPanelsDK's timer and a good quality 8 foot HDMI cable.(Here's the website page: http://tft.vanity.dk/inputlag.html). Mind you this compares relative lag times. My gamer/projector/bloggers play the games. I think their opinion is generally more useful than lag times, at least when the lag times aren't minimal (under 20 ms).

The Home Cinema 3020 measured at either 49 or 50 ms in each of a half dozen test photographs of the Mac screen and the projected timer. You have to switch the projector into fast processing, and turn off a variety of controls to get it that fast. I had the iris off, Super-Resolution at 0 turned off auto 3d detction and other things. I don't know exactly which settings are having an effect on lag, but I just took a minute or so, turned off everything in sight, and voila 50ms. (BTW, the HC5020 measured exactly the same.)"


Very interesting... While projector central said the 3020 had higher lag times than the 5020, but Art says they are the same around 50sh. Just figured I'd throw this out there.
post #955 of 8074
Diverting off to 3D and the french product, most commercial 3D theaters use a single projector with a polarizing filter in front of the lens. This filter which is in the form of a plate runs off a sync signal that changes its polarization angle by 90 degrees, in essence it gets synced to the 3D source and switches as the sources flashes first say the left eye image and the rightI I image. These devices are usually licensed rather than owned and our rather expensive. Obviously, polarized light, polarized by the flipping plate filter (the change in polariztion is done internally in the filter) hits the screen and your screen must preserve it so the polarized light bounces off and is sorted out by the same filters on your glasses but of course each eye has a fixed orientaion filter so the left eye on sees the left image when it is flashed on the screen and the right image by the right eye when it is flashed. The glasses are obviously way cheaper than shutter glasses and quite disposable as well although most movie houses clean them and then hand them out hundred of times. These systems are generally more efficient than shutter glass systems and no sync need be mainted to the glasses.

For a 3D viewer, its one of the best ways to gio and is a better system than the shutter glass one. But, one needs a polarizing preserving screen and the magic filter plate which is hard tc come buy and is expensive. Does anyone know the price of the French company's 3D kit? Someone using Firehawk LS would probably find this sytem preferable to what they have and the only cost essentially would be for the kit. Glasses are cheap.


Kevin. If you want to absorb frequencies say above 250HZ you need soft absorption such as some fiberglass panels etc. high frequencies will bounce off of sheet rook and most will not penetrate it regardless of whether there is one or two sheets. By using 2 sheets, one can stiffen the sheet rock and make it less capable of expanding with sound pressure and then contracting to its original plane by playing back the bass into the room. Having two different sheetrock thinkness won't help here and measuring the transmisssionsay at 1000 HZ, there is little difference with using two different thickness. Farbetter results are by employing some constrained mode dampening to squash the high frequencies. Green glue or decidamp work well here.
Edited by mark haflich - 11/14/12 at 11:38am
post #956 of 8074
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Matrixfan View Post

Hello fellow projector enthusiasts! I have been reading the forum for years, but have not posted yet. How would you describe the black level improvement of the HW50 over the HW30? Is it a better perceived contrast because of the brighter image at the same measured black levels, or has it improved in an absolute manner over the HW30? I read all the available tech site reviews, but somehow I was not quite assured by them in this regard.

i would like to upgrade from a Sanyo PLV-Z2000. In a living room setup IMHO the most tangible improvement in expanding dynamic range is getting as good blacks as possible, because the other end of the scale means more light reflected back to the screen in an untreated room. I have some nice ideas for my next place, but good blacks are a must for me, and moving is a bit further off smile.gif

If I didn't game, the JVC would be perfect. In Europe the prices are higher, one must choose very carefully. Sadly 80-100 ms input lag is simply unacceptable. I wonder if even for just movies lip-sync correction is a must. Other than that I have a serious clamouring for the JVC picture. I saw a HD350, and the natibe blacks amazed me. The HW50 seems to be the jack of all trades and the master of 2 things out of 4 biggrin.gif I am just so impatient waiting for the X35/RS46 to appear here in real world tests on the forum!

Oh, an other thing! When testing input lag with games please use PC games! Console tech has so much input lag embedded into the control chain and internal engine updates that the real input lag of the given projector will be a smaller factor in the overall perceived lag.

I measured a solid 30ms from the HW50, it's one of the quickest I've seen so far with lag measurements.

good question about the increase in contrast. The perceived increase I am seeing on the HW50 vs the HW30 could be due to the brighter image (the measured #'s we've seen shouldn't indicate a day/night difference), but I can tell you subjectively it looks very good.

I did a full calibration on the HW50 yesterday and watched several movies with dark scenes. My first thoughts were - 'the contrast looks at least as good as the Epson' where I thought the HW30 was lacking a bit here last year. Perhaps they have more aggressively tuned the IRIS since I've been watching it closely and this thing is working overtime opening and closing on scene changes. It does a great job closing down on fade to blacks.

For those concerned that the 5020 has DI in 3D and the HW50 doesn't.. imo, this really doesn't matter. Despite some comments from a recent pro review, the 5020's iris in 3D doesn't really add much. If anything, it needs to be more aggressive. I'd rather have the FI in 3D on the 5020 since this works really well on the HW50.
post #957 of 8074
Quote:
Originally Posted by mark haflich View Post

commercial 3D theaters use a single projector with a polarizing filter in front of the lens. This filter which is in the form of a plate runs off a sync signal that changesits polarization angle by 90 degrees
To be more precise:
Most single DLP-theaters use the Real D or Masterimage System. Real D has the alternating polarizer plate in front of the projector, called Z-Screen, Masterimage is a rotating disc with alternating polarisation segments.
AFAIK in both systems not the linear polarisation is used, but circular polarisation. Thus you don't loose the 3D effect even when rotating your head. Analog IMAX 3D uses linear polarizers, there you'll loose the 3D effect when rotating your head. I'm not sure which type of polarisation is used with the new digital IMAX.

Real D and Masterimage are similar to shutter glasses with the difference that the shutter is in front of the projector and not in front of your eyes. Therefore a silver screen is needed which has some downsides, e.g. bad black levels and massive hotspotting.

The big difference to most home cinema systems is that with Real D or Masterimage so called Triple Flash technique is used: The 24 frames per eye are shown 3 times per eye, therefore 72 Hz per eye and 144 Hz total. With 72 Hz most people don't see any flickering any more whereas most HC-projectors can only show 120 fps max, and with 24p material usually only 48 Hz per eye, and that results in perceived flickering. I think with this Z-screen-like alternating polarizer and a JVC(similar) projector you'll still see the flickering.

However there are more 3D systems used in commercial cinema:
1. you can have two projectors with passive polarizers in front, then both L/R-eye pictures are projected at the same time on the screen (which still has to be a silver screen) but you won't have any flashing.
Sony with its 4K SXRD cinema machines does a similar thing: In 3D they divide the 4K panel in two areas, one shows the left and one shows the right image. With a special double lens both images are projected at the same time on the (silver) screen. This technique is called Real D XLS.
(so in 3D those 4K Sony projectors only can show 2K per eye. Actually there aren't any 4K 3D movies in digital cinem yet, it's not standardized by DCI or SMPTE and at the moment it's still a bandwidth problem)

2. There also systems with shutter glasses in commercial cinema, licensed by Xpand. But these also work with triple flash 72 Hz per eye, so no perceivd flickering. With these you don't need a silver screen.

and 3. The Dolby 3D system, which is actually developed by german company Infitec and licensed by Dolby. This is a bit complicated to explain. It works with slightly different wavelengths for the RGB-colors for left and right eye and special filter glasses that have narrow-band filters that only let pass the specific wavelengths for L/R eyes.
In or in front of the projector is a rotating filter wheel. With this system you don't need a silver screen.
post #958 of 8074
I know this question has been asked a lot Zombie but now that you have the HW50 fully calibrated, how do you think the black level in total dark scenes (like lets say the entire The Dark Knight movie smile.gif) looks on the HW50 compared to the JVCs?
post #959 of 8074
Quote:
Originally Posted by audiohobbit View Post

To be more precise:
Most single DLP-theaters use the Real D or Masterimage System. Real D has the alternating polarizer plate in front of the projector, called Z-Screen, Masterimage is a rotating disc with alternating polarisation segments.
AFAIK in both systems not the linear polarisation is used, but circular polarisation. Thus you don't loose the 3D effect even when rotating your head. Analog IMAX 3D uses linear polarizers, there you'll loose the 3D effect when rotating your head. I'm not sure which type of polarisation is used with the new digital IMAX.
Real D and Masterimage are similar to shutter glasses with the difference that the shutter is in front of the projector and not in front of your eyes. Therefore a silver screen is needed which has some downsides, e.g. bad black levels and massive hotspotting.
The big difference to most home cinema systems is that with Real D or Masterimage so called Triple Flash technique is used: The 24 frames per eye are shown 3 times per eye, therefore 72 Hz per eye and 144 Hz total. With 72 Hz most people don't see any flickering any more whereas most HC-projectors can only show 120 fps max, and with 24p material usually only 48 Hz per eye, and that results in perceived flickering. I think with this Z-screen-like alternating polarizer and a JVC(similar) projector you'll still see the flickering.
However there are more 3D systems used in commercial cinema:
1. you can have two projectors with passive polarizers in front, then both L/R-eye pictures are projected at the same time on the screen (which still has to be a silver screen) but you won't have any flashing.
Sony with its 4K SXRD cinema machines does a similar thing: In 3D they divide the 4K panel in two areas, one shows the left and one shows the right image. With a special double lens both images are projected at the same time on the (silver) screen. This technique is called Real D XLS.
(so in 3D those 4K Sony projectors only can show 2K per eye. Actually there aren't any 4K 3D movies in digital cinem yet, it's not standardized by DCI or SMPTE and at the moment it's still a bandwidth problem)
2. There also systems with shutter glasses in commercial cinema, licensed by Xpand. But these also work with triple flash 72 Hz per eye, so no perceivd flickering. With these you don't need a silver screen.
and 3. The Dolby 3D system, which is actually developed by german company Infitec and licensed by Dolby. This is a bit complicated to explain. It works with slightly different wavelengths for the RGB-colors for left and right eye and special filter glasses that have narrow-band filters that only let pass the specific wavelengths for L/R eyes.
In or in front of the projector is a rotating filter wheel. With this system you don't need a silver screen.

Thanks for the summary. i see lots of advantages here nonetheless especially if one uses Firehawk LS which won't hot spot with throws greater than 1.6 and which has an extremently high polarization extinction ratio (preserves polarization). Not bad for 2D either unlike some of the silver higher gain stuff.

I still wonder what the price is.Obviously, the rebrander of the JVC projectors must see some value to adding the switching plate polarizer after the lens and going to a polarizing preserving screen and passive glasees, then just using an RF emitter and RF shutter glasses. I see no need to use a silver screen if one has or can use Firehawk LS from stewart. The gain is low, around 1.25, but the polarizing preserving properties are high, and the screen is very good for 2d and less than ideal light conditions. Nio hotspotting if throws 1.6 and above are used. Can someone please find out the price of the 3D kit.
post #960 of 8074
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by sanderdvd View Post

I know this question has been asked a lot Zombie but now that you have the HW50 fully calibrated, how do you think the black level in total dark scenes (like lets say the entire The Dark Knight movie smile.gif) looks on the HW50 compared to the JVCs?

I use the first 10 minutes of Underworld Evolution as one of my benchmarks. The HW50 is an improvement here in this area (vs the HW30) and looks very good. I'm not entirely ready to give up my RS55 just yet, but we are getting closer and I think it's going to satisfy the majority of new owners.

I've seen RC inside and out and know the pros and cons on the HW50. Now i'm curious to see how RC compares with E-shift 2. Hopefully we're just a few weeks away.

Overall though, the HW50 is a great all around projector and would certainly choose it over the previous HW30.

I'd like to see all the new features (brighter 2D/3D, RC, better 3D) in the V2.0 of the VW95 if it was actually released. That's the projector that would give the new JVC's a run for their $$ since it would have better (than the HW50) native contrast, better lens, full auto shift/focus, etc.
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
AVS › AVS Forum › Display Devices › Digital Hi-End Projectors - $3,000+ USD MSRP › Projector Mini-Shootout Thread 2013-2014