Sony HW50 / BenQ W7000 / Epson 5020 / JVC RS55 / JVC RS 46 / JVC RS4810 / JVC RS56 Mini-shootout... - Page 126

There is still a way to make comparison of black levels using camera. Only this has to be done in a scientific way:
- same environment (no lighting, same objects in the room on the same places);
- all PJ's must be set to the same ftL @ 100% brightness, gamma @ 2.2;
- dynamic contrast must be off;
- camera position must be the same;
- image frame must be the same;
- camera settings must be the same - manual settings with long shutter speed (obviously, the image must be overexposed to show difference in black levels);
- no processing or the same processing after the image has been taken.

Obviously Art don't abide by these rules so his comparisons can't be used to judge projectors' relative black levels.

I remember Coderguy once did a great comparison which showed perceptual black levels of different projectors. I think it was in your thread, Zombie.

All we need is a single chip LCOS machine with JVCs iteration for great contrast. They just need to update their chips like Sony did and you'll have good enough Motion. Then use an LED/laser hybrid light engine to eliminate the possibility of RBE. The single chip route eliminates convergence issues and cuts down on costs.

I.don't know why but they stopped development on a single chip LCOS solution years ago. Ideally, if the chip is fast enough, It can do sequential color and be fine with motion. Maybe that was why they didn't have any real production units.

Haha idk. That 10k:1 may upset some people. Unless that is just a commercial number to keep the lumens high.

I think vivitek has a 3d DLP LED model coming out this year. Probably an updated H9080FD. Hopefully its in that $7-$8000 msrp range. Its basically Runco LS-5 with an LED light engine.

If you are talking about dynamic iris, i can't agree..

I kind of half agree. The issue is that people are usually fine when claiming numbers from JVC machines (or others that use manual irises) when the iris is closed down but then have an issue saying dynamic irises shouldn't count. In the end both fixed and dynamic don't show native black level performance. So it would have to be fully open iris on both or iris in use (whether it be manual or dynamic) on both.

He may be talking about software that gives the impression of heightened contrast but in actuality most of those processors clip whites and crushes blacks. There are a ton of DLP models that have such features. Those should be turned off for sure.

10k:1 native contrast with 4000 lumens should yeild very decent black levels! And keep in mind this is JVCs 1st effort with a laser projector, and true 4k. I expect some amazing machines in the next few years. If the bulbs will last as long as advertised, I intend to stick with my RS46 until such time as something like that is at or under the 5k mark.

SO I think I get what you are doing. The home made splitter allows both RF transmitters to be hooked up & working at the same time. This will allow me to use both types of 3D glasses. Now if I only want to buy the MV3D glasses & emitter then I can just plug it directly into the JVC & buy as many pairs of MV3D glasses that I need. Am I correct?

Fixed iris and dynamic iris are two different beasts. Sure, they both close irises. But with fixed iris you get constant brightness on all IRE levels. I wrote that both projectors to be tested must be calibrated to equal brightness on 100% white field and equal gamma (2.2, for example). Dynamic iris would prevent that most of the time and won't show projector's real native contrast anyway.

I don't think it's so easy to develop faster chips. To make them switch faster you would probably have to make them thinner (I read this somewhere but can't recall where), which in turn would make them less good at blocking light. i.e. they would take a hit in contrast. Sure, they could take Sonys route, but then probably have to start from scratch with a new chip and might not be able to get more contrast than Sony anyway?

Regarding single chip LCOS, the switching speed requirement is very high. Now they can't even switch fast enough to do 3D without ghosting at 120 hz. A DLP with a 5x color wheel is working at 3x (RGB) 5x (wheel speed) x 24 Hz = 360 Hz.

DLPs are inherently about a 1000 fold faster compared to LCOS, which also explains why they do not suffer from any ghosting.

If they could make a laser LCOS I would be very happy with that. If I understand it correctly the very low etendue of the laser would make it possible to close down the iris fully without light loss. 1000-1500 calibrated lumens that doesn't degrade over time coupled with 150K:1 native contrast seems like a very powerful combination to me. In addition low etendue makes it possible to use much simpler and cheaper optics without degrading image quality - i.e. much smaller lenses could be used without affecting sharpness.

I have an X35 at the moment and a 119'' high contrast high power screen. I wouldn't mind even higher contrast even though it's quite good already, and a bit more lumens in 3D would be nice (it's very nice and bright in the sweetspot and in high lamp, but that's noisy and with a new lamp and it's less good outside the sweet spot.). Otherwise I'm very happy with it. Sure, there are some ghosting in the most difficult scenes and it would be nice to get rid of that, but it's rarely visable and I love watching 3D on the machine. I have a Panasonic 55VT50 as well and the JVC kills it in 3D IMO. The image size is of course very important, but in addition to that, the panasonic has very poor black levels in 3D mode and more noticeble ghosting compared to the JVC. The high contrast of the JVC really kills the tv and makes the experience so much better.
Edited by Drexler - 3/10/13 at 3:39am

How much ceiling and floor in front of the screen do you pitch black?

Ceiling is easy to figure out, how do you get black on the floor without it looking really bad from an asthetic point of view?

Black rug that you roll up when not using the projector, otherwise it's the usual non dedicated room compromise: If it's a dedicated room, then who cares about aesthetics: fit a black carpet (at least on the stage if it has one) and enjoy the better picture.

I bought a 10x13 black area rug from Lowes last year. It fits between the screen and the front row of seats and works fine.

Well a fully black carpet is no good, I have a white dog lol. Charcoal is the darkest I'd go, course I'm thinking black walls, black ceiling and and really dark carpet, it'll be impossible to light lol. My 1st room I did a black ceiling and dark red walls, with 2 200w lights on full blast we could barely see.

Never thought about that really, the great CAVE for movies and nothing else I guess

How do you like these compared to the Monster 3D glasses?

That's what I'm doing in my new theater room. Nothing but movies and maybe some game time for the kids.

I happened across another review for the X35 and thought I would share. There are quite a few mentions about comparison to the Sony VPL-HW50ES in the review as well.

http://reviews.cnet.com/home-theater-projectors/jvc-dla-x35b/4505-7858_7-35616134.html

Zombie

I have a JVC 4810 along with the JVC RFemitter. Will any of the aftermarket RF 3D glasses work with the JVC emitter, or does each aftermarket brand like Monster and Xpand require their own dedicated emitter? Thanks.

Off topic:

Jason,

I replaced my home brew Unraid server over the weekend with a business class 24-bay Supermicro server. As usual, it was easy to move the Unraid drives from the old server to the new one. The SM server booted from my Unraid flash drive and recognized the old (and new) drives. After a parity check, I was up and running. Interestingly, almost all my problems with dodgy playback (especially Disney titles like Tangled) via the network to the MED600X went away. No need to use NFS. Playback of iso files is as smooth as from a locally attached USB hard drive. This Supermicro server is faster by far in every way than my other server. I have about 39TB of storage today, and could go up to 92 if I switched out all the drives for 4TB ones. Next step, replace the Banshee-loud power supplies with a quiet Seasonic that I won't be able to hear from a block away. That mod is for later this week.

Thank you. I heard the Panasonics are pretty good, so I'll order a couple of pairs to try out the 3D on the JVC.