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The Coffin Build

post #1 of 46
10/20/12 at 9:52am
Thread Starter 
I know.......I know.........not a catchy build name, but as I near retirement my Son has referred to this room as my coffin. As he has stated many times, "Might as well seal the door and call it your coffin". Seems fitting.......

Anyhow, after 2.5 years our home has finally sold and I don't need to be reminded how I took it in the "stove pipe" concerning selling price. The original thought two years ago was to have the room built by an expert, aka. Erskine-Group but now that thought has taken a turn for the worst and am budget conscious. I still have a few hurdles to jump as my current home closes in November.............any snafu's in closing............well, this post is dead on arrival.......moot.

Well, the crux of the story..........this home will be one-story, with a bonus room above the garage adjacent to the theater room As one might expect, by wife' sewing room above the garage is getting bigger........as my dedicated theater room is getting smaller. Not a bad trade off due to my lovely wife of 26 years has been supportive in regard to my dedicated theater endeavor.

I've enclosed revision #4 rough draft of the home which is not completely accurate due to bonus room being increased to approximately 350 sq ft...............in this scenario, by theater room might be decreased from 26ft to 24ft in length. The half bath/entrance to the theater will be enlarged two feet in width taking away space from my wife's kitchen. She's ok with the change as her quilting room is getting bigger. biggrin.gif

The plan:

Get feedback on dimensions, placement and size of adjacent bath, theater lobby............and of course theater room dimensions. I've told the GC to design the theater room perimeter using 2 X 6 framing so if staggered walls are on the menu (once Dennis gets the plan) major design issues can be averted.

There are a lot of talented, experienced DYI theater folks here with good ideas.........just soliciting a few ideas.

Equipment?

Who knows for sure, but I plan to use either Triad Plats or Gold LCR speakers...........
Projector...........thinking LS-10i or the Sony 1000 4k.
Screen..........I'm hoping for 12ft wide 2.37 screen.......but again, those decisions will not be finalized by me.

Please feel free to comment or make suggestions...............I like cold, hard facts.

Best to All

FLOOR 1.pdf 204k .pdf file
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post #2 of 46
10/20/12 at 9:52am
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bump for future purpose
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post #3 of 46
10/20/12 at 9:53am
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bump for future purposes
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post #4 of 46
10/20/12 at 11:27am
Are you planning to frame the theater in 2x6's or are you just leaving the space for a staggered stud layout?

If I understand your description correctly, a main floor theater will be nice! We don't see many of those.

BTW, I noticed your signature, and I take it things haven't gone as planned wink.gif
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post #5 of 46
10/20/12 at 4:41pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by J_P_A View Post

Are you planning to frame the theater in 2x6's or are you just leaving the space for a staggered stud layout?
If I understand your description correctly, a main floor theater will be nice! We don't see many of those.
BTW, I noticed your signature, and I take it things haven't gone as planned wink.gif

In the stage of designing...........on revision #5. Once the general floor plan is set, off to engineering with the plans. I've told the GC to figure framing the perimeter using 2 X 6's and it might become staggered 2 X 4's with a 6 inch plate. I'm waiting until we close the second week of November before I send CAD designs to Erskine-Group. Until then, I'm just looking for feedback............

Yeah, in regard to things going as planned with my Trojans.................well, if history repeats itself they will be right there in the end. USC has won the last seven meetings when facing an SEC team...............this year will be no different as long as we can get past the Domers and beat the Zeros twice- not an easy task!! wink.gif
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post #6 of 46
10/20/12 at 5:42pm
Where is your equipment going? In the room or do you have a place for the rack set aside? I see a place in the bath/theater foyer that looks promising, but the missus might have something to say about that.

I like the small foyer as it lets you have two doors for sound isolation. It's also nice as it gives visitors a little more privacy when using that restroom.

Well, I'm a little biaed. I'm an SEC fan myself. An Auburn fan, actually, but with the season we're having I've had to branch out a bit:rolleyes:
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post #7 of 46
10/20/12 at 10:04pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by J_P_A View Post

Where is your equipment going? In the room or do you have a place for the rack set aside? I see a place in the bath/theater foyer that looks promising, but the missus might have something to say about that.
I like the small foyer as it lets you have two doors for sound isolation. It's also nice as it gives visitors a little more privacy when using that restroom.
Well, I'm a little biaed. I'm an SEC fan myself. An Auburn fan, actually, but with the season we're having I've had to branch out a bitrolleyes.gif

I too was an Auburn fan for a day...............I was rooting for Auburn when you guys beat the "Zeros" and boy was I happy that day!! Always good to win a NC.........Auburn was exciting to watch that year! smile.gif

On another note, the AV closet is adjacent to the theater entrance.........I plan on using Middle Atlantic AX-SXR-Series Slide-Out & Rotating Rack in the small closet opening. That is the main reason why I'm looking to open up the theater entrance taking a few more feet from my wife' kitchen. The closet for the time being is 32 inches deep but could be deeper.
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post #8 of 46
10/21/12 at 6:23am
It sounds like you've thought this out pretty well. The only other things I can think of would be get ceilings as tall as you can. I've got 9' ceillings and I ran out of head room in a hurry. 10' ceillings would be great, and I think SierraMikeBravo has recommended 11' in other threads. You can dig down in that room to get the extra headroom.

More generally, if your kids stay over often (you sort of implied the kids are out of the house) or if you have stay over guests, or other family that may stay regularly in coming years, you might consider a split floor plan. it'd be a shame for the theater to get repurposed as a bedroom down the road.

And lastly, have you made it clear that the HVAC requirements are much different than any other room in the house, with the kitchen being the possible exception.
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post #9 of 46
10/21/12 at 7:13am
Thread Starter 
I'm reminded of the movie, "Lost in Translation".

After communicating with the GC, revision #5 was emailed to me and a few missing items were evident- typical planning process. The theater foyer was not enlarged two feet into the kitchen and a thirty-six inch door was not included too. I'm a big guy, not gravitationally challenged for my age, so the 36" door is needed. smile.gif The bonus room above the garage has not been enlarged as requested to 20' by 15.5' with an added bath.............still hoping I can keep my 26 ft length in the theater room. Oh well, on to another revision and more communication with the GC.

If you take notice on the plan, the great room finally has the old reclaimed barn post placed which will be used to support timbers across the greatroom and kitchen. The GC has been great to work with and is a very nice guy but I've been through his process three times before, I'll keep him on his toes. smile.gif

One question, what size door have most people used for their theater entrance? Since I want to use matching doors through out the home, I didn't want to have a different door for the theater entrance................................ that was one of the reasons for the small foyer.........a modified double door system.

Oh, BTW............if I haven't mentioned it yet. This will be a Tour of Homes in my area with manufacturing reps available for specified days during the weekly event. Sub Zero-Wolf will have a Rep there ...........I'm working on having a Triad Rep too come down from Portland.......also plan on having material representing AVS Science and Erskine Group. biggrin.gif

FLOOR 1.pdf 205k .pdf file
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post #10 of 46
10/21/12 at 7:46am
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by J_P_A View Post

It sounds like you've thought this out pretty well. The only other things I can think of would be get ceilings as tall as you can. I've got 9' ceillings and I ran out of head room in a hurry. 10' ceillings would be great, and I think SierraMikeBravo has recommended 11' in other threads. You can dig down in that room to get the extra headroom.
More generally, if your kids stay over often (you sort of implied the kids are out of the house) or if you have stay over guests, or other family that may stay regularly in coming years, you might consider a split floor plan. it'd be a shame for the theater to get repurposed as a bedroom down the road.
And lastly, have you made it clear that the HVAC requirements are much different than any other room in the house, with the kitchen being the possible exception.

Thanks for the heads up on the ceiling height............I always planned on using 10 ft ceilings in theater but the post you are referring to I too took note several weeks ago and currently 11ft is in the plan. Since I'm getting up there in age, I didn't want steps into the theater room so no need to dig down to get the height- amazing what engineered trusses can do now........in the past, stick framing was the only method of choice. BTW, 11 foot ceilings in the theater has been problematic for the upstairs quilting room--gotta make the wife happy! My wife wants a bath up there and it looks like my theater room might have to shrink to 24 ft from 26ft. We will see as I'm waiting on revision #6. smile.gif

Yup, both kids are out of the house and on to their careers. My daughter works for an international company and flies back and forth from Berlin and Boston.......that one never visits. The Son..........yeah he still comes home to visit and brings his tornado-like traits along with him. Good idea regarding split floor plan...........the bonus room above the garage is planned for that purpose- quilting, and family visitors.

On HVAC, yes I've made it clear to the GC the specs for the theater room is going to be very different than the rest of the home. The current plan is to have four zones with four thermostats..............1) bedrooms 2) greatroom/kitchen/dining 3) theater room 4) Quilting room. How the loads are spec-ed, I have no idea.........I leave that one to the professionals!
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post #11 of 46
10/23/12 at 8:40pm
Thread Starter 
Still working on elevations with the house plan..................

One small issue...........the backside of the home will be only 9ft which creates an issue with the front side of the theater. The theater will have ceilings 10ft high but now will have a slight slope to 10 ft. A facade wall will be built with screen so this small slope will be covered..............don't know if this will be an acoustic issue.

We did renditions with the back elevations having an 11 ft theater room but it just didn't look right, therefore a compromise was made so there is a small slope in the theater room which I reiterate will be covered by the screen wall.
Edited by doublewing11 - 11/24/12 at 7:49am
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post #12 of 46
10/31/12 at 11:42am
I like the location of the theater. Three of the walls do not have occupied space on the other side and the one wall that is shared with occupied space is the kitchen. looking forward to keeping up with this one. smile.gif
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post #13 of 46
10/31/12 at 6:07pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AV Science Sales 5 View Post

I like the location of the theater. Three of the walls do not have occupied space on the other side and the one wall that is shared with occupied space is the kitchen. looking forward to keeping up with this one. smile.gif

Thanks......................this will be a fantastic ride............... I'm really looking forward to it!

With both kids graduated from college and with those MAJOR expenses out of the way...............it's time for my wife and I to do a few things for ourselves. I'm truly blessed to have a wonderful wife who has been a friend and partner for the last 26 years............she has been so encouraging on this home theater endeavor.

On another note, been busy on the phone talking to John at the Soundproofing Company and am settling on preparing for this endeavor. I've built three homes in my career, but this one I'm leaving it to the professionals.

Since this will be a "Tour of Homes" in my area, this AVS format will be an excellent documentation for locals to have first hand experience on what it take to have a world class theater in their very own home. Thanks to AVS for making this documentation possible................................BTW, final plans are coming to fruition.
Edited by doublewing11 - 12/2/12 at 5:38pm
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post #14 of 46
11/2/12 at 8:24pm
Thread Starter 
Been busy looking for alternatives to trim out the theater.............

Came upon a an idea that may turn out to be very useful and yet unusual. Our family has a tract of timberland which by chance has quite a few acres of old cherry stumps. The land used to be an original homestead cherry orchard which has been reclaimed by planting Douglas fir. Most of the stumps are anywhere from 4 ft up to 6 ft in height and from what I saw several months ago, there's a good change to reclaim some of the heart wood for decorative trim. My bother-in-law plans on taking out the chainsaw and checking how many stumps can be salvaged/reclaimed- he feels there could be more than enough to satisfy my needs with my construction. I'll know more about the possibilities by the end of next week.....................
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post #15 of 46
11/24/12 at 7:09am
Thread Starter 
Long time no post..........

Getting the logistics ready for home and theater..............

Hope to have plans for speaker, screen size and seating locations........... also acoustic design soon. Plan is to use Quest products with fabric walls............ fabrics/carpet have already been chosen.


photo.JPG
Edited by doublewing11 - 11/24/12 at 7:50am
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post #16 of 46
12/1/12 at 4:47pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by doublewing11 View Post

Long time no post..........
Getting the logistics ready for home and theater..............
Hope to have plans for speaker, screen size and seating locations........... also acoustic design soon. Plan is to use Quest products with fabric walls............ fabrics/carpet have already been chosen.

photo.JPG
You said you are looking for suggestions... so I'll throw a couple out there. While the carpet looks very nice, it is too light colored to work well with a projector. It will reflect too much light and wash out your image. No matter how good the contrast on the projector, (100K:1 on the Sony), with all the reflected light off that carpet, you'll never realize it. Even with all the lights off, the light from the projector will be enough to light up that carpet. Your blacks will only ever be dark gray. I would suggest something much darker. You don't need to go completely "black hole", but dark carpeting will work much better than light carpeting. Also consider a dark ceiling and dark walls.

Earlier in the thread, there was some discussion about HVAC. If sound *isolation* is the primary consideration, you want a completely separate HVAC system for the HT, with separate and isolated ducting. Just having a separate "zone" won't help, especially if the duct work is connected to the duct-work for rest of the house. The best way to *isolate* the sound from the rest of the house is to not let it get into the duct-work in the first place. The only way to do that is to completely separate the duct-work for the HT from the rest of the house.

Just my $0.02

Craig
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post #17 of 46
12/2/12 at 5:36pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by craig john View Post

You said you are looking for suggestions... so I'll throw a couple out there. While the carpet looks very nice, it is too light colored to work well with a projector. It will reflect too much light and wash out your image. No matter how good the contrast on the projector, (100K:1 on the Sony), with all the reflected light off that carpet, you'll never realize it. Even with all the lights off, the light from the projector will be enough to light up that carpet. Your blacks will only ever be dark gray. I would suggest something much darker. You don't need to go completely "black hole", but dark carpeting will work much better than light carpeting. Also consider a dark ceiling and dark walls.
Earlier in the thread, there was some discussion about HVAC. If sound *isolation* is the primary consideration, you want a completely separate HVAC system for the HT, with separate and isolated ducting. Just having a separate "zone" won't help, especially if the duct work is connected to the duct-work for rest of the house. The best way to *isolate* the sound from the rest of the house is to not let it get into the duct-work in the first place. The only way to do that is to completely separate the duct-work for the HT from the rest of the house.
Just my $0.02
Craig

Thanks Craig John,

Yes, special attention is being given to HVAC as i will be using the soffit as mufflers for both feed and return....................having two systems would be great, but a zoning system works best in this instance and will be constructed to to minimize outside interference.

I understand your concerns with carpet....................it's a compromise. In actuality, the carpet has darker shades so I'll check them out too.

Thanks for the feedback!
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post #18 of 46
1/7/13 at 8:25am
Thread Starter 
Long time no post..............

Working on electrical schemes and am asking for help concerning rack enclosure..............

Plan to use MA Rotating AXS System for Millwork and In-Wall application but have concerns about having enough outlets i.e. current............

The plan is to have:

2-20amp outlets for amp and in-wall subs....
3-15 amp outlets for power bridge to projector, processor, and a spare

The room will have two separate 20 amp circuits with two receptacles on each circuit.............ie. two larger subs per circuit.

Am I missing something? Is this enough circuits to future proof? Feed back would be most helpful.
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post #19 of 46
2/17/13 at 10:23am
Thread Starter 
Well............finally have my DE plans in hand...........

A few questions for the wise.........

How many people have their furnace and/or air conditioner next to their theater wall/s?

The reason why I ask is because I've paid dearly for a two stage furnace and two stage air conditioner which are supposedly ultra quiet, but am concerned with their locations on adjacent walls of my theater. The furnace has only one possible location which is in the garage, on the back wall of the theater. The air conditioner has been plumbed on the outside wall adjacent to theater too! I'm a little concerned with noise levels from both!

I can move the air conditioner to the side of the garage, but have been told I will loose efficiency of the ac unit by doing so. Wondering if anyone has experience with having both units next to their theater and can give advice. I have less than 48 hours to finalize ac unit location and am struggling with what direction to take.

1) Place ac unit next to theater and cross fingers the noise level won't be a problem.........or
2) Move ac unit 14 ft away from the theater wall and live with a less efficient ac unit.

I'd appreciate advise since the clock is ticking..............

Thanks
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post #20 of 46
2/17/13 at 10:36am
Thread Starter 
Been working with John at the Soundproofing Company.................about to order my materials.

1) 4 Five gallon Pails of GG
2) 280 whisperclips
3) 1 case of acoustic caulk sealant
4) 16 IB-3 Brackets
5) 1 case putty pads
6) 5 rolls of 3/8 Serenity Mat
7) Zero Automatic door bottom
8) Zero Adjustable door system
9) Green Glue dispenser

Am I missing anything?

In addition, need advice/help with brand, size of fasteners for attaching clips to studs............5/8 OSB to channel, and 5/8 DD

Thanks
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post #21 of 46
2/17/13 at 12:53pm
I'm having a little trouble following exactly where things are going. A layout would be nice. However, if I understand correctly, you are referring to the AC compressor (outside unit) that is next to the exterior wall of your theater and a "furnace" that will be in the garage. When you say furnace, are you talking about the air handler? Is it a heat pump / furnace combo? i'm not sure where you live, so I don't know the climate.

As far as the exterior unit goes, our house is brick veneer, OSB decking, 2x4 walls, spray foam insulation, standard double pane windows, and 1/2" sheetrock on the inside. We have a 5 ton Trane unit just outside our dining room (which has windows on 3 walls, and I can barely hear it when it kicks on. I may not notice it at all if it wasn't for hearing the thermostat click and seeing the slight dimming of our lights. Generally, these newer AC compressors are fairly quiet as the trend has been to make the units larger and more efficient (larger slower moving fan) that has made them quieter. The moral of all that is I don't think I would worry too much about the AC. You'll have your exterior finish, fiberglass batts (I'm assuming), decoupled walls, and DD+GG to help limit with the noise intrusion. You might ask they they pour the compressor pad with a gap between the house and the pad just limit the noise coupled into the foundation, although that may have little to no impact.

Will the furnace be in it's own room, or will it be open to the garage? If it's in it's own room, you could consider clips+channel+DD+GG in there. Also, if it's not, you might just see if you have any noise issues, and if you do find it objectionable, you could build a room around it and use clips+channel+DD+GG. That way you don't waste money fixing a problem that may not exist. Our variable speed air handler is directly above our bedroom, and I can hear the wind noise from the return and vents, but I don't notice the sound of the actual air handler.

Did John discuss using IB-1 clips rather than whisper clips? Just something you might want to ask about. Dennis doesn't spec them, but it's good to know your options.

As far as screws, I used the Grip-Rite exterior coated screws. If I had it to do over again, I would use 2" screws exclusively, as their 1-5/8" screws are smaller, even though both the 2" and 1-5/8" screws are both supposed to be #8s. The SIM for the particular whisper clip you have will specify which type and size screws to use.
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post #22 of 46
2/17/13 at 1:45pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by J_P_A View Post

I'm having a little trouble following exactly where things are going. A layout would be nice. However, if I understand correctly, you are referring to the AC compressor (outside unit) that is next to the exterior wall of your theater and a "furnace" that will be in the garage. When you say furnace, are you talking about the air handler? Is it a heat pump / furnace combo? i'm not sure where you live, so I don't know the climate.

As far as the exterior unit goes, our house is brick veneer, OSB decking, 2x4 walls, spray foam insulation, standard double pane windows, and 1/2" sheetrock on the inside. We have a 5 ton Trane unit just outside our dining room (which has windows on 3 walls, and I can barely hear it when it kicks on. I may not notice it at all if it wasn't for hearing the thermostat click and seeing the slight dimming of our lights. Generally, these newer AC compressors are fairly quiet as the trend has been to make the units larger and more efficient (larger slower moving fan) that has made them quieter. The moral of all that is I don't think I would worry too much about the AC. You'll have your exterior finish, fiberglass batts (I'm assuming), decoupled walls, and DD+GG to help limit with the noise intrusion. You might ask they they pour the compressor pad with a gap between the house and the pad just limit the noise coupled into the foundation, although that may have little to no impact.

Will the furnace be in it's own room, or will it be open to the garage? If it's in it's own room, you could consider clips+channel+DD+GG in there. Also, if it's not, you might just see if you have any noise issues, and if you do find it objectionable, you could build a room around it and use clips+channel+DD+GG. That way you don't waste money fixing a problem that may not exist. Our variable speed air handler is directly above our bedroom, and I can hear the wind noise from the return and vents, but I don't notice the sound of the actual air handler.

Did John discuss using IB-1 clips rather than whisper clips? Just something you might want to ask about. Dennis doesn't spec them, but it's good to know your options.

As far as screws, I used the Grip-Rite exterior coated screws. If I had it to do over again, I would use 2" screws exclusively, as their 1-5/8" screws are smaller, even though both the 2" and 1-5/8" screws are both supposed to be #8s. The SIM for the particular whisper clip you have will specify which type and size screws to use.

I'm in the Pacific Northwest and have found using a gas furnace/air handler and AC unit is more cost effective ie. energy costs...... than using a heat pump.

You are correct assuming the gas furnace is in the garage.............and the AC unit has been plumbed to the exterior wall of the theater. The last house I sold, the AC unit was loud!! My memories of our last HVAC system has me sweating bullets regarding sound containment. A variable speed Lennox Signature V98 has been spec-ed due to my concerns............in addition, the AC unit is an XC21 which is supposed to be ultra quiet too, but my fear still exists............spending all this time and money soundproofing a room just to hear rumblings of an AC unit in theater.

John has not discussed using IB-1 clips..............getting a hold of him on the phone is next to impossible, therefore most conversations are done via email.

Thanks for the heads up on the screws...............I'll try to attach the theater design.
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post #23 of 46
2/17/13 at 1:56pm
I would try to leave myself some space so that I could build a decoupled wall around the AHU if it proved to be too loud. That wouldn't concern me too much since you have fairly easy options for a retrofit solution.

Could you find another home with the same compressor and go listen to it? I suppose in your neck of the woods you won't find many people running their AC, though. Down here, I think ours was running last week smile.gif Can you get a spec on how loud you should expect it to be (db). That would at least give you an idea of what to expect.
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post #24 of 46
3/28/13 at 8:28am
Thread Starter 
Progress is moving along.................

368 clips were used of which 100 were for soffits.............950 linear feet of channel which was very difficult to to locate and have delivered. Had to wait 12 days for the stuff!

Electrical rough-in is done and more than 500 feet of 12 gauge wire is completed along with 75 linear feet of 1" tubing for front and back for XLR cables.

Lineacoustic RC was easy to find, contrary to what I've read here in the forums................800 sq ft for about $400 is not bad. Quest panels are being delivered as I speak..........getting close.

Still trying to finalize speakers and projector.................2" tubing is being used to supply the projector............not gluing the joints due to future possibilities of moving. Believe me, the electrical tubing is not going to move................

Pictures to come...............
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post #25 of 46
4/17/13 at 7:40am
Thread Starter 



First layer is done! Today is drywall.........green glue!
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post #26 of 46
4/17/13 at 7:45am
Thread Starter 


Solid Knotty Alder door..........custom made, 2-1/2 inches thick. Will receive Zero seals around. The whole theater will be using Knotty alder including 7 columns, trim and sofit. The side wall sofits will be done after drywall which are being used as a muffler.
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post #27 of 46
4/17/13 at 8:38am
Really moving along doublewing! That is one awesome looking door!
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post #28 of 46
4/17/13 at 8:42am
Dwing,

Did you ever decide on your speaker choice yet? I thought you were after some Triad Plats last, but not sure.
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post #29 of 46
4/17/13 at 9:51am
what are zero seals?
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post #30 of 46
4/17/13 at 10:01am
These are Zero seals:
http://www.soundproofingcompany.com/soundproofing-products/door-bottom-jamb-stop/
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