Q - BenQ W7000 or Epson 3020 -- Which direction should I go? - Page 2

Haha, I thought I was done with this thread, but this piqued my interest. Honestly, unless you don't already have a 3D projector and are interested in jumping into 3D and you love deep blacks, why would you purchase the 5020? I'd imagine that the 8500 would be every bit as good, if not better, in 2D than the 5020. And, by the sound of your post, you are pretty certain that the W7000 will still trump the 3D provided by the 5020.

Anyhoo, I'm just bored and I've had a few beers. Crab, I would say you're sitting pretty right now with your 8500 and W7000. Best of both worlds, imho. I'd save your beans, wait a cycle and see what next year has to offer.

Yea I know, but the bulb on my 8500Ub is coming up to 2000 hours and is starting to dim, looking a bit weak on my 153" screen. Instead of investing the money on a new bulb I'll put that money towards the 5020. The 5020 will be better than my 8500Ub, again in every category. If I had the 8700Ub I would probably keep that. I believe the blacks are even better with the later edition models and the shadow detail is much improved. Overall just a much brighter and better projector than my 8500Ub, those extra lumens in best mode really do make a difference on a 153" screen.

So that's my plan for my two projector setup. I'll pack away my 8350 and 8500Ub and be used as back up just in case the W7000 or 5020 crap out.

Note: the 5020 might end up being the Sony Hw50ES

The 5020 offers much better contrast and black levels than the 3020, but I don't think they are really comparable for most people.

The 3020 is $1500, the 5020 is $2500.

That's a full $1,000 difference which is a lot of money. $1,000 can buy you a lot of things, like a Carada screen, a midrange Denon receiver (like the AVR 1713) and a full 5.1 speaker set (like the Take Classic Energy 5.1) etc. etc.

I would love a 5020, but each of us has to draw the line somewhere....and a $1,000 price difference is pretty big when you are talking $1500 versus $2500.

on the other hand, if you are shopping $4000 and $5000 projectors, well $1000 isn't that big of a deal in the mid to higher range, because you are also likely shopping much more expensive screens, audio etc etc.

Do you have a local dealer who sells Epson? Go look at one, you'll know straight away whether its to your liking.

Unfortunately I couldn't find a single retailer in Michigan who has any Optoma projectors to view....nothing in Metro Detroit with a population of 5 million.

On the other hand, lots of local dealers have Sonys, Panasonics, Mitsus, Epsons etc so you can directly compare.

Same thing with BENQ....they and Optoma seem to limit retail channels...which sucks....they have great pictures, right? Why not get them in teh dealers hands so people can do a A/B comparo against , say Epson....

I recieved my 3020 last nite. I have a 3010 that I intend on selling. For whatever its worth, the 3d on the 3020 v. the 3010 is nite and day. I thought the criticism of the 3010 was a bit over baked on the crosstalk issue, but to be sure, it existed and in some instances was annoying...especially once you start looking for it. I have tested parts of movies that i knew had bad crosstalk on the 3010 on the 3020....compared the same scenes within minutes of each other. What was significant crosstalk is not almost entirely...if not in most instances completely gone. I think what ever they did to the 3020 has also sharpened th 3d picture itself...things have more depth and fell more 3d....the glasses feel a bit flimsy but I find them way more comfortable than the galsses fo r the 3010. I would also say that that feeling I had to throw the remote of the 3010 across the room when using 3d becasue the signals were getting mashed up are gone with the RF glasses. Finally, this was all done without having to tweak the 3d depth and with the brightness level at medium...the brightness is terrific in 3d.

By way of comparison, i tested the HD33. There was no crosstalk...I mean zero. But at the end of the day, the picture was dim compared to the 3010. I was willing to sacrifice brightness for a bit of crosstalk. Now with the 3020..nearly zero crosstalk and even brighter. It is a win-win.

i am sure there are plenty of great projectors and many dig on the dlp. I like the dlp look as well...before these projectors I have a Mits 3800. Pic was great...but always seemed just a bit dark on my 120 inch screen. No such problems with the epson. If it sounds like I am happy with the epson upgrade then it si because I am. Just curious why these bastards put out the 3010 before it had been fully cooked.

*What was significant crosstalk is now almost entirely...if not in most instances completely gone.

You should check out the DIY screen section. All I did was put my projector where I wanted it, turn it on so it's a blue screen, make sure it was square, then use painters tape to tape around the image. I used a light neutral grey (you may wish to go with white, but I wouldn't because the 3020 is already apparently super bright and at that point you'd be wanting to go for good contrast) mixed with satin polycrylic for added gain. I bought a Wagner HVLP gun for cheap and painted the screen. You could roll it on as well, but the sprayer makes a super clean finish and I have used it for a ton of other projects around the house, so it has paid for itself many times over. Anyhow, then I finished the screen by buying 3" flat baseboard molding, painting it flat black, then nailing it into the wall. It was easy, cheap, and I don't get any complaints when I have people over. If I were to do it again, I would probably wrap the border in velvet, but...

As mentioned above, lots of great stuff in the DIY section.

I did the same with my first screen but used velvet tape to create the boarder, looked and worked really well. Total cost, under $100

My newest screen I built a false wall and built a tensioned screen frame (using bolts along the inside of the 2x4 frame) and used Seymour XD material. I wrapped my false wall framing with fabric. I now have an acoustically transparent screen, awesome! Total cost, under $1000.

Crab, how did the acoustically transparent screen compare to just painting on the wall? To me, the image looks pretty crisp and I'm worried that an AT screen will affect the picture quality, even though I know getting it will enhance the audio quality since I could have the speakers at the right height as opposed to being below the screen.

I can't see the weave from 15' back unless I really look for it. Not really apparent while watching. I think the picture looks awesome, IMO, and have no regrets with going A/T.

I used Cream&sugar mix, from hometheater shack, for my painted wall and it looked awesome. People have to realize that they don't have to spend a ton to get a nice looking picture and paint when done properly looks really really good.

Sound imaging is pretty cool and noticeable on my 153" screen. I never thought much about sound imaging before but after watching on an acoustically transparent screen I'm sold! I tell people of this scene of a cart with a rusted squeaky wheel that moved across the front sound stage and the pin point accuracy of sound to visual reference and the seamless movement of sound across the front stage was unreal. I was sold after that scene.

Here's the same picture, the only one I have, that I have posted in other threads. The image is from my Epson 8500Ub or was it my 8350??? I'm 6'4" for perspective.

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Quote:
Originally Posted by VividiD View Post

Hey, what do you guys think of this --
http://www.amazon.com/Elite-ELECTRIC125H-Electric-Projection-125-Inch/dp/B000Q87LM6/ref=cm_cr_pr_product_top
Is there a big difference between that, and say... this --
http://www.amazon.com/Elite-Screens-M120UWV2-Manual-Projection/dp/B000B7PCSW/ref=pd_sim_e_8
Thanks guys! : )

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3.5 stars from reviews on the 120" screen and 4.5 on the 125"

There's also something to be said with automation. I would go with the electric 125" screen if it were me.
Edited by Crabalocker - 10/28/12 at 11:41pm

VividiD, Have you got your projector yet? If not, check out Ernie's in Ceresco. I used to live in Omaha a couple years ago. Yea, I couldn't find many places to view projectors except for some high end places that had high end set ups. Custom Electronics on 75th and Pacific had a JVC RS-2 set up when I was there, but not sure what they got now. They were kinda expensive but knew their stuff, had a good selection and good customer service. But I went out to Ernie's and they had a nice theater to view. I've bought some expensive stuff from Ernie's and they had good prices and customer service. Ask for Brit. It's about an hours drive west and just north of Lincoln.

Here's a couple of screen shots I just took. They are the W7000 and my older 8500Ub. You'll see the difference in blacks and will give you an idea what the upgrade from the 3020 to the 5020 would be kinda like.

Same exposure same camera and no picture touch-ups.



W7000


8500Ub





W7000


8500Ub





W7000


8500Ub

Edited by Crabalocker - 10/29/12 at 6:47pm

Wow, that's the 8500ub? How would the 8350 compare to the 8500ub?

the 8350's blacks aren't as good as the W7000

OK, so then if I stay away from DLP, what would be your ecommendations from best to worst in the Epson lines? Is the 8700ub brighter than the 8500ub? As I mentionned before, my screen size will most likely be 128" with slight gain and the majority of my viewing will be in total darkness for movies. I will however view the projector sometimes with lights on (or during the day) and the thing that worries me about the 8500ub and 8700ub is that it will not be bright enough (at least that is what I get from codeguy's calculator).

if you prefer Epson, you can consider the 5010 or coming soon 5020, tons of lumens for larger screen size and very good blacks....or Panasonic AE8000, there are many choices out there

I would love those projectors but they are out of my price range at this time. I want to stay within the $1500 range. Not completely set on Epson, they just seem to be the best option out there for LCD. What about the 8500ub vs 8700ub, what are your thought son those 2, especially considering you watch on a 133" screen with 0.9 gain? Do you ever watch with lights on or during the day, what does the picture look like in those conditions?

my 8500Ub lights up my 153" 1.1 gain screen. The 8700Ub is even better than the 8500Ub. The 8500 had issues with shadow detail, or so I'm told, and the 8700 is much better. The 8500 is Ok with ambient light, the 8350 is better (brighter), but with the lights low or off, the 8500Ub's blacks make everything pop.

I would say it's the 8350, 8500Ub, 8700Ub, 5010. 5020??? The 5010 and 5020 will have more lumens than the 8500 and 8700Ub in best mode.

The BenQ is a really nice projector also, I actually prefer its look and colour...it just doesn't produce the deepest blacks. That and it's really really bright!

Don't worry about these projectors lighting up a 130" screen.

Also, in those pictures my 8500Ub is dimming. The bulb has close to 2000 hours on it.

Crabalocker, I really like the look of BenQ as well but since I see the RBE (slightly, but it's there and I fear I will notice it even more later on), I think I should stay away from DLP. Wow, the 8500ub on 153" screen, that is huge!! Let me know what you think about the 8500ub (or even the 8700ub) with lights on or during daytime, is it too washed out or very vieweable?

if you are worry about not bright enough, you can pair the 8500UB/8700UB with a Da-Lite High Power screen

The 8500Ub is washed out a little, as you would expect but if I do run it with the lights on I switch it to living room mode. The problem with living room mode is that it makes the colours not really look quite right. That's why I'm going to a two projector setup. The BenQ for daytime a video games and probably a new 5020 for movies.

The 8500Ub looks pretty good with a little ambient light, you just can't go full light. I usually have the lights dimmed but still on.

The 8350 is a good projector too, but its blacks are similar to the W7000.

I see RBE as well.

I don't really like that option since it limits the viewing angle. I prefer to stick with a regular screen.

I'll take a picture of the 8500Ub with some ambient light to give you an idea. I'll take a photo of the OppO screen saver and one other shot. I won't be able to post it for an hour or so.

That's no problem Crabalocker, I'll wait for it. Thanks for the help. I just want to make sure that I cover all my bases here.

I think 8500UB/8700UB is the best choice for your budget if you like deep blacks, alternative 3LCD option would be the 8350

WereWolf84, these are the 3 models I am considering at the moment. I also had the Panasonic 100U as a choice for pure brightness capabilities but am leaning away from that projector right now. I am a bit spoiled since my main TV at home right now is a Pioneer Elite Plasma Pro 101-FD so deep blacks is what I am used to. This is not to say that I must have the best blacks, I realize that my budget does not permit that right now but I want to get the best solution that I can.

I tried a video but my video camera makes everything too dark and can't figure out how to get a decent picture. The same goes for the photo with ambient light. I'm not a good enough photographer to adjust the exposure and such to get a 'do it justice' image.

All I can say is that the blacks with the 8500Ub start to look like the blacks from the W7000 with the lights out but starts to lose the pop. One because of the ambient light and second, my bulb is dimming. The W7000 starts to really shine here. That's why I got it. No question those extra lumens really help when you start turning the lights up.