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BenQ W1070 : DLP Full HD, 3D Ready with lens-shift for 1000$ - Page 210

post #6271 of 8500
I noticed a few post back (don't keep up on this thread to much) that someone was having issue with setting brightness.
As was mentioned that HDMI settings for the device and color space all play into things and you should really be using a device that output at Reference levels. Of course that is not always possible so a BR player is going to be the closest you can get..not a media player or laptop or HTPC.
You may need different settings for those other devices.. All that other stuff aside, there is a trick not mentioned much that can be done with a DLP.
I do this all the time to verify the player and pattern are correct.

The brightness pattern on the free AVS 709 disk is the one I use because it is accurate and easy to use.

First set your BRP HDMI to 4:2:2 and set the brightness with this pattern. With the AVS disk that way you set it is to have the # 17 flashing and #16 is completely the same as the surrounding black and can not bee seen. Now display a 0% window pattern which is the same a video black or #16 on the brightness pattern. Note your brightness setting stand right in front of the screen. Turn up brightness looking at the pattern, as you turn it up you will see what looks like dancing specs, these are the micro mirrors moving. Now you see the specs, turn down the brightness till the just stop moving. That is your ultimate brightness setting. Now recheck the brightness pattern, can you still see 17 flashing, if not raise the brightness one click or so should do it.

Check content with the BRP not other devices to check shadow detail. If it is good on the BR your issues are with the other players or the files you are playing.

Depending on the projectors ability, and your gamma adjustment or lack of, you may need to make changes (raise brightness) to see detail.
I could keep going as there is a complete forum of data on Calibration but I have to get to work, hope that helps someone.
Edited by airscapes - 9/17/13 at 5:39am
post #6272 of 8500
Quote:
Originally Posted by hotjt133 View Post

That's largely correct. In my 130" setup the top edge is 8-10cm below the lens. There is also about 10cm of lens shift to play with.

But 92" screen does not do projector a justice, and will probably be too bright. If not limited by the room size, I would go as large as possible.

Quote:
Originally Posted by kbarnes701 View Post

Broadly, the w1070 needs the lens to line up with the top of the screen. What I did was use a PJ mount with an adjustable pole. I set it up roughly correctly and then used the adjustability of the pole to get it spot on, while watching the w1070's test pattern on the screen. This seemed to me to be an easier route than trying to get it perfect using any sort of rigid mount.

The 5020UB - it isn’t an issue as the Epson has the biggest lens shift in the business and you can put the PJ almost anywhere and use the lens shift to get the image lined up properly. Lens shift is an optical adjustment so it it has no negative impact on the image quality - it literally moves the lens.

Thank you much for thew information above....I guess I wasn't misunderstanding too badly what the calculators were trying to show me smile.gif. A few more questions:

1. What mount would you all recommend if I went the route of the BenQ? I guess with the current screen setup it would require a adjustable pole in order to get that necessary distance offset from the ceiling....

2. I'm leaning towards the BenQ since I'm a novice entry level media room guy. This was a bonus part of the house we bought, and I get to toy with it, since it's "mine" according to my wife smile.gif. After the requisitie furniture upgrades and purchases, not much money left to play with to outfit this room, judging by what I'm reading here, in order to turn it into a real theater experience room. Given that, I felt like the Epson would be overkill for me and my purposes. Does anyone have experience with both and can explain what the biggest differences will be between the 2? I don't have a calibration disc or white meter or anything fancy like that, so I'm not a videophile by any means.....

Thanks again!
post #6273 of 8500
Quote:
Originally Posted by ssun1976 View Post
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by hotjt133 View Post

That's largely correct. In my 130" setup the top edge is 8-10cm below the lens. There is also about 10cm of lens shift to play with.

But 92" screen does not do projector a justice, and will probably be too bright. If not limited by the room size, I would go as large as possible.
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by kbarnes701 View Post

Broadly, the w1070 needs the lens to line up with the top of the screen. What I did was use a PJ mount with an adjustable pole. I set it up roughly correctly and then used the adjustability of the pole to get it spot on, while watching the w1070's test pattern on the screen. This seemed to me to be an easier route than trying to get it perfect using any sort of rigid mount.

The 5020UB - it isn’t an issue as the Epson has the biggest lens shift in the business and you can put the PJ almost anywhere and use the lens shift to get the image lined up properly. Lens shift is an optical adjustment so it it has no negative impact on the image quality - it literally moves the lens.

Thank you much for thew information above....I guess I wasn't misunderstanding too badly what the calculators were trying to show me smile.gif. A few more questions:

1. What mount would you all recommend if I went the route of the BenQ? I guess with the current screen setup it would require a adjustable pole in order to get that necessary distance offset from the ceiling....

2. I'm leaning towards the BenQ since I'm a novice entry level media room guy. This was a bonus part of the house we bought, and I get to toy with it, since it's "mine" according to my wife smile.gif. After the requisitie furniture upgrades and purchases, not much money left to play with to outfit this room, judging by what I'm reading here, in order to turn it into a real theater experience room. Given that, I felt like the Epson would be overkill for me and my purposes. Does anyone have experience with both and can explain what the biggest differences will be between the 2? I don't have a calibration disc or white meter or anything fancy like that, so I'm not a videophile by any means.....

Thanks again!

 

I have experience with both. In fact, I am currently waiting for the release of the 5030UB (early November in the UK) and will be upgrading to that unit.

 
Really, there is no comparison between these two units. One is an entry level PJ that costs under $1,000, the other is a fairly high spec unit that costs three times as much. If you can run to the 5020UB that will give you advantages all round, with one possible exception (see later).
 
I'll confine my remarks to difference in PQ between the two, rather than 'mechanical' differences such as lens offset, throw distances etc, as these can be easily checked on one of the PJ comparison sites.
 
The biggest difference is the black level. The w1070 is average for black level, the 5020UB is way above average. Black is important because it is the 'foundation' of the image. It contributes hugely to 'punch', especially in dark scenes. The w1070 is remarkable for the money - on any scenes other than very dark ones, the PQ is superb. It is pin sharp (DLP PJs are renowned for sharpness) whereas the 5020UB, being a LCD PJ may have convergence issues, where the R, G and B are not fully aligned. The PJ includes a feature to improve convergence. DLP has no convergence issues. The w1070 is very bright, but so is the Epson, so I'd say there isn't too much in it unless you have a huge screen and/or a huge throw distance. The w1070 includes a full CMS so it can be calibrated to ISF standards, which is almost unique at this price level. On any scenes other than the darkest, the w1070 is spectacularly impressive IMO.
 
So it depends on what you are looking for and what you are prepared to pony up for it. If you want the best PQ you can get for under $3,000 then the Epson is your choice. If you want the best PQ for under $1,000 it's the BenQ. If you think you won’t be too fussy about black levels or about seeing 'dark gray' not 'black' bars when watching a 2.40:1 aspect ratio movie, then you will be very happy with the BenQ. If most of your viewing is TV and sport, you will be delighted with the BenQ. Does that help?

 

WRT to mounts, just use google or Amazon and see what there is. Measure the distance from the top of your screen to the ceiling and use that as a guide for where the centre of the lens should be, then choose a mount that has flexibility up and down for a few inches, This will enable you to get it spot on. I can't recommend the mount I use because it isn't available in the US. No need to spend a fortune - the BenQ isn't all that heavy. If you go with the Epson, then you can use a mount directly attached to the ceiling and rely on the Epson's huge lens shift adjustability.

post #6274 of 8500
Quote:
Originally Posted by hotjt133 View Post
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by ssun1976 View Post

1. If I purchase the BenQ w1070 to install in the room, locating it roughly where the other projector mount is, how low down from the ceiling will the projector need to be? I've tried using the BenQ calculator and it seems to suggest that the projector will need to be 13 inches down from the ceiling (to the center of the lens). Am I understanding this right?

That's largely correct. In my 130" setup the top edge is 8-10cm below the lens. There is also about 10cm of lens shift to play with.

But 92" screen does not do projector a justice, and will probably be too bright. If not limited by the room size, I would go as large as possible.

 

I only have room in my small HT for a 92 inch screen (unfortunately). The w1070 is very bright - I project from a throw of 9 feet as well, to make matters more difficult. I found that initially I needed to use a 4X ND filter to be able to calibrate a sensible luminance level for the room. After 200 hours or so on the lamp, I recalibrated and no longer need any sort of filter to get a foot-lambert reading of about 16. This is with a gray screen with unity gain.

post #6275 of 8500
The comment about lens shift not altering the image is not accurate, it can and does alter the image (especially when used in excessive amounts). wink.gif

Jason
post #6276 of 8500
Quote:
Originally Posted by DaGamePimp View Post

The comment about lens shift not altering the image is not accurate, it can and does alter the image (especially when used in excessive amounts). wink.gif

Jason

 

How?

post #6277 of 8500
Quote:
Originally Posted by kbarnes701 View Post

How?

Consider you are shifting the light path / lens and there by altering the end result away from optimal.

The use of lens shift often creates focal issues (CA and sharpness uniformity).

Now I am not meaning to imply that everyone will notice the less than optimal image but it does exist all the same (to what degree will vary unit to unit).

Jason
post #6278 of 8500
While we are at the topic of lens shift, is there any projector in the market that can rotate the image to a small degree?

I found in my setup, the most difficult part is to keep it absolute horizontal. This is probably due to I delibrately put the mount at the center of the room. Why did I do this? Because the 1070 has an off center lens, but my future projector may be center, or maybe off to the other end. I just don't want to knock another hole and put extra braces everytime I change a projector.

So for now the lens center is also directly under the mount. This caused the projector unbalanced and very difficult to make small adjustments (partly due to my cheap mount design), especially to make it absolute horizontal. So I was thinking if a projector can lens shift and rotate would be convenient. Might be wishful thinking at this pricing point?
post #6279 of 8500
The ND filter arrived. I got myself the ND X to 400 filter. By the way the size should be 70mm not 72mm.

And... it doesn't work. It can't get the image to look good.

I believe if I was going to start doing a review on this projector I would start by saying it sucks.
This is not my first projector and I got it mainly because it's the only one that can make 118" from 3.5m from lens to screen.

But... oh boy... this projector sucks so much and I got it second hand.
I'm dealing on sending it back but.. oh my god it sucks so much the blacks on this are terrible. Reminds me of the first LCD screens on the market 10 years ago.

If you get $1000 go to a strip club or buy yourself a nice tv set.
This projector is only good for barbecues and very bright areas when quality doesn't matter.

This projector will be way better if you get yourself drunk but in the morning after it still sucks.
post #6280 of 8500
Guys... don't feed the troll, just leave it be.

Jason
post #6281 of 8500

I'm late to the party but my 1070 was delivered yesterday morning. This is my 3rd projector. Really pleased with it and was surprised at out good it looks right out of the box. Learned a lot about it in this thread and was one of the main reasons I chose it. Can't imagine any one not being pleased at this price range. Thanks for the good contributions in this thread.


Edited by XStanleyX - 9/17/13 at 6:27pm
post #6282 of 8500
Quote:
Originally Posted by XStanleyX View Post

I'm late to the party but my 1070 was delivered yesterday morning. This is my 3rd projector. Really pleased with it and was surprised at out good it looks right out of the box. Learned a lot about it in this thread and was one of the main reasons I chose it. Can't imagine any one not being pleased at this price range. Thanks for the good contributions in this thread.


congrats! what screen size? and screen? I agree, great pj for the price. still amazed after a couple of months. enjoy!
post #6283 of 8500
Quote:
Originally Posted by XStanleyX View Post

I'm late to the party but my 1070 was delivered yesterday morning. This is my 3rd projector. Really pleased with it and was surprised at out good it looks right out of the box. Learned a lot about it in this thread and was one of the main reasons I chose it. Can't imagine any one not being pleased at this price range. Thanks for the good contributions in this thread.

How do you find the fan noise to be? My projector will be mounted about 3 feet above the seating area. Thoughts?
post #6284 of 8500
Quote:
Originally Posted by eah9 View Post


congrats! what screen size? and screen? I agree, great pj for the price. still amazed after a couple of months. enjoy!

 

 

I only got a 80" pull down screen to tide me over till I make a move in Nov. or Dec. After I make the move I'll go as big as I can go with a fixed screen as the new place will allow.

post #6285 of 8500
Quote:
Originally Posted by butie120 View Post


How do you find the fan noise to be? My projector will be mounted about 3 feet above the seating area. Thoughts?

 

 

Mine is mounted directly above my head and I don't think it makes much noise. Once the movie has started I don't notice it at all.

post #6286 of 8500
Quote:
Originally Posted by butie120 View Post

How do you find the fan noise to be? My projector will be mounted about 3 feet above the seating area. Thoughts?

On a table a few feet in front of my couch, it is quiet as a whisper in ecco mode, which is how I want to run it anyway. If I change the lamp mode I can briefly hear the fan speed up or down, but other than that, its really not noticeable.
post #6287 of 8500
Quote:
Originally Posted by veggav View Post

The ND filter arrived. I got myself the ND X to 400 filter. By the way the size should be 70mm not 72mm. And... it doesn't work. It can't get the image to look good. [...] This projector will be way better if you get yourself drunk but in the morning after it still sucks.

One of the good thing about this projector are the many positive reviews. Just list them and it will be off your hands within days on Craigslist. Also, you should get enough dough to cover half of the better projector you should have bought in the first place biggrin.gif

That said, I think everyone has the right to express their feelings. I went through previous posts from you and found that from day 1 you were complaining about the contrast ratio. Is the W1070 significantly worse than your previous panasonic? Could there be a technical problem?

As usual, let's not forget that this is an entry level (i.e., cheap) projector and one should not expect any wonder. BenQ still needs to make a profit from each sales!
post #6288 of 8500
Quote:
Originally Posted by XStanleyX View Post


I only got a 80" pull down screen to tide me over till I make a move in Nov. or Dec. After I make the move I'll go as big as I can go with a fixed screen as the new place will allow.


Great. I heard this will pj will do 150" easily. I was limited to 100" but it's fantastic at that size.
post #6289 of 8500
Quote:
Originally Posted by DaGamePimp View Post
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by kbarnes701 View Post

How?

Consider you are shifting the light path / lens and there by altering the end result away from optimal.

The use of lens shift often creates focal issues (CA and sharpness uniformity).

Now I am not meaning to imply that everyone will notice the less than optimal image but it does exist all the same (to what degree will vary unit to unit).

Jason

 

Sensible use of Optical lens shift (as distinct from keystoning which is not what we are discussing) won't normally degrade the image in a way anyone will notice it. There can be some loss of brightness and some 'bowing' of the image but with sensible optical adjustment these are not visible to the viewer. Of course, if someone decides to stick the PJ 3 feet to the left and 3 feet lower than is correct, then one may well see all manner of issues arising.  But what I was suggesting to the OP was that he could use the Epson's optical lens shift to adjust the picture onto his screen without worrying about getting the ceiling mount inch-perfect.  IOW, an adjustment of maybe 2 or 3 inches vertically. That amount of lens shift on the Epson will not degrade the image in any practical sense. I perhaps didn’t make myself clear enough originally - I am not advocating placing the PJ in a silly place and then using great gobs of lens shift to get the image into the screen - but used sensibly optical lens shift can help a lot with final adjustments. Keystoning, of course, is something I would never, ever recommend.


Edited by kbarnes701 - 9/18/13 at 4:59am
post #6290 of 8500
Quote:
Originally Posted by DaGamePimp View Post

Guys... don't feed the troll, just leave it be.

Jason

 

+1

post #6291 of 8500

Any thoughts on which pair are better?
post #6292 of 8500
Quote:
Originally Posted by bighvy76 View Post


Any thoughts on which pair are better?

The 3Active's are more comfortable. To me anyway. They are lighter and they hug my face better and don't slip down my nose like the 3DTVCorps. I also like that they are rechargeable.

Image wise, the 3Active's seem a tad bit brighter, but I just got them and didn't switch back and forth between the two to compare. Just going of memory of the same film, and it seemed a bit brighter to me.

All in all, they are very close, but I prefer the 3Active's for the reasons that I mentioned. They cost $30 more for a pair though, so you would have to weigh that in your decision.

A couple others have said that they block the DLP Link red flashes slightly better, but I can't confirm this as I just got the 3Active's and didn't A/B them with the 3DTVCorps. Could be that they do, but I would hazard a guess that it amounts to very little difference when I do actually A/B them, as the 3DTVCorps block the red flash very well themselves..

If comfort and rechargeability are important, and you don't mind the extra $30, then get the 3Active. You might also be getting a brighter picture and better red flash blocking in the process, but I can't say 100% for certain at this point. Only that I believe so based on limited testing.
post #6293 of 8500
Quote:
Originally Posted by bighvy76 View Post


Any thoughts on which pair are better?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Stuntman_Mike View Post

The 3Active's are more comfortable. To me anyway. They are lighter and they hug my face better and don't slip down my nose like the 3DTVCorps. I also like that they are rechargeable.

Image wise, the 3Active's seem a tad bit brighter, but I just got them and didn't switch back and forth between the two to compare. Just going of memory of the same film, and it seemed a bit brighter to me.

All in all, they are very close, but I prefer the 3Active's for the reasons that I mentioned. They cost $30 more for a pair though, so you would have to weigh that in your decision.

A couple others have said that they block the DLP Link red flashes slightly better, but I can't confirm this as I just got the 3Active's and didn't A/B them with the 3DTVCorps. Could be that they do, but I would hazard a guess that it amounts to very little difference when I do actually A/B them, as the 3DTVCorps block the red flash very well themselves..

If comfort and rechargeability are important, and you don't mind the extra $30, then get the 3Active. You might also be getting a brighter picture and better red flash blocking in the process, but I can't say 100% for certain at this point. Only that I believe so based on limited testing.

+1 I have the 3D Actives dimensional optics (4 pair). I haven't tried the 3DTVcorp ones though. Outstanding 3d quality and comfortable. And the quality of the glasses seems very good and comes with a nice case to keep them in. They can be purchased from Amazon too (if you are a prime member - free 2 day shipping).
post #6294 of 8500
Quote:
Originally Posted by eah9 View Post


+1 I have the 3D Actives dimensional optics (4 pair). I haven't tried the 3DTVcorp ones though. Outstanding 3d quality and comfortable. And the quality of the glasses seems very good and comes with a nice case to keep them in. They can be purchased from Amazon too (if you are a prime member - free 2 day shipping).

I have both the 3D 3DTV and 3D Actives and I agree the 3D Actives are great but the 3DTVcorp ones are also very good. I can't see much difference in picture quality with either pair. Regarding comfort it is possible to adjust either pair by using a hair dryer to soften the plastic slightly and make adjustments. This is what optical stores do with a heat gun. If you don't want to do it yourself take the pair to any optical store or Costco and ask them to do it for you. They do not charge for this service. Dimensional Optics often runs 20% sales and promotion codes for their 3D Active glasses. I plan to order two more pairs when they do it again.
If you get the code you have to order it direct from them . I would give them a call and ask when they might do it again. They also provide great service and support and the case is really nice.
post #6295 of 8500
Another happy w1070 owner here. I picked up the Sainsonic glasses and they work very well for me.

Sorry to ask what's been asked before, but anyone have hints to get 3D working on PC players? I've tried them all with no luck.

WinDVD and two other major players find my 3d graphics card hardware but say the BenQ is not a 3D display device.
TMT spits out red-blue 3d on most settings, and the one setting that seems to switch between left/right frames doesn't work.

In any case, none of the players seem to change the screen refresh rate when moving to fullscreen. I expected this would be required? It happens on my blu-ray player and ps3 when i choose a 3d movie and it initiates a new hdmi handshake.
post #6296 of 8500
Firmware 1.07 is out:

ISF Night setting can’t be keep after 2D->3D timing changed
To keep lamp hour after “reset all setting in USE OSD”
To improve the 32 gray level via PS3 HDMI
Modify picture mode of “power off” icon
Modify HSG setting in No signal condition

I'll post it up via a link after work, but I don't think I'll upgrade mine to this one, I'm giving my PS3 to my niece in anticipation of getting my XB1 for the holidaze, and the other stuff is kinda, meh. Maybe there are hidding boosts that this doesn't mention, but I read all the service reports for complaints that this firmware fixes, and it's all the same as what I posted above. It woulda been better for them to add more 3D stuff like auto-switching / auto-detecting when 3D is enabled at the source, to avoid clicks (and especially to switch back to 2D).
post #6297 of 8500
Quote:
Originally Posted by RLBURNSIDE View Post

Firmware 1.07 is out:

ISF Night setting can’t be keep after 2D->3D timing changed
To keep lamp hour after “reset all setting in USE OSD”
To improve the 32 gray level via PS3 HDMI
Modify picture mode of “power off” icon
Modify HSG setting in No signal condition

I'll post it up via a link after work, but I don't think I'll upgrade mine to this one, I'm giving my PS3 to my niece in anticipation of getting my XB1 for the holidaze, and the other stuff is kinda, meh. Maybe there are hidding boosts that this doesn't mention, but I read all the service reports for complaints that this firmware fixes, and it's all the same as what I posted above. It woulda been better for them to add more 3D stuff like auto-switching / auto-detecting when 3D is enabled at the source, to avoid clicks (and especially to switch back to 2D).

Thanks for the info RLBURNSIDE. Appreciate it! I am holding off on this one too, unless something major is discovered. Everything is working great on 1.06.
post #6298 of 8500
hello,

the w1070 rev. 01-105, with new remote and from july 2013 will have firmware 1.06, right?
thanks!
post #6299 of 8500
Is there any horizontal keystone correction setting on this unit? I found the vertical keystone, but don't see anything else. The studs in my room used for the theater were off center around 6 inches... and the position settings to move the image don't work via HDMI, only PC. I really don't want to put the screen off-center, and I am not sure I have the skills to build a ceiling mount that is off the stud!

The trapezoid is minor if I shoot it towards the center of the room, my wife doesn't even notice it, but it is driving me insane smile.gif
post #6300 of 8500
Quote:
Originally Posted by XYnie View Post

Is there any horizontal keystone correction setting on this unit? I found the vertical keystone, but don't see anything else. The studs in my room used for the theater were off center around 6 inches... and the position settings to move the image don't work via HDMI, only PC. I really don't want to put the screen off-center, and I am not sure I have the skills to build a ceiling mount that is off the stud!

The trapezoid is minor if I shoot it towards the center of the room, my wife doesn't even notice it, but it is driving me insane smile.gif

I don't think it has horizontal keystone correction. Just put a cut 2x4 or something between the studs and mount it to that. Not too bad to do. I had to put a piece or 2 above my ceiling tiles to allow for more flexible mounting of the pj. Good luck!!
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