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Gaming Projector ~$2k

post #1 of 21
11/11/12 at 3:49pm
Thread Starter 
I am new to the projector world (this will be my first) and pretty suprised by the wide range of competition and lack of a clear leading brand or model.

I was all set to get he Epson 3010e for my game room and started reading about the horrible input lag (100ms+). I am planning this room for 75% gaming, so lag is important.

After much research, I am leaning toward the BenQ W7000 ( ~35 ms lag) because it can do 3D (not required but a nice bonus) and handle a room with some ambient light. My room is 12' x 14' and has several windows with white curtains. (so some light); I am thinking somewhere around 80 - 85" screen.

Below are the other leading candidates I considered:
  • Mitsubishi HC7800 (great lag time, seems targeted for a dedicated home theater room with better light control)
  • BenQ W6000 (does not do 3D)
  • Panasonic AE7000 (seems targeted for a dedicated home theater room with better light control)
  • Acer H9500BD (higher lag time around 80ms and I am shooting for around 30ms)
  • Epson 8350 (great lag time, but not bright enough for a room with ambient light)

So, did I miss anything? Any sugegstions for better alternatives to the BenQ W7000 around $2k?

Any and all input from the expersts is much appreciated!
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post #2 of 21
11/11/12 at 4:07pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mizelhike View Post

I am new to the projector world (this will be my first) and pretty suprised by the wide range of competition and lack of a clear leading brand or model.
I was all set to get he Epson 3010e for my game room and started reading about the horrible input lag (100ms+). I am planning this room for 75% gaming, so lag is important.
After much research, I am leaning toward the BenQ W7000 ( ~35 ms lag) because it can do 3D (not required but a nice bonus) and handle a room with some ambient light. My room is 12' x 14' and has several windows with white curtains. (so some light); I am thinking somewhere around 80 - 85" screen.
Below are the other leading candidates I considered:
  • Mitsubishi HC7800 (great lag time, seems targeted for a dedicated home theater room with better light control)
  • BenQ W6000 (does not do 3D)
  • Panasonic AE7000 (seems targeted for a dedicated home theater room with better light control)
  • Acer H9500BD (higher lag time around 80ms and I am shooting for around 30ms)
  • Epson 8350 (great lag time, but not bright enough for a room with ambient light)
So, did I miss anything? Any sugegstions for better alternatives to the BenQ W7000 around $2k?
Any and all input from the expersts is much appreciated!

Benq W7000 is what you should get
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post #3 of 21
11/11/12 at 4:50pm
The W7000 is a really bright projector, I don't know but it might overpower an 80-85" screen at a 12-14' throw. I use the projector on my 153" screen and it's BRIGHT and have to watch with some ambient light (18' throw).

I have no issues with gaming lag, I can't tell the difference in lag between it and my 8350. My COD K/D ratio for team death match is around 1.8 so I'm a fairly descent/OK player.

For a screen that small, why not get a 70 or 80" TV? The benefits of a projector really start to come to life at a 100" and bigger...IMHO.
Edited by Crabalocker - 11/11/12 at 4:56pm
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post #4 of 21
11/11/12 at 4:59pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Crabalocker View Post

The W7000 is a really bright projector, I don't know but it might overpower an 80-85" screen at a 12-14' throw. I use the projector on my 153" screen and it's BRIGHT and have to watch with some ambient light (18' throw).
I have no issues with gaming lag, I can't tell the difference in lag between it and my 8350. My COD K/D ratio for team death match is around 1.8 so I'm a fairly descent/OK player.
For a screen that small, why not get a 70 or 80" TV? The benefits of a projector really start to come to life at a 100" and bigger...IMHO.

With that throw distance, he should consider a 100in+ screen. Can't wait to play the new COD in 3D tomorrow on my 120in screen
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post #5 of 21
11/11/12 at 5:47pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Crabalocker View Post

The W7000 is a really bright projector, I don't know but it might overpower an 80-85" screen at a 12-14' throw. I use the projector on my 153" screen and it's BRIGHT and have to watch with some ambient light (18' throw).
I have no issues with gaming lag, I can't tell the difference in lag between it and my 8350. My COD K/D ratio for team death match is around 1.8 so I'm a fairly descent/OK player.
For a screen that small, why not get a 70 or 80" TV? The benefits of a projector really start to come to life at a 100" and bigger...IMHO.

Crab, Lee, thanks for the feedback.

The reason for a projector is because of the room setup. I'm in a 3 story row house in the city and it's only 12' wide, so I have to get creative with the space. The thrid floor has a landing with a stair case and I am mounting the screen where the image will be projected on the wall of the stairwell (see picture below, the screen will replace the hanging picture and extend to the left). It's would be very challenging to run the cables for a TV mounted to that wall.

Glad to hear the lag is on par with the 8530, I was just reading W7000 owners thread and zombie10k was seeing 50ms, which is borderline for me. How are you finding the transition time from 3D to 2D? That seems to be the major complaint with the W7000 (although I don't expect to be switching between them that often).

As for the size, I am planning to experiment. Viewing distance is ~10 ft; so, I am afraid if I go much bigger than 84", I may be too close. I don't want to have to turn my head when gaming. I may end up in the 100"+ range, but since this is my first PJ I need to see it to make the call. What's the viewing distance of your 153"?

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post #6 of 21
11/11/12 at 5:57pm
I didn't say that its lag time is the same as the 8350 (I never measured) I just can't tell (notice) the difference between the two. The 8350 probably has less lag (measured).

I sit 15' back.

If you do go with a projector, don't worry about a screen at first. Just shine it on the wall (it will still look really good) and adjust till you get a size you like. If you end up with a smaller screen, 85" or so, go for a really low gain deep grey screen (W7000). That will help with cutting some of the brightness and the dark grey screen will help with blacks and contrast. Just a thought. (even on a 100" screen, if you can go that big, I would get a low gain grey type screen to cut down the brightness and increase contrast/blacks)

Good luck
Edited by Crabalocker - 11/12/12 at 11:56am
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post #7 of 21
11/11/12 at 7:20pm
The Panasonic AR100u is supposed to be a good gaming projector as well and it would suit the room you would be using it in perfectly with 2800 lumens of brightness. It doesn't do 3d though.
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post #8 of 21
11/11/12 at 11:44pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mizelhike View Post

So, did I miss anything?
Maybe.....
Are you aware that you cannot run 3D at 1080p60?
I run an Acer H5360 which is only 720p....but since I, like you, use mine for a majority of gaming, did not spend the big bucks for 1080p I wouldn't be able to use. IMO, 3D 1080p is not yet in its prime time.

Either sacrifice 3D, or save your pennies and get a cheapo 720p unit until a 1080p model come out which will support 3D 1080p60 rolleyes.gif
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post #9 of 21
11/12/12 at 3:51am
Quote:
Originally Posted by miahallen View Post

Maybe.....
Are you aware that you cannot run 3D at 1080p60?
I run an Acer H5360 which is only 720p....but since I, like you, use mine for a majority of gaming, did not spend the big bucks for 1080p I wouldn't be able to use. IMO, 3D 1080p is not yet in its prime time.
Either sacrifice 3D, or save your pennies and get a cheapo 720p unit until a 1080p model come out which will support 3D 1080p60 rolleyes.gif

If using a PC as your source 3D 1080p @ 60hz is possible.

The limitation is HDMI which is why Nvidia 3D Vision uses DVI-D because of the increased bandwidth full 1080p60 can be achieved. The negative is requiring a certified 3D Vision display/projector which is a limited market.

Nvidia did just add HDMI checkerboard support to there Beta 310.33 driver so 1080p60 over HDMI with Nvidia 3DTV Play is now possible. Before it required hacks to do it now it's a drop down option in the Nvidia control panel.
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post #10 of 21
11/12/12 at 5:14am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zip3kx07 View Post

If using a PC as your source 3D 1080p @ 60hz is possible.
The limitation is HDMI which is why Nvidia 3D Vision uses DVI-D because of the increased bandwidth full 1080p60 can be achieved. The negative is requiring a certified 3D Vision display/projector which is a limited market.
Nvidia did just add HDMI checkerboard support to there Beta 310.33 driver so 1080p60 over HDMI with Nvidia 3DTV Play is now possible. Before it required hacks to do it now it's a drop down option in the Nvidia control panel.

I realize its an HDMI limitation....if you would be so kind as to point us in the direction of a 3D Vision 1080p projector with DVI-D...I'll withdraw my statement (hint, ain't gonna happen).

Humm, checkerboard huh?....is there discussion about this anywhere? I'd like to know more wink.gif
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post #11 of 21
11/12/12 at 8:38am
Viewsonic Pro8200 is what you should get if you want really low input lag. Picture quality won't be as good as the BenQ, but I'd guess you likely won't notice a difference if you're only gaming.
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post #12 of 21
11/12/12 at 10:11am
I have the Benq W7000 and it works great for me for gaming. Just make sure to turn off Frame Interpolaton.
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post #13 of 21
11/12/12 at 10:28am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mizelhike View Post

So, did I miss anything?

the under $3K forum?

Sorry, couldn't resist wink.gif
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post #14 of 21
11/12/12 at 11:07am
Quote:
Originally Posted by dougri View Post

the under $3K forum?
Sorry, couldn't resist wink.gif

Aw, be nice to the new guy. But yes, OP, this should be in the sub-$3k forum.
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post #15 of 21
11/12/12 at 4:55pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zip3kx07 View Post

Nvidia did just add HDMI checkerboard support to there Beta 310.33 driver so 1080p60 over HDMI with Nvidia 3DTV Play is now possible. Before it required hacks to do it now it's a drop down option in the Nvidia control panel.
Checkerboard is still only 1/2 resolution per frame, so its really only a 12% boost in resolution over full 720p60 rolleyes.gif

I'm quite stumped....I cannot figure out why the largest screen you can play 3D @ 1080p60 is only 27"....it's quite frustrating. mad.gif
I keep hearing the arguement that the market isn't large enough, but I call BS, I think there are plenty of gamers interested in full resolution 3D gaming at larger sizes...
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post #16 of 21
11/12/12 at 5:26pm
If you are new to projectors make sure you are not affected or at least not annoyed by Rainbow-Effect. I had an Acer H9500BD here for a while and for the money it was great. Very good image quality and also good 3D-quality but the rainbow effect was killing it for me, so I returned it and am now looking into the Panasonic AE8000. There is some crosstalk but otherwise it seems to be perfect for me. Gaming in this size is great and also in 3D. Played Motorstorm in 3D and it's like a different - better - game. Killzone in 3D was also amazing but the lag made it impossible to play competitive.
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post #17 of 21
11/12/12 at 7:26pm
Thread Starter 
Awesome feedback--thanks everyone!
Quote:
Originally Posted by KUV1977 View Post

If you are new to projectors make sure you are not affected or at least not annoyed by Rainbow-Effect. I had an Acer H9500BD here for a while and for the money it was great. Very good image quality and also good 3D-quality but the rainbow effect was killing it for me, so I returned it and am now looking into the Panasonic AE8000. There is some crosstalk but otherwise it seems to be perfect for me. Gaming in this size is great and also in 3D. Played Motorstorm in 3D and it's like a different - better - game. Killzone in 3D was also amazing but the lag made it impossible to play competitive.
Good point. Quite honestly I don't have the keenest of eyes and I have never noticed the rainbow effect before, but then again I haven't spent much time with projectors. Will try to find a place to demo this weekend.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Frosteh View Post

Aw, be nice to the new guy. But yes, OP, this should be in the sub-$3k forum.
Yeah, I actually realized it right after posting, but I couldn't move it. I'll claim new guy-itis and plead ignorance...sorry!!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Frosteh View Post

Viewsonic Pro8200 is what you should get if you want really low input lag. Picture quality won't be as good as the BenQ, but I'd guess you likely won't notice a difference if you're only gaming.
Frosteh, thanks. That's a great suggestion. I don't usually get talked into *cheaper* options, but this seems like a good one. To be clear, I actually do plan to use the projector for movies and TV, but expect to do most of that on the downstairs Sony Bravia 710 and would probably just do the projector for the big movie night. Is this bright enough to handle a room with ambient light? Guess I really need to think about whether 3D is worth it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by dmoneyman2323 View Post

The Panasonic AR100u is supposed to be a good gaming projector as well and it would suit the room you would be using it in perfectly with 2800 lumens of brightness. It doesn't do 3d though.
I originally ruled this out because of lack of 3D, but I am reconsidering if 3D is really worth it. I am also starting to consider the Optoma HD33, which is on par with the price of the AR100u, but has 3D. So now I am really torn between these 3 (W7000, HD33, AR100u). And maybe even the Viewsonic Pro8200 if i decide to go even cheaper...There are just too many options!!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Crabalocker View Post

I didn't say that its lag time is the same as the 8350 (I never measured) I just can't tell (notice) the difference between the two. The 8350 probably has less lag (measured).
I sit 15' back.
If you do go with a projector, don't worry about a screen at first. Just shine it on the wall (it will still look really good) and adjust till you get a size you like. If you end up with a smaller screen, 85" or so, go for a really low gain deep grey screen (W7000). That will help with cutting some of the brightness and the dark grey screen will help with blacks and contrast. Just a thought. (even on a 100" screen, if you can go that big, I would get a low gain grey type screen to cut down the brightness and increase contrast/blacks)
Good luck
Is there a chance that the W7000 could be too bright for an 11' throw?

Thanks everybody for the input!!
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post #18 of 21
11/12/12 at 9:39pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mizelhike View Post

Awesome feedback--thanks everyone!
Good point. Quite honestly I don't have the keenest of eyes and I have never noticed the rainbow effect before, but then again I haven't spent much time with projectors. Will try to find a place to demo this weekend.
Yeah, I actually realized it right after posting, but I couldn't move it. I'll claim new guy-itis and plead ignorance...sorry!!
Frosteh, thanks. That's a great suggestion. I don't usually get talked into *cheaper* options, but this seems like a good one. To be clear, I actually do plan to use the projector for movies and TV, but expect to do most of that on the downstairs Sony Bravia 710 and would probably just do the projector for the big movie night. Is this bright enough to handle a room with ambient light? Guess I really need to think about whether 3D is worth it.
I originally ruled this out because of lack of 3D, but I am reconsidering if 3D is really worth it. I am also starting to consider the Optoma HD33, which is on par with the price of the AR100u, but has 3D. So now I am really torn between these 3 (W7000, HD33, AR100u). And maybe even the Viewsonic Pro8200 if i decide to go even cheaper...There are just too many options!!
Is there a chance that the W7000 could be too bright for an 11' throw?
Thanks everybody for the input!!

I use an Optoma GT720 the majority of the time for my gaming. It's cheap and short throw with good speakers. I like to use it because no one head is every in the way. Plus, with friends over, everyone is moving around. I also use it outside in my 220in screen in the backyard at night. It's very portable and bright.

I use my Benq W7000 with my 120in HP screen with a Darbee. It's at close to max gain, so I'm getting around 80-90ftL, which brings games to life. Plus, it makes 3D look bright and immersive. It always seem as if the screen is much bigger with 3D.

I liked how gaming looked on my JVC RS55, the eshift gave it a nice look, can't wait to see how the RS48 looks with the new and improved eshift. Higher resolution is always wanted IMO
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post #19 of 21
11/19/12 at 4:43pm
The pro8200 is one if the brightest projectors on the market. It will definitely be bright enough for anything with ambient light. Pair it with a grey screen, maybe an N6 or N7, and you'll have very good black levels and contrast in all conditions. Not that the Pro8200 is the best out there, but at $500-$600 you can't go wrong with just trying it. If you don't like it you can always return it and get something else, provided you don't put too many hours on the bulb. I have an older JVC but I was surprised at how good the viewsonic is. If youre new to projectors, I'd get this anyway since its a small investment to see if a projector is something you'll actually like for gaming. I personally hate gaming on projectors since its irritating to have to actually look around the screen when I need an in game stat or to look for baddies to kill.
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post #20 of 21
11/19/12 at 7:14pm
Thread Starter 
Thanks frosteh, but I just ordered the W7000 (actually re-ordered once I found out east coast TVS does not include warranty and amazon is cheaper when you consider the warranty). I decided to just go for 3D. Now I just wait a week for delivery...biggrin.gif
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post #21 of 21
11/20/12 at 11:07am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mizelhike View Post

Thanks frosteh, but I just ordered the W7000 (actually re-ordered once I found out east coast TVS does not include warranty and amazon is cheaper when you consider the warranty). I decided to just go for 3D. Now I just wait a week for delivery...biggrin.gif

You'll love it. I saw one in a demo room and it's a great projector. Just remember to turn off FI and the iris during gaming or your lag will be ridiculous. Contrast will suffer a bit but it would get annoying during games anyway. Also, check to see if you have the most recent firmware version before using it. If it's not recent (v1.03 I believe), then either send it back and request a newer one or call up BenQ and have them update it for you.
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