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Official OPPO BDP-105 Owner's Thread - Page 11

post #301 of 10257
Quote:
Originally Posted by audiofan1 View Post

I for one hope it is an improvement and not an over cooked goose or a dog with a sweater! I'm glad Oppo listens to there customers but there is a point at which one must decide the important fundamentals. I want the 105 to exceed the 95 in pure raw performance first but from what I understand thus far they added something and killed the reference benchmark performance of the 95 to make the new feature work, I call that compensation and I hope the end result is more than a work around. I just don't want it to come down to choosing features over performance in that case the 95 will stay. Non the less this will be fun and I'm looking forward to the auditioning of the 105 as I'm willing to put my money on Oppo for one upping themselves.smile.gif

Well Oppo has already indicated that while there were some design considerations; overall performance was not sacrificed. Some have already reported subjective improvement.

I know you have already commented about the quad stacking in the BDP-95 and the lack of it in the BDP-105, but I'm willing to bet that Oppo accomplished their goal of implementing new features while maintaining the audio quality of the BDP-95. Also, these design decisions may have actually raised a new benchmark in the BDP-105. I think anyone really interested in the BDP-105 and is a present owner of the BDP-95 should audition the BDP-105 (which you have indicated you will) and then offer an opinion as opposed to challenging some of those posters who have auditioned both and are currently favoring the BDP-105.smile.gif
post #302 of 10257
Quote:
Originally Posted by audiofan1 View Post

..... they added something and killed the reference benchmark performance of the 95 to make the new feature work, I call that compensation........
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Pariseau View Post

You can't know that yet, right? This is just a fear at this point? I think I'm spotting comparative reviews and objective tests pretty much in real time as they come out, and I've seen nothing so far that would raise this level of concern.
Time will tell!
--Bob

+1 Bob. There really is no reason to speculate at this point!smile.gif
post #303 of 10257
Quote:
Originally Posted by audiofan1 View Post

Still to early to tell in my book and I for one need more elaboration "you know, audiophile lingo" okay that may have rhymed a little but is it warm, lean ,recessed, forward, neutral etc. etc. biggrin.gif

Ah! You want the adjectives.smile.gif I think most of the adjectives are subjective also.smile.gif Well my comments are going to bore you to death.biggrin.gif I know you will make the best decision for your setup.smile.gif
post #304 of 10257
I'm using the 105 without a receiver/processor.

I have three identical active speakers for LF, RF, C (ATC SCM10), and a 4-channel power amp with an input gain dial powering the 4 passive surround speakers, and a powered sub (ATC C2).

All speaker set to small, cross over at 80hz.

Using the Oppo's test tones in the Speaker Config screen i first match the surrounds using the gain dial on the power amp.

The three speakers across the front are the same so no adjustments needed.

So I'm at 0db trims in the Oppo for all speakers except the sub.

In order to match SPL for the sub (using Radio Shack digital SPL meter, slow, c-weighting) I have to max the Level knob on the sub and max the trim in the Oppo (+10db) Speaker Setup screen.

Even then I am about 1-2 db shy of a match.

I'm pretty sure bass-man Bob said it was ideal to be a few db high on the sub level?

So that means I'm off by almost 5db.

I also recall you (Bob) menitoned that the +10db would have to be applied externally?

So I'm pretty sure I've either done this wrong, won't be able to do it or both.

I do have plans to get an analog preamp back into the mix (Parasound P7) - mainly to add my turntable back into the mix. But I'm seeing now that that pre-amps's +10db trims might be necessary.

Thanks for any further advice.
Edited by emylly - 11/23/12 at 6:56am
post #305 of 10257
Quote:
Originally Posted by emylly View Post

I'm using the 105 without a receiver/processor.
I have three identical active speakers for LF, RF, C (ATC SCM10), and a 4-channel power amp with an input gain dial powering the 4 passive surround speakers, and a powered sub (ATC C2).
All speaker set to small, cross over at 80hz.
Using the Oppo's test tones in the Speaker Config screen i first match the surrounds using the gain dial on the power amp.
The three speakers across the front are the same so no adjustments needed.
So I'm at 0db trims in the Oppo for all speakers except the sub.
In order to match SPL for the sub (using Radio Shack digital SPL meter, slow, c-weighting) I have to max the Level knob on the sub and max the trim in the Oppo (+10db) Speaker Setup screen.
Even then I am about 1-2 db shy of a match.
I'm pretty sure bass-man Bob said it was ideal to be a few db high on the sub level?
So that means I'm off by almost 5db.
I also recall you (Bob) menitoned that the +10db would have to be applied externally?
So I'm pretty sure I've either done this wrong, won't be able to do it or both.
I do have plans to get an analog preamp back into the mix (Parasound P7) - mainly to add my turntable back into the mix. But I'm seeing now that that pre-amps's +10db trims might be necessary.
Thanks for any further advice.

Is there any reason you don't turn down all the other speakers to achieve the match or +3dbs for the subwoofer?
post #306 of 10257
Quote:
Originally Posted by JimP View Post

Is there any reason you don't turn down all the other speakers to achieve the match or +3dbs for the subwoofer?

True - that would match levels better in my current config but I guess my question was more about what I can/should do to not have to max out my sub's gain - both on the sub and in the Oppo speaker setup.

I'm guessing in my case I can't avoid it unless I get a pre-amp or receiver back into the mix.

The processor I was using before (Arcam AVP700) did have the +10db gain added to MCH input.

The pre-amp I'd like to start using instead does have a +10db trim for the sub as well.

Maybe I've answered my own question - but maybe there's something I haven't considered.
post #307 of 10257
Quote:
Originally Posted by John Schlarb View Post

Hmm, I think I've answered my own question. For my 48-year-old ears, I don't think I'll be able to tell the difference - particularly with my speaker and room setup. I've decided to get the BDP-103, and invest the difference in more SACDs. My golden-ear days are over, I think.

John,

I am coming to the same conclusion -- I've been running an 83SE -- I like the analog sound much better but in MCH the digital soundstage is much more satisfying because it takes advantage of the Denon AVRs Audessy 32 equalization, where the analog does not. I use the SE for 2.1 listening. I'd love to get the 105, but the 103 fits the budget better. Still might audition the 105 just to settle the matter.
post #308 of 10257
Quote:
Originally Posted by sac8d4 View Post

Since, the BDP-95 and BDP-105 are made by OPPO, there are a lot more sonic similarities with the machines than are there sonic differences, especially if you were comparing the sound qualities of various other players from different companies.

That is my experience also. Invariably new models from the same company generally have a very similar signature sound as their predecessors unless the new model has a major change to the circuit, power supply design or technology breakthrough. Based on my understanding the 105 v the 95 is more of a feature upgrade than any major circuit redesign or major advancement in chip technology, although I understand the power supply has been upgraded. Given this scenario, in theory the sound should be very similar.

Having said that and for whatever reason, my initial impression of the 105 is much more favorable than my initial impression of the 95.

For me personally the feature upgrade alone is worth it. The reason I returned the 95 after 2 weeks was the lack of features (main issue was lack of digital and USB inputs). If you use a HTPC and/or digital cable everything can now be passed through the Oppo. All of these features have now been included making the Oppo the leader in universal players and an incredible bargain in my opinion.
Edited by djkiwi - 11/23/12 at 10:22am
post #309 of 10257
Quote:
Originally Posted by JonStatt View Post

I have a high-end system including Kef reference 4.2 speakers and have both the 95 and 105 connected and they do not sound exactly the same. I already mentioned In an earlier post and 2 other posters with a 95 agreed that the 105 has a more defined and detailed treble. Bass may be marginally tighter as well but it was the high end that was most apparent. I would say the 105 is 15% better....so not huge but more than the other poster suggested in my humble opinion.
i agree with you it is better
post #310 of 10257
Quote:
Originally Posted by Friendly Fire View Post

John,
I am coming to the same conclusion -- I've been running an 83SE -- I like the analog sound much better but in MCH the digital soundstage is much more satisfying because it takes advantage of the Denon AVRs Audessy 32 equalization, where the analog does not. I use the SE for 2.1 listening. I'd love to get the 105, but the 103 fits the budget better. Still might audition the 105 just to settle the matter.

I did pull the trigger and am auditioning both, the 105 is clearly a step up in dynamics and bottom end. There isn't even a need for me to A/B the units, it is really apparent very quickly. However, I am still finding it hard to separate with my outboard DAC...both Oppo models are great transports.
post #311 of 10257
Is there a difference in sound when you decode in the player then output hdmi or 7.1 analog? If decoding takes place in the player can u still take advantage of the pumped up audio section thru hdmi output?
Edited by kemiza - 11/23/12 at 10:04am
post #312 of 10257
Quote:
Originally Posted by kemiza View Post

Is there a difference in sound when you decode in the player then output hdmi or 7.1 analog?

Not for HDMI or optical/coax, no.

-Bill
post #313 of 10257
Originally Posted by djkiwi [/B]

If people can't notice the difference between the BDP 105 and the Panasonic 500 then two things are going on:
1. Their sensory perceptions are incapable of differentiation.
This isn't meant as an insult. .
2. Their system is incapable of differentiation.

Originally Posted by thorix[/B]
b) according to my experience there is in most cases a common understanding what sounds good and natural, exccluding 2 specific types of people. The first category are those who do not care, which are more and more folks who grew up with mp3.
Happy Thanksgiving!
I enjoy learning from this forum, and appreciate the hard work and knowledge of our mentors here, which has helped me be prepared for my new toy. which HAS arrived. I also agree with much of what both gentlemen above shared-as opinions. On top of what they stated is the likelihood that many users out here do not have signal interconnect and speaker cables good enough to pass the signal well enough intact to be fully appreciated--or subjectively compared.
I'll offer my comparative opinion from a different direction, for those who have not had a 95, and wonder if the 105 is worth the price and trouble. I received mine just in time for being off for 5 days so I will have time to warm it up properly, and exercise all the functions I have been dying to try out. No secrets here--I am stoked, and early on, after my first listen to redbook CDs, favorite SACDs and a few BRD movies, to me it is wonderful! I LOVE the 105. I will tell you why.
The new 105 so far, clearly sounds more dynamic, powerful, cleaner, warm (full--NOT lean), smooth, and has deeper and cleaner bass than anything I have heard in my dedicated theater room. I could not be happier with its purchase, with the caveat I have never owned a player over $1200. As an old electronics designer, I also know what literal "burning in" means, and believe it is not the same as the improvements gained from letting a system operate over time, with the cumulative effects of the capacitors forming, and other nuance-critical components becoming more stable with use. You do not have to believe that, but like better wire insulation, rotation, and metallurgy, it will make a difference in the sound. And I look forward to the additional improvements.
I did not have the luxury of having a 95 to compare my new 105 to, but have been listening to very good (but not well heeled) stereo for a very long time. I started young on tubes, then McIntosh, Marantz, PS Audio, and still enjoy turntable analog. After 25-30 years of reading Absolute Sound and Stereophile, I think I can hear, and know what sounds good to me, in MY system. which is important, and is totally subjective. I use primarily Audioquest (with batteries) interconnectl cables for my more critical inputs, and Kimber Heroes on the lessor inputs like surround and VCRs. I use Audioquest Rocket 88 Bi-wiring to the Maggie 1.6 QRs and Transparent for the others. I wanted the new 105 so I can get away from the additional electronics--pre-pro, external DACs, and more cables, etc, which all affect the sound of whatever comes out of the OPPO. Any and all electronics AND wire affects the signal, just depends on how, and how much. I will find out this weekend how much my prepro affects it by going around it directly to the power amp. My perspective includes my older NAD 7ch T163 Tuner pre-pro, and matching NAD 7ch T973 power amp, into pairs of Magnapan front MG1.6QRs, surround MG MC1s, rear surround MG 12QRs, and center MG CC3, all run full range. Plus a Velodyne 10" SW is set for roll off at 60 Hz. The flat screen is a Smart 60" Samsung 6100. My amplification is older but sounds clean and powerful at my budget level. My old Sony BDP NS999ES was about equal, and different, but not better than the Oppo 83, and far better than my older Denon. I have used most of the digital inputs thru a DacMagic, and for computer USB output FLAC and WAV, both at home and RV travel. I purchased the 105 so I can feed all my digital including Direct TV thru it and controlling the volume to the power amp. The room does not require a lot of bass control so I do not need that complication.
BTW, one other gain from deleting a 7.1 ch pre-pro is cutting the price and signal loss of 8 more good cable interconnects, which is considerable, easily more than the cost of the 105.
My one unknown is how to deal with my turntable phono preamp, as I do not think the concept of ADDA is cool for perfectly good HQ analog if I give up the analog part of the pre-pro?
Any suggestions other than living with the pre-pro?
Astronomertoo
post #314 of 10257
I have a stereo setup with the 105 directly driving the power amp via the XLR dedicated stereo outs. I have a powered sub-woofer that I can add to the equation. Ideally, for two channel audio listening would like to have "normal" stereo listening, but with multi-channel (DVD, Blu-ray playback) listening would like to have the sub-woofer in play. Is there any way to do this automagically? Or do I have to change the downmix and sub-woofer on/off status each time?

Thanks.

Chris
post #315 of 10257
Quote:
Originally Posted by bobcfla View Post

My one unknown is how to deal with my turntable phono preamp, as I do not think the concept of ADDA is cool for perfectly good HQ analog if I give up the analog part of the pre-pro?
Any suggestions other than living with the pre-pro?
Astronomertoo

If you are looking for a way to swich in/out your phono preamp to your mains, the Placette line stage which is a passive volume control/3 input switch would do you well. Try running your Oppo directly to your amps and you should hear transparency like never before...removing the preamp and cables is significant. If you then insert a Placette inline with the mains you are only adding one extra cable (and the vishay s102 resisitor in the placette) this will give you 3 input switch capability without any loss in detail due to active componets, power supplies etc...

Also thank your for you indepth review....I also have the Maggie 1.6qr (bi-amped) and accurried the bdp-95 last year. The one thing that was lacking for me with the 95 was the width and depth of the soundstage...clearly audible with the maggies when compared to my EAD series III DAC which is has more depth and is just more musical. I attribute the difference with the 95 to its power supply and was excited to hear that there had been some redesign for the 105...unfortunately I am not thrilled with the idea of changing the DAC stacking setup...seems like a no gain tradeoff...but I will have to audition the 105 to hear for myself.
post #316 of 10257
Quote:
Originally Posted by darkphader View Post

I have a stereo setup with the 105 directly driving the power amp via the XLR dedicated stereo outs. I have a powered sub-woofer that I can add to the equation. Ideally, for two channel audio listening would like to have "normal" stereo listening, but with multi-channel (DVD, Blu-ray playback) listening would like to have the sub-woofer in play. Is there any way to do this automagically? Or do I have to change the downmix and sub-woofer on/off status each time?
Thanks.
Chris

As long as the FL-FR speakers are set as "large" you shouldn't need to change anything for stereo vs M-ch listening. If you want bass steering from FL-FR channels while m-ch listening, you need to change them to "small".
post #317 of 10257
Quote:
Originally Posted by Styln View Post

Spent some time today playing with DLNA. Overall it works... but can be problematic. The best program I've found for Android is one I purchased about a year ago called BubbleUPnP (see pics). Overall, this is the best all-around UPnP server, player, control point I found after dismissing more than a few. I also use it as a DLNA server at work to listen to music on my BMP. All round a good performer. The pics above give you an idea what to expect using it to control the BDP-105.
I also tryed the Linn Kinsky controller, but just don't like the rooms orientation as I'm only listening in one room. YMMV.
I'm going to refrain from a "how does it sound" review right now as I only did casual listening while focusing on remote controlling the BDP-105. Mostly I listened through my so-so headphones: Grado SR80s and AKG S550s. As you can imagine, there was no problem driving these phones as they are designed for portable listening.
So, DLNA control, one of my top must haves works, but does have a serious flaw with the UMS server. The issue is a song in the play list stops playing abruptly. By stops playing, I mean that the Oppo counter is still counting, the controller counter is still counting, but there is silence frown.gif The counters continues, and appears to go to the next song, but more nothing is played. If I tap on the next song in the play list, it will play for another 20 minutes or so before it happens again. Seems to happen near the end of a song, so probably related to the change to the next song.
The Oppo is connected to the same gigEth wired network as my BDP-83SE, which has never failed to play a song all the way through. The NAS and network are loafing. Am trying my other server, Asset UPnP to see if there is a compatibility issue. Been playing for about 45 minutes so far with no issues smile.gif On the plus side, the BDP-105 plays many, many more file types and containers than the 83se. On the down-side, I can no longer even listen to my blue-ray or dvd concert discs as I've got an old LED TV with a composite and a D-Sub connection. Now I can listen to the ones I've ripped to disc, but still no video at all.
Styln

Well, today is a good day to solve the no HDCP/BDP-105 requirement problem... and I did.

http://www.samsung.com/us/computer/monitors/LS24CLLSBZ/ZA

Not going to claim any great knowledge of video, but I will vouch that via a HDMI/DVI cable it will display video content from the BDP-105.

This may shock some people, but having been one of the first BDP-83, 83SE, and 105 owners, last night was the fist time I have seen these decks display other than composite video! I've had these decks in an audio only system and composite is fine for that. But for our Thanksgiving dinner gathering, I moved the 83SE into the living room where it's connected to a 5" 1080p Samsung display. I play several blu-ray concert videos and really enjoyed the video. Now both the display and the audio system in the living room are pedestrian (that's right - stocked with previous Black Fridy/Cyber Monday deals!). So while I really enjoyed the picture, it was my turn to be shocked at how ordinary by venerable 83SE sounded. It sounded so meh! Guess this is just proof positive the system really matters.

So getting systems sorted out over the holiday. The BDP-105 has been playing constantly since the 15th. Just listening while writing this up I'm happy with what I hear: wide sound stage with great imaging. Everything I expect to hear is there smile.gif Don't have much time today, but looking forward to spending a few hours with the new deck tomorrow tomorrow smile.gif

Happy Thanksgiving folks,

Styln

PS Opps, in my original post those AKGs are K550s not S550s
post #318 of 10257
Quote:
Originally Posted by wuwhere View Post

From my interpretation of that 5% improvement, the 105 is 5% leaner than than the 95?

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Pariseau View Post


Wait. Is that good or bad? biggrin.gif
I honestly don't know how folks can characterize this stuff much beyond "liking" it better or not, but then there's a whole vocabulary of audiophile criticism out there which completely mystifies me.
--Bob (lifting the veil another 5%) P.

http://www.stereophile.com/content/sounds-audio-glossary-glossary

post #319 of 10257
Quote:
Originally Posted by audiofan1 View Post


I for one hope it is an improvement and not an over cooked goose or a dog with a sweater! I'm glad Oppo listens to there customers but there is a point at which one must decide the important fundamentals. I want the 105 to exceed the 95 in pure raw performance first but from what I understand thus far they added something and killed the reference benchmark performance of the 95 to make the new feature work, I call that compensation and I hope the end result is more than a work around. I just don't want it to come down to choosing features over performance in that case the 95 will stay. Non the less this will be fun and I'm looking forward to the auditioning of the 105 as I'm willing to put my money on Oppo for one upping themselves.smile.gif

 

What performance feature was 'killed' in the reference 95 to make the 105 work, if i may ask?

post #320 of 10257
Quote:
Originally Posted by rdgrimes View Post

As long as the FL-FR speakers are set as "large" you shouldn't need to change anything for stereo vs M-ch listening. If you want bass steering from FL-FR channels while m-ch listening, you need to change them to "small".

My worry was that the bass below the crossover frequency would end up in both the main speakers as well as the sub-woofer during m-ch if I leave the speakers set to "large". Is this not so?
post #321 of 10257
Quote:
Originally Posted by darkphader View Post

My worry was that the bass below the crossover frequency would end up in both the main speakers as well as the sub-woofer during m-ch if I leave the speakers set to "large". Is this not so?

The subwoofer channel only carries the LFE channel plus re-directed LF from channels set as "small".
post #322 of 10257
Quote:
Originally Posted by karmakuma View Post


My last input just a few posts above was actually meant as a reply to your post...
Marco

Marco ...yes thanks. Your post was very informative and helpful. I assume you listened to their premium service at 320Kbps? I need to learn more about the Spotify music service.


Edited by dmusoke - 11/23/12 at 12:08pm
post #323 of 10257
Hello all,

I have also the Audeze LCD-2 headphone and I would like to know if the amp has enough power to drive them ? From what I read it's borderline.

Thank you
post #324 of 10257
Quote:
Originally Posted by zoomin View Post


http://mog.com - Not lossless but pretty good quality stream AND the ability to play one song or an entire album of your choosing when you want, however many times you want - that's the killer part for me.

Thanks zoomin ...it seems to have the same bit-rate at Spotify (320Kbps) but for free smile.gif! Paid subscriptions eliminate commercials(which don't bother me much btw) and provide unlimited song play and downloads. Cool!

I wish Oppo could really help us out here, PLEASE Oppo???

post #325 of 10257
Quote:
Originally Posted by dmusoke View Post

Marco ...yes thanks. Your post was very informative and helpful. I assume you listened to their premium service at 320Kbps? I need to learn more about the Spotify music service.

Yepp, 320kbps

Cheers Marco
post #326 of 10257
Quote:
Originally Posted by bakerwi View Post

Well Oppo has already indicated that while there were some design considerations; overall performance was not sacrificed. Some have already reported subjective improvement.
I know you have already commented about the quad stacking in the BDP-95 and the lack of it in the BDP-105, but I'm willing to bet that Oppo accomplished their goal of implementing new features while maintaining the audio quality of the BDP-95. Also, these design decisions may have actually raised a new benchmark in the BDP-105. I think anyone really interested in the BDP-105 and is a present owner of the BDP-95 should audition the BDP-105 (which you have indicated you will) and then offer an opinion as opposed to challenging some of those posters who have auditioned both and are currently favoring the BDP-105.smile.gif

I don't recall challenging anything or anyone, except my own expectations of the 105 and was very clear to state I would be trying one to see for myself, sorry if anyone got offended:)
post #327 of 10257
One thing that would turn this device from an obvious killer unit into an uberkiller would be the integration of a proper Apple Airplay receiver unit ( audio + video)... without the crappy 48khz upsampling crippling done with the apple-tv and the like... and this all in one device?!?!? weeeha wink.gif

Cheers Marco
post #328 of 10257
Dmusoke This concern came from the initial "Secrets review" of why Oppo choose to unstack the dac's( which was a part of the 95's reference point and part of its benchmark performance). I really hope its something I don't miss on the 105 , but as I have previously stated " I have full confidence in the Oppo team" which was earned through there excellent 95:)
Edited by audiofan1 - 11/23/12 at 2:05pm
post #329 of 10257
Quote:
Originally Posted by rdgrimes View Post

The subwoofer channel only carries the LFE channel plus re-directed LF from channels set as "small".

So when I leave the speakers set to "large" and the dedicated stereo outputs downmix set to "FL/FR" the LFE goes only to the sub-woofer if/when available and not to the main speakers, therefore no bass doubling. The crossover frequency would therefore have no effect in this case. Stereo material (without LFE) is heard the same as it would be if the downmix was set to "Stereo". And the headphone out is always a full "Stereo" downmix regardless of these settings.

Is this correct so far?

I'm thinking this would only work if the actual audio appearing in in the dedicated stereo outputs is dependent on the settings in the audio processing section for the multi-channel outputs which would need to be "LT/RT" or the setting of the dedicated stereo outputs downmix set to "FL/FR" would not have the surround information mixed in. Which is where my confusion comes in as in the manual there is a clearly highlighted note that states:

NOTE
Speaker Configuration applies to the multi-channel analog audio outputs only. All digital
(bitstream and LPCM) outputs are unaffected by these settings.


The note seems to imply that the settings in that section have no affect on the dedicated stereo outputs.
post #330 of 10257
So far I am thrilled with the 105. Granted I am coming from a Pioneer BDP-320 player and an Arcam CD-73T but even the wife said "that sounds so much better" while watching The Lorax.

My only issue so far is using the network to view my Plex Media Server on my iMac is rather clunky. Granted the wireless connection doesn't help but clicking through the menus is painful and slow. I will try repositioning the wireless router though to see if that helps fix this.

Aditionally, it would be nice to have either Spotify or MOG. Any advice on how to get that to work without using a direct computer connection through the USB input? Ideally I want a better interface than the Oppo Pandora style interface so iPad support would be good. Also, my DVR uses the HDMI in so really I just want something that connects through the USB DAC or Coax inputs. Sonos?
Edited by BrianNYC - 11/23/12 at 2:08pm
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