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Official OPPO BDP-105 Owner's Thread - Page 227

post #6781 of 10176
Quote:
Originally Posted by rhale64L7 View Post

Well fellow avsers I will not be selling the Foundation. I asked my wife to listen and I switched. She is just laying on the love seat. I switched to the Foundation and she said thats the new one isnt it. I said yes. The bass is clearly more defined and it is smooth on the Foundation. I made sure eq was off. And no it is not a double blind abx test. Dont have the equipment or time or money. Not trying to be a smartbutt. Just people asked so I did it. Not trying to derail thread at all either. Now back on topic. How to get dsd out either through hdmi or xlr

Glad you did the test. Krell makes some nice stuff, and it appears the Krell's DAC is better than the Oppo's. Of course, everything adds some coloration (not necessarily a bad thing), and the Krell could just be better suited to your amps and speakers. In this case, I think the Oppo 103 will suit your needs just fine (and you save a few bucks).

Personally, I've done the DSD vs. PCM test and I can't hear a difference between the two. Your ears/system may say otherwise. When passing the signal from your Oppo to your Krell via HDMI, what is your Krell telling you about the signal (PCM or DSD)?

When passing the signal via XLR, the Oppo should read DSD. I know you said both DSD and PCM light up. I'm not at home, so I can't do a test, but as I recall, my Oppo just reads DSD when I'm using it's analog outputs.
post #6782 of 10176
Hey guys. Not sure if an Oppo (this model in particular) is the right fit for me, so I'd thought I'd try to get a couple of questions answered. At this point I actually don't have a home theater system to speak of, but soon plan on getting it started once I get an idea of what I need. These are the components I had in mind, and I'm not sure where the 105 would fit into it:

Speakers: GoldenEar SuperCinema 50 System w/Force Field 4 sub
Receiver: Marantz SR7008
Media Servers: Synology DS1513+, Sonos Connect, HTPC

I should probably state that I know little to nothing about a/v hardware and plan on having someone set everything up. With that said, my concern with the Oppo's integration into all this is taking advantage its a/v processors. In regards to video, how can I get the player to process my bluray rips from my NAS server? If possible, through what connections? Same question for my audio files. What about the speakers? Would they need to hooked up directly to the player in order to take advantage of the reference DAC, or could they be connected to the receiver?

I realize these questions are pretty elementary, but any help would be appreciated.
post #6783 of 10176
Yes I dont know that is why I was trying it out and asking questions. I know the chipset does support dsd but do no time know for sure if it is implemented here. I dont have the setting on auto I have it on bit stream. Should I put the setting on auto then? Still shouldn't the oppo if is is playing dsd say that on the oppo screen and not pcm? Or am I wrong on this?

I guess I will have to call Krell next week to find out if it supports dsd.
post #6784 of 10176
Quote:
Originally Posted by rhale64L7 View Post


I guess I will have to call Krell next week to find out if it supports dsd.

I just did a little Internet research on the Krell Foundation. It does NOT support DSD. So the Oppo is recognizing this and turning the signal into PCM via HDMI.
post #6785 of 10176
Quote:
Originally Posted by rhale64L7 View Post

?..Still shouldn't the oppo if is is playing dsd say that on the oppo screen and not pcm? Or am I wrong on this?

I guess I will have to call Krell next week to find out if it supports dsd.
The Oppo is sending pcm encoded audio streams to your Krell. That's why it says "PCM" on the front panel. If "pcm" is not lit up and you're playing an sacd, then a dsd stream is being sent out hdmi2.....and the "only" way that's going to happen is:
1. Your "sacd output" setting is set to "dsd" .
2. After your Oppo and your Krell do an hdmi handshake, your Krell will tell the Oppo if it is capable of receiving a dsd stream. If your Krell can't do it, then your Oppo will send out a PCM stream instead...hence your "pcm" indicator is on.

As HowardV has told you, your Foundation doesn't currently support dsd over hdmi. The question I'm wondering is, if the Oppo outputs a pcm stream from an sacd, what is the bitrate and sampling frequency of that stream?? Is it reading/sending the cd layer of the sacd(16-bit, 44kHz)? Or does it convert the dsd audio off the disk to 24-bit/192kHz pcm?? I'm thinking the Oppo may convert to the highest pcm format that your receiving audio source(i.e. your Krell) is compatible with (which was determined during the handshake)??
Edited by DanF8500 - 8/16/13 at 11:11pm
post #6786 of 10176
Quote:
Originally Posted by DanF8500 View Post

The question I'm wondering is, if the Oppo outputs a pcm stream from an sacd, what is the bitrate and sampling frequency of that stream?? Is it reading/sending the cd layer of the sacd(16-bit, 44kHz)? Or does it convert the dsd audio off the disk to 24-bit/192kHz pcm?? I'm thinking the Oppo may convert to the highest pcm format that your receiving audio source(i.e. your Krell) is compatible with...??
The Oppo gives out the PCM stream via HDMI Out 2 in 88,2kHz/24bit.
post #6787 of 10176
Yes that would be interesting. What pcm rate am I getting then?

Also if the chipset supports dsd why would they take that out? Can they add that support with a firmware update? I suppose so. It sounds awesome the way it is but could it sound better.

Also can you get 7.1 out of 5.1 if you set in your processor surround+back if it is dts master audio? I thought I was earlier but didnt like the eq settings so reset everything to factory settings. I then changed the others back to what I wanted. I get all 7.1 with the intro just not the actual movie. This is Transformers 1. I was just trying out the first helicopter scene to check settings. That is my reference mayhem scene. I was messing with the oppo settings also. Could I have changed a setting there maybe? I wouldn't think any of those settings would matter for Hdmi.
post #6788 of 10176
I am getting 7.1 out of a 5.1 signal on the Lucky One blue ray. Just checked.
post #6789 of 10176
i keep seeing u can run this as a pre av. but every review they run it threw a pre av havnt seen one that didnt. so my question is can it be run like for example oppo bdp-105 to xpa-2 to philharmonic 3zzzz. would that work? and does anyone know any reviews that just played the oppo as a pre-pro? my delima is i have a amp , speakers and been looking to hook them up to somthing and ran into this site. this looks like a space saver but i dont know if it would work alone or if i need a pre pro. im so confussed lol help i want to here my speakers.lol
post #6790 of 10176
Quote:
Originally Posted by zask2 View Post

i keep seeing u can run this as a pre av. but every review they run it threw a pre av havnt seen one that didnt. so my question is can it be run like for example oppo bdp-105 to xpa-2 to philharmonic 3zzzz. would that work? and does anyone know any reviews that just played the oppo as a pre-pro? my delima is i have a amp , speakers and been looking to hook them up to somthing and ran into this site. this looks like a space saver but i dont know if it would work alone or if i need a pre pro. im so confussed lol help i want to here my speakers.lol

Don't need no stinkin AVR/PRE/PRO.

I run my 105 directly to my amp and it sounds great. Just all depends if you want room correction and other fancy AVR options.

In the Speaker Configuration, make sure to get the distances correct and set the Speaker Trim to your desired setting. Best way to do that is get an SPL meter.
post #6791 of 10176
tyvm! ok this is my first venture into this hobie so if i ack like i dont know somthing it is cuz i dont. i started this venture out by buying my amp xpa-2 then my philharmonic 3z then my tv oh yea my tv lmao really thats why im doing all this. so when you say set my speakers corection and distance is that explained in a manual or on the oppo? but the oppo is it ! just ordered it so ill have more question and help . tyvm in advance
post #6792 of 10176
Quote:
Originally Posted by zask2 View Post

tyvm! ok this is my first venture into this hobie so if i ack like i dont know somthing it is cuz i dont. i started this venture out by buying my amp xpa-2 then my philharmonic 3z then my tv oh yea my tv lmao really thats why im doing all this. so when you say set my speakers corection and distance is that explained in a manual or on the oppo? but the oppo is it ! just ordered it so ill have more question and help . tyvm in advance

It is outlined in the Operator's Manual for Speaker Configuration. Here's some reading you can do until it arrives:

http://oppodigital.com/blu-ray-bdp-105/blu-ray-BDP-105-Support.aspx
post #6793 of 10176
Quote:
Originally Posted by HowardV View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by rhale64L7 View Post

Well fellow avsers I will not be selling the Foundation. I asked my wife to listen and I switched. She is just laying on the love seat. I switched to the Foundation and she said thats the new one isnt it. I said yes. The bass is clearly more defined and it is smooth on the Foundation. I made sure eq was off. And no it is not a double blind abx test. Dont have the equipment or time or money. Not trying to be a smartbutt. Just people asked so I did it. Not trying to derail thread at all either. Now back on topic. How to get dsd out either through hdmi or xlr

Glad you did the test. Krell makes some nice stuff, and it appears the Krell's DAC is better than the Oppo's. Of course, everything adds some coloration (not necessarily a bad thing), and the Krell could just be better suited to your amps and speakers. In this case, I think the Oppo 103 will suit your needs just fine (and you save a few bucks).

Personally, I've done the DSD vs. PCM test and I can't hear a difference between the two. Your ears/system may say otherwise. When passing the signal from your Oppo to your Krell via HDMI, what is your Krell telling you about the signal (PCM or DSD)?

When passing the signal via XLR, the Oppo should read DSD. I know you said both DSD and PCM light up. I'm not at home, so I can't do a test, but as I recall, my Oppo just reads DSD when I'm using it's analog outputs.

Well howard when I pass the dsd signal either way the oppo is saying pcm. The krell is also stating pcm. And on the Foundation not accepting dsd I know of only one person who stated that. And he stated it because of the cirrus logic chipset that is used. In the brief explanation of the chipset on cirrus logics website it indeed doesnt mention dsd support anywhere. But I did more investigating because the same chipset is in the Cary cinema 11a and 12 and the Cary does support dsd. So I downloaded the pdf of the chipset and low and behold at the very bottom it states it supports full 5.1 dsd. So is my oppo sending pcm only or is it sending dsd that is the question now I guess. I have no dsd indicator light come on in the oppo it is always saying pcm. This is whether going out xlr or through hdmi.

Sent from my SCH-I545 using Tapatalk 2
post #6794 of 10176
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lv99 Slacker View Post

Hey guys. Not sure if an Oppo (this model in particular) is the right fit for me, so I'd thought I'd try to get a couple of questions answered. At this point I actually don't have a home theater system to speak of, but soon plan on getting it started once I get an idea of what I need. These are the components I had in mind, and I'm not sure where the 105 would fit into it:

Speakers: GoldenEar SuperCinema 50 System w/Force Field 4 sub
Receiver: Marantz SR7008
Media Servers: Synology DS1513+, Sonos Connect, HTPC

I should probably state that I know little to nothing about a/v hardware and plan on having someone set everything up. With that said, my concern with the Oppo's integration into all this is taking advantage its a/v processors. In regards to video, how can I get the player to process my bluray rips from my NAS server? If possible, through what connections? Same question for my audio files. What about the speakers? Would they need to hooked up directly to the player in order to take advantage of the reference DAC, or could they be connected to the receiver?

I realize these questions are pretty elementary, but any help would be appreciated.
I don't think you will need to buy a 105 if you're thinking about purchasing the SR7008. There's too many duplicated features in both components. The sr7008 can do just about everything the 105 can do except play shiny disks. I think a less expensive blu-ray player would be a better choice.
post #6795 of 10176
Quote:
Originally Posted by rhale64L7 View Post

Well howard when I pass the dsd signal either way the oppo is saying pcm. The krell is also stating pcm. And on the Foundation not accepting dsd I know of only one person who stated that. And he stated it because of the cirrus logic chipset that is used. In the brief explanation of the chipset on cirrus logics website it indeed doesnt mention dsd support anywhere. But I did more investigating because the same chipset is in the Cary cinema 11a and 12 and the Cary does support dsd. So I downloaded the pdf of the chipset and low and behold at the very bottom it states it supports full 5.1 dsd. So is my oppo sending pcm only or is it sending dsd that is the question now I guess. I have no dsd indicator light come on in the oppo it is always saying pcm. This is whether going out xlr or through hdmi.

Sent from my SCH-I545 using Tapatalk 2
There's nothing more we can do for you. Your next move is to talk to Krell. The 105 doesn't have a "dsd" indicator. If the "sacd" indicator is lit with no "pcm" indicator on, the 105 is outputting dsd. Go back and read my reply to you yesterday again. I described the function of the 105's front panel indicators....
post #6796 of 10176
Quote:
Originally Posted by rhale64L7 View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by HowardV View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by rhale64L7 View Post

Well fellow avsers I will not be selling the Foundation. I asked my wife to listen and I switched. She is just laying on the love seat. I switched to the Foundation and she said thats the new one isnt it. I said yes. The bass is clearly more defined and it is smooth on the Foundation. I made sure eq was off. And no it is not a double blind abx test. Dont have the equipment or time or money. Not trying to be a smartbutt. Just people asked so I did it. Not trying to derail thread at all either. Now back on topic. How to get dsd out either through hdmi or xlr

Glad you did the test. Krell makes some nice stuff, and it appears the Krell's DAC is better than the Oppo's. Of course, everything adds some coloration (not necessarily a bad thing), and the Krell could just be better suited to your amps and speakers. In this case, I think the Oppo 103 will suit your needs just fine (and you save a few bucks).

Personally, I've done the DSD vs. PCM test and I can't hear a difference between the two. Your ears/system may say otherwise. When passing the signal from your Oppo to your Krell via HDMI, what is your Krell telling you about the signal (PCM or DSD)?

When passing the signal via XLR, the Oppo should read DSD. I know you said both DSD and PCM light up. I'm not at home, so I can't do a test, but as I recall, my Oppo just reads DSD when I'm using it's analog outputs.

Well howard when I pass the dsd signal either way the oppo is saying pcm. The krell is also stating pcm. And on the Foundation not accepting dsd I know of only one person who stated that. And he stated it because of the cirrus logic chipset that is used. In the brief explanation of the chipset on cirrus logics website it indeed doesnt mention dsd support anywhere. But I did more investigating because the same chipset is in the Cary cinema 11a and 12 and the Cary does support dsd. So I downloaded the pdf of the chipset and low and behold at the very bottom it states it supports full 5.1 dsd. So is my oppo sending pcm only or is it sending dsd that is the question now I guess. I have no dsd indicator light come on in the oppo it is always saying pcm. This is whether going out xlr or through hdmi.

Sent from my SCH-I545 using Tapatalk 2

If the PCM indicator is lit, then the OPPO is not using DSD for output.

To get DSD-Direct-to-Analog conversion for the XLR outputs, set SACD Output DSD and temporarily set HDMI Audio OFF. The player can not do DSD and PCM simultaneously, and if the HDMI audio output is forced to PCM (due the handshake from the AVR saying it can not accept DSD) then PCM is also used for the Analog output path.

Typically an AVR that actually has the special DACs which can do DSD-Direct-to-Analog conversion will require the use to make a special setting choice enabling that. The reason is that audio processing in the digital domain is done using LPCM, so when you decide to pass DSD directly to the DACs you will be bypassing all audio processing. The same is true in the OPPO. I.e., when DSD-Direct-to-Analog Conversion is engaged, processing steps such as Crossover processing, speaker distance adjustment and down-mixing can't happen.

If you DON'T make that setting choice in the AVR, the USUAL result is that the AVR accepts the DSD input, but converts it to LPCM itself as the first step upon input. But I imagine their are possibly AVRs out there which refuse to accept DSD if you have their internal DSD to DAC path disabled.

Note that HDMI DSD output is only available on the HDMI 2 output of the OPPO. If you have both HDMI 1 and HDMI 2 in use, be sure you have Split A/V set, as that will mute the HDMI audio output on HDMI 1 so that HDMI 2 DSD output is not blocked simply because the HDMI 1 device can't *ALSO* accept DSD.
--Bob
post #6797 of 10176
Quote:
Originally Posted by DanF8500 View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by rhale64L7 View Post

Well howard when I pass the dsd signal either way the oppo is saying pcm. The krell is also stating pcm. And on the Foundation not accepting dsd I know of only one person who stated that. And he stated it because of the cirrus logic chipset that is used. In the brief explanation of the chipset on cirrus logics website it indeed doesnt mention dsd support anywhere. But I did more investigating because the same chipset is in the Cary cinema 11a and 12 and the Cary does support dsd. So I downloaded the pdf of the chipset and low and behold at the very bottom it states it supports full 5.1 dsd. So is my oppo sending pcm only or is it sending dsd that is the question now I guess. I have no dsd indicator light come on in the oppo it is always saying pcm. This is whether going out xlr or through hdmi.

Sent from my SCH-I545 using Tapatalk 2
There's nothing more we can do for you. Your next move is to talk to Krell. The 105 doesn't have a "dsd" indicator. If the "sacd" indicator is lit with no "pcm" indicator on, the 105 is outputting dsd. Go back and read my reply to you yesterday again. I described the function of the 105's front panel indicators....
Dan I am sorry but I didn think you mentioned anything adout no dsd indicator. Also I didnt know I had to switch hdmi audio off in order for the oppo to send dsd out the xlr outputs. I am learning.

Thank you folks for all your help. It is deeply appreciated.

Sent from my SCH-I545 using Tapatalk 2
post #6798 of 10176
Quote:
Originally Posted by rhale64L7 View Post

Also I didnt know I had to switch hdmi audio off in order for the oppo to send dsd out the xlr outputs. I am learning.

Thank you folks for all your help. It is deeply appreciated.

Sent from my SCH-I545 using Tapatalk 2
That's okay....We're all on here to get/give answers. Just a little correction to your above statement. I mentioned earlier that you can't get dsd out the xlr. DSD is a digital audio format. The audio signal that passes out the rca/xlr connectors is an analog signal, not digital. What Bob was referring to above about hdmi audio needing to be "off" for dsd direct to analog means that the Oppo will convert a dsd audio stream to analog internally without any other conversions.....the final signal out the rca/xlr connectors is a pure analog signal.
post #6799 of 10176
Ok dan so then the pcm indicator would not be lit on the oppo when set to hdmi audio off.

And thank you Bob for your very thorough explanation.

And I will be speaking with Krell to see if they are planning a firmware to fix this. If it can do it why shouldn't it at the price they charge.

Also if they are not planning to add this I should probably be keeping the 105 for playing these pristine sounding sacd disks correct? Because the Foundation does have an awesome analog stage. It is fully balanced all the way through.

Sent from my SCH-I545 using Tapatalk 2
post #6800 of 10176
Quote:
Originally Posted by rhale64L7 View Post

Well howard when I pass the dsd signal either way the oppo is saying pcm. The krell is also stating pcm. And on the Foundation not accepting dsd I know of only one person who stated that. And he stated it because of the cirrus logic chipset that is used. In the brief explanation of the chipset on cirrus logics website it indeed doesnt mention dsd support anywhere. But I did more investigating because the same chipset is in the Cary cinema 11a and 12 and the Cary does support dsd. So I downloaded the pdf of the chipset and low and behold at the very bottom it states it supports full 5.1 dsd. So is my oppo sending pcm only or is it sending dsd that is the question now I guess. I have no dsd indicator light come on in the oppo it is always saying pcm. This is whether going out xlr or through hdmi.

Sent from my SCH-I545 using Tapatalk 2

I have my Oppo connected via analog (XLR) cables. I verified earlier today that when playing an SACD and the Oppo is set to DSD, the display on the Oppo just reads SACD. The OSD (on screen display shown on my TV) does say SACD DSD. When I set the Oppo do convert DSD to PCM and then play an SACD, both the Oppo's display and the OSD show SACD PCM.

On another forum, there is an extensive thread on your Krell Foundation. It appears the DSD portion of the Cirrus Logic Chipset is an option which Krell didn't utilize in the Foundation. It does not appear to be a firmware fix as it's hardware based. In the Krell Foundation manual, there is no mention of DSD either. You can still use DSD if you use the analog output of the Oppo to the analog input of your Krell, but then you'll be utilizing Oppo's DAC. Since the Krell's DAC appear to sound better than Oppo's in your system, I would probably stick HDMI. Personally, I think the comparison of DSD vs. conversion to PCM is over exaggerated.
post #6801 of 10176
ok, since I don't know if oppo will update firmware to show metadata from AIFF files or not I started re-ripping my 1000 cd collection over in WAV format to separate usb flash drives.

I seem to have to turn the volume knob up on the output devices to get the same volume with WAV files as I did with AIFF files.

Its going to be a long night...
post #6802 of 10176
Quote:
Originally Posted by edfowler View Post

ok, since I don't know if oppo will update firmware to show metadata from AIFF files or not I started re-ripping my 1000 cd collection over in WAV format to separate usb flash drives.

I seem to have to turn the volume knob up on the output devices to get the same volume with WAV files as I did with AIFF files.

Its going to be a long night...

Any reason for going wav instead of flac. My Oppo 95 diplays covers, artist/track title info from my flac files
post #6803 of 10176
My 105 did not display metadata when I ripped a cd to FLAC
post #6804 of 10176
gracenote does not work with flac but does with wav on my 105
post #6805 of 10176
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mongo171 View Post

Don't need no stinkin AVR/PRE/PRO. I run my 105 directly to my amp and it sounds great. Just all depends if you want room correction and other fancy AVR options. In the Speaker Configuration, make sure to get the distances correct and set the Speaker Trim to your desired setting. Best way to do that is get an SPL meter.

I wish OPPO would incorporate DIRAC into their next player since they have already a deal with them, then I would abandon my Pre/pro reducing the numbers of boxes!
post #6806 of 10176
Quote:
Originally Posted by edfowler View Post

My 105 did not display metadata when I ripped a cd to FLAC
gracenote does not work with flac but does with wav on my 105
Then your ripper/converter/internal computer codecs must be messed up. You must be doing something wrong. I knew something was amiss when you stated you had to manually increase the volume of your converted wav files after converting from an aiff source. You shouldn't have to use gracenote on the 105 for flac files. All the appropriate metadata should have been embedded in the flac file by your converter/ripper software.
Edited by DanF8500 - 8/18/13 at 8:11am
post #6807 of 10176
Quote:
Originally Posted by edfowler View Post

ok, since I don't know if oppo will update firmware to show metadata from AIFF files or not I started re-ripping my 1000 cd collection over in WAV format to separate usb flash drives. I seem to have to turn the volume knob up on the output devices to get the same volume with WAV files as I did with AIFF files. Its going to be a long night...

All my music is in AIFF and FLAC so I am not going to rip my 700 CDs and 150 SACD again, hopefully they will show metadata with these formats:(
post #6808 of 10176
Quote:
Originally Posted by Igor16 View Post

I'm new to this world and many basic topics are not familiar to me.
I couldn't fully follow you when you spoke about bi-amp and gain control,
where could I read something to improve my know how on these topics?
At the moment I'm looking at:
- audiolab 8200P
- Rotel 1552
Any opinion on these Amps?

A quick Google search will answer your queries much better than I can. But basically bi-amping means to drive the woofers with separate power amps then the rest of the speakers. That implies 2 things, that your speakers are wired for this capability and that you need twice as many power amps (4 channels to drive a stereo pair). A gain control attenuates the incoming signal (think volume control) and will allow, in the case of bi-amping, some micro-balancing of the levels being fed to the woofers vs the other transducers. Gain controls on the power amps also allow one to "tune" or more closely "match" the pre-amp to the power amp, that is to operate their pre-amp (or Oppo - as it is the pre-amp when going direct) output at more optimum levels without involving additional gear.
If you feel gain controls are important to your setup you will need to check the specifications of the power amps you're considering to find out if they have them. It seems gain controls are virtually standard in most "Pro Audio" gear but for some reason lacking in most "home", and even much "audiophile", audio gear.
post #6809 of 10176
Any word on the release time frame for the OPPO 105 4x S/PDIF upgrade for digital output?
post #6810 of 10176
Quote:
Originally Posted by thebland View Post

Any word on the release time frame for the OPPO 105 4x S/PDIF upgrade for digital output?

Huh?
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