New SVS SB1000 & PB1000 Subwoofers!! - Page 14

Thank you very much for your response. I do have a couple of questions though. Are you recommending the SB-1000 instead of the PB-1000 because I want to use it primarily for music, or because I have MMGs? I really wanted to spend $600-700, but I guess I am going to have to spend more.

What do you think if I buy one SB-1000 now and save to buy the other one later? I don't want to be completely unsatisfied with one while I save more $$.

Thanks again,

Victor

That's over 4700 cubic feet. Personally, I think a single of either sub would be simply overwhelmed by that much space. Of the options you listed a pair of PB1000's would definitely be better then one LFM-1 Plus. Another potential option would be the PSA XV15.

U thik the xv15 would be fine with that space?

Yes to both. Generally speaking, acoustic suspension subwoofers have better definition then their ported counterparts. The Maggies will be a bit of a challenge with just about any subwoofer, but I suspect that difficulty would be magnified with a bass reflex design.


With a $600-$700 budget I would suggest the SB12-NSD instead. It's almost the exact same size as the SB1000, but uses a better driver and amp. I think you would have greater success blending that with the Maggies. A single is still too small for that much space, but if it's only temporary -- and you don't push it too hard -- you should be OK for a short time.

I'm not sure "fine" is the term I would use, more like "less overwhelmed". Realistically, your room needs two XV15's, but with it's huge output potential it's probably the best of all the options you have thus far.

Hi Jim, me again.

I called SVS before I read your response. I spoke to a guy named Jack. I told him about my speakers, room size, etc. He recommended to get two PB-1000 instead of two SB12-NSD. He said that it would blend better with the Maggies and provide deeper bass. I actually agree with your assesment and it makes much more sense to me. I want this system primarily for music. I will watch movies once or twice a week only, and play music everyday. A pair of SB12-NSD seems like the logical choice.

I made up my mind and I would just go ahead and buy both of whatever I choose now by the way.

Hey Jim I just measured its 20ft x 15ft 3inches with 10ft ceilings

I'm glad you were able to come up with a solution that meets your needs. After you get everything setup and tuned make sure you come back and post your thoughts.

I sure will Jim. You would still recommend the pair of SB12 regardless of the SVS's guy opinion correct?

You just knocked off like 35% of the total space, so that might make a little difference...

With that I think a pair of PB1000 would probably do quite nice. They have a good sound for a budget sub, and having two of them would provide enough output to handle just about anything.

Give your circumstances, a pair of SB12's would still be my recommendation. I believe the person you spoke with at SVS is correct about the depth -- and that the PB1000 would probably go a little deeper -- but he and I differ on the integration aspect with regard to your Maggie's, especially given your propensity for music. And it's not as though the SB12 is a slouch in the depth department either; Josh Ricci, one of the most respected names when it comes to subwoofer evaluations, thought it was a wonderful sub that could dig surprisingly deep. His review can be found here.

Thanks, Jim. Yeah, I realize that the PB1000 is my best bet, but my whole setup (with exception to the surround speakers) is along one wall in the living room, and because of the WAF my only option for subwoofer placement is the small empty spot on that wall. So is the SB12nsd here a better choice over the SB1000 in your estimation?

Jim, you are awesome. Thanks!

Small acoustic suspension subwoofers all suffer from what amounts to an immutable law of physics; lower output due to their size. There are ways to mitigate the issue, but it can't be circumvented in it's entirety. The PB1000 can play deeper and louder then either the SB1000 or SB12, but it won't have the sound quality (there's no free lunch I'm afraid because every design has it advantages and liabilities, and SQ is often where ported loses a step or two vis-a-vis sealed).

The SB12 benefits from a better amp, driver and sturdier cabinet then the SB1000, all of which will prove advantageous to the depth, volume and quality of it's sound. Of the three the SB12 will have the highest sound quality and will more then likely exceed the output and depth of the SB1000, but not the PB1000.

It's not unreasonable to assume they would rank something like this in a head to head battle...

SB1000: SQ=2nd, Output=3rd, Depth=3rd
PB1000: SQ=3rd, Output=1st, Depth=1st
SB12-NSD: SQ=1st, Output=2nd, Depth=2nd

so Jim do you still believe that a PB-1000 will be a better choice for me than a SB12? i notice that you place PB in SQ = 3. is it that bad? i don't know how your review is going

Can I put one on each side of the tv stand 53" apart ?? Or do they have to be right next to each other ??

ITs best if you can get both near the corners outside of the main speakers.
I have mine inside the main speakers due to the size of my Scree. And my mains would block some of the screen
if place inside my Subs.

So yes you can put then 53" apart but its best to move them to where they sound best and have a more even response.

Athanasios

Yeh I can put them on the outside of each main veritas v5.2's !!! So they would be about 70" apart !!

I actually need a bit longer Sub cable to move mine out a bit from the center. I think I have to get a RCA coupler to do that, or a Y splitter
instead of going out the Left subs Line out to the other sub.

Athanasios

But they won't be really near corners !!! As the room has a hallway to the left before it gets to the other wall!! And a corner fireplace to the right !!

Ahhh, then you'll have to try to have them about the same distance from the closest side wall I would think. But here goes the old saying, do the sub crawl to find the best location. Moving and testing is the best way to work things out.


I am still doing this with my PB 1000's. I have some drops in volume at 60-80 HZ Moving closer to the back wall worsens it, moving out helps. so Now I need to dial in Side to side.
maybe angle them as well. But i need more cable for this. My equipment is on the side wall and the LCRSW line levels are Pre run in wall to a 3 channel floor amp. I had a single sub
before.

Athanasios

You're starting to over-think this whole subwoofer purchase...

That "rating" was merely to highlight the point I was trying to make about the different properties of those 3 subwoofers. I don't think the PB1000 is bad at all -- it actually sounds pretty darn good -- but I suspect the design goals were depth and output, like most other ported subs. Bass reflex can still sound good, but the primary advantages tend more towards low and loud.

Your hands are pretty much tied because of the amount of space you have. Going with a small acoustic suspension subwoofer is probably not going to work all that well.

You can place them either way, but the results will be different. It depends upon what you're trying to achieve, and how much space you have.

Co-locating, which is generally one on top of the other, will give you a couple dB extra output (volume essentially). Separating them will often smooth the sound distribution, evening out the bass in more areas of the room. That's not a given though, because placement is critical to ensure that occurs, but it's one of the primary advantages of having multiple subs.

Thank you for the reply, Jim! Sounds like a trade-off, just like a lot of things are. So my only options (based on the smaller footprint consideration) are to go with the SB1000, or with the better sound and build quality of the SB12-NSD. I'm assuming that your findings of the SB unit build quality are based on your observations of the build qualtity of the PB1000 that's in your house for evaluation. To pay a little extra for a better cabinet and parts so this sub can reproduce better sound for better cinema and music seems like it's worth another $150 to me!

I'm going with dual pb1000 Jim thanks buddy

It's not that the build quality is bad, per se, it's just not constructed like an SB12. As you noted, trade-off's are required in virtually everything. SVS strikes me as a company that tries not to cut too many corners, or at least doesn't trim a lot in the places were it matters most. You can tell by the weight and appearance of the PB1000 that it's a budget-minded subwoofer. However, if they spent most of the money on a good driver, solid amp and custom DSP tuning then I'm OK with the appearance because ultimately it's the sound that matters most. SVS has a 5 year warranty on the 1000 series, which is unheard for budget subs, so they must be pretty confident about the quality of the parts inside.

That being said... if you have the extra $$ then the SB12 becomes very attractive. While I'm sure the SB1000 is a nice subwoofer I suspect the differences between it and the SB12 are such that the extra $150 might actually be a bargain.

I may reach out to Ed Mullen and see if he wants to send me an SB1000 too, so I can compare and contrast it with the PB1000. I specifically asked for the PB1000 because I thought that was going to be the unit most people wanted -- which does appear to be the case -- but it might be interesting to see in person what the differences between the two really is.

You're very welcome. Now you're on the hook though; you have to come back and post your impressions after they've been set up and broken in.

That be great Jim if they send you one. I love my dual PB1000's so far. I moved them just tonight further towards the corners in my theater and watched taken 2. And some bits of 9 before it. Much louder for sure with more felt bass. Tomorrow I'll test some frequencies to see if the 40 and 70hz nulls i had went up at all. I have a feeling my sweet spot for the subs is where my Mains are and those can't be moved. Bummer.


Athanasios

Well ill tell u this I'm super happy with my little velodyne I have now so I'm sure ill be happy with 2 pb1000's!! I'm only upgrading because everyone says what I have is junk !! and since I got the veritas I might as well give them proper bass

That would be great, Jim! I would hold out on my purchase of an SVS sub pending an A-B comparison of those two.

Hope Mr. Mullen is reading this. Ed, would you please loan Jim an SB1000 for review along side a PB1000?