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Skyfall - Page 8

post #211 of 426
Quote:
Originally Posted by Josh Z View Post

The movie made a billion dollars at the box office and had overwhelmingly positive reviews from both critics and audiences. You are part of the extraordinarily large group who enjoyed most of its character casting decisions, etc. It's the haters who fall into an infinitessimal minority, but sadly they are of course the most vocal.
The casting decisions were appropriate IMO.

If there is anything to complain about it is the typical over-the-top action that every Bond movie has.
However, it's part and parcel to the franchise.
post #212 of 426
I had no problem with the casting personally... I just think they got a very ho-hum script to work with. All the dialog scenes were just dull as hell for me.
post #213 of 426
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jdurg View Post

I believe it actually had to do with the fact that around the time that Goldeneye came out, the head of the British Intelligence Agency was a woman. So they were doing it to tie the series, which had been on hiatus since Licence to Kill, back into the modern era.

With regards to Daniel Craig's age, I couldn't care less about his actual age. What I give a crap about is how the actor himself has aged. As long as he doesn't "look" old, then it's fine. When Sean Connery came back for Diamonds Are Forever, he hadn't aged well at all and really looked horrible in the role. Roger Moore was INCREDIBLY ancient in his later movies and it was quite noticeable. However, Pierce Brosnan wasn't exactly a young chap when he finished up his role as James Bond, but he hadn't physically aged as badly as Moore and Connery did. I use my eyes to determine if an actor is too "old" for a role, not a birth date. smile.gif
Then you better check your eyes. I didnt know how old he was until someone here mentioned it. His face is getting wrinkled and he is going bald. He doesnt even have black hair like Bond. Maybe they will get him a wig for the next one.
That being said I do like Craig and the way that they have brought back the more gritty Bond. But I would have liked to see Skyfall be his last. Again, I am glad to see the revenge, love vendetta, lone wolf crap finally gone. Hopefully they will have a proper mission for him in the next one like they did in Casino Royale.
I would like to see something along the lines of From Russia, With Love. Make it a spy movie for a change instead of just another action movie.
post #214 of 426
He's starting to look more and more like Dominique Pinot, with each passing year.
post #215 of 426
I was 20 when the first Bond movie came out so any Bond under 50 is a "young" guy to me and other baby boomers like me. That said, he's also a punk Bond versus a suave Bond, which makes him more American than British, so you will miss the intent: Bond's main focus is/was to prevent changes to the status quo of Britain, good or bad. There are lots of tongue-in-cheek stuff in the early Bonds. Some of the evil doers had mixed agendas, just their methods were "wrong" and must be punished, so Bond made sure they didn't succeed. But Bond was conflicted by man's one true calling--get women, as many as you can, and that was the other half of the story. Many of you probably don't know what I mean given the sexual revolution, but back in the 60's, it was what we men all lived for--saving the world was secondary, and we couldn't get enough of Bond back then.
post #216 of 426
It's an OK movie. My biggest problem I have with the new Craig movies is they don't seem like Bond movies to me. They feel more like the Bourne movies. Maybe they should just go ahead and change his name

"Bourne, Jason Bourne"
post #217 of 426
Quote:
Originally Posted by threed123 View Post

I was 20 when the first Bond movie came out so any Bond under 50 is a "young" guy to me and other baby boomers like me. That said, he's also a punk Bond versus a suave Bond, which makes him more American than British, so you will miss the intent: Bond's main focus is/was to prevent changes to the status quo of Britain, good or bad. There are lots of tongue-in-cheek stuff in the early Bonds. Some of the evil doers had mixed agendas, just their methods were "wrong" and must be punished, so Bond made sure they didn't succeed. But Bond was conflicted by man's one true calling--get women, as many as you can, and that was the other half of the story. Many of you probably don't know what I mean given the sexual revolution, but back in the 60's, it was what we men all lived for--saving the world was secondary, and we couldn't get enough of Bond back then.
Back in the 60s the only thing bigger than James Bond was the Beatles. It was huge when a new 007 flick came out. People were camping out and standing in line for days. Thats why when I hear that Skyfall was the most successful Bond movie it doesnt mean that much to me. It may have grossed more money so if I was an investor that would be successful. But Im not.
post #218 of 426
Quote:
Originally Posted by Josh Z View Post

Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)
As I said, Bond couldn't trust anyone. Silva had moles and connections in MI6, the police force and other agencies. Bond had to do it himself.

Again, this is explained so clearly in the movie that it astounds me that anyone would not understand it.
Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)
It astounds me that you don't get what I'm saying.

I know all about the moles and all that!

Bond really though that the best, safest place to take her would be out in the middle of nowhere? Surrounded by nothing with Bond AND ONLY Bond there to protect her? Luckily for them that old guy was there. Otherwise they might have really been screwed. biggrin.gif

When he went into the whole shpiel about taking her outside of the grid or whatever it was that he said, and then for them to show up later at "Skyfall", I just thought to myself, really? This is the best place to keep her? And then as the whole rest of the movie went on, I just kept thinking to myself, man she is screwed. And that's when I just kept wondering, when is she gonna say to Bond "Damnit James, what the hell were you thinking, bringing me out here like this you damned fool!" biggrin.gif

Now do you get where I'm going with this?!?! redface.gif

There had to have been a better option for her safety.

To me it all just seemed like a cheap ploy to show off some old Bond stuff like the car, and to show where Bond grew up. And also as mentioned earlier, to have Connery show up as the old guy which would have been cool if that had happened. I guess if that had actually happened I wouldn't be having such an issue with them being out there.

Edited by yadfgp - 2/14/13 at 7:16pm
post #219 of 426
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jon S View Post

Does anyone have any issues playing back "Skyfall"? I have a Pioneer BDP-09FD and BDP-05FD... Both players stop after the opening 20th Century Fox splash screen and then nothing...

It plays back fine on a Oppo and a Sony player...

I have the same issue. It will not play on my Sharp BD-HP24U(A). Oddly enough after waiting an eternity it will play on my old Sharp BD-HP20 player made in 2007. This kind of crap makes me want to stop buying blu-rays and the stupid players.
post #220 of 426
Quote:
Originally Posted by joshdt View Post

I have the same issue. It will not play on my Sharp BD-HP24U(A). Oddly enough after waiting an eternity it will play on my old Sharp BD-HP20 player made in 2007. This kind of crap makes me want to stop buying blu-rays and the stupid players.
Quote:
Originally Posted by joshdt View Post

I have the same issue. It will not play on my Sharp BD-HP24U(A). Oddly enough after waiting an eternity it will play on my old Sharp BD-HP20 player made in 2007. This kind of crap makes me want to stop buying blu-rays and the stupid players.

I, also, have the same issue with the Pioneer 05...however, my other Pioneer player (BDP-31FD) has no problem with this disc!...go figure...
post #221 of 426
Quote:
Originally Posted by raoul_duke View Post

He's starting to look more and more like Dominique Pinot, with each passing year.
LOL, that's just mean....wink.gif
post #222 of 426
Quote:
Originally Posted by joshdt View Post

I have the same issue. It will not play on my Sharp BD-HP24U(A). Oddly enough after waiting an eternity it will play on my old Sharp BD-HP20 player made in 2007. This kind of crap makes me want to stop buying blu-rays and the stupid players.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ed Weinman View Post

I, also, have the same issue with the Pioneer 05...however, my other Pioneer player (BDP-31FD) has no problem with this disc!...go figure...
Guys, it isn't the hardware.
The problem is the copy protection put on BDs by paranoid studios.
There has always been schemes to make software hard to copy...it goes back decades.wink.gif
post #223 of 426
Seems to play fine in my Sony S-470!!
post #224 of 426
Quote:
Originally Posted by oink View Post


Guys, it isn't the hardware.
The problem is the copy protection put on BDs by paranoid studios.
There has always been schemes to make software hard to copy...it goes back decades.wink.gif
What's the point? I could have downloaded this weeks ago if I wanted to. And now, paying customers are having to wait until their player manufacturer releases a firmware update. Yeah, that's working out real great.
post #225 of 426
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ed Weinman View Post


I, also, have the same issue with the Pioneer 05...however, my other Pioneer player (BDP-31FD) has no problem with this disc!...go figure...

Add me to the list.... Sorta.

I tried to play it on my Pioneer BDP150 and got the tiny Fox icon as it appeared to be loading then ....nothing. The counter just sat at 0000 and I finally removed the disc and turned it off and tried again with no luck. I tried another disc as the player is fairly new and I thought maybe the player might be defective but the other disc loaded and played fine. So i gave Skyfall one more try and this time it loaded and went straight to the trailers and eventually to the main menu. So my suggestion is try another disc, then try Skyfall if you're having this problem.

I agree with comments that after all this time there's no excuse from either hardware or disc manufacturers for a new blu-ray to not play on a player that's been out in the last 3 or so years.
post #226 of 426
I haven't had any trouble with mine (fingers crossed). It's always those damned Universal disks and their "loading a fresh preview from the Internet" that make my player go into convulsions and stop working. I ended up unplugging the ethernet cable.
post #227 of 426
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jedi2016 View Post

paying customers are having to wait until their player manufacturer releases a firmware update. Yeah, that's working out real great.
Again, it's the studios fear of piracy....write a letter to 'em and tell 'em what you really think.wink.gif
post #228 of 426
Good Lord this disc looks amazing in my home theater (like others)! Incredible in every way: some of the best contrast (night scenes, Shanghai, etc), detail, color I've seen. I loved Deakins Cinematography in the movie so it was a massive thrill to see just how gorgeously it has been rendered on the Blu-Ray.
post #229 of 426
Anybody from the sound mixing industry watched the BD yet? ...especially who if familiar with the cinema mix? I was alerted by a friend who is, but didn't see it in theaaters, who pointed out a number of problems with the BD mix. I thought he was just being anal, but since I have a screening event with guests tomorrow night, I checked it out. I think my friend is right.

First, the mix is really hot! That's not necessarily a deal-breaker, but consider the actions sequences. The average level in the action sequences is so high that there is no dynamic range/room left for impactful events such as crashes or bangs, etc. That's not a big deal, but just means that it could have been mixed such that it is more impactful. The overall hot level of the mix creates another problem I'll get to below.

Secondly, I found the dialogue bloated in the lower mid-range throughout. At worst it makes dialogue even a bit hard to understand, and at best it is a distraction (seeming un-natural). It takes some analysis to understand why it seemed this way on my system in my room (Audyssey Pro calibrated in large room). My theory is that not only is the mix hot, but the EQ is jacked up a bit from the mid-range down for the BD release. Here is the path of my analysis. I use Dynamic EQ. As you must all know, DEQ is based on a level calibration at THX reference which is the reference for cinema mixes as well. Presuming your system calibration is reasonably accurate and the BD mix is reasonably near 0dB, Dynamic EQ can apply its effect as designed. If a mix (or non-film source) is significantly hotter than reference, then DEQ will be applying its curve too heavily for the volume level you have chosen. Of course, this would not be true if you listened with your volume control at 0dB (reference). I don't listen at 0dB, so DEQ is compounding the mid-range and down.

If this was only below 80Hz, I'd have no problem with this. But since it invades the dialogue, it is quite troublesome. The obvious alternative is to turn off Dynamic EQ. That is what I did, and it "solved" the problem. Without DEQ, Skyfall sounds like most other movies with DEQ on in my room. That is why I have the theory that they have monkyed with the EQ for the BD release.

So, I guess this is a heads-up...just in case you experience the same impression in your room.

BTW, the new Audyssey feature of DEQ offset is designed to be used with hot sources. I use -10dB of DEQ offset for music sources which run hotter than music mixes. Since the level of the Skyfall mix is so non-standard, it makes finding something (a "fix") that works rather subjective. I thought that a DEQ offset of -10dB might work, but DEQ turned off sounds more like other modern mixes to me...with DEQ on. My $.02 worth. smile.gif
post #230 of 426
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cam Man View Post

Anybody from the sound mixing industry watched the BD yet? ...especially who if familiar with the cinema mix? I was alerted by a friend who is, but didn't see it in theaaters, who pointed out a number of problems with the BD mix. I thought he was just being anal, but since I have a screening event with guests tomorrow night, I checked it out. I think my friend is right.

First, the mix is really hot! That's not necessarily a deal-breaker, but consider the actions sequences. The average level in the action sequences is so high that there is no dynamic range/room left for impactful events such as crashes or bangs, etc. That's not a big deal, but just means that it could have been mixed such that it is more impactful. The overall hot level of the mix creates another problem I'll get to below.

Secondly, I found the dialogue bloated in the lower mid-range throughout. At worst it makes dialogue even a bit hard to understand, and at best it is a distraction (seeming un-natural). It takes some analysis to understand why it seemed this way on my system in my room (Audyssey Pro calibrated in large room). My theory is that not only is the mix hot, but the EQ is jacked up a bit from the mid-range down for the BD release. Here is the path of my analysis. I use Dynamic EQ. As you must all know, DEQ is based on a level calibration at THX reference which is the reference for cinema mixes as well. Presuming your system calibration is reasonably accurate and the BD mix is reasonably near 0dB, Dynamic EQ can apply its effect as designed. If a mix (or non-film source) is significantly hotter than reference, then DEQ will be applying its curve too heavily for the volume level you have chosen. Of course, this would not be true if you listened with your volume control at 0dB (reference). I don't listen at 0dB, so DEQ is compounding the mid-range and down.

If this was only below 80Hz, I'd have no problem with this. But since it invades the dialogue, it is quite troublesome. The obvious alternative is to turn off Dynamic EQ. That is what I did, and it "solved" the problem. Without DEQ, Skyfall sounds like most other movies with DEQ on in my room. That is why I have the theory that they have monkyed with the EQ for the BD release.

So, I guess this is a heads-up...just in case you experience the same impression in your room.

BTW, the new Audyssey feature of DEQ offset is designed to be used with hot sources. I use -10dB of DEQ offset for music sources which run hotter than music mixes. Since the level of the Skyfall mix is so non-standard, it makes finding something (a "fix") that works rather subjective. I thought that a DEQ offset of -10dB might work, but DEQ turned off sounds more like other modern mixes to me...with DEQ on. My $.02 worth. smile.gif

When I first played it I definitely thought the mix was hot like TDKR. I still think it wasn't as bad though as TDKR. Do you have timestamps for the parts you think the dialogue is bloated? I'll give it a try again but I didn't have any problems with dialogue when I watched it.

I'm using DEQ at the -5 offset.
post #231 of 426
Quote:
Originally Posted by pokekevin View Post

When I first played it I definitely thought the mix was hot like TDKR. I still think it wasn't as bad though as TDKR. Do you have timestamps for the parts you think the dialogue is bloated? I'll give it a try again but I didn't have any problems with dialogue when I watched it.

I'm using DEQ at the -5 offset.

"Bloated" is definately a subjective term, but I found it most noticable in smaller rooms and on shots that were not closeups. For instance the opening scene where Bond is commenting on the hard drive being gone, etc.; the M/Bond conversation in M's flat; the first meeiting conversation between the 'two" Ms. The dialogue EQ when the shot is wide gives the voice the proximity that would be appropriate for a close up, but seems out of place for a wide shot. Sorry, I'm responding quickly since I have to run for now.
post #232 of 426
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cam Man View Post

the first meeiting conversation between..........

Careful about spoilers for those who haven't seen it yet... I don't mind them I know the film, but others don't and will see the film for the first time on Blu-ray...
post #233 of 426
This answers why I wasn't dazzled by the AQ.

Thanx for the info.smile.gif
post #234 of 426
Quote:
Originally Posted by oink View Post

This answers why I wasn't dazzled by the AQ.

IMO, there is way too much compression and/or limiting being done for Blu-ray (and DVD) soundtracks. It may be OK to do that for the DD soundtracks but they should leave the lossless tracks alone. The argument made for additional processing is the original mix was done for theater presentation and most home systems and TVs can not handle the range a theater can and to that I say “phooey”. Many of my old LaserDisc titles had much better soundtracks than the same title on DVD because of additional audio processing done to the DVD release.

The other thing I really dislike is taking older Dolby Stereo soundtracks and redoing them for 5.1 for disc release and NOT providing the original Dolby Stereo (a.k.a. Dolby Surround) soundtracks. In cases where both are provided I use PLIIx on the DS tracks and it sounds better than the redone 5.1 in most cases.

For me, Skyfall had a fair/good soundtrack overall, the major complaint was over processed music track. The surround effects and LFE were good/very good.

I have an old ADC RTA in the rack and at glance can see what is happening
post #235 of 426
Quote:
Originally Posted by yadfgp View Post

Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)
I know all about the moles and all that!

Bond really though that the best, safest place to take her would be out in the middle of nowhere? Surrounded by nothing with Bond AND ONLY Bond there to protect her? Luckily for them that old guy was there. Otherwise they might have really been screwed. biggrin.gif

You say that you understand what I've said, but then you ask a question that suggests you didn't understand at all.
Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)
If you understand that Bond cannot trust anyone, and cannot take M to a police station or a safe house of anywhere else normally considered secure, where exactly would you have him take her?

Yes, Bond and only Bond is there to protect her. Who else is supposed to help him protect her when HE CAN'T TRUST ANYONE ELSE ?

Yes, the house is in the middle of nowhere, where Silva cannot sneak up on him, and he can lure Silva's men into the traps he's set up. Where else should he bring her?
post #236 of 426
FWIW....

I only spot-checked the disc, but I did note during the opening chase that the dynamic range wasn't as wide as I was expecting it to be either.

Dialogue seemed fine, but I was playing it room corrected via the Audyssey on my Denon Receiver. I did not play it with DEQ engaged. I tried to get the DEQ working when I first set up the receiver, but all I ever got was bloated sound and I just ended up throwing in the towel and never engage it.
post #237 of 426
Quote:
Originally Posted by R Harkness View Post

FWIW....

I only spot-checked the disc, but I did note during the opening chase that the dynamic range wasn't as wide as I was expecting it to be either.

Dialogue seemed fine, but I was playing it room corrected via the Audyssey on my Denon Receiver. I did not play it with DEQ engaged. I tried to get the DEQ working when I first set up the receiver, but all I ever got was bloated sound and I just ended up throwing in the towel and never engage it.

It took me awhile but I finally settled with the ref offset to -5.

I must say the dialogue sounds a lot better though for skyfall with DEQ off.

Curious to why the BD mixes for TDKR and Skyfall are mixed hot. Any insiders?
Edited by pokekevin - 2/15/13 at 11:59am
post #238 of 426
Here is some more to chew on regarding the plot of Skyfall (courtesy of cracked.com):
Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)
The Plot Twist
In Skyfall, James Bond tracks his villain through a series of expert spy techniques such as attacking a train with a backhoe, getting shot, feeding a dude to a komodo dragon, and just plain screwing. In the end, he is able to catch his man, a sinisterly foreign yet creepily Aryan ex-agent named Silva (Javier Bardem).

But in a twist no one had seen since The Avengers (and before that, The Dark Knight), it then turns out that the villain intentionally got himself captured! It was all a plan to get to Bond's boss, M (Judi Dench), who was on trial thanks to Silva's machinations. Silva manages to upload a virus into MI6's system, escapes his cell, disguises himself as a police officer, and meets up with his henchmen to take out M at her hearing ... but not before crashing an expertly timed train right on a pursuing Bond's dome.

Hold On, Now ...
Before we go any further, yes, this is universally considered to be an awesome movie. It's just that any time a movie has the villain do the, "Surprise! Every action you've taken has actually played perfectly into my hands!" bit with the hero, it never really makes sense. And this is a great example -- when you walk through it from the bad guy's point of view, you realize that either Silva is an incredibly lucky basterd, or he's literally God.

The entire point of Silva's scheme is to kill M during her hearing -- he has two guys waiting for him with a cop uniform after he breaks out of MI6 specifically so that he can sneak into the courthouse and shoot her. Presumably he allowed himself to get captured (as opposed to just going straight to the courthouse) because he wanted to upload the virus into MI6's computers to distract everyone.

Here's the thing: Silva's master plan began the moment he got captured, timing it so that he'd be in custody right when M was testifying. But he didn't turn himself in -- he was captured by Bond. So how could he have known when that would happen? Bond tracks a bullet shard in his shoulder to an assassin guy who has a casino chip from a casino where he sticks it to some lady who happens to know where Silva is. That's literally how it happens -- Silva had no control over that. How many days were those two fake cops standing there, waiting for Silva?

And then, when Bond corners him, Silva blows the tunnel at just the right time for a train to come crashing through it. How did he even know to set explosives in the specific time and place where James Bond would catch him? How did he know a train would be coming along at just that moment? He utters a little catchphrase in the split second the train crashes through -- imagine if the train had gotten delayed and they'd had to stand there in silence for 20 minutes until it finally came along.
post #239 of 426
Quote:
Originally Posted by oink View Post

Here is some more to chew on regarding the plot of Skyfall (courtesy of cracked.com):
Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)
The Plot Twist
In Skyfall, James Bond tracks his villain through a series of expert spy techniques such as attacking a train with a backhoe, getting shot, feeding a dude to a komodo dragon, and just plain screwing. In the end, he is able to catch his man, a sinisterly foreign yet creepily Aryan ex-agent named Silva (Javier Bardem).

But in a twist no one had seen since The Avengers (and before that, The Dark Knight), it then turns out that the villain intentionally got himself captured! It was all a plan to get to Bond's boss, M (Judi Dench), who was on trial thanks to Silva's machinations. Silva manages to upload a virus into MI6's system, escapes his cell, disguises himself as a police officer, and meets up with his henchmen to take out M at her hearing ... but not before crashing an expertly timed train right on a pursuing Bond's dome.

Hold On, Now ...
Before we go any further, yes, this is universally considered to be an awesome movie. It's just that any time a movie has the villain do the, "Surprise! Every action you've taken has actually played perfectly into my hands!" bit with the hero, it never really makes sense. And this is a great example -- when you walk through it from the bad guy's point of view, you realize that either Silva is an incredibly lucky basterd, or he's literally God.

The entire point of Silva's scheme is to kill M during her hearing -- he has two guys waiting for him with a cop uniform after he breaks out of MI6 specifically so that he can sneak into the courthouse and shoot her. Presumably he allowed himself to get captured (as opposed to just going straight to the courthouse) because he wanted to upload the virus into MI6's computers to distract everyone.

Here's the thing: Silva's master plan began the moment he got captured, timing it so that he'd be in custody right when M was testifying. But he didn't turn himself in -- he was captured by Bond. So how could he have known when that would happen? Bond tracks a bullet shard in his shoulder to an assassin guy who has a casino chip from a casino where he sticks it to some lady who happens to know where Silva is. That's literally how it happens -- Silva had no control over that. How many days were those two fake cops standing there, waiting for Silva?

And then, when Bond corners him, Silva blows the tunnel at just the right time for a train to come crashing through it. How did he even know to set explosives in the specific time and place where James Bond would catch him? How did he know a train would be coming along at just that moment? He utters a little catchphrase in the split second the train crashes through -- imagine if the train had gotten delayed and they'd had to stand there in silence for 20 minutes until it finally came along.

You can add this as well...

Honest Trailers - Skyfall
post #240 of 426
Honest Trailers are trying too hard.
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