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lost on where to start on building a sub based for music

post #1 of 87
11/26/12 at 2:25pm
Thread Starter 
well so far i have looked into all different subs and amps i just want a little added thump when im cranking the tunes on my 2.1 system

one thing i know it has to be able to keep up with my cerwin vega d-9 mains and d-5s as well

i do like this sub http://www.parts-express.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?partnumber=293-656

as well as this amp maybe http://www.parts-express.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?partnumber=300-752

my big question is what type of box would be best for some amazing bass
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post #2 of 87
11/26/12 at 3:14pm
that driver isn't what you are looking for.

what receiver are you using?

is this mostly music or movies too?
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post #3 of 87
11/26/12 at 3:21pm
Thread Starter 
i have the yamaha R-S700 receiver!

i would say 90% music and 10% movies i have a theater for that stuff
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post #4 of 87
11/26/12 at 3:43pm
one option could be the amp that you posted, but switch to the b&c 18ps76 woofer.

http://www.parts-express.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?partnumber=294-675

a six cubic foot enclosure tuned to 38hz placed in between your mains will definitely kick things up a notch.

the sensitivity is about 10db higher than the epic 10, and that is a lot.

with 500 watts, you should have over 120db 1w1m from 35hz up.

if you like music with really low bass like dubstep, it can be tuned a little lower. if you like mostly rock and such and want maximum kick out of the drum, the 38hz tune will do nicely.

another budget pro 18":

http://www.parts-express.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?partnumber=294-301
Edited by LTD02 - 11/26/12 at 4:15pm
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post #5 of 87
11/26/12 at 4:08pm
Thread Starter 
but with that amp and driver the amp would be way under powering that driver with like 300 watts at 8 ohms so id have to bump up the amp

the other problem i see is that is a 18 inch woofer not a sub i want to have a clean look of home gear and i really like mad amounts of excursion. Occasionally i put bass tracks through this system at levels that are unimaginable that i don't have a sub to fill in for the sick drops of dub-step and some old school bass mechanics!

is there such efficiency in the home world or is pro were i need to be looking more at?

6 cubic ft box is pretty big for a sub in my opinion.
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post #6 of 87
11/26/12 at 4:17pm
The new Dayton 18HO driver may be a good compromise then? 4cuft closed box. The midbass should be very good(but maybe not as good as good PA alternatives), tho it requires some power, 1000w ish. and maybe some EQ too...
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post #7 of 87
11/26/12 at 4:26pm
"but with that amp and driver the amp would be way under powering that driver with like 300 watts at 8 ohms so id have to bump up the amp"

good catch. not sure what i was thinking.

if you like the bass mechanics and dub-step, now you are looking at a 25hz tune or so.

as for the size of the cab, the smaller that you go, the more power you need for the same spl.

i'm not sure that you need massive excursion drivers in a ported configuration. also, comparing pro-audio xmax with home audio xmax is often apples and oranges. most pro audio drivers have a lot more usable excursion out past their rated value.
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post #8 of 87
11/26/12 at 4:27pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by tylerlovely2006 View Post

6 cubic ft box is pretty big for a sub in my opinion.

Not really...your not going to get cabin gain like you would in a car. You need to move a lot of air to get big sound. And if you want to really feel those drops you need some large drivers (in large enclosures) to move that air.

You are also asking people to blindly give you suggestions for a room and budget we no nothing about. So be prepared for a ton of different ideas that mean nothing.

How about we start by figuring out your budget, your room size, ect. Filling in those couple of blanks will really help to narrow the ideas being thrown at you.
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post #9 of 87
11/26/12 at 4:29pm
PROFESSOR!!!! Good to see ya bud!

LTD02 is a wise man and I completely value his opinion. So I'm just curious here. What about the Dayton HO? How would that sound in this setup?


EDIT: I still have those 190v.2's available bud wink.gif

Good luck Lovely!


dbl
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post #10 of 87
11/26/12 at 4:36pm
Thread Starter 
i realy like that sub i was just looking at that exact same driver 1000 watts is definitely possible as well http://www.parts-express.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?partnumber=300-809

with this driver http://www.parts-express.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?partnumber=295-472

and a 4cuft

i also plan on getting a pro eq http://www.parts-express.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?partnumber=248-722 soon as well to get some better sound out of the hole system i am running a dual 7 band eq now and with some fine tune that amp should allow plunty of ajustments tell i get that eq

would that be a sealed inclosure or ported?
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post #11 of 87
11/26/12 at 4:41pm
"What about the Dayton HO[-18 i'm assuming]? How would that sound in this setup?"

looks good in a medium-large cab around 6 cubic feet. the p.a. woofers tend to have more sensitivity on the top end though.
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post #12 of 87
11/26/12 at 4:42pm
Sealed.

Gorilla83 went for multiple Dayton 18HO
http://www.avsforum.com/t/1435795/first-diy-project-for-a-guy-looking-to-upgrade-multiple-sealed-18s
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post #13 of 87
11/26/12 at 4:48pm
"would that be a sealed inclosure or ported?"

that is great for a home theater sealed 4 cubic foot setup.

i was just trying to suggest something that would maximize performance in your mostly music application, but if you don't have the space, you don't have the space.

if you do have the space, that driver, same power, in a ported 7 cubic footer net, gives 6db more spl at 30hz, which is the same as two sealed subs and amps.

that is where it really comes down to what you want and are willing to tradeoff.
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post #14 of 87
11/26/12 at 5:19pm
Thread Starter 
how do you figure the port dimensions and length and would 23x23x23 box work im not good at math lol
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post #15 of 87
11/26/12 at 5:25pm
Thread Starter 
well my budget is 600-700 equipment and the room is a unfinished basement for now at some point will be a room for the system just not at this time ! i have a hundred set aside for materials and such so total of 800 i guess!
Edited by tylerlovely2006 - 11/27/12 at 1:07pm
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post #16 of 87
11/27/12 at 7:02pm
Thread Starter 
wow this thread died in 5 hours wow
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post #17 of 87
11/27/12 at 7:31pm
"how do you figure the port dimensions and length and would 23x23x23 box work im not good at math lol"

that is going to net out to about 5 cubic feet.

grab a couple dayton dvc385-88 before they go off sale:
http://www.parts-express.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?partnumber=295-190

grab a couple 500 watt plate amps.

plop two 4" diameter ports per box that are 18" long for roughly a 25hz tune.

fire them up and let 'em rip.

that should give you 123db or so from 30hz-60hz which it seems that you are looking for.

a little over budget, but everybody goes a little over budget. :-)

or, build one. then kick yourself for not buying the second driver while still on sale. :-)
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post #18 of 87
11/27/12 at 8:31pm
Hmm, Dayton DVC is on sale, Bash 300 is on sale, F20 may fit somewhere, if not two (and still be within budget)?
How about it Tyler, could you fit two 20ft^3 enclosures? cool.gif You'd have excellent output >20hz.
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post #19 of 87
11/27/12 at 8:50pm
Thread Starter 
could i make it one big tower cab make two cabs in one big one? i cant beleave that price on those drivers

http://www.parts-express.com/pe/pshowdetl.cfm?&Partnumber=300-809&scqty=1

with one of those amps running the drivers at a 4 ohm load that would be more then enough power! right:)
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post #20 of 87
11/27/12 at 9:30pm
you can put them both in one big cab holding all other things equal. the big cab would be just the same as two standalone cabs. it would have 2x the size, 2x the ports, 2x the drivers, 2x the power, etc.

the 1000 watt plate amp is a bit of a problem because the drivers are dual 8 ohm. each driver can be wired for 4 or 16 ohms.

as a result, a pair can be wired for 2, 8, or 32 ohms. that doesn't match well to the 4 ohm load the plate amp wants.
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post #21 of 87
11/27/12 at 9:48pm
Thread Starter 
well in that case how about this amp

https://www.parts-express.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?partnumber=245-502

then all id need is a crossover in between the amp ad receiver to control the frequency?
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post #22 of 87
11/27/12 at 9:54pm
525 watts per channel into 4 ohms is good.

"then all id need is a crossover in between the amp ad receiver to control the frequency?"

the receiver should be able to take care of that. i'm not familiar with the dsp on that amp. i kind of get the sense that you would be best off running them in "plus mode" or whatever your receiver calls running your mains full range and adding in subs on top of that.
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post #23 of 87
11/27/12 at 9:59pm
Thread Starter 
http://usa.yamaha.com/products/audio-visual/hifi-components/stereo-receivers/r-s700/

there is the link to my receiver its not as advanced as the avr receivers
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post #24 of 87
11/27/12 at 10:08pm
i tried to access the manual, but yamaha wants me to login...retarded.
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post #25 of 87
11/27/12 at 10:12pm
Thread Starter 
627.10 still at my budget thats a supper ++++smile.gifsmile.gifsmile.gifsmile.gif
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post #26 of 87
11/27/12 at 10:16pm
Thread Starter 
well what all did you need to no i do no the menu on the receiver dose not have much settings other then volume and but no speaker sizes or sub stuff
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post #27 of 87
11/27/12 at 10:28pm
I looked at the manual and nothing in there about bass redirection or crossover. It does have a subwoofer output so it must do something smile.gif
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post #28 of 87
11/27/12 at 10:39pm
does the receiver have pre-outs for the left and right channels?
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post #29 of 87
11/27/12 at 10:54pm
Thread Starter 
Yes it dose have pre outs for the mains
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post #30 of 87
11/27/12 at 11:20pm
oh great. then just run those into your amp. looks like the amp has rca inputs, so you won't need converter cables.

the dsp in the amp appears to have something called "LowPass Mode", which is what you would use to choose the frequency where you want to roll the subs out and let just your mains take over.

see page 5 of the manual: http://www.crownaudio.com/media/storagebk/pdf/amps/142169-1_XLS3_MultilingualManual_032410.pdf
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