AVS › AVS Forum › Display Devices › Digital Hi-End Projectors - $3,000+ USD MSRP › Official JVC DLA-RS46 / DLA-X35 owners thread
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

Official JVC DLA-RS46 / DLA-X35 owners thread - Page 10

post #271 of 793
12/27/12 at 5:17am
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by szepi0808 View Post

new 3D firmware (V041) If the first 3 digits of the serial number of your device or 167xxxxx 157xxxxx begin with

JVC offers its users a new 3D firmware (V041) for projector DLA-X35.
Projection / Television
Happy owner Projector DLA-X35, if you use the device in 3D JVC offers a qualitative evolution of 3D processing.
(You're not concerned if you use the device only in 2D)
The change relates to a new software management system which manages SWITCHER 3D reducer 3D ghosting.
(SWITCHER circuit synchronizes 3D signals to the eye and Right eye Left).
If the first 3 digits of the serial number of your device or 167xxxxx 157xxxxx begin with,
(Other series have already benefited from this change in our factories)

from January 2013, you may contact your dealer so that it sends your device in one of our approved service. Everything is implemented with your dealer that you will find your device in one week, free of charge (the port return is borne by JVC)

Note 1: The installation of this evolution requires specific tools and is not achievable by the user or dealer.
Note 2: You must put your device in its original packaging with all of its internal and calles protections.



Thanks for the link szepi. My serial number starts with 167 ... not sure why JVC in North America doesn't have a clue about this problem yet.
Reply
Reply

Gear mentioned in this thread:

post #272 of 793
12/27/12 at 11:44am
Quote:
Originally Posted by KMR View Post

I have a couple of questions, if someone can answer them:
1) Has anyone experienced a problem with streaky text? Some RS45s had this problem last year; I don't know how prevalent it was, but mine had it.
2) Has anyone compared the RS46 to the HW30? I say the HW30 instead of the HW50 since I think the 30 is closer in price to the RS46 than the HW50 is (could be mistaken).

My problem is the same.
replaces the jvc






Reply
Reply
post #273 of 793
12/28/12 at 9:05am
Just pulled the trigger on the RS46 (purchased through AVS, thanks Mike!). Can't wait to get the media room set up in the next few months.
Reply
Reply
post #274 of 793
12/28/12 at 5:22pm
I thought I had the smearing text issue as well but I reset the lens and refocused/recentered the image and it disappeared. Weird.
Reply
Reply
post #275 of 793
12/30/12 at 2:23am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kelvin1965S View Post

I found this on a previous HD350 I had, most noticeable on end credits so a kind of ghost image of the title might appear elsewhere on the screen. I had my projector mounted dead centre with no lens shift in either direction. Simple fix was to move my projector higher up and apply vertical lens shift. It didn't impact on sharpness that I could tell from my seat (even close to the screen it looked good) but the ghosting went. Even since I've used the higher mounting set up with shift and my new X35 looks pin sharp in this position and I've not seen any ghost reflections on it.
I know some are almost obsessed with not using lens shift for fear of causing softness, but for me I'd rather get rid of something I can see from my seat (ghosting) rather than worry about something I can't (as it looks plenty sharp enough still). If it helps my set up is max throw, so minimum zoom, minimum iris the former meaning that I get a sharper image than being near full zoom anyway. I believe that as the iris is opened up the ghosting effect is less pronounced.

Using extreme lens shift does move the reflection off the screen but that's not really an ideal solution for people using high-power screens that require mounting as close to seating height as possible.

Can you test your X35 with no lens shift to see if the problem is still there? You don't need to move the projector as long as enough of the image is still on the screen without lens shift applied to check for the reflections. Thanks.

Quote:
Originally Posted by szepi0808 View Post

My problem is the same.
replaces the jvc

Please let us know if your replacement JVC fixes the problem.
Reply
Reply
post #276 of 793
12/30/12 at 10:38am
I can try this, though it was my old HD350 that I saw the issue with ghost reflections then I moved it higher up and applied lens shift. The X35 was put straight into the same place so I've never tried it without shift. I'll try to remember next time I have it switched on.
Reply
Reply
post #277 of 793
12/31/12 at 12:19am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wizziwig View Post

Please let us know if your replacement JVC fixes the problem.
jvc replaces the device
I look forward to the arrival of the new unit.
Reply
Reply
post #278 of 793
12/31/12 at 1:51am
Quote:
Originally Posted by szepi0808 View Post

My problem is the same.
replaces the jvc
Upon closer examination, I do notice a little bit of streaking on solid, high-contrast images. I don't notice it on menu text (I even checked the yellow "Are you sure you want to power off?" text like you showed and didn't see anything) but I can see it around some words on my Oppo BDP-103's home screen. Mind you, I had to be standing right up against the screen to notice it and even then it was really faint. It's not nearly as severe as the images you posted but then again I don't know if you've enhanced those at all to make the smearing more visible.

It seems to me this is some sort of internal reflection that just happens to be slightly visible with high-contrast images. It sure doesn't look like an electronic fault because the smearing doesn't seem to be actively generated by the pixel grid -- the edges of the streaks aren't defined by pixel boundaries. In other words, IMHO it's just an optical anomaly due to the lens or imaging engine configuration. I'm baffled as to why it would vary amongst projectors though. I guess it's possible that different combinations of lens shift, throw distance, aperture settings, zoom settings, screen size, and screen materials could affect the visibility of the smears.

Given the facts that my projector has great convergence (at its worst red might be off by 1/3 of a pixel), great focus, and I can't make out the streaking unless I'm within a few feet of my screen, and then only barely, I'm willing to let this slide. wink.gif

Sometimes I hate this forum...it compels me to look for problems that I'd never have otherwise found!
Edited by Schwa - 12/31/12 at 1:57am
Reply
Reply
post #279 of 793
12/31/12 at 2:31am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Schwa View Post

I guess it's possible that different combinations of lens shift, throw distance, aperture settings, zoom settings, screen size, and screen materials could affect the visibility of the smears.

I'm sure this is a major factor since I have found lens shift makes a difference in my set up with the ghosting effect I got my old HD350, plus I have a very long throw and use a low iris setting, but a fairly large screen (by UK standards anyway) of 112" wide. I haven't tried out my X35 with the lens shift zeroed but I may well have it switched on tonight, so I'll try to remember to check it (and photograph if I find any streaking).
Quote:
Originally Posted by Schwa View Post

Sometimes I hate this forum...it compels me to look for problems that I'd never have otherwise found!

Someone asked me to have a close look at my screen to see if I had any dead pixels and I politely declined. biggrin.gif I once had a Panasonic projector for over 6 months without being aware of such an issue until I happened to go near the screen due to a fly on the screen and I saw one stuck blue pixel and was horrified at first, but even knowing where it was I couldn't see it from my viewing seat. However, I'd rather not tempt fate by actively seeking out a dead pixel. smile.gif The streaking I'm less bothered about as in my setup it doesn't occur, though if I can 'invoke' the effect by centring the lens shift at least it might help provide a fix for others (apart from HP owners of course).
Reply
Reply
post #280 of 793
12/31/12 at 6:19am
Thread Starter 
My 3D impressions with the X35 (note: first experience ever, anywhere, on anything):

I tried 3D yesterday with a couple PS3 games (Gran Turismo 5, Ratchet & Clank), some television using 2D-to-3D conversion, and part of Prometheus (my only 3D blu-ray).

GT5 was just ok. I was expecting more 3D, as in the environments being 3D. With the in-car view, you could definitely tell that the dashboard was much closer than the environment, but the road/scenery was flat. Not interested in playing this game in 3D in the future.

Ratchet and Clank (an action/platformer game), had a much better 3D environment and was far more interesting for 3D than GT5. But probably still not enough to make me prefer to play it in 3D rather than 2D.

Trying out the 2D-3D conversion with EPL football was unimpressive and I turned it off soon after. The players seem to be slightly closer than the rest of the field, the soccer ball had no 3D effect when played from sideline-to-sideline. But the game itself was excellent (Man City vs. Norwich City).

So far, less than impressed with 3D overall, 0 for 3.

Lastly, I tried Prometheus. The opening of Prometheus was an incredible experience, in particular the low angle shot along the river leading up to the water falls. As well, all of the shots from inside the spaceship that had a view of the outside (space or landscape) were jaw dropping. I only watched the first 45 minutes or so of the movie, but I came away thinking: IMPRESSIVE. There was no pop-out 3D, just depth 3D, which was fine for me because, at times, it felt as if I was right behind the actors and looking over their shoulders, and as I said, the views from the bridge of the ship truly felt like I was on it. Outstanding.

And on a technical note, the RF sync was flawless, very impressive.

Now the bad:

Unfortunately, ghosting was difficult to ignore on everything I viewed, even with a relatively dark movie like Prometheus. I have one of the first batch X35 models without the switcher update, which I will now send in to JVC service whenever possible. I had crosstalk set to -8 and parallax set to anywhere from -4 to -9 (depending on the source).

Also, these JVC glasses just don't fit me well. Pinching behind the ear, heavy on the nose, and my eyelashes brush the lens.

The brightness on my 100" screen @ 11' throw was fine for me; in fact, I turned the lamp setting to low ... I preferred the silent fan noise more than the slight bump in brightness. Overall, my purely subjective guess would be that the glasses cut the brightness by about 50% ... I need to get a lux meter ...

.....................

Two questions now:

If I could get comfortable glasses, I could see myself buying more 3D movies. Does anybody have any suggestions, or has anybody compiled a list of compatible RF glasses yet?

Is it normal to have to adjust the JVC parallax setting between individual sources?
Reply
Reply
post #281 of 793
12/31/12 at 6:32am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Schwa View Post

Upon closer examination, I do notice a little bit of streaking on solid, high-contrast images. I don't notice it on menu text (I even checked the yellow "Are you sure you want to power off?" text like you showed and didn't see anything) but I can see it around some words on my Oppo BDP-103's home screen. Mind you, I had to be standing right up against the screen to notice it and even then it was really faint. It's not nearly as severe as the images you posted but then again I don't know if you've enhanced those at all to make the smearing more visible.
It seems to me this is some sort of internal reflection that just happens to be slightly visible with high-contrast images. It sure doesn't look like an electronic fault because the smearing doesn't seem to be actively generated by the pixel grid -- the edges of the streaks aren't defined by pixel boundaries. In other words, IMHO it's just an optical anomaly due to the lens or imaging engine configuration. I'm baffled as to why it would vary amongst projectors though. I guess it's possible that different combinations of lens shift, throw distance, aperture settings, zoom settings, screen size, and screen materials could affect the visibility of the smears.
Given the facts that my projector has great convergence (at its worst red might be off by 1/3 of a pixel), great focus, and I can't make out the streaking unless I'm within a few feet of my screen, and then only barely, I'm willing to let this slide. wink.gif
Sometimes I hate this forum...it compels me to look for problems that I'd never have otherwise found!

I have that slight streaking on the Oppo home screen as well..and can only see it up close, I cant see it from seating distance.

I almost have dead on convergence with blue being a tiny bit off...but almost there and focus is also spot on.........Id rather have the slight streaking from close distance than bad convergence and bad focus uniformity. Im also willing to let the streaking slide.........my streaking look no where near as bad as those pics though.
Reply
Reply
post #282 of 793
12/31/12 at 6:55am
Hello can anyone tell me how many inches a x35 can project from 3,20meters?

Thanks in advance...and I wish to all a happy new year...
Reply
Reply
post #283 of 793
12/31/12 at 7:02am
Quote:
Originally Posted by johnchalt View Post

Hello can anyone tell me how many inches a x35 can project from 3,20meters?
Thanks in advance...and I wish to all a happy new year...

Per the specs, max image width would be 90".
AVScience Insider

Buy Gear From AVS

» Get the latest news and updates at the AVScience sponsor page.
Reply
AVScience Insider

Buy Gear From AVS

» Get the latest news and updates at the AVScience sponsor page.
Reply
post #284 of 793
12/31/12 at 10:43am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dragon Reborn View Post

If I could get comfortable glasses, I could see myself buying more 3D movies. Does anybody have any suggestions, or has anybody compiled a list of compatible RF glasses yet?

Panasonic TY-ER3D4MU glasses work (I have them and have confirmed this myself). Reviewers have commented that these are among the most comfortable glasses available, so take that FWIW.

I also imagine that Samsung SSG-4100GB glasses will work with the JVC emitter since they're known to work with Panasonic TVs that use the TY-ER3D4MU glasses. In fact, bot the Panasonic and Samsung glasses conform to the "Full HD 3D" standard, so I think it's a safe bet that any glasses that conform to that standard will work with the JVC emitter.

Please keep us posted on your pre- and post-3D firmware update impressions! Mike Garrett told me that JVC told him the update was very minor, so I'm not inclined to send my projector in to get it unless it makes a distinct improvement in 3D performance.
Reply
Reply
post #285 of 793
12/31/12 at 12:19pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by AV Science Sales 5 View Post

Per the specs, max image width would be 90".


What a pity...I need 10 more inches.
Reply
Reply
post #286 of 793
12/31/12 at 12:39pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Schwa View Post

Panasonic TY-ER3D4MU glasses work (I have them and have confirmed this myself). Reviewers have commented that these are among the most comfortable glasses available, so take that FWIW.
I also imagine that Samsung SSG-4100GB glasses will work with the JVC emitter since they're known to work with Panasonic TVs that use the TY-ER3D4MU glasses. In fact, bot the Panasonic and Samsung glasses conform to the "Full HD 3D" standard, so I think it's a safe bet that any glasses that conform to that standard will work with the JVC emitter.
Please keep us posted on your pre- and post-3D firmware update impressions! Mike Garrett told me that JVC told him the update was very minor, so I'm not inclined to send my projector in to get it unless it makes a distinct improvement in 3D performance.

How do the Panasonic glasses compare with JVC? Lens size and frame size comparison, lens darkness comparison. Thanks.
Reply
Reply
post #287 of 793
12/31/12 at 2:11pm
The Panasonic lenses are not as tall as the JVCs. The frame size and lens darkness are about the same.
Reply
Reply
post #288 of 793
12/31/12 at 2:19pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Schwa View Post

The Panasonic lenses are not as tall as the JVCs. The frame size and lens darkness are about the same.

Thanks for that info. If you end up trying those Samsung's too, let us know.
Reply
Reply
post #289 of 793
12/31/12 at 6:47pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dragon Reborn View Post

Thanks for that info. If you end up trying those Samsung's too, let us know.
I won't be getting the Samsung glasses - they've gotten pretty poor reviews. They're definitely cheap though!
Reply
Reply
post #290 of 793
12/31/12 at 11:28pm
I just watched a little of Finding Nemo 3D on the JVC and, although brightness and flicker weren't really problems, the crosstalk was pretty bad. I'm really curious to get some feedback as to whether the firmware update fixes this. I don't remember the 3D being nearly as troublesome when I watched The Avengers or Men in Black 3.
Reply
Reply
post #291 of 793
1/1/13 at 6:34am
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Schwa View Post

The Panasonic lenses are not as tall as the JVCs. The frame size and lens darkness are about the same.

If you have the new JVC glasses, could you post a pic of them beside the Panasonics? Thanks.
Reply
Reply
post #292 of 793
1/1/13 at 7:54am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dragon Reborn View Post

Unfortunately, ghosting was difficult to ignore on everything I viewed, even with a relatively dark movie like Prometheus. I have one of the first batch X35 models without the switcher update, which I will now send in to JVC service whenever possible. I had crosstalk set to -8 and parallax set to anywhere from -4 to -9 (depending on the source).

Is it normal to have to adjust the JVC parallax setting between individual sources?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Schwa View Post

I just watched a little of Finding Nemo 3D on the JVC and, although brightness and flicker weren't really problems, the crosstalk was pretty bad. I'm really curious to get some feedback as to whether the firmware update fixes this. I don't remember the 3D being nearly as troublesome when I watched The Avengers or Men in Black 3.

you'll find it varies quite a bit depending on the kind of 3D content your watching. The main issue has to do with 'dark on light' ghosting where there is a dark object against the light background..

Dragon - you shouldn't have to adjust the parallax. What you're doing is just reducing the crosstalk in one area of the foreground in exchange to moving it to another location in the background if that makes sense. Ideally it should stay at the factory setting.

I haven't see any information yet on the post firmware update, but it only makes sense that it's going to be identical to the 4810's 3D. The crosstalk will be reduced at the expense of a lumen drop with varying degrees of crosstalk/brightness performance as you adjust the CT controls from 0 to 8. I'm curious to hear from someone that had the update done.
Reply
Reply
post #293 of 793
1/1/13 at 8:58am
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by zombie10k View Post

you'll find it varies quite a bit depending on the kind of 3D content your watching. The main issue has to do with 'dark on light' ghosting where there is a dark object against the light background..
Dragon - you shouldn't have to adjust the parallax. What you're doing is just reducing the crosstalk in one area of the foreground in exchange to moving it to another location in the background if that makes sense. Ideally it should stay at the factory setting.
I haven't see any information yet on the post firmware update, but it only makes sense that it's going to be identical to the 4810's 3D. The crosstalk will be reduced at the expense of a lumen drop with varying degrees of crosstalk/brightness performance as you adjust the CT controls from 0 to 8. I'm curious to hear from someone that had the update done.

Re: dark on light ghosting. Even in the dark movie of Prometheus, I found the ghosting distracting when it showed up. I really really liked how the 3D was implemented in Prometheus ... Zombie, have you watched this movie and if so, how does it rate as far as other movies (non-animated and non-documentary) go?

Re: parallax ... did not know that. Thanks for that info.

I plan to do the firmware update but first will need to get a lux meter. Just so I get the placement correct when measuring: screen > lux meter > 3D glasses > projector ?
Reply
Reply
post #294 of 793
1/1/13 at 9:51am
I did watch Prometheus on the Epson 5020 and only saw a rare instance of ghosting, overall it looked very good. I don't know if I can handle watching it again since this is how it should have ended... cool.gif

This is a good, inexpensive light meter that can be used.



Here's how to measure the lumens, I'll use my 142" 16:9 as an example.

We have to convert Sq Inches -> Sq Meters.

The screen is 70" tall x 124" wide. 70" x 124" = 8680 Sq Inches -> 5.59 Sq Meters


To get a basic lux reading, you need a 100% white screen on any basic calibration disk. You can put the projector in simulated 3D mode and make sure that 3D mode is selected from the menu. Then take a lux reading at the center of the screen with the meter facing the projector.

Lumens = LUX * Sq Meters. In this case, it's 170 * 5.59 = ~950 lumens.

The reason I said basic idea is because you should technically measure 9 points across the screen (top left, bottom right, etc) and then average the LUX reading. It will be lower than the center measurement. This is final lumen reading.

Also be sure to post how far the projector is for the screen for the guys that like crunching the #'s. With the 4810 software, there was a swing of about 300 lumens from CT @ 0 to CT @ 8.
Reply
Reply
post #295 of 793
1/1/13 at 3:50pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dragon Reborn View Post

If you have the new JVC glasses, could you post a pic of them beside the Panasonics? Thanks.

The Panasonic glasses are on the left in all but the last picture.







Reply
Reply
post #296 of 793
1/2/13 at 1:29am
I m trying to calibrate my JVC X35 in 3D mode with ChromaPure but it just doesn t work until now

I calibrate with the i1 Display III pro upgraded version. +- 50 -100IRE calibration works fine but everything from 5 - 50IRE is not doable. But maybe I am doing something wrong. My meter is positioned 30cm from the center of the screen and angled a little bit horizontal. I fixed the active shutter glasses (left eye) in front of the lens of the meter and put them on. The projector is running in 2D to 3D conversion. When I change values under 50IRE sometimes only one increment in eg. red bias all of a sudden makes the red go from eg. 80% to 120%. Besides the problem I can t get a proper grayscale the gamma is just way off. I ve tried gamma A(3D), gamme B(3D) and gamma C(3D). (These are the only ones you can choose in the 3D setting). All three give a really bad gamma curve going from 2.3@10IRE to something like 1.4@90IRE.

As starting point for the 3D calibration I use the 7500K custom setting and reduced HighGreen A LOT to get approx. 100% green from approx 30 - 100 IRE.
Reply
Reply
post #297 of 793
1/2/13 at 2:42am
Quote:
Originally Posted by sanderdvd View Post

I m trying to calibrate my JVC X35 in 3D mode with ChromaPure but it just doesn t work until now
I calibrate with the i1 Display III pro upgraded version. +- 50 -100IRE calibration works fine but everything from 5 - 50IRE is not doable. But maybe I am doing something wrong. My meter is positioned 30cm from the center of the screen and angled a little bit horizontal. I fixed the active shutter glasses (left eye) in front of the lens of the meter and put them on. The projector is running in 2D to 3D conversion. When I change values under 50IRE sometimes only one increment in eg. red bias all of a sudden makes the red go from eg. 80% to 120%. Besides the problem I can t get a proper grayscale the gamma is just way off. I ve tried gamma A(3D), gamme B(3D) and gamma C(3D). (These are the only ones you can choose in the 3D setting). All three give a really bad gamma curve going from 2.3@10IRE to something like 1.4@90IRE.
As starting point for the 3D calibration I use the 7500K custom setting and reduced HighGreen A LOT to get approx. 100% green from approx 30 - 100 IRE.

How's the fL in 50IRE? Normally Luminance behind the 3D glasses would be less than 25% of the 2D brightness. but 50IRE should be measureable...
Reply
Reply
post #298 of 793
1/2/13 at 2:46am
Quote:
Originally Posted by freebits View Post

How's the fL in 50IRE? Normally Luminance behind the 3D glasses would be less than 25% of the 2D brightness. but 50IRE should be measureable...
wel, maybe it s a bit less than 50 IRE but 35 IRE and lower is almost impossible to do it right. I also have a feeling that while in 2D making changes to the LowRGB settings act very different then in 3D.
Reply
Reply
post #299 of 793
1/2/13 at 3:13am
Quote:
Originally Posted by sanderdvd View Post

wel, maybe it s a bit less than 50 IRE but 35 IRE and lower is almost impossible to do it right. I also have a feeling that while in 2D making changes to the LowRGB settings act very different then in 3D.

All the other Gamma shows the same result? Try to choose lower gamma so that lower IREs can be less affected. I normally calibrate 3D with Gamma 2.0 or so.
If not, maybe you'll need Lumagen to get perfect gamma. Btw, I could get very flat 2D gamma w/o Lumagen from my RS4810. It's disappointing JVC didn't tweak 3D gamma enough with X35.
Reply
Reply
post #300 of 793
1/2/13 at 5:56am
Quote:
Originally Posted by freebits View Post

All the other Gamma shows the same result? Try to choose lower gamma so that lower IREs can be less affected. I normally calibrate 3D with Gamma 2.0 or so.
If not, maybe you'll need Lumagen to get perfect gamma. Btw, I could get very flat 2D gamma w/o Lumagen from my RS4810. It's disappointing JVC didn't tweak 3D gamma enough with X35.
in 3D you can only select gamma A(3D), gamme B(3D) and gamma C(3D) and not a custom gamma.
Reply
Reply
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home

Gear mentioned in this thread:

AVS › AVS Forum › Display Devices › Digital Hi-End Projectors - $3,000+ USD MSRP › Official JVC DLA-RS46 / DLA-X35 owners thread