or Connect
AVS › AVS Forum › Audio › Speakers › Tekton Pendragon
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

Tekton Pendragon - Page 51

post #1501 of 1749
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill Fitzmaurice View Post

That's not the case. Speaker's don't draw watts, though the argument can be made that they draw current. In any event, what determines how loud a speaker goes is the voltage swing provided by the amp, and that figure is decided by the amp, the speaker doesn't get a vote in the matter, unless it's too much, and then it will reveal its displeasure by the release of magic smoke. mad.gif
I had replied hastily while at work, but are you saying that a speaker powered to say, 80 db, would draw more current at that same 80db from some amps, than from others? I am not an EE, but being an aircraft mechanic I have some knowledge of electrical, and this makes no sense to me? My point was that the preamp determines how much current, or watts is consumed by the speaker, to the limits of the amp, or speaker.
post #1502 of 1749
Quote:
Originally Posted by carp View Post

At any rate, 104 or 107 db's at the LP from one speaker is VERY LOUD!!! smile.gif

Which is why I struggle with the fact that part of me wants a separate amp for my speakers since there is no way I'm using all the power from my avr as it is.

I succumbed to the struggle. I'm at peace now biggrin.gif.

Not trying to be a wanker, just sayin' is all tongue.gifbiggrin.gif
post #1503 of 1749
Quote:
Originally Posted by jdcrox View Post

I had replied hastily while at work, but are you saying that a speaker powered to say, 80 db, would draw more current at that same 80db from some amps, than from others? I am not an EE, but being an aircraft mechanic I have some knowledge of electrical, and this makes no sense to me?
Nor to me.
Quote:
My point was that the preamp determines how much current, or watts is consumed by the speaker, to the limits of the amp, or speaker.
You never mentioned the pre-amp. You said "Really amps do not "push" watts to speakers, rather speakers draw what they need.", which is not the case.
post #1504 of 1749
Quote:
Originally Posted by Soundman5000 View Post

I have yet to open up my Pendragons. Does anyone know if this tweeter ( SB Acoustics SB29RDCN-C000-4) is the one in the Pens?

http://www.madisoundspeakerstore.com/ring-radiator-tweeters/sb-acoustics-sb29rdcn-c000-4-neo-magnet-ring-dome-tweeter/

These look like the one in the pens from the front. Assuming these are the ones I see they are rated @ 100 w with the proper crossover point.

Thats a huge power rating for a tweeter. Heck, my Pro EV horn drivers are only rated at 60w and have survived a live show with 4,000 crazy bikers.

I would think these tweets would be very hard to fry but that gets me back to wondering if the crossover is designed with-in spec. The tweet mfg says they need a high-pass Butterworth, 2600 Hz. 12 dB/oct crossover.

As a Pendragon owner I am thinking it may be worthwhile to pick a few up for spare just in case. Would be a bad thing to pop one after they stop making replacements a year or so from now. I was able to get some B&W parts 15 years later but may not be so lucky with the Pendragons.

Right. That's a very high power rating for the super tweeters. Makes one wonder... Can someone that knows what they are looking at take a peek?
post #1505 of 1749
Quote:
Originally Posted by Toymachyne View Post

Right. That's a very high power rating for the super tweeters.
Not as high as you might think. 100w sounds impressive, but that's with a 2.5kHz 12dB filter, which translates to an actual power rating of closer to 10 watts. That's where the THD of the system comes in. With a clean signal you won't see more than 10 watts above 2.5kHz with a 100w full range signal. But if you have high THD you can easily reach 20 watts, and that will toast a tweeter in short order.
Quote:
Pro EV horn drivers are only rated at 60w and have survived a live show with 4,000 crazy bikers.
Those horn drivers may have 20dB higher sensitivity than a direct radiator, so where dB output is concerned 60w into those could equal 6000w into a direct radiator.
post #1506 of 1749
Thread Starter 
I finished the speaker grilles and I doubt if they look any better than what Eric put out. They look fine from the front though. I basically stapled the speaker cloth to the frame and inserted the Madisound pegs into the holes I drilled. I built 3 grilles for the mains + the center. In the following parts and cost list I'll just list for the mains.

Here's the material and cost list:
Madisound pegs: 8 pegs @ $.41 each = $3.28 + shipping
Speaker cloth from Parts Express: 1 Yd. $24.50 + ship. (Less expensive is available)
11"x16" X11"x16" wood for the frame from Menard's: $7.00 for an 8' piece x 2=$14.00 .
Tools extra. Total= $42.00 + shipping

Instructions:
Cut the pieces of 11"x16" : 2 pieces 10-3/16" for top & bottom and 2 pieces 31-1/16" for the sides. (For the center speaker 31-1/4")
Glue the top & bottom pieces inside the side pieces. I used vice clamp and wood glue.
For the Madisound pegs I had to use a 3/8" drill bit. This is where it gets a little complicated. The frame is a little tight for the speakers so I had to offset the pegs on one side of the frame. The flange on the pegs overhangs the frame by maybe a 1/16". It's the only way to make it fit. The drilled hole is right on the edge of the frame. When I drilled the hole I used the vice clamp to hold the wood so it wouldn't split. I measured the distance between the holes on the speaker from the center of the hole. Then I used a straightedge like a framing square to line up the drilling points on the frame. The frame will touch the drivers on one side. The wood will have to be trimmed back if you don't want it touching the drivers. I was going to use sandpaper but I remembered I had a Dremel tool with a sanding drum attachment. This worked great and fast. I sanded an area of about 2" long so the wood didn't touch. Hope this makes sense.
Once that's done cut and lay out a piece of speaker cloth. Allow extra material and staple the sides to the frame first then the ends. Pull tight as you go. I started in the center of the rail on each piece. Corners are a pain. There's a few video's out there if you do a search under speaker grille cloth. After everything is stapled I cut the material back around the drilled holes and I glued the pegs in the holes. It's a good idea to make sure everything lines up before stapling the cloth. Trim the excess cloth around the frame. That's about it. The front of the grille is all that matters so I didn't spend too much time making sure everything on the back was just right.














post #1507 of 1749
Those are great! They're sure better than the no-grills I have on my Mini-Lores (ordered nearly a year ago now).

That's much more carpentry than I ever do, but I may give it a try anyway. The empty grill-peg holes in my otherwise-beautiful speakers make me a little sad every day. What a shame.
post #1508 of 1749

?


Edited by sagasa - 11/19/13 at 4:40pm
post #1509 of 1749
Quote:
Originally Posted by DarkRail View Post

Those are great! They're sure better than the no-grills I have on my Mini-Lores (ordered nearly a year ago now).

That's much more carpentry than I ever do, but I may give it a try anyway. The empty grill-peg holes in my otherwise-beautiful speakers make me a little sad every day. What a shame.

Kensmith48 did a great job on his grills! I thank him for posting all the details and pics!
However, it is such a shame that it has come to this.

When I was a Real Estate agent I had a home builder that would obsess on things like his hard wood floors. He would put like 7 coats of clear and had the best looking floors in town but when we did an open house all the cable coax wall pates would be missing. In the business it was said he was not a good finisher.

When customers would tour the house all they would see when looking at that shiny floor was the ugly reflection of a black coax cable hanging out the wall.

Those empty grill-peg holes to me were like my builders lack of coax plates.

Some people just don't get it. He makes a good speaker but for goodness sake finish the dang thing!
Edited by Soundman5000 - 11/20/13 at 9:46pm
post #1510 of 1749
Thread Starter 
Thanks Soundman,

I sent an e-mail to Tekton requesting some nameplates for the speakers. Daniel said he would send some about a week ago but so far I haven't rec'd them. When and if I get them I'll post pics of the 3 completed speakers w/ grilles.

Ken
post #1511 of 1749
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kensmith48 View Post

Thanks Soundman,

I sent an e-mail to Tekton requesting some nameplates for the speakers. Daniel said he would send some about a week ago but so far I haven't rec'd them. When and if I get them I'll post pics of the 3 completed speakers w/ grilles.

Ken
Don't hold your breath. I asked three times and they never sent them
post #1512 of 1749
Thread cleanup
post #1513 of 1749
Quote:
Originally Posted by chalugadp View Post

Don't hold your breath. I asked three times and they never sent them
Were you in a dark bathroom staring in a mirror when you said it?

"nameplates. nameplates. nameplates."

(should be funny for those who get one of the references... an odd question for those who do not)
post #1514 of 1749
I used to scare my kids when they were little by saying Candyman.
post #1515 of 1749
I ordered my front 3(LCR) speakers - all Pendragon -SE around 3rd. week of Aug. I had them delivered this morning. Promised delivery was 6 weeks, delivered in 12 weeks. Still stuck at work. Will get my first listen tonight.
Will post an update in a week or so.
post #1516 of 1749
Quote:
Originally Posted by cmohan View Post

I ordered my front 3(LCR) speakers - all Pendragon -SE around 3rd. week of Aug. I had them delivered this morning. Promised delivery was 6 weeks, delivered in 12 weeks. Still stuck at work. Will get my first listen tonight.
Will post an update in a week or so.

Congrats! A picture is worth a thousand words...Please post some pics of your new additions to your living room and give us a report. Enjoy!
Edited by Soundman5000 - 11/25/13 at 6:43pm
post #1517 of 1749
Just wanted to thank chalugadp for the Pendragon center channel. It arrived safely and well packed. Looks and sounds amazing. Thanks so much for an excellent price and transaction.
Cheers!!!!biggrin.gif
post #1518 of 1749
Quote:
Originally Posted by scottvamp View Post

Just wanted to thank chalugadp for the Pendragon center channel. It arrived safely and well packed. Looks and sounds amazing. Thanks so much for an excellent price and transaction.
Cheers!!!!biggrin.gif

Great to hear !!!! It was my first time packing a speaker and I learned a lot. I still have a pair of Oriel 10's for sale at $475 for them plus shipping . They are in great condition and sound sweet. I am selling because I want to build my own speakers with high end veneers and that are capable of extreme spl with no problem .

With mine there is no 3 month wait and no other issues. If interested pm me. smile.gif
post #1519 of 1749
Thread Starter 
It doesn't look like Eric/Daniel is going to send the nameplates anytime soon so I thought I'd post pics of the diy grilles.





Edited by Kensmith48 - 11/30/13 at 9:30am
post #1520 of 1749
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kensmith48 View Post

It doesn't look like Eric/Daniel is going to send the nameplates anytime soon so I thought I'd post pics of the diy grilles.





Great looking job!
post #1521 of 1749
Great job on the grills...Your pics make me want to come over and watch a movie and I am a 2 channel guy!

My late father had this thing about advertising for someone. He would not buy a car if the dealer put a tag or anything on the car with any advertising. He always said they need to pay him to advertise.
With that in mind, if I had to build my own grills I don't think I would go to any trouble to advertising for Eric with his logo. They look better without IMO!
post #1522 of 1749
Thread Starter 
Thanks, Guys,

I do the same with car dealers. Just bought a Honda Accord (for my wife) and I told them not to put any dealer decals on.

I thought the nameplates would dress up the speakers a little. My wife wonders why he didn't put them on without the grills. She said she never saw any piece of electronic gear that I've purchased without a serial number except for these speakers.

Ken
post #1523 of 1749
Oddly: no one seems upset that the manufacturer is advertising by putting their name and the model name on the car wink.gif
post #1524 of 1749
I never thought about that. The Pendragons have no name on them... I had to check to be sure and nope nothing lol
post #1525 of 1749
Thread Starter 
I just sent an e-mail to Eric/Daniel asking why they feel they have to lie to their customers. I said if you don't have the nameplates or don't want to send them just say so and quit leading people on.
post #1526 of 1749
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kensmith48 View Post

I just sent an e-mail to Eric/Daniel asking why they feel they have to lie to their customers. I said if you don't have the nameplates or don't want to send them just say so and quit leading people on.
Perhaps they fancy a future in politics? rolleyes.gif
post #1527 of 1749
To me, the reason they haven't sent them is because they didn't order them. And the most likely reason they didn't order them is because they didn't have the money to pay for them which really ought to be a stock item. As to the speakers not having serial numbers, well that's just bush league. Of course, if a reviewer made note of a serial number and then sent the speaker back, there'd be no way to then sell it as new because of the paper trail.
post #1528 of 1749
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chu Gai View Post

To me, the reason they haven't sent them is because they didn't order them. And the most likely reason they didn't order them is because they didn't have the money to pay for them which really ought to be a stock item. As to the speakers not having serial numbers, well that's just bush league. Of course, if a reviewer made note of a serial number and then sent the speaker back, there'd be no way to then sell it as new because of the paper trail.
Or change the sticker / plate.
post #1529 of 1749

I've just received a set of two Pendragons and had some questions about setup.  I am new to this forum and this is my first set of decent speakers so I apologize in advance if any of these have been answered before.

 

Just some details about my setup:

 

Room :  Home is an 'open concept' with post and beam construction so doesn't have a normal layout.  About 22 feet long, 24 feet wide, and 12 foot ceilings at the highest point.  There is a massive chimney in the middle of the room.

 

Receiver : onkyo 818 (not using any separate amps, but am considering adding a Crown NXLS2000 to drive the fronts)

Sub : ADS MS3-u

 

Pendragons are spaced 2 feet from the back wall and six feet apart from each other.  About two inches of toe-in.

 

Center/Surrounds/Surround Rears : Carried over from my last system which was a onkyo htib.  Plan on upgrading these eventually, but wanted to get the fronts upgraded first as I mainly use the setup for listening to music.

 

So far I'm pretty blown away by the sound but have noticed that the bass doesn't have as much 'impact' as I would've expected.  I know that most reviews seem to emphasize this aspect so I'm guessing something about my setup is off.  I'm getting a nice full range of sound, it just seems like the power in the mid and lower range isn't quite there.  I'm not expecting subwoofer levels of bass but by the size of the drivers it seems like there should be a significant 'punch'.

 

Some causes might be:

 

1.  Insufficient 'break-in'.  I've only played them for about 5 hours so far, not sure what kind of difference waiting the recommended break-in time will make (I've read 40-200hrs).

2.  Insufficient amp power - The 818 is a pretty lowly receiver for this caliber of speaker so maybe it is to blame?  The thing is I can play them plenty loud without distortion, but the bass impact doesn't seem to scale up with the higher volume like I expected.  Would more amp power improve this?  Also, the woofers don't seem to move much even at high volume...is this normal with these speakers or do other owners notice much movement while playing loud?

3.  Bad room setup - I used the audessy xt32 setup of the 818 which seemed to apply good settings (the pendragons are crossed over at 40 hz).  Not sure if the distance from the back wall or the weirdness of the room in general might be robbing some of the bass impact.  I've tried running from multiple sources with audessy enabled and disabled and while the sound definitely changes the bass performance seems similar.

4.  I've read one post in these forums from user 'Brouham' that he had the speaker terminals reversed so that the positive terminal was connected to the black (negative) binding post and vice versa.  http://www.avsforum.com/t/1446325/tekton-pendragon/150

Has anyone encountered this with their Pendragons?  How would I test something like that?

 

Thanks for any input.


Edited by arexsvn - 12/6/13 at 11:52am
post #1530 of 1749
Those eminence drivers will take 50 hours to sound decent and more to really hit their stride.

Is it possible that the Pen location has resulted in the listening position being in a bass null? Disconnect the subs and listen...and crawl around the floor and listen.

Is it possible that the subs are a problem...disconnect the Pens and just listen to the subs including the crawl to see where they sound best. If they don't have their best bass at the listening position then they may need moved.

Finally, the Pens go deep...why cross them at all..
Run them full range and use the subs to augment from 35 hz down.
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: Speakers
AVS › AVS Forum › Audio › Speakers › Tekton Pendragon