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Anyone here using an Emotiva UMC-200? What are your thoughts?

post #1 of 344
1/4/13 at 5:42am
Thread Starter 
I have the itch to get a new piece of gear again. And was going to give the Emo UMC-200 a try. It's gotten pretty good reviews and the Emo fan club seems happy. I'd like to know if anyone here has put it through it's paces. I am a fan of what Emo has to offer at a given price point. I have all Emo speakers and interconnects. I'm currently running an Onkyo 818 which I think sounds great. And it powers my outdoor speakers just fine via zone 2. I have an Outlaw 7500 5 channel amp for the interior speakers. I'm looking to get even better sound quality out of my speakers. I've been happy with the 818, but for $600, if I can get even better sound, I'd be willing to give it a shot.

Here is my setup:
LG 60" Plasma
Onkyo 818
Outlaw Audio 7500 5 channel amp (300 x 5 at 4ohm)
Emotiva ERM 6.2 (Fronts)
Emotiva ERM 6.3 (Center)
Emotiva ERD-1 (Surrounds)
Oppo BDC-103 BluRay player
Fios STB
PS3
Apple TV3

Zone 2:
Emotiva UOM-6.2 (powered by Onkyo)

So I know if I go with the Emo UMC-200 and stay with it I will need a 2 channel amp to run my outdoor speakers. Not worried because in NY they don't get used until April or May. I can buy an amp over the next few months.

I'm more concerned with getting even better sound quality out of my music. I listen to music 60%,TV/Movies 40%. So my preference is the sound quality with music. I doubt anyone has compared the Onkyo vs UMC-200, but any feedback on the UMC-200 would be appreciated.
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post #2 of 344
1/4/13 at 9:03am
One thought would be to wait for them to release their flagship XMC-1 although it's going to be more than twice the price. I don't own a UMC-200 so I can't give you an owner's perspective, but it and the Outlaw 975 seem to offer pretty good bang for buck. The UMC has no option for video processing (or legacy inputs), and the 975 has no room correction, but both of these features are pretty basic versions. From what I've read, the sound quality is a step up from an AVR, from what many owners are saying.

Apparently the UMC sale price may go up after the 15th.
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post #3 of 344
1/4/13 at 1:52pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by runnin' View Post

One thought would be to wait for them to release their flagship XMC-1 although it's going to be more than twice the price. I don't own a UMC-200 so I can't give you an owner's perspective, but it and the Outlaw 975 seem to offer pretty good bang for buck. The UMC has no option for video processing (or legacy inputs), and the 975 has no room correction, but both of these features are pretty basic versions. From what I've read, the sound quality is a step up from an AVR, from what many owners are saying.
Apparently the UMC sale price may go up after the 15th.

If I buy the UMC-200 and like it, I will sell the 818 to offset the cost. I will then have a 25% discount on the XMC when it comes out. Sounds quality is more important than anything to me. I have no legacy components so no worries there. I'll probably order it this weekend and test. I can always return it and stick with the 818 if I hear no audible superiority I guess.
Edited by joeyvaz - 1/4/13 at 1:58pm
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post #4 of 344
1/4/13 at 2:15pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by joeyvaz View Post

So I know if I go with the Emo UMC-200 and stay with it I will need a 2 channel amp to run my outdoor speakers. Not worried because in NY they don't get used until April or May. I can buy an amp over the next few months.
I'm more concerned with getting even better sound quality out of my music. I listen to music 60%,TV/Movies 40%. So my preference is the sound quality with music. I doubt anyone has compared the Onkyo vs UMC-200, but any feedback on the UMC-200 would be appreciated.

Are you using Audyssey XT32 with the 818? Are you using HDMI or the analog outputs of the Oppo 103 to the 818? If you are happy with XT32 and are using HDMI I would stick with the 818. I doubt you will find much if any SQ differences between the 818 and the UMC-200.

Bill
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post #5 of 344
1/5/13 at 6:47pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill Mac View Post

Are you using Audyssey XT32 with the 818? Are you using HDMI or the analog outputs of the Oppo 103 to the 818? If you are happy with XT32 and are using HDMI I would stick with the 818. I doubt you will find much if any SQ differences between the 818 and the UMC-200.
Bill

Yes, Using xt32 and all of my sources are HDMI. The only thing I am disappointed about with the 818 is the lack of multi channel inputs. I have a nice collection of SACD and DVD-A discs that I'd like to listen to via the analog out on the Oppo, but I can't at this point.
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post #6 of 344
1/5/13 at 7:13pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by joeyvaz View Post

Yes, Using xt32 and all of my sources are HDMI. The only thing I am disappointed about with the 818 is the lack of multi channel inputs. I have a nice collection of SACD and DVD-A discs that I'd like to listen to via the analog out on the Oppo, but I can't at this point.

I'm using HDMI out of my 103 with XT32 to listen to SACD/DVD-As and I'm very happy with the SQ. When using the 7.1 analog input for multichannel music you have to use the basic bass management and speaker settings of the Oppo. I have done numerous comparisons between the 5.1 analog input and HDMI with XT32 when listening to SACD/DVD-As. I much prefer using HDMI and XT32 over analog with no room correction or sub EQ.

Bill
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post #7 of 344
1/5/13 at 7:31pm
+1 There is no need for multichannel connections. Bass management via multichannel connections is always inferior to an AVR's bass management. I would recommend keeping the 818 versus buying the UMC-200. Unless you like investing in headaches and lack luster performance. Then buy all means throw your money away in an Emotiva pre amp processor. Just so you know I own several Emotiva amplifiers but you couldn't give me an Emotiva pre amp processor for free.
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post #8 of 344
1/5/13 at 7:53pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Secret Squirrel View Post

+1 There is no need for multichannel connections. Bass management via multichannel connections is always inferior to an AVR's bass management. I would recommend keeping the 818 versus buying the UMC-200. Unless you like investing in headaches and lack luster performance. Then buy all means throw your money away in an Emotiva pre amp processor. Just so you know I own several Emotiva amplifiers but you couldn't give me an Emotiva pre amp processor for free.

I'd take one for free! And turn around and sell it. I recently sold a UMC-1 and bought an NR818. Works for me and I haven't (yet) seen the 24fps glitch.

As for playing SACD and DVD-A sources the NR818 plays them fine over HDMI. I don't know why you would prefer playing them through an analog source since the NR818 has very good DACs built in. IMO multi-channel inputs are going the way of the other legacy audio/video connections to make room for the new stuff. Embrace the technology!biggrin.gif
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post #9 of 344
1/5/13 at 8:00pm
You just hit 6,666 posts. Pretty cool.
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post #10 of 344
1/5/13 at 8:03pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Secret Squirrel View Post

You just hit 6,666 posts. Pretty cool.

I just noticed that as well smile.gif.

Bill
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post #11 of 344
1/5/13 at 8:12pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Secret Squirrel View Post

+1 There is no need for multichannel connections. Bass management via multichannel connections is always inferior to an AVR's bass management. I would recommend keeping the 818 versus buying the UMC-200. Unless you like investing in headaches and lack luster performance. Then buy all means throw your money away in an Emotiva pre amp processor. Just so you know I own several Emotiva amplifiers but you couldn't give me an Emotiva pre amp processor for free.

My thoughts exactly. I own Emotiva amps and wouldn't hesitate to buy more but, I bought a UMC-1 for the discount card and was so disappointed with it that I'd be ashamed to even give it away. The only nice thing I can say about it is that the LEDs were a pleasing shade of blue. A decent mainstream AVR with some flavor of Audyssey and pre-outs to a beefier amp is a pretty fantastic setup. If the OP wants better sound quality, well placed and quality room treatments will make a much bigger difference than any pre-amp down/up/side-grade.
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post #12 of 344
1/5/13 at 8:21pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by dmsdms View Post

A decent mainstream AVR with some flavor of Audyssey and pre-outs to a beefier amp is a pretty fantastic setup. If the OP wants better sound quality, well placed and quality room treatments will make a much bigger difference than any pre-amp down/up/side-grade.

I agree 100% with both of the above statements. I'm still amazed that some say the UMC-1 and the UMC-200 blow away similar priced AVRs. I really do not see where the improvements that they claim to hear are coming from. Maybe its after several tall glasses of blueberry Kool-Aid biggrin.gif.

Bill
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post #13 of 344
1/5/13 at 10:46pm
The advantage to the UMC-200 would be in the EQ ability - 11 band parametric per channel + 4 bands for the sub and fully adjustable by the user. No AVR I know of has that. Mine will arrive in a few weeks.
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post #14 of 344
1/5/13 at 10:54pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Trackman View Post

The advantage to the UMC-200 would be in the EQ ability - 11 band parametric per channel + 4 bands for the sub and fully adjustable by the user. No AVR I know of has that. Mine will arrive in a few weeks.

Might want to check over at the Emotiva Lounge in this thread (post #33) that discusses an issue with the UMC-200's FW and using the PEQ.

Bill
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post #15 of 344
1/5/13 at 11:50pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Trackman View Post

The advantage to the UMC-200 would be in the EQ ability - 11 band parametric per channel + 4 bands for the sub and fully adjustable by the user. No AVR I know of has that. Mine will arrive in a few weeks.

That is indeed a very important feature if you are using EmoQ. It will allow you to undo the Aiwa Boombox sound that EmoQ will give you even with nice speakers, a treated room and a perfectly leveled microphone.
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post #16 of 344
1/6/13 at 7:38am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill Mac View Post

Might want to check over at the Emotiva Lounge in this thread (post #33) that discusses an issue with the UMC-200's FW and using the PEQ.
Bill

Thanks for the heads up - I was aware of that. The initial firmware was fine - this popped up on some 2d gen units. Hopefully, the updated (3d gen) firmware on mine will have eliminated that possibility. As I recall, that situation was a factory QC slip that can be avoided by simply resetting the defaults at initial start up.
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post #17 of 344
1/6/13 at 7:40am
Quote:
Originally Posted by dmsdms View Post

That is indeed a very important feature if you are using EmoQ. It will allow you to undo the Aiwa Boombox sound that EmoQ will give you even with nice speakers, a treated room and a perfectly leveled microphone.

Haven't heard this complaint about EmoQ2. The original EmoQ I am not familiar with.
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post #18 of 344
1/6/13 at 8:02am
I'm in the process of updateing and have narrowed it down to this pre-amp and a 5 Amp....Or just buying a Denon 4520 .......One of the featurers I frown on is thoses push up and down buttons instead of a big knob for the volume. I just hate thoses things. Car radios were bad about that feature also. You never saw the factories do it, just the aftermarket.When setting up the second zones I always do it at the reciever and not the remote. I still use a MX-700 Universal and sometimes its just easier, and quicker to walk over to the unit and do it by hand. You are already standing there after loading the CD anyway......... I'm guessing its a cheaper way to do it (no Knob), but in my eyes really does cheapen them up.
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post #19 of 344
1/6/13 at 8:28am
Quote:
Originally Posted by ss3740 View Post

I'm in the process of updateing and have narrowed it down to this pre-amp and a 5 Amp....Or just buying a Denon 4520 .......One of the featurers I frown on is thoses push up and down buttons instead of a big knob for the volume. I just hate thoses things. Car radios were bad about that feature also. You never saw the factories do it, just the aftermarket.When setting up the second zones I always do it at the reciever and not the remote. I still use a MX-700 Universal and sometimes its just easier, and quicker to walk over to the unit and do it by hand. You are already standing there after loading the CD anyway......... I'm guessing its a cheaper way to do it (no Knob), but in my eyes really does cheapen them up.

I would buy the 4520.

Bill
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post #20 of 344
1/6/13 at 1:21pm
Bill

Thanks...I think my mind is made up.I have went back and forth for two weeks. Will do something (one way or the other) next week.....Whatever the choice, I'm makeing it a 2 fer and ordering a Oppo 103 at the same time as my old one just went in the trash can....
Not trying to hyjack the thread....So I will leave it at that...Jeff
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post #21 of 344
1/7/13 at 12:19pm
Unfortunately, the 818 improperly handles 24P sources converting 23.976 FPS to 24 FPS which causes some frame skips.
I have one unopened while I see if I can return it.

I have owned an 885, 885 and how have a 808 and PR-DC5507 preamp.
One thing is for sure, counting on Onkyo to fix it is far too optimistic for me

Unfortunately, the UMC-200 is missing power on volume and, more importantly, max volume settings.
I emailed Emotiva sales to see if there are planned. If so, I might give a UMC-200 a spin.

- Rich
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post #22 of 344
1/7/13 at 2:53pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by RichB View Post

Unfortunately, the 818 improperly handles 24P sources converting 23.976 FPS to 24 FPS which causes some frame skips.
I have one unopened while I see if I can return it.
I have owned an 885, 885 and how have a 808 and PR-DC5507 preamp.
One thing is for sure, counting on Onkyo to fix it is far too optimistic for me
Unfortunately, the UMC-200 is missing power on volume and, more importantly, max volume settings.
I emailed Emotiva sales to see if there are planned. If so, I might give a UMC-200 a spin.
- Rich

Would sending the video straight to your display be an option for the 24p bug? Don't count on Emotiva to implement power on volume or max volume settings with the UMC-200. I requested it as an option with the UMC-1 and it never happened. Both of these volume settings are available on many $200 AVRs. For some reason Emotiva does not think these settings are needed. I was thinking of this today when powering off my system after listening to some music. I had the volume on my 4311 at about -10dB. I thought how bad it would be if the 4311 powered up at that volume while my wife was watching Ellen eek.gif. I have the 4311's power up volume set to -35dB and the maximum volume of -10dB. If I'm having a "loud" listening session I'll raise the max to 0dB. But I always set it back to -10dB.

Bill
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post #23 of 344
1/7/13 at 5:15pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill Mac View Post

Would sending the video straight to your display be an option for the 24p bug? Don't count on Emotiva to implement power on volume or max volume settings with the UMC-200. I requested it as an option with the UMC-1 and it never happened. Both of these volume settings are available on many $200 AVRs. For some reason Emotiva does not think these settings are needed. I was thinking of this today when powering off my system after listening to some music. I had the volume on my 4311 at about -10dB. I thought how bad it would be if the 4311 powered up at that volume while my wife was watching Ellen eek.gif. I have the 4311's power up volume set to -35dB and the maximum volume of -10dB. If I'm having a "loud" listening session I'll raise the max to 0dB. But I always set it back to -10dB.
Bill

Thanks Bill,

I write them about the issue.
I guess it might be a good test to see what they say...

- Rich
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post #24 of 344
1/9/13 at 12:06pm
I had a pretty rough experience with the UMC 1...I really like other emotiva products and can happily recommend their other stuff.

It would take a very serious product to get me away from Onkyo/Denon at this point. Onkyo is on its second strike with me for problems with a 905...Denon is my darling right now with the 4311.
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post #25 of 344
1/9/13 at 12:14pm
Well, I got nowhere with "Max Volume" request for the UMC-200 or upcoming XMC-1.

Perhaps the person handling sales is not well plugged in.
I like the idea that the XMC-1 is trying to be a giant killer.

Here is what I write them in response to after they wished me luck finding a processor that meets my needs.
Quote:
Hello XXX,

Thank you for responding.
Unfortunately, I cannot purchase a product without this feature as I have small children, over 20,000 dollar speakers, and a 400 watt per channel amp. It is far too dangerous.

I applaud your desire to take on the high end processors.
However, with high end processors come high end equipment.

Please consider this carefully because I fear you will eventually have to address this deficiency to achieve the success you desire.

Best Regards,

- Rich

P.S. Here is a comparission chart I sent them:



I really wanted to buy their products too. All I was looking for was a statement that the feature made sense and they will provide down the line.


- Rich
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post #26 of 344
1/9/13 at 2:05pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by RichB View Post

Well, I got nowhere with "Max Volume" request for the UMC-200 or upcoming XMC-1. I really wanted to buy their products too. All I was looking for was a statement that the feature made sense and they will provide down the line.
- Rich

It really is amazing to me that Emotiva will not add selectable power on volume and maximum volume settings on their prepros. These are basic features that everyone can find useful IMO. When you see $300 AVRs with these features one can see it isn't an expensive feature to add to a prepro.

Bill
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post #27 of 344
1/9/13 at 2:37pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill Mac View Post

It really is amazing to me that Emotiva will not add selectable power on volume and maximum volume settings on their prepros. These are basic features that everyone can find useful IMO. When you see $300 AVRs with these features one can see it isn't an expensive feature to add to a prepro.
Bill

+1. I recently bought a Sony 5700ES and it does not have this feature. However it has all the apps (I do not need) that most already have on their blue ray or other devise. Makes no sense, however it is not a show stopper as it has great sound.

IMO the UMC is offered as a entry level processor. It is unusual for someone with $20,000 speakers to be seeking a cheapo processor.

Thowe $300 AVR's do not have pre outs. Maybe the cost for pre out is = to volume control and you have to offer one or the other.smile.gif
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post #28 of 344
1/9/13 at 3:40pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by MUDCAT45 View Post

+1. I recently bought a Sony 5700ES and it does not have this feature. However it has all the apps (I do not need) that most already have on their blue ray or other devise. Makes no sense, however it is not a show stopper as it has great sound.
IMO the UMC is offered as a entry level processor. It is unusual for someone with $20,000 speakers to be seeking a cheapo processor.
Thowe $300 AVR's do not have pre outs. Maybe the cost for pre out is = to volume control and you have to offer one or the other.smile.gif

I was not given any indication that there is a plan to add it to the XMC-1 which Emotiva sales called a "Giant Killer".
My speakers are large tongue.gif

- Rich
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post #29 of 344
1/9/13 at 4:26pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by RichB View Post

I was not given any indication that there is a plan to add it to the XMC-1 which Emotiva sales called a "Giant Killer".

I've heard the its a "Giant Killer" from Emotiva before. It didn't happen for me with the UMC-1 wink.gif. I hope it becomes a reality with the XMC-1.

Bill
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post #30 of 344
1/9/13 at 6:52pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill Mac View Post

I've heard the its a "Giant Killer" from Emotiva before. It didn't happen for me with the UMC-1 wink.gif. I hope it becomes a reality with the XMC-1.

Bill

I like the feature set of the UMC-200, UMC-500, and XMC-1. I would like to see them succeed.

- Rich
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