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Official Panasonic TC-PxxST60 Series thread - Page 111

post #3301 of 12381
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bond 007 View Post

Even 5.1 sounds better with a 7.1 system. There is a big difference especially with front height presence speakers. And 2.0 music also sounds better with 7 speakers instead of 5. When is the last time you saw a car audio system that only had 2 speakers since its only for stereo sound anyway? wink.gif

Maybe if you have low quality speakers or a poor setup in general. 2.0 music sounds best with a 2.0 or 2.1 setup. Processing it to fill up 5 extra speakers won't improve a thing.

5.1 processed to 7.1 does sounds great however.
post #3302 of 12381
Quote:
Originally Posted by MechanicalMan View Post

FWIW, you don't need to feel compelled to purchase or use a center channel speaker. This is the wrong place to debate the subject, but as others have said, you could go without a center speaker. I personally have a 4.1 system, and I have no plans to add a center speaker.

Currently my speaker calibrator has my 5.1 setup converted into a 4.1 (due to the room conditions and/or speaker placement). While sitting dead center, the phantom center sounds phenomenal. It's much more enveloping and life-like than my center handling dialogue (in this particular room). Sadly it's not without it's flaws. Moving 3 inches left or right will complete destroy the illusion. It's especially problematic when more than one person is watching. Nothing worse than hearing audio coming from what seems 3ft. right or left of the screen.
post #3303 of 12381
Quote:
Originally Posted by omzworld View Post

I am a fence sitter at the moment for 55St60. My only concerns being: Is plasma easy to ship? I will be taking the TV back to India either by Flight cargo or shipping it. Further I will be changing my apartment in 3 months(around 80miles). So is it safe? I have LED is much safer in this regard

Why not just buy the TV in India? Isn't India's power grid 220 Volt @ 50hZ? If so, a North American TV won't be compatible. Also, the warranty is void if the TV is taken to a different country than it was sold in. And it's very possible that it will get damaged while being shipped halfway around the world.


post #3304 of 12381
Quote:
Originally Posted by omzworld View Post

I am a fence sitter at the moment for 55St60.
My only concerns being:
  1. Is plasma easy to ship? I will be taking the TV back to India either by Flight cargo or shipping it. Further I will be changing my apartment in 3 months(around 80miles). So is it safe? I have LED is much safer in this regard
  2. Does the white look greyish if open window present in a room?

My personal recommendation is for you to go look at one in-store for yourself. Only you can tell if the whites are going to bother you. I personally feel like if you are a LED/LCD user and you are pleased with your experiences, then you MAY be disappointed with a plasma. Because obviously bright whites and lighter blacks don't bother you or you like them.

If you are a plasma fan (like most of the people in this thread) - this is the BEST TV for your money (value). Awesome blacks, awesome 2D picture, more settings, etc....

As far as shipping, it's hard to say. Both are a risk. The trip and how the crew handles each one will determine if it breaks NOT the type of set you buy.

Hope this helps.
post #3305 of 12381
Quote:
Originally Posted by RandyWalters View Post

Why not just buy the TV in India? Isn't India's power grid 220 Volt @ 50hZ? If so, a North American TV won't be compatible. Also, the warranty is void if the TV is taken to a different country than it was sold in. And it's very possible that it will get damaged while being shipped halfway around the world.



I thought my cable clutter was bad wink.gif
post #3306 of 12381
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stump909 View Post

Maybe if you have low quality speakers or a poor setup in general. 2.0 music sounds best with a 2.0 or 2.1 setup. Processing it to fill up 5 extra speakers won't improve a thing.

5.1 processed to 7.1 does sounds great however.
I have a 7ch Stereo option on my receiver and it sounds great. What you suggest is that all car systems should only have 2 speakers. Have you ripped out all but the front 2 speakers in your car?
post #3307 of 12381
Quote:
Originally Posted by RandyWalters View Post

D'oh - i was going to recommend trying a remote for an older Panny Pro Monitor model - they have an "Off Timer" key (works the same as the Sleep key on a TV), and some of these remotes also have the discrete ON and OFF keys that are handy to help set up macros on a learning remote. The EUR7636070R is one such remote, and there's currently one on Ebay for $9 (Ebay Item number: 221221281607). Maybe you can cancel the Amazon order in time if you think this Pro remote is a better option?

PS - curious if you tried just leaving your Mute icon on the screen for several seconds to see if it extinguishes itself after 3 seconds like my GT50 does?

My order already shows as shipped, I'll live with it if it solves the sleep timer (though discreet on/off would be great).

The MUTE icon stays on the screen, waited about 30 secs then gave EXIT key a tap and was happy.

Thanks again for the suggestions.
post #3308 of 12381
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bond 007 View Post

I have a 7ch Stereo option on my receiver and it sounds great. What you suggest is that all car systems should only have 2 speakers. Have you ripped out all but the front 2 speakers in your car?

Buddy, you don't want to start this haha. One should never use a car as an example of quality audio fidelity. It's impossible with the sheer number of reflections such a cramped space will create (plus windows and other non sound wave friendly materials). It's not like your car is upconverting the 2.0 music to 4.0 or whatever. It's just playing the left channel on the left speakers and the right channel in the right. Your 7ch stereo option may sound "great", but that's probably more of an "ignorance is bliss" thing. What kind of speakers do you have? That, source material, speaker arrangement, and room acoustics are the 4 largest factors for sounds quality. Playing a 24-bit Flac in a acoustically treated (or calibrated) room with 2 quality speakers (properly arranged) will out do any car or 7.1 upconversion.
post #3309 of 12381
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stump909 View Post

Buddy, you don't want to start this haha. One should never use a car as an example of quality audio fidelity. It's impossible with the sheer number of reflections such a cramped space will create (plus windows and other non sound wave friendly materials). It's not like your car is upconverting the 2.0 music to 4.0 or whatever. It's just playing the left channel on the left speakers and the right channel in the right. Your 7ch stereo option may sound "great", but that's probably more of an "ignorance is bliss" thing. What kind of speakers do you have? That, source material, speaker arrangement, and room acoustics are the 4 largest factors for sounds quality. Playing a 24-bit Flac in a acoustically treated (or calibrated) room with 2 quality speakers (properly arranged) will out do any car or 7.1 upconversion.
Of course it will. How many people have a treated room though. You are talking in theory. I am talking about reality. You have missed the point or didnt read my post very well. My AVR is not upconverting anything. It is doing just as you described the car is doing. Playing the left channel in left and right channel in right. The ctr gets a full signal.
post #3310 of 12381
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bond 007 View Post

Of course it will. How many people have a treated room though. You are talking in theory. I am talking about reality. You have missed the point or didnt read my post very well. My AVR is not upconverting anything. It is doing just as you described the car is doing. Playing the left channel in left and right channel in right. The ctr gets a full signal.

Notice I said calibrated as well. Many AVR's include high quality acoustic correction curves to compensate for wave loss or amplification. The scenario I presented is quite realistic, not theory. And you point is still pointless. Playing the Left channel from all the left speakers and the right channel from all the right speakers will do nothing but ruin the soundstage and immersion effects from phase shifts. A setting like that is only beneficial in a party scenario. More is not better when it comes to music, unless the record was masters with multiple speakers in mind.
post #3311 of 12381
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stump909 View Post

Notice I said calibrated as well. Many AVR's include high quality acoustic correction curves to compensate for wave loss or amplification. The scenario I presented is quite realistic, not theory. And you point is still pointless. Playing the Left channel from all the left speakers and the right channel from all the right speakers will do nothing but ruin the soundstage and immersion effects from phase shifts. A setting like that is only beneficial in a party scenario. More is not better when it comes to music, unless the record was masters with multiple speakers in mind.
My receiver has room correction software.
post #3312 of 12381
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bond 007 View Post

My receiver has room correction software.

Congratulations. It's doesn't mean your speakers are up to snuff or your music is high quality. Clearly if you can play 7-ch stereo and think it sounds better than 2.0/1, you've got a flaw in your setup. However, if you're happy, I wouldn't go looking for it. Once you have a proper setup, nothing will ever sound flawless again.
post #3313 of 12381
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stump909 View Post

Congratulations. It's doesn't mean your speakers are up to snuff or your music is high quality. Clearly if you can play 7-ch stereo and think it sounds better than 2.0/1, you've got a flaw in your setup. However, if you're happy, I wouldn't go looking for it. Once you have a proper setup, nothing will ever sound flawless again.
I never said it was flawless. Very few people can. Do you have a flawless system or are you just preaching?
post #3314 of 12381
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bond 007 View Post

I never said it was flawless. Very few people can. Do you have a flawless system or are you just preaching?

I have a nice system. Would I say it's the best? No, but for the money it's about as good as one can get. I have friends who've spent double on their systems that don't sound nearly as good. Thanks to my ST60 joining the team, I'm now experiencing sensory nirvana. Sorry if I came off as brash, but the one aspect I constantly see neglected in a HT is the audio. It pains me to see folks with a $2000 TV listening from the built-in speakers or some crummy HTIB.
Edited by Stump909 - 5/1/13 at 8:46am
post #3315 of 12381
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bond 007 View Post

I have a 7ch Stereo option on my receiver and it sounds great. What you suggest is that all car systems should only have 2 speakers. Have you ripped out all but the front 2 speakers in your car?

+1 I listen to all my 2.0 music in 5.2, sounds amazing ! biggrin.gif

I do have 5 full range speakers, yes, even for surrounds, 5 matching speakers cool.gif
post #3316 of 12381
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stump909 View Post

A setting like that is only beneficial in a party scenario

I'm always in party mode, house music til the sun comes up - maybe that's why I enjoy it in 5.2 wink.gif
post #3317 of 12381
Quote:
Originally Posted by Blu_One View Post

I'm always in party mode, house music til the sun comes up - maybe that's why I enjoy it in 5.2 wink.gif

That would be good material for that setup. If you trying to recreate the presence of a band playing infront of you, not so much haha.
post #3318 of 12381
Posted my "plasma n00b" comparison review of the 55ST60 to my new 65PS64 over here in the S60 thread.

http://www.avsforum.com/t/1461177/official-panasonic-s60-series-discussion-thread/1140
Edited by MountainMichael - 5/6/13 at 6:35pm
post #3319 of 12381
Almost every sound mixing and mastering house (for music) uses a 2.1 setup or (variation there of)...so if you want to recreate what was intended to be heard (with exeption of the few albums that are mixed for "soround sound") a good 2.1 system is the only way to get this.

On the other hand what sounds good to each individual may vary.
post #3320 of 12381
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stump909 View Post

That would be good material for that setup. If you trying to recreate the presence of a band playing infront of you, not so much haha.

Oh ok, gotcha, that makes sense !
post #3321 of 12381
Quote:
Originally Posted by wattheF View Post

Almost every sound mixing and mastering house (for music) uses a 2.1 setup or (variation there of)...so if you want to recreate what was intended to be heard (with exeption of the few albums that are mixed for "soround sound") a good 2.1 system is the only way to get this.

On the other hand what sounds good to each individual may vary.

that's definitely the conventional thinking.

the thing i've always wondered, should the goal really be to hear what is heard in the mixing studio? or should it be to hear what the artists hears in their head? cause i think the surround sound might be the only way to get the latter.


of course, none of this helps me decide whether or not to buy the ST60 rolleyes.gif
Edited by fierce_gt - 5/1/13 at 10:13am
post #3322 of 12381
Quote:
Originally Posted by fierce_gt View Post

that's definitely the conventional thinking.

the thing i've always wondered, should the goal really be to hear what is heard in the mixing studio? or should it be to hear what the artists hears in their head? cause i think the surround sound might be the only way to get the latter

of course, none of this helps me decide whether or not to buy the ST60:rolleyes:

I think we should move away from this discussion in this thread, we don't wanna piss off our fellow ST60 owners and potential owners, IMO
post #3323 of 12381
Quote:
Originally Posted by fierce_gt View Post

that's definitely the conventional thinking.

the thing i've always wondered, should the goal really be to hear what is heard in the mixing studio? or should it be to hear what the artists hears in their head? cause i think the surround sound might be the only way to get the latter.


of course, none of this helps me decide whether or not to buy the ST60:rolleyes:

Haha, continuing on the off-topic discussion, you'd be surprised how "surround" a well done 2.0 system can sound. Technically you only have 2 ears, so the effect of immersion is created with time delays and phase shifts. More speakers just makes the mastering easier. I think the result you want to end with is the sense that you have a chair placed right in-front of the band at the studio or you are crowd member dead center at a live event.

As for the ST60, the answer is yes biggrin.gif.
post #3324 of 12381
Here's my problem. 60ST60 at bestbuy canada is $2000. warranties are $450 (2yrs), $480 (3yrs), $530 (4yrs), so of coarse 4 yrs is the best "deal", for the lack of a better term. $2530 with 15% taxes is $2909.50. The people here that own the tv, would you say is worth it for 2910?
post #3325 of 12381
Quote:
Originally Posted by hank0 View Post

Here's my problem. 60ST60 at bestbuy canada is $2000. warranties are $450 (2yrs), $480 (3yrs), $530 (4yrs), so of coarse 4 yrs is the best "deal", for the lack of a better term. $2530 with 15% taxes is $2909.50. The people here that own the tv, would you say is worth it for 2910?

I'm in Canada, got a 65ST60 for 1900 all in, that's 65" not 60"..

I wouldn't recommend paying that much for warranty. Put it on a good credit card, and the manufacturers warranty is doubled, that's all you need in my opinion..
post #3326 of 12381
Sorry
Quote:
Originally Posted by Blu_One View Post

I'm in Canada, got a 65ST60 for 1900 all in, that's 65" not 60"..

I wouldn't recommend paying that much for warranty. Put it on a good credit card, and the manufacturers warranty is doubled, that's all you need in my opinion..

Sorry that's 2,900 all in lol, oops
post #3327 of 12381
Quote:
Originally Posted by Esteban Medaglia View Post

Apologies for asking again, but has anybody ordered a large TV from Amazon? If so, would you care to share your experiences (delivery, unpacking, returns, etc)? I want to purchase the 65ST60 at Best Buy but they still do not even list it on their website...

Just had my 60ST60 delivered yesterday. Ordered from Amazon on 4/22. The company they used for the shipment was CEVA and while their tracking system leaves something to be desired, I'd say the experience went very smoothly. The delivery company called on 4/29 to arrange for a time, and the next day they called me about 30 minutes before they were going to be arriving. Two guys showed up, took the TV downstairs to my den, unpacked it, and waited for me to check it over for any issues. All-in-all, a good experience. We got the TV mounted last night and all seems to be working perfectly. Very happy with my Amazon experience!
post #3328 of 12381
Quote:
Originally Posted by hank0 View Post

Here's my problem. 60ST60 at bestbuy canada is $2000. warranties are $450 (2yrs), $480 (3yrs), $530 (4yrs), so of coarse 4 yrs is the best "deal", for the lack of a better term. $2530 with 15% taxes is $2909.50. The people here that own the tv, would you say is worth it for 2910?

That's a tough call. What we are really talking about is, is the ST60 worth $2000 ($500 more than we pay in the US)... I think that (given your options) it is worth it.

The warranty you listed (on the other hand), I would not even consider. Not at $450-530! I'm having a hard time deciding if I want to buy a square trade warranty for mine, and that is only $99 (for extra 3 years of coverage). Manufactures warranty usually suffices. Major issues usually show their face within the first few months (if not the the first few hours). If I were you, I'd pull the trigger on the $2000 price, and leave the overpriced extended warranty behind.
Edited by AdamHD - 5/1/13 at 10:00am
post #3329 of 12381
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stump909 View Post

Maybe if you have low quality speakers or a poor setup in general. 2.0 music sounds best with a 2.0 or 2.1 setup. Processing it to fill up 5 extra speakers won't improve a thing.
You state that as though it were a fact, but it's just your opinion. The most obvious cases where expanding two channel sound to 5.1 will sound better are the many movies with Dolby encoded surround in their two channels.
post #3330 of 12381
Enough with the speakers talk. If you want to discuss it, go to the appropriate thread please!


5 days into my ownership. Loving it so far smile.gif I did get a bit of IR while watching the nba playoffs on tnt... ended up using the wow disney disc to clear. I've tried the 3d on 3cnet (or whatever that channel is called) I thought it actually looked pretty good. I only watched for 20 minutes or so, and no headaches etc. so I'm hopeful. I'm one of those who gets headaches etc.. when watching 3d in the new 48fps (the hobbit). I'm fine if I watch 3d at Imax or something like that.

I'm waiting for Chad to get back into my area and let him calibrate her... smile.gif
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