or Connect
AVS › AVS Forum › Display Devices › Plasma Flat Panel Displays › Official Panasonic TC-PxxST60 Series thread
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

Official Panasonic TC-PxxST60 Series thread - Page 139

post #4141 of 12344
Quote:
Originally Posted by HD2Blu View Post

My experience is that judder happens with 24fps (from the bluray player) and 48hz or 96hz modes. Try to turn 24fps off on the bluray player and set to 60hz. See if you still see it. Many sites have mentioned that they should have had a 72hz mode like the pioneers. Let us know what you find.

I experience the exact opposite. With 24hz content being displayed at 60hz I see the normal judder you would see on any other display doing 3:2 pulldown. When I change it to 96hz it looks perfect, no judder at all. Super smooth pans.
post #4142 of 12344
Quote:
Originally Posted by HD2Blu View Post

The BEST reassurance you will find (in my opinion) is to try it for yourself. If I was in your shoes - I would be SUPER pleased with this TV. Basement is great lighting for this set. Despite what other members say, I have experienced NO buzzing (and I'm NOT deaf). So it seems it is personal experience. Try it for yourself and let us know. I think you will be really pleased.

Good point. Because I know I will doubt myself if I didn't at least try the ST60 first.
post #4143 of 12344
Quote:
Originally Posted by smeg36 View Post

I experience the exact opposite. With 24hz content being displayed at 60hz I see the normal judder you would see on any other display doing 3:2 pulldown. When I change it to 96hz it looks perfect, no judder at all. Super smooth pans.

Yeah, I meant turn off both the 24fps mode on the player too. You really just have to play with settings on both the player and the TV to see if it is the settings or the TV malfunctioning.
post #4144 of 12344
The flickering is baffling to me... First of all ,I'm not sure I see it at 96. I have mine set there and it looks great. But besides that, 96 is divisible by 24, right? Why would 60hz, which is NOT divisible by 24, look better? Also, I noticed some edge enhancement on my blu-ray when switching to 60hz. That was way more unacceptable to me than this specter of flickering that I can't see.
post #4145 of 12344
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pop Zeus View Post

The flickering is baffling to me... First of all ,I'm not sure I see it at 96. I have mine set there and it looks great. But besides that, 96 is divisible by 24, right? Why would 60hz, which is NOT divisible by 24, look better? Also, I noticed some edge enhancement on my blu-ray when switching to 60hz. That was way more unacceptable to me than this specter of flickering that I can't see.

Individual sensitivity to the flickering varies! If you don't see it at 96Hz, you should most definitely use it for 24Hz sources. 60Hz may look better to different people for a number of reasons--flicker sensitivity, image processing, optimized sub-pixel rates for 30Hz/60Hz but not 24Hz/48Hz/96Hz, etc.
post #4146 of 12344
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rice Rocket View Post

Individual sensitivity to the flickering varies! If you don't see it at 96Hz, you should most definitely use it for 24Hz sources. 60Hz may look better to different people for a number of reasons--flicker sensitivity, image processing, optimized sub-pixel rates for 30Hz/60Hz but not 24Hz/48Hz/96Hz, etc.

Not only do I see flicker at 96 Hz, activating 24 Hz playback on my PC and standalone BD player results in occasional hitches in motion, like I used to see on my old Sony TV when Cinemotion was set to Auto 1. Outputting normal 1080p with the ST60 set to 60 Hz looks great. (Of course the motion enhancer is off on the Panasonic.)
post #4147 of 12344
Quote:
Originally Posted by sawfish View Post

Not only do I see flicker at 96 Hz, activating 24 Hz playback on my PC and standalone BD player results in occasional hitches in motion, like I used to see on my old Sony TV when Cinemotion was set to Auto 1. Outputting normal 1080p with the ST60 set to 60 Hz looks great. (Of course the motion enhancer is off on the Panasonic.)

I played with all 4 settings

24p @ 48hz
24p @ 60hz
24p @ 96hz
60p @ 60hz

And I have to say 60p@60 from my bdt220 bluray was a clear winner.

48hz is trash, 24p@60hz was ok most of the time but could detect flicker in bright areas and credits are nearly unwatchable, 96hz produced a slight extremely fast flicker at times.

60@60 seems perfect with no ill effects and still looks very film like so someone explain to my why the big deal about 24p from the source?
post #4148 of 12344
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bond 007 View Post

There is nothing that you have to do to make the optical port work on the tv. Sounds like a compatibility issue. What is it youre trying to hook up again? A soundbar or something?

Its a HT in a box. It would be used only for cable. It worked no problem with my GT50.

Should I try another toslink cable?
post #4149 of 12344
Quote:
Originally Posted by wattheF View Post

Its a HT in a box. It would be used only for cable. It worked no problem with my GT50.

Should I try another toslink cable?
Yes. Very strange. Have you tried powering things on and off in different orders to see if its a handshake issue? Tv then htib? Htib then tv? Checked the htib settings? Checked the cable box settings?
If it is only for cable, shouldnt you be running a cable from cable box to htib?
Edited by Bond 007 - 5/10/13 at 7:03pm
post #4150 of 12344
Quote:
Originally Posted by biggweeziehd View Post

I played with all 4 settings

24p @ 48hz
24p @ 60hz
24p @ 96hz
60p @ 60hz

And I have to say 60p@60 from my bdt220 bluray was a clear winner.

48hz is trash, 24p@60hz was ok most of the time but could detect flicker in bright areas and credits are nearly unwatchable, 96hz produced a slight extremely fast flicker at times.

60@60 seems perfect with no ill effects and still looks very film like so someone explain to my why the big deal about 24p from the source?

I agree smile.gif but I guess some people want it to look like they are watching a projector in the theater.
post #4151 of 12344
Anyone else think the Cnet Settings look a bit washed out for most content with the gamma set to 2.2?

I set it to 2.4 and think it looks better for most content.
post #4152 of 12344
Quote:
Originally Posted by wattheF View Post

Anyone else think the Cnet Settings look a bit washed out for most content with the gamma set to 2.2?

I set it to 2.4 and think it looks better for most content.

I thought cnet settings were green and dull never used them after my first try
post #4153 of 12344
Quote:
Originally Posted by wattheF View Post

Anyone else think the Cnet Settings look a bit washed out for most content with the gamma set to 2.2?

I set it to 2.4 and think it looks better for most content.

I've been running on CNET for a while now (a mix of D-Nice and CNET).. looks good to me cool.gif

But I'll try it out at 2.4 and see.. did you use a calibration disc afterwards to make sure you're not clipping or anything like that, and everything looks good ?
post #4154 of 12344
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bond 007 View Post

Yes. Very strange. Have you tried powering things on and off in different orders to see if its a handshake issue? Tv then htib? Htib then tv? Checked the htib settings? Checked the cable box settings?
If it is only for cable, shouldnt you be running a cable from cable box to htib?

I tried running a HDMI to the HT in a box but there is apparently an issue because audio doesn't work at all with certain channels and is slow to kick in in all channels. I am also worried that my cheap HT in a box "receiver" may be doing some processing of its own with the PQ that may not be desirable. I haven't had a chance to really test that theory but that is the reasoning for using an HDMI direct to the TV and a toslink for sound.
post #4155 of 12344
Quote:
Originally Posted by biggweeziehd View Post

I played with all 4 settings

24p @ 48hz
24p @ 60hz
24p @ 96hz
60p @ 60hz

And I have to say 60p@60 from my bdt220 bluray was a clear winner.

48hz is trash, 24p@60hz was ok most of the time but could detect flicker in bright areas and credits are nearly unwatchable, 96hz produced a slight extremely fast flicker at times.

60@60 seems perfect with no ill effects and still looks very film like so someone explain to my why the big deal about 24p from the source?

Nice test !

I've been doing the same, 1080p/60 from the Oppo 103 BDP. I guess it really depends on your display.. (re. why the big deal about 24p from the source).

But in my case, like you, I'm not using it and I think it looks great at 1080p/60, no complaints at all biggrin.gif
post #4156 of 12344
Quote:
Originally Posted by Blu_One View Post

I've been running on CNET for a while now (a mix of D-Nice and CNET).. looks good to me cool.gif

But I'll try it out at 2.4 and see.. did you use a calibration disc afterwards to make sure you're not clipping or anything like that, and everything looks good ?

No don't have one yet. Do you recommend the WOW disc?

Color looks more saturated too with 2.4
post #4157 of 12344
Quote:
Originally Posted by wattheF View Post

No don't have one yet. Do you recommend the WOW disc?

Color looks more saturated too with 2.4

Yeah I would definitely recommend the Wow BD, $20 online I think, well worth it in my opinion and many others on AVS.

Check out this recent poll/thread:
http://www.avsforum.com/t/1470226/which-setup-disc-s-do-you-use
post #4158 of 12344
Quote:
Originally Posted by Blu_One View Post

Nice test !

I've been doing the same, 1080p/60 from the Oppo 103 BDP. I guess it really depends on your display.. (re. why the big deal about 24p from the source).

But in my case, like you, I'm not using it and I think it looks great at 1080p/60, no complaints at all biggrin.gif

Yeah I think I just convinced myself to stop bothering with 24p when I never stop fiddling with the settings and 60p seems perfect
post #4159 of 12344
Quote:
Originally Posted by wattheF View Post

Anyone else think the Cnet Settings look a bit washed out for most content with the gamma set to 2.2?

I set it to 2.4 and think it looks better for most content.
2.4 might look good but if you go back and forth from 2.2 in dark content, 2.4 crushes blacks.
post #4160 of 12344
Now that people mentioned it, I also experience judder issues during fast moving scenes. I'm using my HTPC running i3 with integrated intel graphic. I have the refresh rate under the video setting to 60hz. On the ST60, under Picture\Advance Picture\24p Direct in, I have it set at 60Hz also. Is that the correct setting?
post #4161 of 12344
Quote:
Originally Posted by wiggindude View Post

Now that people mentioned it, I also experience judder issues during fast moving scenes. I'm using my HTPC running i3 with integrated intel graphic. I have the refresh rate under the video setting to 60hz. On the ST60, under Picture\Advance Picture\24p Direct in, I have it set at 60Hz also. Is that the correct setting?

Trial and error bro... Get testing
post #4162 of 12344
Quote:
Originally Posted by wiggindude View Post

Now that people mentioned it, I also experience judder issues during fast moving scenes. I'm using my HTPC running i3 with integrated intel graphic. I have the refresh rate under the video setting to 60hz. On the ST60, under Picture\Advance Picture\24p Direct in, I have it set at 60Hz also. Is that the correct setting?

I would suspect the graphics first, but I'm not up to date on Intel's graphics. Try checking out the HTPC forum to see how effective your setup is for what you're trying to do.

They will want to know how much main memory you have, and how much of that is being used by your integrated Intel graphics.
Edited by htwaits - 5/10/13 at 10:29pm
post #4163 of 12344
Having seen/listened to the shootout and it's feedback...as I posted in another thread, I thought looking at these awesome black level pics of the ST60 that it looked plenty dark enough for me. I thought I just didn't have enough of a trained eye to "see" the better blacks of the VT60, which were supposedly like .000875 or almost half the ST60's .0016. Turns out they were pretty close after all!

Decision is made. I'll stay on Panny over the input lag issue, but it's the 60ST60 for me. Just hunting for price now... cool.gif
post #4164 of 12344
Quote:
Originally Posted by Omni009 View Post

Having seen/listened to the shootout and it's feedback...as I posted in another thread, I thought looking at these awesome black level pics of the ST60 that it looked plenty dark enough for me. I thought I just didn't have enough of a trained eye to "see" the better blacks of the VT60, which were supposedly like .000875 or almost half the ST60's .0016. Turns out they were pretty close after all!

Decision is made. I'll stay on Panny over the input lag issue, but it's the 60ST60 for me. Just hunting for price now... cool.gif

Yeah I was surprised too. I think a lot of people who ordered a ZT will actually cancel and get a VT based on the HD Shootout. And at least they can get the VT now instead of waiting who knows how long for the ZT..

Good choice on the ST60, watching some James Bond on BD right now cool.gif
post #4165 of 12344
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bond 007 View Post

Yes. Very strange. Have you tried powering things on and off in different orders to see if its a handshake issue? Tv then htib? Htib then tv? Checked the htib settings? Checked the cable box settings?
If it is only for cable, shouldnt you be running a cable from cable box to htib?

I got my 12' toslink cable (I got it off amazon for 5$ shipped). Working great, I am getting my surround audio out of my TV. I didn't even set anything, I just turned the tv vol down all the way, set my receiver to listen for the optical input, and I am in business. I would definitely try another cable.
post #4166 of 12344
While watching the hockey game and running the slides today, I noticed maybe 2 inches from the right side of the screen this vertical white light/line running from top to bottom. It's most noticeable with the white and gray slides and the ice from the hockey game. It's only noticeable when you're actually looking for it. Is this something I should be concerned about? I'm still in the break in period, so I'm still running slides and watching regular tv when I'm home. Is there anything I can do to get rid of this? Any advice or suggestions will be greatly appreciated. Thanks
post #4167 of 12344
That's normal, a lot of owners have reported this.

BTW, why are you running slides? are you planning on using D-Nice's settings? If so, then you've kinda defeated the purpose by watching other content.
post #4168 of 12344
Quote:
Originally Posted by Moonchilde View Post

That's normal, a lot of owners have reported this.

BTW, why are you running slides? are you planning on using D-Nice's settings? If so, then you've kinda defeated the purpose by watching other content.
Running slides while not watching content is a good way to put hours on your screen without worrying about static logo's or black bars or anything like that.

Also, whether you run the slides for 100 hours straight or not, D-Nice's settings still look better then the stock settings the ST60 ships with. Also, everyone's panel is different so if we both run the slides for 100 hours straight and add D-Nice's settings each TV is sure to produce different readings anyway and a professional calibration would still be needed if you actually wanted to achieve the best levels for your TV.
post #4169 of 12344
The black ST60 approaching the Kuro:
Quote:
So, numbers! How does 0.005 cd/m2 sound? Yep, this £900 plasma television can produce a shade of black so deep that it’s only second to the reigning champion, the (we’re sorry to keep talking about these) discontinued Pioneer KURO plasma displays which were many times more expensive. Keep in mind that such a deep shade of black is actually unmeasurably low and confuses most calibration instruments: the blacks on the TX-P42ST60B are so dark that most devices can’t even register them. Our Klein K-10 is one of few that can, so keep this in mind if you hear the black level on this TV quoted as something like “0.02″ or “0.03″ – it’s in fact much lower.
0.005 cd/m2 represents a not insignificant improvement over last year’s Viera ST50 series, which came in at an already outstanding 0.009 cd/m2. It’s as good as the best viewing mode (“THX Cinema”) on last year’s flagship Panasonic TX-P65VT50, and on nearly equal footing with the KUROs.

he brightness is not left between 120 and 138 Cd / m² :
Quote:
It turned out that we could easily hit our luminance target of 120 cd/m2 with the [Contrast] control alone, with the [Panel Luminance Setting] on “Min”. This clipped out only a few of the absolute brightest tones (the rarely used “whiter than white” shades) in the picture. We could comfortably push the [Contrast] control up without clipping too many whiter-than-white shades and get 138 cd/m2 out of the panel on the “Low” panel setting. Pushing that up to “Mid” gave us 158 cd/m2. The “High” setting gave us a smaller increase to 166 cd/m2. However, both the Mid and High settings were partly achieved by manipulating the gamma tracking (“Mid” was acceptable but a little “s-curved”, whereas “High” began to look a little unnatural). Because we had no problem getting a bright picture out of the Viera TX-P42ST60B, we could happily use the “Low” panel luminance setting.

cool.gif
post #4170 of 12344
Quote:
Originally Posted by Moonchilde View Post

That's normal, a lot of owners have reported this.

BTW, why are you running slides? are you planning on using D-Nice's settings? If so, then you've kinda defeated the purpose by watching other content.

Ok thanks, will that white line eventually go away or it's something I'll just have to deal with?

Yes I will be using D-Nice's settings. I've read on hear that some owners actually does both for the break in. To be honest, I probably couldn't go 100 straight hours without watching content on this beauty.
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: Plasma Flat Panel Displays
AVS › AVS Forum › Display Devices › Plasma Flat Panel Displays › Official Panasonic TC-PxxST60 Series thread