or Connect
AVS › AVS Forum › Blu-ray & HD DVD › Blu-ray Players › Oppo BDP-105 "Sound Quality" Check Thread for Audiophiles
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

Oppo BDP-105 "Sound Quality" Check Thread for Audiophiles - Page 24

post #691 of 1458
Quote:
Originally Posted by wse View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Pariseau View Post

Do you want to play stereo content as 2.0 speakers or 2.1 speakers? Do you want to do Crossover processing in the OPPO or in the Classe?
--Bob

So when I play stereo using the XLR the processing I'd done I the OPPO

When I play multichannel analog I want to be able to use the two DACS in the OPPO.

Can I plug both the XLR and the RCA in the stereo audio out?

I need your answer to my two questions.

Yes, you can connect both the XLR and RCA pairs from the Dedicated Stereo set, but they will both be subject to the same settings. I.e., with Stereo Signal FRONT LEFT/RIGHT they will both be subject to the Speaker Configuration settings you have established for the normal LF/RF RCA jacks of the multi-channel set.



Here's what I do with my Anthem Statement D2v: I want to use Anthem Room Correction even when playing Analog audio input -- I won't restate the reasons here. To do that means I set the D2v to re-digitize the Analog input and do all of the audio processing.

And THAT means I DON'T want the OPPO to also be doing processing on its Analog outputs.

So I use the multi-channel outputs with all speakers set to LARGE, the Sub ON, all speakers equidistant, and all speakers with 0dB volume trim. Set that way, there is no Crossover processing done by the OPPO. (The D2v only allows 5.1 input via multi-channel Analog so I also have the OPPO set to 5.1 Down-Mix, which is only relevant when I play 7.1 tracks.)

Meanwhile I also have Stereo Signal FRONT LEFT/RIGHT set. This lets me cable the L/R RCA jacks from the Dedicated Stereo set in lieu of the normal LF/RF RCA jacks of the multi-channel set.

Now, when I play Stereo content via Analog, i use this EXACT SAME arrangement. The D2v sees 5.1 Analog input with everything silent except for the LF/RF channels. It process that into 2.1 speaker output for me, via ARC.

When I play Multi-channel content, this configuration works the same way -- with all Crossover processing, distance adjustment, volume trims, and room correction handled in the D2v.

This ALSO means I can easily flip between SACD Output PCM and DSD. When using SACD Output DSD, all audio processing in the OPPO is bypassed. But since my configuration for PCM is *ALREADY* set to bypass just such processing, I can change between PCM and DSD via the OPPO DACs without having to do any other, compensating adjustments. Again, Crossover processing and etc. happens in the D2v.

Now, I could hook up the L/R XLR pair from the Dedicated Stereo set and use that to play stereo content. Since I have LF/RF of the multi-channel set configured to do no processing that will also apply to this XLR pair. But the XLR input would get handled the same way in my D2v as the LF/RF from the multi-channel set so there's no need. There's one exception to this. The D2v can do processing on true stereo input -- things like PLIIx to fire up the Surround speakers. But when I play stereo content via the multi-channel set the D2v can't do that because it has no way of knowing the silence in the Center and Surrounds input channels isn't "real". I could hook up the L/R XLR stereo pair and select that in the D2v and then it would know the input is always and only stereo -- and thus it could provide things like PLIIx. But that's not something the interests me so I haven't done it.

NOTE that I could also enable DTS Neo:6 processing in the OPPO, and then Stereo content would be expanded into the Center and Surrounds as part of the multi-channel Analog output. I have done that for Beta Testing and it works, but it is not my preferred way of listening.
--Bob
post #692 of 1458
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Pariseau View PostDo you want to play stereo content as 2.0 speakers or 2.1 speakers? Do you want to do Crossover processing in the OPPO or in the Classe?
--Bob

Question 1: Do you want to play stereo content as 2.0 speakers or 2.1 speakers?

 

- I want to Play Stereo as 2.0 speakers unfiltered. The B&W 800 Diamond can reproduce bass, and I don't listen to organ music

 

 

Question 2: Do you want to do Crossover processing in the OPPO or in the Classe?

 

- I want the OPPO to do the processing for Stereo but also for multichannel when I listen to SACDs

 

 

On the Stereo Analog out from the Oppo there are both XLR and RCA can I plug both XLR and RCA?

post #693 of 1458
When using SACD Output DSD, all audio processing in the OPPO is bypassed ? Are saying the Oppo Dacs are not being used ?
post #694 of 1458
Quote:
Originally Posted by a1usedcomp View Post

When using SACD Output DSD, all audio processing in the OPPO is bypassed ? Are saying the Oppo Dacs are not being used ?

If you are using analog output then the DACs must be used; there is no other way.

No audio processing means distance settings, etc, are not used. Normally they would be for analog (and only for analog).

-Bill
post #695 of 1458
Quote:
Originally Posted by wmcclain View Post

If you are using analog output then the DACs must be used; there is no other way.

No audio processing means distance settings, etc, are not used. Normally they would be for analog (and only for analog).

-Bill

Thanks
post #696 of 1458
I was the first to have the tubed ModWright Oppo 105. I use it for music and 2.0 HT with my Runco plasma. The 105 really takes a step up with good cables. I use Prana Wire interconnects from my 105 to a Concert Fidelity tubed preamp. I mean this with all honesty, I do not miss my $30k Burmester 089 CDP.
post #697 of 1458
Quote:
Originally Posted by Talk2Me View Post

I was the first to have the tubed ModWright Oppo 105. I use it for music and 2.0 HT with my Runco plasma. The 105 really takes a step up with good cables. I use Prana Wire interconnects from my 105 to a Concert Fidelity tubed preamp. I mean this with all honesty, I do not miss my $30k Burmester 089 CDP.

 

^^^ Thanks for the review of the tubed BDP-105 and glad you enjoy its sound. When it was reviewed by 6moons.com magazine, the reviewer didn't seem to be that enthused about its sound, often describing it as slow/sluggish and soft sounding. Is this your experience? Have you tube rolled yet? 

 

http://www.6moons.com/audioreviews/modwright11/1.html

post #698 of 1458
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Pariseau View Post

I want to use Anthem Room Correction even when playing Analog audio input -- I won't restate the reasons here. To do that means I set the D2v to re-digitize the Analog input and do all of the audio processing.

And THAT means I DON'T want the OPPO to also be doing processing on its Analog outputs.
--Bob

It's not clear why Bob doesn't use HDMI from his Oppo to his Anthem D2v rather than analog that he re-digitizes, but maybe that's part of the reasons he doesn't want to restate that I've forgotten.

I use pretty much the same setup as Bob. I take 7.1 analog from the 105 to a Cary Cinema 11a, substituting stereo LR for front LR of 7.1 with stereo signal set to FRONT LEFT/RIGHT. The stereo XLR is connected to the XLR input of the of the Cary. The LR fronts are set to large in the 105 menu; the surrounds to 60 Hz -- I no longer use a center channel. According to Oppo, if the signal contains .1 information, it will be sent to the subs regardless of the size settings of the other speakers. This setup works well.

I use both HDMI and stereo analog to connect a Sony XA-5400ES to the Cary but I prefer the sound of the Cary to that of the Sony, so tend to select HDMI.

Although the Cary has excellent sound, it's buggy and its ARC is useless -- even the manual suggests tape and SPL meter.

db
post #699 of 1458
Thanks to Bob's posts and to Kal's informative "Music in the Round" in the July issue of Stereophile, I decided to try resetting the SACD output to DSD instead of PCM. Perhaps it's just my imagination, but it seems pretty close to audio nirvana. I've tried both XLR and 7.1 inputs. The settings for the surrounds and mains aren't that disparate, so DSD surround sounds fine even without Oppo processing. It would be great if SACD output were switchable between DSD and PCM from the Oppo remote, but for the nonce, I'm leaving it set at DSD.

db
post #700 of 1458
Quote:
Originally Posted by dmusoke View Post

^^^ Thanks for the review of the tubed BDP-105 and glad you enjoy its sound. When it was reviewed by 6moons.com magazine, the reviewer didn't seem to be that enthused about its sound, often describing it as slow/sluggish and soft sounding. Is this your experience? Have you tube rolled yet? 

http://www.6moons.com/audioreviews/modwright11/1.html

I own both the Sony XA-5400ES and Oppo BDP-105 Stock and to me the Sony just sounds more warmer and detailed
post #701 of 1458
Re using 5.1 Analog in my setup: I'm a Beta Tester for the OPPO 105, so of course I try to find the time to test it as many different ways as possible. If that were not the case, in my home theater I'd have a 103 instead, and just use HDMI for audio into my Anthem Statement D2v.

But as is, I regularly cycle between the various output choices of the 105 as I play new discs. Heck, that even includes COAX S/PDIF output, and, of course the Headphones jack. Looking for bugs, don'tcha know. Collect them all!

However, my setup is designed around using ARC in the D2v, so I don't try to bypass that, even when using 5.1 Analog from the OPPO. (The D2v only accepts 7.1 input digitally.)
--Bob
Edited by Bob Pariseau - 6/16/13 at 5:27pm
post #702 of 1458
Quote:
Originally Posted by wse View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Pariseau View Post

Do you want to play stereo content as 2.0 speakers or 2.1 speakers? Do you want to do Crossover processing in the OPPO or in the Classe?


--Bob
Question 1: Do you want to play stereo content as 2.0 speakers or 2.1 speakers?


- I want to Play Stereo as 2.0 speakers unfiltered. The B&W 800 Diamond can reproduce bass, and I don't listen to organ music



Question 2: Do you want to do Crossover processing in the OPPO or in the Classe?


- I want the OPPO to do the processing for Stereo but also for multichannel when I listen to SACDs


On the Stereo Analog out from the Oppo there are both XLR and RCA can I plug both XLR and RCA?

Yes you can cable both the Dedicated Stereo XLR pair and the Dedicated Stereo RCA pair at the same time, but understand the settings that affect one will also affect the other.

If you want the OPPO to do Crossover processing, speaker distance adjustment, down-mix, and etc., when playing SACD discs, then be sure you use SACD Output PCM -- not DSD.

As for the rest, you can get what you want easily enough so long as you are OK with leaving LF/RF set to LARGE (no Crossover processing from those two speakers). You can even use the Dedicated Stereo jacks in lieu of the normal LF/RF pair from the multi-channel set.

Incant the following spell:

1) Cable the Dedicated Stereo RCA L/R pair to your multi-channel LF/RF input. Cable the rest of your multi-channel input using the normal RCA jacks from the multi-channel set. Cable the Dedicated Stereo XLR L/R pair to an XLR stereo input.

2) Set Stereo Signal FRONT LEFT/RIGHT.

3) In Speaker Configuration: Set correct distances for all your speakers/sub. Set LF/RF LARGE. Set Subwoofer ON (I'm assuming you have a Sub; if not things change a bit). Set the Center and Surrounds LARGE or SMALL as you think best. If *ANY* speakers are set to SMALL, then pick a Crossover Frequency value.

4) Set Down-Mix to match the number of channels you have cabled to your AVR's multi-channel Input. So if your AVR accepts 7.1 multi-channel Analog input, set Down-Mix to 7.1. Note that there's no need to change Down-Mix just because you are playing 5.1 or Stereo content.

5) Adjust all your speaker levels using a calibration disc: For example, use the LPCM test tracks from AIX Audio Calibration, Blu-Ray. NOTE: If ALL speakers are set to LARGE, then the Subwoofer channel will need +10dB boost. If ANY speaker is set to SMALL, then the Subwoofer channel will need +15dB boost. It is best to accomplish the boost external to the player -- i.e,. in the AVR or simply by raising the volume knob on the Sub. The calibration disc and an SPL meter will let you confirm you've done it correctly. Note that the XLR outputs are the standard +6dB hotter than the RCA outputs. The XLR stereo input in your AVR may compensate for this by default, if not, you may need to use lower Main Volume in the AVR when selecting to listen to that XLR pair.

6) Set SACD Output PCM. Set HDCD Decoding ON. Set Dynamic Range Control OFF. Set DTS Neo:6 Mode OFF (except when you actually want to use it). Set Secondary Audio ON. The HDMI Audio setting does not matter -- if you are not using HDMI audio at all, you can just set it to OFF.

7) Set your AVR to "pass through" the multi-channel and stereo inputs. I.e., since the OPPO is doing Crossover processing, distance adjustment, and volume trim, you don't want the AVR to ALSO be trying to do those. Note that this means you will forego any processing such as "Room Correction" in your AVR.

(Don't be alarmed if there's a small puff of orange smoke at the end. Oh, did I mention the chalk pentagram?)

OK, now you can select the multi-channel Input in your AVR for playing multi-channel content. The Subwoofer channel will carry LFE content from the multi-channel track plus bass steered from Center or the Surrounds if they are set to SMALL.

For stereo content you can listen to EITHER the multi-channel Input or that XLR stereo Input. In either case, only the Left Front and Right Front speaker channels will have sound. The Subwoofer will be silent because you set LF/RF to LARGE and there's no LFE channel in 2.0 content. Since you can listen to Stereo content either way, you can compare RCA vs. XLR input for Stereo as implemented in your AVR. (NOTE: Volume level must be carefully matched both ways for a valid comparison.) If you WANT your AVR to process that Stereo input -- as for example to apply PLIIx to light up the Surround speakers -- you will probably need to use the XLR Stereo input as the AVR has no way to know the silence in Center and Surrounds of the multi-channel Input isn't "real".

Again, use a calibration disc like AIX to validate all this.
--Bob
Edited by Bob Pariseau - 6/16/13 at 6:05pm
post #703 of 1458

Gracias Bob,

 

Why PCM and not DSD?

post #704 of 1458
Quote:
Originally Posted by wse View Post

Gracias Bob,

Why PCM and not DSD?

You said you want the OPPO to do processing (such as Crossover, distance alignment, or down-mix) when playing SACDs. For that you have to use SACD Output PCM. DSD-Direct-to-Analog Conversion bypasses all audio processing in the player. Note that the same thing happens when using the Asynchronous USB DAC Input, however with LF/RF set to LARGE that's not an issue, because the OPPO isn't doing Crossover processing for those anyway. (That Input is always and only Stereo.)
--Bob
post #705 of 1458
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Pariseau View Post

DSD-Direct-to-Analog Conversion bypasses all audio processing in the player.--Bob
Geez...that's kinda important to know. I searched the Oppo 105 manual and I could find nowhere where that was explained. Here I've been listening to my SACD's for 2 months now not realizing that my trim settings were having no effect. Thank you Bob - it's a whole new game now!
post #706 of 1458
Hello. I'm having a strange problem when play SACD on my 105. I have the 105 input to my AVR BD via HDMI. When the disc id first loaded it seems to skip for about 20 sec with the "PCM" light flashing. After that it seems fine. It will only occur again if i switch the input from HDMI to analog on the 105. I called Oppo and they said its a handshake issue. This does not seem to occur with regular CD's. does this seem correct?
post #707 of 1458
Bob,

Why should secondary audio be set to on?

db
post #708 of 1458
Quote:
Originally Posted by dbphd View Post

Bob,

Why should secondary audio be set to on?

db

That's mainly personal preference. But the point is, when using EITHER Analog audio or HDMI LPCM audio you CAN leave Secondary Audio ON in the 103/105 without loss of quality -- i.e., if there's not actually any secondary track present and you just want to enjoy the primary track.

This is not the case if you use HDMI Bitstream audio because the primary track has to be decoded in prep for mixing in the secondary track (whether or not that's actually present), and then the result has to be RE-encoded back into a Bitstream for output. And since no consumer electronics has the horse power to encode a lossless track "on the fly", that's done using a lossy DD or DTS track -- albeit the highest bit-rate form of those.
--Bob
post #709 of 1458
Quote:
Originally Posted by gelly View Post

Hello. I'm having a strange problem when play SACD on my 105. I have the 105 input to my AVR BD via HDMI. When the disc id first loaded it seems to skip for about 20 sec with the "PCM" light flashing. After that it seems fine. It will only occur again if i switch the input from HDMI to analog on the 105. I called Oppo and they said its a handshake issue. This does not seem to occur with regular CD's. does this seem correct?

When playing an SACD with SACD Output PCM set, the HDMI cable carries 88.2KHz 2.0 or 5.1 audio. CDs are 44.1KHz 2.0 audio. Evidently your AVR is having trouble deciding it likes the 88.2KHz input. Either it is not believing the input format, or it thinks the input is not a valid digital audio stream.

So you are getting HDMI handshake retries for the audio.

When you switch the AVR to listening on its Analog input, there is ANOTHER handshake on the HDMI connection (carrying the video from the player) as the AVR has now stopped being a consumer of the HDMI Audio -- i.e,. copy protection has to be set up again.

There are few things you can try to simplify the HDMI handshake. First set SACD Output PCM (not DSD) so that the player doesn't try to negotiate DSD with the AVR. Next, when using HDMI for audio, set HDMI Audio LPCM or Bitstream at your preference -- but not AUTO. (Either way, the output will still be LPCM when playing an SACD.)

In addition to that, there's the usual advice that HDMI handshake issues often mean a cabling problem. To test that, try setting the output of the OPPO to 1080i with Deep Color OFF. If the SACD audio handshake on HDMI works without problems then that says you probably need to look to your cabling. On the other hand, if the problem persists, it may simply be something that your AVR is doing -- taking too long to lock in when fed 88.2KHz audio.
--Bob
post #710 of 1458
Thanks Bob, I'll try those suggestion. However Yesterday I played a new regular CD. I had my AVR set to CD as that is where my analog out is from my Oppo. The Cd started playing well only to start skipping around 3 min in. I called oppo and the tech claimed its still a hand shake issue. Since i have my oppo connected 7.1 analog/ 2.0 analog and HDMI from oppo to AVR via BD input, the HDMI connection is still trying to connect even though i have selected it on analog. He suggested i disconnect the HDMI from my oppo to the AVR. this seemed to work(only tried it for a few min). He said if this solution worked I can either a) try to change out the HDMI cable or b) permanently disconnect the HDMi cable. Which I'd rather not do since i enjoy watching DVD while letting my AVR doing the R/C via Audessy. Also i noticed when listening to a CD while in BD(HDMI) and select 7.1 analog on my AVR(by switching the A/D) button i seem to get no skips. But when doing this am i utilizing the oppo DAC? Thanks very much in advance.
post #711 of 1458
Tipped my toe into the Headphone world and gotta admit ,very impressed ! good stuff Oppo! wink.gif
post #712 of 1458
Quote:
Originally Posted by gelly View Post

Thanks Bob, I'll try those suggestion. However Yesterday I played a new regular CD. I had my AVR set to CD as that is where my analog out is from my Oppo. The Cd started playing well only to start skipping around 3 min in. I called oppo and the tech claimed its still a hand shake issue. Since i have my oppo connected 7.1 analog/ 2.0 analog and HDMI from oppo to AVR via BD input, the HDMI connection is still trying to connect even though i have selected it on analog. He suggested i disconnect the HDMI from my oppo to the AVR. this seemed to work(only tried it for a few min). He said if this solution worked I can either a) try to change out the HDMI cable or b) permanently disconnect the HDMi cable. Which I'd rather not do since i enjoy watching DVD while letting my AVR doing the R/C via Audessy. Also i noticed when listening to a CD while in BD(HDMI) and select 7.1 analog on my AVR(by switching the A/D) button i seem to get no skips. But when doing this am i utilizing the oppo DAC? Thanks very much in advance.

Sure, any time you are listening to the output of the OPPO's Analog jacks you must be using its DACs as that's the only way a signal gets to those jacks.

The HDMI retries which are causing those mutes can be due to cabling not up to the bandwidth you've got on it (e.g., if you've got Deep Color ON), or due to the device at the other end of the cable simply not responding fast enough.
--Bob
post #713 of 1458
Short of a live performance, I have never heard a better classical music session than when I listened yesterday to Ivan Fisher's rendition of Mahler's First Symphony.

Although I have a fast Verizon FiOS connection to the Internet, it still took the better part of a day to download the 5GB .dff file from Channel Classics to the PC. From there, it was a simple matter to transfer the folder to a thumb drive and to fire up an Oppo BDP-105. I chose the 7.1 analog connection to a Sony STR-DA5600ES A/V. It sounded marginally better than via the HDMI or stereo connections, although all three paths were great.

Thanks for the tip.
post #714 of 1458
Ok I asked this in the other OPPO thread, what would give me the best music?

Mac mini SSD with Audirvana plugging in the OPPO BDP-105 Silver with Option

1. USB Cable

2. HDMi Cable
post #715 of 1458
Quote:
Originally Posted by ajglass View Post

Short of a live performance, I have never heard a better classical music session than when I listened yesterday to Ivan Fisher's rendition of Mahler's First Symphony.

Although I have a fast Verizon FiOS connection to the Internet, it still took the better part of a day to download the 5GB .dff file from Channel Classics to the PC. From there, it was a simple matter to transfer the folder to a thumb drive and to fire up an Oppo BDP-105. I chose the 7.1 analog connection to a Sony STR-DA5600ES A/V. It sounded marginally better than via the HDMI or stereo connections, although all three paths were great.

Thanks for the tip.

That good to hear ' I have the sacd of this and this should make for a nice comparison as it will be my first DFF file. Although I have a great affinity for the 2nd which is eek.gif The 1st is a masterpiece and I hear the 5th is soon to be released cool.gif
post #716 of 1458
Quote:
Originally Posted by audiofan1 View Post


That good to hear ' I have the sacd of this and this should make for a nice comparison as it will be my first DFF file. Although I have a great affinity for the 2nd which is eek.gif The 1st is a masterpiece and I hear the 5th is soon to be released cool.gif

Both the 1st and the 5th are excellent and spectacular.

post #717 of 1458

Did anyone try this 

 

 
- Mac mini SSD with Audirvana plugging in the OPPO BDP-105 using a USB Cable
 
or 
 
- Harddrive plugged-in straight to the Oppo?
post #718 of 1458
Quote:
it still took the better part of a day to download the 5GB .dff file from Channel Classics to the PC
The internet bandwidth these online audio businesses have really stinks! What a pain to have to wait nearly a whole day to download an audio album.....I too have fios internet (50mbps)...I've got the capability to download 5 Gigs in under 15 minutes....it's funny...they provide this high definition audio technology, but still operate the business with phone modem speeds...
post #719 of 1458
Quote:
Originally Posted by DanF8500 View PostThe internet bandwidth these online audio businesses have really stinks! What a pain to have to wait nearly a whole day to download an audio album.....I too have fios internet (50mbps)...I've got the capability to download 5 Gigs in under 15 minutes....it's funny...they provide this high definition audio technology, but still operate the business with phone modem speeds...

Really that's unbelievable how do the DSD file sound

post #720 of 1458
^The dsd files sound awesome!! They have to be streamed via a thumb drive or network drive....that's the only two ways to play a dsd file on the 105 now....typical file sizes for a 60 minute, 2-channel, dsd album will be about 2.5 Gb. A multichannel(5.1) equivalent will be 5 Gb.
Edited by DanF8500 - 6/20/13 at 3:16pm
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: Blu-ray Players
AVS › AVS Forum › Blu-ray & HD DVD › Blu-ray Players › Oppo BDP-105 "Sound Quality" Check Thread for Audiophiles