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Oppo BDP-105: Upping the 'Separates' Ante - Page 2

post #31 of 61
1/27/13 at 12:04pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by WagBoss View Post

Isn't the Oppo BDP-105 basically just a AVR with a blu-ray reader in it? XD

All it needs is a volume controller. At the BDP-105 it should come with volume control so people can use it just like an AVR with BD player built-in (plus 2 HDMI inputs) and only need to feed the output to power amp.
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post #32 of 61
1/27/13 at 12:08pm
Thread Starter 
The volume control is on the remote, a physical volume control is unnecessary IMO.
Quote:
Originally Posted by David Susilo View Post

All it needs is a volume controller. At the BDP-105 it should come with volume control so people can use it just like an AVR with BD player built-in (plus 2 HDMI inputs) and only need to feed the output to power amp.
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post #33 of 61
1/27/13 at 12:17pm
Imagic - when you say "pick a volume level" do you mean I would manually set the volume on the Krell and the Krell would be in the home theater chain as opposed to using its HT bypass mode?
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post #34 of 61
1/27/13 at 12:25pm
Thread Starter 
Yes. You would find the volume level that is equivalent to 'unity' in HT mode and use that level each time - unless you found no difference between the sound of the balanced and unbalanced connections.
Quote:
Originally Posted by olfac87 View Post

Imagic - when you say "pick a volume level" do you mean I would manually set the volume on the Krell and the Krell would be in the home theater chain as opposed to using its HT bypass mode?
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post #35 of 61
1/27/13 at 4:00pm
I just got the 103 and realized the 105 was available. Looks like I will be switching it out to the 105. I use 7.1 analog to my Halo Pre-amp and let the OPPO do the processing. from what I have read, it's worth the upgrade if you are using analog, which I am. I sure hope so!!
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post #36 of 61
1/27/13 at 4:39pm

Interesting discussion, less is more :)

 

Does the Oppo BDP-105 responds faster than the BDP-95?

 

Also if plugged in straight to the amps there is no bass management function? No EQ and so on..

 

I am interested maybe I could sell the SSP-800 and use the Oppo BDP-105 straight?

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post #37 of 61
1/27/13 at 4:49pm
Thread Starter 
There is bass management, if you want it. You can set speaker sizes individually. No EQ. From an earlier post:

"Crossover: Allows you to set the Bass Management kick-in frequency for all speakers. When the
speaker size is set to Small in Speaker Configuration (see page 71), bass information below this
frequency is not passed to the speakers to reduce possible distortion, and if the subwoofer is
available, bass information will be redirected to the subwoofer. When all speaker sizes are set to
Large, there is no Bass Management.
x 40Hz / 60Hz / 80Hz / 90Hz / 100Hz / 110Hz / 120Hz / 150Hz / 200Hz / 250Hz – These are
the available crossover frequencies.

Here's the manual: http://download.oppodigital.com/BDP105/BDP-105_USER_MANUAL_English_v1.6.pdf

Quote:
Originally Posted by wse View Post

Interesting discussion, less is more smile.gif

Does the Oppo BDP-105 responds faster than the BDP-95?

Also if plugged in straight to the amps there is no bass management function? No EQ and so on..

I am interested maybe I could sell the SSP-800 and use the Oppo BDP-105 straight?
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post #38 of 61
1/27/13 at 8:31pm
Here is a DBT that destroys the argument smile.gif
Enjoy:
http://www.matrixhifi.com/ENG_contenedor_ppec.htm
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post #39 of 61
1/27/13 at 10:59pm
Thread Starter 
What does this DB test demonstrate? That connecting a player directly to an amp is a good idea. That Behringer makes good sounding amps. That a 'Shaky Wooden Chair' is funny. I would not expect anybody to hear any difference in that particular test. Try running the same test but swap out the Behringer for a cheap AVR and throw in some hard-to-drive speakers and you'd have a very different result.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ratloko View Post

Here is a DBT that destroys the argument smile.gif
Enjoy:
http://www.matrixhifi.com/ENG_contenedor_ppec.htm

Edited by imagic - 1/27/13 at 11:11pm
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post #40 of 61
1/27/13 at 11:29pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bghead8che View Post

Plus there are other issues. If you have satellite, Xbox, etc there is no way to route the audio through the Oppo. Not to mention the lack of HDMI switching.

-Brian

Couldn't you just send a satellite or cable box signal to one of the hdmi inputs of the Oppo 105 and use the input button on the remote of the Oppo to toggle through the various inputs?
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post #41 of 61
1/27/13 at 11:36pm
I am very interested in this subject of replacing my existing prepro with the Oppo 105. I currently have the Emotiva UMC-200 prepro but I see that I could replace it by using the Oppo 105 instead. I am not concerned about losing the room correction capability of the Emo but what else would I need to look out for as far as losing something I may need by having the Emo prepro?

I don't currently have a separate cablebox but if I added one later I guess I could connect it to the hdmi input of the Oppo 105. I currently have the Oppo 93 and I really like the dacs of the analog outs but the 105 would really be a step up. My current amp is the Emotiva XPA-5 and ATI 1502 amp along with Paradigm Ref. 20's version 2 speakers for a 7.1 setup for music and movies.Thanks.
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post #42 of 61
1/28/13 at 1:44am
Which electrical parameters - of power amps - would one have to consider when connecting a 105 directly to them?

- Input impedance; is there a minimum? Is higher always better? I understand the 105's output impedance is 100 Ohms.
- dB gain?
- Input sensitivity?
- How much different are the above between the XLR and RCA outputs?


The reason I ask is:

- I want to know what electrical parameters will give the best range of levels (from barely audible, to louder-than-needed), without sacrificing dynamics or an inaudible noise floor.
- I've read that even when the 105 is at volume level "1," some say their system plays too loud.
- I want to know, will you lose dynamic range when reducing levels digitally? For example, will there still be 24 bits of dynamic range at volume level 1-10?
- It seems gain controls on each channel could be mandatory for some power amps - mainly to reduce the gain. How much adjustability is needed?

Sorry for cross-posting, but there are at least 2 threads on this specific subject.
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post #43 of 61
1/28/13 at 8:47am
This simple answer, correct me if I'm wrong, is "no". The BDP-105 is a universal player which theoretically has audiophile quality designs for the DAC, including the power supply and analog outputs, etc. If you don't have an extensive CD/SACD collection and aren't really an audiophile, then pass. Off-topic just a bit, but I'd love to put the 105 up against my CD/SACD player (reach me if you live near Pittsburgh!).

The notion of passing up the controller (pre-amp) is not new to hi-end audio (two channel stereo). It isn't easy to pull off at a high level even in that most simple application so I doubt that it will work for Home Theater. It would be fantastic if there was a higher end full feature pre/pro with a blu-ray spinner integrated. Then again, what's the downside of passing the bitstream from a $100 blu-ray player?
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post #44 of 61
1/28/13 at 9:04am
Thread Starter 
Connect a good CD or Blu-Ray player to a decent Pro amp and a good pair of full-range speakers and you've got just about all AVR-based systems beat, especially for 2-channel reproduction. I'm certainly not arguing against using an AVR with preamp outputs and a less-expensive Blu-Ray player to achieve something similar, but the Oppo's specs make it clear that it's up to the task of running a stack of amps in a HT setup with no outside help, as well as acting as a high-quality DAC for two additional HDMI sources. I see no real downside as long as the end-user is realistic about the Oppos capabilities.

There's no reason not to use the 105 to play back file-based and streaming tracks, the benefits of the DAC and balanced stereo connection remain. I never had issues with any of the numerous minimalist 2-channel systems I've put together over the years.

I do agree it would be nice to see something like this unit, but with Audyssey built-in.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jh901 View Post

This simple answer, correct me if I'm wrong, is "no". The BDP-105 is a universal player which theoretically has audiophile quality designs for the DAC, including the power supply and analog outputs, etc. If you don't have an extensive CD/SACD collection and aren't really an audiophile, then pass. Off-topic just a bit, but I'd love to put the 105 up against my CD/SACD player (reach me if you live near Pittsburgh!).

The notion of passing up the controller (pre-amp) is not new to hi-end audio (two channel stereo). It isn't easy to pull off at a high level even in that most simple application so I doubt that it will work for Home Theater. It would be fantastic if there was a higher end full feature pre/pro with a blu-ray spinner integrated. Then again, what's the downside of passing the bitstream from a $100 blu-ray player?

Edited by imagic - 1/28/13 at 9:28am
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post #45 of 61
1/28/13 at 1:10pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by imagic View Post


I do agree it would be nice to see something like this unit, but with Audyssey built-in.

+1. I would buy that unit. Oppo, please come out with a pre-pro which incorporates all these features :-)
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post #46 of 61
1/29/13 at 1:11pm
One sec, several of you have mentioned a HTPC, I thought there were limitations in what a HTPC could playback when it came to bluray? Only reason I have yet to BUILD a HTPC to be honest....and I cant record directv through it....

Anyways, on the Oppo, I think this is really nice option. I would enjoy having a unit that does video and then has analog outs to go to the P7 I think. Sure it doesnt have the room correct stuff but I would much rather tune it myself since the room correct does not seem to fix all the issues that can be fixed manually.

However, that does take alot more time to set up correctly.
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post #47 of 61
1/29/13 at 1:22pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kimeran View Post

One sec, several of you have mentioned a HTPC, I thought there were limitations in what a HTPC could playback when it came to bluray? Only reason I have yet to BUILD a HTPC to be honest....and I cant record directv through it....

Anyways, on the Oppo, I think this is really nice option. I would enjoy having a unit that does video and then has analog outs to go to the P7 I think. Sure it doesnt have the room correct stuff but I would much rather tune it myself since the room correct does not seem to fix all the issues that can be fixed manually.

However, that does take alot more time to set up correctly.

I have never had a problem with any blu-ray on my HTPC.
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post #48 of 61
1/29/13 at 1:27pm
Thread Starter 
Here's my PC - 8 channels of uncompressed audio is supported

Quote:
Originally Posted by WagBoss View Post

I have never had a problem with any blu-ray on my HTPC.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kimeran View Post

One sec, several of you have mentioned a HTPC, I thought there were limitations in what a HTPC could playback when it came to bluray? Only reason I have yet to BUILD a HTPC to be honest....and I cant record directv through it....

Anyways, on the Oppo, I think this is really nice option. I would enjoy having a unit that does video and then has analog outs to go to the P7 I think. Sure it doesnt have the room correct stuff but I would much rather tune it myself since the room correct does not seem to fix all the issues that can be fixed manually.

However, that does take alot more time to set up correctly.
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post #49 of 61
1/29/13 at 2:52pm
*GASP*

That's bad, I think I need to go ahead and build one now even though I dont REALLY need it.
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post #50 of 61
1/29/13 at 7:02pm
is the 105 that much better then the 103 when it comes to 7.1 analog outs? I would be using the analog outs from 2 sources, htpc and xbox that is inputed with hdmi. my viewing is mainly movies and gaming.

I am debating the 700 dollars extra between these 2 players.

All I know is when my denon avr craped out I whent from the computer 7.1 analog out into a 7 channel emotiva amp, the sound was much improved.
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post #51 of 61
1/30/13 at 2:27pm
I run the analog outs of an asus xonar soundcard (DAC) directly to tube monoblocks. asus also makes a card with multichannel analog outs. the key to the sound is the direct connection to the amp, the quality of the amps and interconnect, and not introducing a preamp into the mix. For 2 channel you can also use any usb dac (which have come down in price and up in quality). I use this for cds, dvds and blu-rays, played or ripped. Video with mpchc and madvr. I couldn't imagine this oppo sounds any better or is more versatile.
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post #52 of 61
1/30/13 at 2:27pm
I run the analog outs of an asus xonar soundcard (DAC) directly to tube monoblocks. asus also makes a card with multichannel analog outs. the key to the sound is the direct connection to the amp, the quality of the amps and interconnect, and not introducing a preamp into the mix. For 2 channel you can also use any usb dac (which have come down in price and up in quality). I use this for cds, dvds and blu-rays, played or ripped. Video with mpchc and madvr. I couldn't imagine this oppo sounds any better or is more versatile.
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post #53 of 61
1/31/13 at 7:08am
Quote:
Originally Posted by imagic View Post

There's no reason not to use the 105 to play back file-based and streaming tracks, the benefits of the DAC and balanced stereo connection remain. I never had issues with any of the numerous minimalist 2-channel systems I've put together over the years.

What is the best pre-amp you've ever had in your 2-channel system?
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post #54 of 61
1/31/13 at 7:24am
Thread Starter 
The best pre-amp is no pre-amp IMO, I am a big fan of hooking quality sources directly to the amp. In the past when I have needed pre-amp like capabilities, I've use pro mixing boards and audio interfaces. One of the nicest sounding sources I've used was a Motu Traveler MK3 and on the bargain front I was blown away by the Alesis MultiMix 8 USB 2.0 - it is an audiophile-quality DAC masquerading as an 8-channel mixer/audio interface.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jh901 View Post

What is the best pre-amp you've ever had in your 2-channel system?
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post #55 of 61
1/31/13 at 8:43am
Quote:
Originally Posted by 808///M3 View Post

Which electrical parameters - of power amps - would one have to consider when connecting a 105 directly to them?

- Input impedance; is there a minimum? Is higher always better? I understand the 105's output impedance is 100 Ohms.
- dB gain?
- Input sensitivity?
- How much different are the above between the XLR and RCA outputs?


The reason I ask is:

- I want to know what electrical parameters will give the best range of levels (from barely audible, to louder-than-needed), without sacrificing dynamics or an inaudible noise floor.
- I've read that even when the 105 is at volume level "1," some say their system plays too loud.
- I want to know, will you lose dynamic range when reducing levels digitally? For example, will there still be 24 bits of dynamic range at volume level 1-10?
- It seems gain controls on each channel could be mandatory for some power amps - mainly to reduce the gain. How much adjustability is needed?

Sorry for cross-posting, but there are at least 2 threads on this specific subject.

Great questions. I'd like to learn more about it as well.
I am brand new to the 105 and have it connected directly to my Pass Labs X250. My amp has 30db of gain and 22 Ohms input impedance. My speakers have a stingy sensitivity at ~85db.
In my system (2.1), the volume gets only a little louder than loud enough (for most of the movies I've tried). For Kung Fu Panda, though, 100 on the volume is NOT quite loud enough. With my Integra DTR7.8 in the mix, a volume of -7db was freaking LOUD. Or... it sounded loud. Interestingly, the Oppo's stereo mixdown and analog outs present a much more textured and nuanced sound on Bluray. It's very different from the Integra and other surround receivers I've heard which seem to present audio as soft, medium, or loud - and nothing in between.
So... I am really encouraged with the analog outs of the Oppo but disappointed with the volume control / gain. I guess I need to think about putting a pre/pro back in. or a 2 channel preamp AND a processor. or ... I dunno. I'll stick with this for a while.
Also, volume setting 1 is way too loud (for me). It's about as loud as someone talking from across a table.
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post #56 of 61
1/31/13 at 3:32pm
i am slowly starting to build a budget stereo system.
i have a marantz av8801, would the dac in the marantz be atleast on equal terms with the oppo 105?
i am looking mainly for digital file playback. but i already have a set of speakers hooked up for my Home theater setup

running a separate 2 channel setup.
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post #57 of 61
1/31/13 at 4:04pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by kunstadt View Post

Great questions. I'd like to learn more about it as well.
I am brand new to the 105 and have it connected directly to my Pass Labs X250. My amp has 30db of gain and 22 Ohms input impedance. My speakers have a stingy sensitivity at ~85db.
In my system (2.1), the volume gets only a little louder than loud enough (for most of the movies I've tried). For Kung Fu Panda, though, 100 on the volume is NOT quite loud enough. With my Integra DTR7.8 in the mix, a volume of -7db was freaking LOUD. Or... it sounded loud. Interestingly, the Oppo's stereo mixdown and analog outs present a much more textured and nuanced sound on Bluray. It's very different from the Integra and other surround receivers I've heard which seem to present audio as soft, medium, or loud - and nothing in between.
So... I am really encouraged with the analog outs of the Oppo but disappointed with the volume control / gain. I guess I need to think about putting a pre/pro back in. or a 2 channel preamp AND a processor. or ... I dunno. I'll stick with this for a while.
Also, volume setting 1 is way too loud (for me). It's about as loud as someone talking from across a table.

Thank you, kunstadt, these are exactly the kinds of things I'm looking for. Unfortunately, while it's what I was looking for, it's not quite what I wanted to hear... I've heard others say the same - "1" is too loud, and "100" is not loud enough. It seems Oppo may have designed their volume control to span too narrow a range - probably only covering a small portion of the ESS DAC's total range. I think, to find an amp that provides a good range of levels (again, from barely audible, to louder-than-you-need), there'd have to be some kind of synergy between the 105 and the amp's specs... A certain combination of input sensitivity and dB gain, along with appropriately sensitive speakers.

Anybody else using the 105 as pre/pro, and willing to share their amplifier specifications? Thanks.
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post #58 of 61
1/31/13 at 4:09pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by 808///M3 View Post

Anybody else using the 105 as pre/pro, and willing to share their amplifier specifications? Thanks.

There are reports in the BDP-105 owner's thread: http://www.avsforum.com/t/1439524/official-oppo-bdp-105-owners-thread

-Bill
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post #59 of 61
1/31/13 at 4:21pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by kunstadt View Post

Great questions. I'd like to learn more about it as well.
I am brand new to the 105 and have it connected directly to my Pass Labs X250. My amp has 30db of gain and 22 Ohms input impedance. My speakers have a stingy sensitivity at ~85db....

Even while I take that to mean 22 kilohms input impedance, isn't this a bit low compared to most amps? Would there be an audible difference between 22kOhms and 47kOhms? Not that I'd have a problem with ANY of the specs if I owned an X250! Nice!
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post #60 of 61
1/31/13 at 4:26pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by wmcclain View Post

There are reports in the BDP-105 owner's thread: http://www.avsforum.com/t/1439524/official-oppo-bdp-105-owners-thread

-Bill
Thanks, Bill. I started from page 1 of the owner's thread and had reached page 45 so far. Then I skipped straight over to this thread since it has more of what I need, much less of what I don't. I'll keep going through the owner's thread but still believe I'm more likely to get my questions answered here.
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