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Need help choosing between Insteon, Lutron, or whatever you recommend - Page 2

post #31 of 70
1/28/13 at 7:47pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by ajeagle6921 View Post

I am going to use the maestro wireless. I believe it can be controlled by irule

Sir, Maestro Wireless cannot be controlled by iRule. We are trying to help you smile.gif The Maestro Wireless system is specifically for people who do not want a full automation setup with apps etc. It's a simple wireless controller for up to ten switches and devices. It's good for things like a conference room or home theater in a non-automated home.
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post #32 of 70
1/28/13 at 8:43pm
Thread Starter 
Then which Lutron switch do you recommend I use with irule? I've read if people using that setup I believe.
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post #33 of 70
1/28/13 at 8:44pm
Thread Starter 
.
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post #34 of 70
1/29/13 at 3:23am
I didn't realize until just now that Lutron offers 2 IR lighting control platforms, the most basic Maestro IR and the Lutron Spacer systems.

From a brief search, I don't know if the Maestro IR product can be controlled with a wired emitter, but the Spacer keypad can. I would assume the Spacer dimmers can too, but not sure.

Read all you can on both before you buy.
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post #35 of 70
1/29/13 at 3:59am
Quote:
Sir, Maestro Wireless cannot be controlled by iRule.

Yes it can.
Quote:
I don't know if the Maestro IR product can be controlled with a wired emitter,

It can
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post #36 of 70
1/29/13 at 4:37am
How is Maestro RF/Wireless controlled with iRule?

Where is the Maestro IR emitter placed? Front receiver, in front of the plate?
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post #37 of 70
1/29/13 at 8:58am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Neurorad View Post

How is Maestro RF/Wireless controlled with iRule?

Where is the Maestro IR emitter placed? Front receiver, in front of the plate?

The Maestro IR piece that I think we're talking about here are IR only. Maestro RF is a different animal. I have one Maestro IR dimmer and use an MX900 to shoot IR at it. I think this is the product that iRule can control with a blaster or well placed emitter.
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post #38 of 70
1/29/13 at 9:26am
Quote:
Originally Posted by ekkoville View Post

The Maestro IR piece that I think we're talking about here are IR only. Maestro RF is a different animal. I have one Maestro IR dimmer and use an MX900 to shoot IR at it. I think this is the product that iRule can control with a blaster or well placed emitter.

Sorry, that was 2 unrelated questions.
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post #39 of 70
1/29/13 at 8:54pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by az1324 View Post

Well post what you learned, what you like about the options you narrowed down, and then say why you are stuck trying to decide. Address professional install vs your DIY ability and budget as those are the two most important factors.

Otherwise you are asking someone to design a system for you and not only that but make sure to ask you the details of what you want so they can get it right. Sounds like a professional consulting job.

Talk about a welcoming attitude. Sheesh...if you don't want to answer the question, then don't answer it. Why berate the guy? I am starting from scratch here and don't know what questions to ask, so the kind of discussion the OP's post could generate would be of interest to me as I begin to gather enough knowledge to even know where to go and do research and which questions to ask. He if were an expert, he would not need anyone's help.

Bottomline, there are plenty of posts to read. If you don't like this, skip it as let those who are interested read it without watching someone talk down to someone else.
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post #40 of 70
1/30/13 at 5:06pm
Thread Starter 
I agree
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post #41 of 70
1/30/13 at 5:23pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by SAM64 View Post

Yes it can.
It can

I've never used the product so I'm basing this entirely off of their website, and it makes no mention of an IR capability. It only discusses the "Clear Connect RF Technology" capability.
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post #42 of 70
1/30/13 at 7:45pm
I now realize that Sam64 is probably referring to the wireless IR system and not wireless RF.
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post #43 of 70
1/30/13 at 7:51pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by FinanceBuzz View Post

Talk about a welcoming attitude. Sheesh...if you don't want to answer the question, then don't answer it. Why berate the guy? I am starting from scratch here and don't know what questions to ask, so the kind of discussion the OP's post could generate would be of interest to me as I begin to gather enough knowledge to even know where to go and do research and which questions to ask. He if were an expert, he would not need anyone's help.

Bottomline, there are plenty of posts to read. If you don't like this, skip it as let those who are interested read it without watching someone talk down to someone else.

Thanks for making that bolded point. Search, read, repeat. Even if you don't know what questions to ask, chances are they have already been answered. If they haven't, by all means post them. But by then they are going to be well-informed, specific, answerable questions. The great thing about the internet is that it can eliminate the inefficiency of traditional human interaction (eg. the guy at home depot who spends all day answering the same question over and over). So search is awesome, thick skin is awesome, and learning things is awesome (including learning new ways to function as a person/netizen aka don't be set in your ways).

As this thread demonstrates, when there is no focus to the topic you get misinformation and extraneous posts which doesn't help anyone.

So hopefully this thread gets back on track by the OP posting what he decides to do and why, and any mistakes he makes so that other people can avoid them in the future and posts in such a way as to make it easily searchable for others.
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post #44 of 70
1/30/13 at 7:56pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Neurorad View Post

I now realize that Sam64 is probably referring to the wireless IR system and not wireless RF.

"Maestro IR" and "Maestro Wireless" are two distinct products, I haven't found any models that merge the two.
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post #45 of 70
1/31/13 at 3:56am
Thread Starter 
OK, so I'm working with a good installer with some Elan, control 4, and creston? experience. I've worked with him in the past and does a great job. So after talking with him about what we are trying to do he is doing some research into irule and insteon.

Right now I am leaning towards going with Lutron switches and controlling it with iRule. What I'm trying to figure out is whether to use Lutron Maestro Wireless or the RadioRA2. I believe both will work with iRule if you buy the proper converter. Apparently it costs around $400. Has any ever worked with both of these with iRule and have a recommendation? Would prefer the Maestro Wirelss since it is a lot cheaper but if general consensus is that it's worth the money then I will go that way.

Seems to be a lot of confusion about which Lutron to go with and conflicting posts on here. Hoping someone has had experience with both.

I also talked to iRule and said to control the Somfy RF RTS shades I need another $400 adapter to convert the signal for the shades. Has ayone ever done this either?

Hope this has been a good update. I am definitely learning a lot. Thanks again for the help.
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post #46 of 70
1/31/13 at 4:07am
The obvious thing to do is call Lutron and ask if MRF2 can be used with any home automation bridge. But basically the reason why they are cheaper is because they cannot. Besides the one post in this thread, where have you read that they can?
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post #47 of 70
1/31/13 at 4:28am
Thread Starter 
I will be honest, I cannot remember. I have read so many articles and threads I can't recall. So basically I need to go with radiora2? I have looked at Insteon and it is appealing cause of the cost but the reviews are mixed.
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post #48 of 70
1/31/13 at 7:03am
Yes, but I think it's really hard to justify the added expense and hassle of RA2 over Insteon. With Insteon it is very easy and inexpensive to try out a few products and see if you like it, so why not start there.
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post #49 of 70
1/31/13 at 12:04pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by ajeagle6921 View Post

I will be honest, I cannot remember. I have read so many articles and threads I can't recall. So basically I need to go with radiora2? I have looked at Insteon and it is appealing cause of the cost but the reviews are mixed.

I think wherever you read that, the poster was mistaken or confusing the product with another Lutron device. The IR dimmers can be controlled by a handheld remote, but there's no "hard wired" IR port on the back or whatever to allow reliable control from iRule, etc. Within the Lutron line you might be able to use the Spacer system, but that would require one system per room, and would still need further integration to work beyond that.
Quote:
Originally Posted by az1324 View Post

Yes, but I think it's really hard to justify the added expense and hassle of RA2 over Insteon. With Insteon it is very easy and inexpensive to try out a few products and see if you like it, so why not start there.

Well, RA2 is certainly more expensive, but has a number of advantages / features over Insteon. But yes, Insteon is very cheap and easy to start out with and try, and if it doesn't fit your needs, you can swap out components for RA2. Which is the path I'm on currently. I wasn't happy with the basics I was doing with Insteon, and the more-appealing keypad solutions of RA2 is what tipped me over to that solution (I've gone through the training, haven't pulled the trigger on the purchase yet).

Jeff
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post #50 of 70
1/31/13 at 12:07pm
I've often wondered if Maestro RF could be controlled with RA2. The (old) integration protocol wasn't clear.

Just pulled up the newest version of that paper (Rev K, Dec 2012), and I see 'Clear Connect Integration Access Points'. WTH?

Will RA2 be phased out, replaced with the new 'Clear Connect' platform? Where does this Clear Connect Integration Access Point fit in? Most probably, It looks like Maestro RF will be replaced with this system called 'Clear Connect'.

Page 37, list of Clear Connect System Device Compatibility Index - everything but RA2 Main Controller.

Looks like RA2 is distinguished from CC by the Vacation Mode, and RS232 integration. Not sure what other distinguishing features exist.

Edit - Link to latest rev of integration protocol
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post #51 of 70
1/31/13 at 12:13pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Neurorad View Post

Will RA2 be phased out, replaced with the new 'Clear Connect' platform? Where does this Clear Connect Integration Access Point fit in? Most probably, It looks like Maestro RF will be replaced with this system called 'Clear Connect'.

The RA2 platform is based on "Luton's Clear Connect RF technology"...

I'd assume the other RF dimmers are using the same underlying technology (probably the same devices!), dumbed-down with fixed addresses / functions to build more plug-and-play small system solutions. I doubt they'll make something that would allow the whole-house-level integration of RA2 at a lower price point. I think it's basically the same gear - if they want to do that, just lower the price of RA2...

Jeff
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post #52 of 70
1/31/13 at 12:55pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by jautor View Post

The RA2 platform is based on "Luton's Clear Connect RF technology"...

I'd assume the other RF dimmers are using the same underlying technology (probably the same devices!), dumbed-down with fixed addresses / functions to build more plug-and-play small system solutions. I doubt they'll make something that would allow the whole-house-level integration of RA2 at a lower price point. I think it's basically the same gear - if they want to do that, just lower the price of RA2...

Jeff

You are correct, they are both based on the same underlying "Clear Connect" technology. Only RA2 is meant to be used in full home automation applications, Maestro Wireless is meant as a entry level technology for people who want limited remote control ability but no software controller for full HA.

To the OP, everything you've described tells me you should go Insteon. RA2 is not for beginners, and it's much more expensive. Z-Wave isn't necessarily better. WeMo has serious flaws (see here).
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post #53 of 70
1/31/13 at 4:12pm
To the OP, you may want to investigate using Roomie Remote instead of irule for control. You may find the learning curve more to your liking.

Cheers,
Jim
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post #54 of 70
1/31/13 at 4:47pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Neurorad View Post


Where does this Clear Connect Integration Access Point fit in?

That is for the CCD line sold through AMX.

Yes all the wireless dimmers are the same hardware. Now you're starting to understand my complaints. wink.gif
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post #55 of 70
1/31/13 at 6:40pm
How do you wire a 2-way switch on insteon? RR2 requires a switch on one end and a remote switch on the other. Price on the remote is significantly cheaper than the swittch so if you add the cost of the two RR2 switches its probably closer to the price of two insteon switches assuming of course the insteon switches used is the same on both end.

Keep in mind that if you work with a authorized dealer, you can get a significant discount from the list price.
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post #56 of 70
1/31/13 at 7:44pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by crisms98 View Post

How do you wire a 2-way switch on insteon? RR2 requires a switch on one end and a remote switch on the other. Price on the remote is significantly cheaper than the swittch so if you add the cost of the two RR2 switches its probably closer to the price of two insteon switches assuming of course the insteon switches used is the same on both end.

Keep in mind that if you work with a authorized dealer, you can get a significant discount from the list price.

You mean a 3-way circuit (two switches)? You just link them together they don't even have to share a common wire. Yes they are the same cost $50 each but that's still probably cheaper. Plus it comes with the advantages of not requiring the dedicated communication wire, the ability to use the second switch as a load control also, the ability to trigger different scenes or on levels from each switch, etc...
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post #57 of 70
1/31/13 at 10:21pm
The difference is about $15 for the same switches on RR2. Not sure if what you described regarding light scenes is done by a switch or keypad since RR2 does scenes on keypads and in the main repeater as phantom keys.
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post #58 of 70
2/1/13 at 5:21am
In this newest Lutron Integration Protocol, all of the RA2 compatible devices listed (p 30) are also listed for the Clear Connect system (p 37). The Clear Connect integration access point (the 'Translator') appears to lack a 'monitor' function, for integration. RA2 Main Repeater has this function.
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post #59 of 70
2/1/13 at 6:14am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Neurorad View Post

In this newest Lutron Integration Protocol, all of the RA2 compatible devices listed (p 30) are also listed for the Clear Connect system (p 37). The Clear Connect integration access point (the 'Translator') appears to lack a 'monitor' function, for integration. RA2 Main Repeater has this function.

Well you have to note that there are versions of (most of) those devices whose part numbers start with CC instead of RR. As to how far they went to engineer incompatibility, who knows. Maybe it's all smoke and mirrors and the only difference is the label. The only thing to do would be to try everything and see what works.

That gateway does support monitoring, but it only supports 31 devices.
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post #60 of 70
2/1/13 at 6:50am
Following RA2 forums pretty closely the last few years, nobody has come out and said the Maestro RF dimmers can be used with the RA2 Main Repeater. Might have to give it a shot someday.
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