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Inexpensive: <$2k - 4K TV about to enter US - Page 6

post #151 of 194
BR can hold 100GB. There is no reason why the upcoming Sony 4K player, and PS4, couldn't have a BR player that would dump the Discs to a contained hard drive for playing. Beats the heck out of downloading and streaming is out of the question.
post #152 of 194
Someone on overclock.net bought a Skyworth 39e780u 39" 4K HDTV (review) for only $600 by wiring someone in China, and getting it shipped to him.

Surprisingly, the display overclocks (via computer) to a true 140Hz refresh rate at 1920x1080, confirmed native 120Hz with multtool... (And supposedly 254Hz refresh rate at 1280x720, but not fully confirmed)

Also blogged at Blur Busters as well as added to HDTV Overclocking HOWTO: True Native 120Hz from PC to TV
Edited by Mark Rejhon - 6/13/13 at 3:28pm
post #153 of 194
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark Rejhon View Post

Someone on overclock.net bought a Skyworth 39e780u 39" 4K HDTV (review) for only $600 by wiring someone in China, and getting it shipped to him.

Surprisingly, the display overclocks (via computer) to a true 140Hz refresh rate at 1920x1080, and to a true 254Hz refresh rate at 1280x720!

Also blogged at Blur Busters as well as added to HDTV Overclocking HOWTO: True Native 120Hz from PC to TV

 

Ironically, someone in the Sony KDL-xxR550A forum just posted that the TV can take 120hz native all on its own.  I don't know if he's being fooled by some HDMI handshaking that may or may not be going on behind his back, but I find that interesting.  That and HDCP used to be the only things that made monitors monitors and TVs TVs.

post #154 of 194
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark Rejhon View Post

Someone on overclock.net bought a Skyworth 39e780u 39" 4K HDTV (review) for only $600 by wiring someone in China, and getting it shipped to him.

Surprisingly, the display overclocks (via computer) to a true 140Hz refresh rate at 1920x1080, and to a true 254Hz refresh rate at 1280x720!

Also blogged at Blur Busters as well as added to HDTV Overclocking HOWTO: True Native 120Hz from PC to TV

 

This is great news, but I see it far beyond gamers.  It opens the door to 3rd party attempts at interpolation---the next rev of darblet or whatever.  Even open source stuff potentially (maybe?....or does that come up against blu-ray and HDCP licensing hooey?)

post #155 of 194
Quote:
Originally Posted by RLBURNSIDE View Post

30hz sucks for desktop use, you can try it on your current 1080p display if you don't believe me. They haven't used 30hz for computer monitors since the days of EGA, if even then. I don't remember ever owning a < 60hz tv or monitor.

This thread has convinced me not to upgrade my receiver until HDMI 2.0 is out and all the kinks are sorted out. Really, 4k /30hz passthrough is useless cruft for those of us who want their displays to be smoother than a circa 1920s era projector. Hopefully you can get the 60hz signal through, one way or the other. Having to use a second cable isn't the worst thing in the world. I'm really looking forward to a highly curved 4k projector screen that will literally put me in the center of the virtual worlds I create. Perhaps a variable, curvature DIY screen could be cool, but that assumes Ps4 games will support changing the projection matrix, which is highly doubtful.

Are we stuck in a never ending cycle of HDMI updates requiring AVR purchases? It seems like we need new AVRs every 2-3 years now which is getting expensive.
post #156 of 194
Quote:
Originally Posted by ThumperII View Post

Are we stuck in a never ending cycle of HDMI updates requiring AVR purchases? It seems like we need new AVRs every 2-3 years now which is getting expensive.
This is part of the reason I use a HTPC as my sole playback device, using an external DAC rather than passing audio through HDMI.
post #157 of 194
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chronoptimist View Post

This is part of the reason I use a HTPC as my sole playback device, using an external DAC rather than passing audio through HDMI.

How do you get the digital audio to your external DAC?
post #158 of 194
Has anyone else tried to buy the Skyworth 4K TV, at least to test as a 39" computer monitor?

This Skyworth 4K TV needs to be purchased through a Chinese buying agent service, such as via Taobao Buying Agent Service (e.g. like this page) [WARNING: Unverified] and other services such as these. A Buying Agent is an agent service that purchases stuff only domestically available inside mainland china & ships them out of the country to you. This can cost a pretty penny, but the TV is rather cheap for 4K.

You also need to buy a voltage converter, to convert your voltage to Chinese compatible voltage (220V, 50HZ, 60 watts minimum, 100 watts recommended), since this TV does not have a universal voltage power supply.
It is only 600 dollars including shipping, so the risk outlay is fairly low.
post #159 of 194
I would do it, but I'd get laughed at trying to fit a 39" on the desk in the home office. frown.gif
post #160 of 194
Quote:
Originally Posted by rogo View Post

I would do it, but I'd get laughed at trying to fit a 39" on the desk in the home office. frown.gif

Why? I have a 37" 1080P on my desk at home and a 30" 2560P on my desk at work. I'm very interested in the Seiki 39" 4k for both home and office desk when it comes out around Christmas time or so.

Until you have worked with something that large you can't appreciate it.
post #161 of 194
Quote:
Originally Posted by rogo View Post

I would do it, but I'd get laughed at trying to fit a 39" on the desk in the home office. frown.gif
It's not that big, especially if you can wall-mount it. You will find using a 4K display that size considerably more productive than whatever you are using right now - and a single large monitor has been proven to be more effective than multiple monitors.
post #162 of 194
Exactly. The 37" I've been using at my home office for years has been wall mounted with a scissors mount. It allows me to easily pull it closer, tilt, pivot, etc.

I have a couch in the office as well so it works when I have client over and need to show them things.
post #163 of 194
Quote:
Originally Posted by rogo View Post

I would do it, but I'd get laughed at trying to fit a 39" on the desk in the home office. frown.gif

When literally put on a desk, the 39" is too big from the ergonomy point of view. Assuming the viewing distance of 1-1.5 PH, the proper mount of a monitor is when eye height is quite above the horizontal center line of the screen allowing the head to to be in a slightly downward looking position (it is absolutely unacceptable for the head to be in the up or even neutral position). Thus, for proper positioning of bigger monitors one has to use a professional desk allowing to lower the monitor stand area below the desk surface. In this way, lower edge of the screen can be adjusted to be at the level of the desk or even below it. This obviously has a limit as it would look awkward to have a lower edge of the display much below the desk surface but the 39" monitor seems to be still reasonable in this respect. Concern then is only if the horizontal viewing angle is still OK for flat monitor as the eye distance difference to the center and edges is quite big, curved displays would solve this problem.
post #164 of 194
Pre-orders for the Seiki 39" 4K TV > $699 starts June 27; http://www.engadget.com/2013/06/25/seiki-launches-39-inch-4k-tv-for-699/
post #165 of 194
^Could be the same panel as in the Asus 39" 4K monitor? The monitor was also predicted to be rather cheap.
post #166 of 194
Quote:
Originally Posted by coolscan View Post

Pre-orders for the Seiki 39" 4K TV > $699 starts June 27; http://www.engadget.com/2013/06/25/seiki-launches-39-inch-4k-tv-for-699/
Good timing.

I'd now wait for this one -- far easier to get than the Skyworth.
Available at Sears, full warranty, and ready to plug into a North American power outlet!
post #167 of 194
I've been on the fence for the last month or so over the 50" model. I wanted all those pixels on my desktop, but it seemed just a bit too big to be practical. The 39" version eliminates that worry. I will definitely be pre-ordering in two days.
post #168 of 194
Quote:
Originally Posted by irkuck View Post

^Could be the same panel as in the Asus 39" 4K monitor? The monitor was also predicted to be rather cheap.
Probably the same panel source with Asus framework and software.
Might be an even better deal as Monitor because of the Display port and the Asus software built in tune with Asus GPUs for PC monitoring more than TV.
They should hurry up! wink.gif
post #169 of 194
How close do you have to sit to a 39 inch to see the 4K resolution difference?
post #170 of 194
Pretty darn close. That's why this doesn't make sense as a TV, but makes perfect sense as a monitor.
post #171 of 194
Quote:
Originally Posted by Artwood View Post

How close do you have to sit to a 39 inch to see the 4K resolution difference?

Pixel size on this monitor will be like pixels on a standard 20" 1920x1080 monitor, just go and check. Remember the use as computer monitor implies that sometimes viewing distance is very close.
post #172 of 194
Quote:
Originally Posted by irkuck View Post

When literally put on a desk, the 39" is too big from the ergonomy point of view. Assuming the viewing distance of 1-1.5 PH, the proper mount of a monitor is when eye height is quite above the horizontal center line of the screen allowing the head to to be in a slightly downward looking position (it is absolutely unacceptable for the head to be in the up or even neutral position). Thus, for proper positioning of bigger monitors one has to use a professional desk allowing to lower the monitor stand area below the desk surface. In this way, lower edge of the screen can be adjusted to be at the level of the desk or even below it. This obviously has a limit as it would look awkward to have a lower edge of the display much below the desk surface but the 39" monitor seems to be still reasonable in this respect. Concern then is only if the horizontal viewing angle is still OK for flat monitor as the eye distance difference to the center and edges is quite big, curved displays would solve this problem.

Have to disagree. I have been using a 37" Samsung 1080P LCD as a PC monitor for over 3 years. Viewing distance is ~1.7 PH with a slight upward tilt to my head. Upward tilt is much less stressful to an old whiplash injury than downward tilt. 39 - 42" width should be no problem as primary use is to read material such as on this forum. Undecided at this point of whether to buy soon or wait until HDMI 2 is standard on sets. In any case expect experience to be like going from iPad generation 1 to gen 3 retina display.
post #173 of 194
Quote:
Originally Posted by dsinger View Post

Have to disagree. I have been using a 37" Samsung 1080P LCD as a PC monitor for over 3 years. Viewing distance is ~1.7 PH with a slight upward tilt to my head. Upward tilt is much less stressful to an old whiplash injury than downward tilt. 39 - 42" width should be no problem as primary use is to read material such as on this forum. Undecided at this point of whether to buy soon or wait until HDMI 2 is standard on sets. In any case expect experience to be like going from iPad generation 1 to gen 3 retina display.
+1

Agreed. No display is too big to be used as a computer monitor, as long as the display is pushed back to allow seeing the whole display without turning your head, and the DPI settings is properly adjusted.
(That said Mac DPI scaling is superior to Windows DPI scaling.)
post #174 of 194
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark Rejhon View Post

+1

Agreed. No display is too big to be used as a computer monitor, as long as the display is pushed back to allow seeing the whole display without turning your head, and the DPI settings is properly adjusted.
(That said Mac DPI scaling is superior to Windows DPI scaling.)

Correct my 37" 1080P is mounted to a wall 4.5 feet from the from the other side of the desk and I often sit a bit further than that.
post #175 of 194
Quote:
Originally Posted by irkuck View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Artwood View Post

How close do you have to sit to a 39 inch to see the 4K resolution difference?

Pixel size on this monitor will be like pixels on a standard 20" 1920x1080 monitor, just go and check. Remember the use as computer monitor implies that sometimes viewing distance is very close.

 

Correct and correct.  He shouldn't need to check that though: Doubling the diagonal of a rectangle will double both the width and height.  Going from 2K 20" to 4K 40" to 8K 80" all yield the same size for each pixel.  Just so very many more of the LCD pixels he so loves.

post #176 of 194
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark Rejhon View Post

That said Mac DPI scaling is superior to Windows DPI scaling.
Mac renders 100% and 200% natively, any other setting is scaled and looks blurry.
Windows renders 100, 125 and 150% natively. Since Windows 8, it handles DPI scaling just as well as Macs do. (previously versions could break older applications when using DPI scaling)

A 39" 4K display has roughly the same DPI as a standard PC monitor, so there is no need to use DPI scaling at all though.
Quote:
Originally Posted by tgm1024 View Post

Going from 2K 20" to 4K 40" to 8K 80" all yield the same size for each pixel. Just so very many more of the LCD pixels he so loves.
This is why I want a 55" 8K display. Then we will finally have a high DPI display (~160 DPI) at a reasonably large size.
post #177 of 194
Guys, thanks for the comments.

I would get laughed it, it won't fit on my desk, it can't be wall mounted or placed on some ergo arm, it can't be lowered, etc. etc.

It's a nice idea, but until there is Apple support, I don't even really need to solve the problem.
post #178 of 194
Quote:
Originally Posted by rogo View Post

Guys, thanks for the comments.

I would get laughed it, it won't fit on my desk, it can't be wall mounted or placed on some ergo arm, it can't be lowered, etc. etc.

It's a nice idea, but until there is Apple support, I don't even really need to solve the problem.

I would rather be laughed at while having a 39" 4k display on my desk smile.gif I'd be laughing right back ... that would be awesome.
post #179 of 194
I'm very interested in the 39" Seiki, more for gaming than anything. That being the case I'll probably just wait to see what Asus puts out in their cheapie 39" displayport equipped model. I already have 2 GTX Titans, what's 1 more?biggrin.gif
post #180 of 194
Quote:
Originally Posted by rogo View Post

It's a nice idea, but until there is Apple support, I don't even really need to solve the problem.
There's a tweak that makes the SEIKI 4K work on Apple
Yes, unofficial, but it works.

Members in the RedUser.net forums (the home of RED Cinema cameras) solved the Apple 4K problem, and has a Macbook Air running the SEIKI 4K at full 3840x2160 at full 30Hz!

Photo proof of a lowly Macbook Air -- even playing back 4K video at full framerate.
Passive adaptor from Belkin + minor Apple driver patch (to remove 165Mhz pixel clock limit)
It's somewhat of an unofficial software hack, but it works.



original post in thread
Edited by Mark Rejhon - 6/26/13 at 8:45pm
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