statements spec?

http://www.htguide.com/forum/showpost.php4?p=379820&postcount=781

 

I can't find anything about power but Jim Holtz recommends minimum 100wats..

http://www.htguide.com/forum/showpost.php4?p=385185&postcount=807

Did you see the new Finalists? Those are pretty nice too, but not quite the size of Statements.

Avr is fine. The rating you are looking at is closer to power handling, not power needed to play loud enough.

Have you completed the Statements build yet, OP? I am highly considering doing a pair of Statements and a Statement Center, but I want to make sure that it is up to the performance of the Seos12 and Corn-Scala in terms of Sound Quality. I am also curious as to how the Statements would stack up against the Ascend Acoustics Sierra Towers, or the Mini-Statements versus the Sierra-1, also from Ascend. If any of you guys know anything about this, please either post up, or PM me. I will probably start my own thread with these questions later today.

Statements kit?

Can you provide the source for the kit(s)?

Nevermind, I found the Meniscus site, cool!

Based on the reviews and, it would be hard to believe the Statements would not best the Ascend Acoustics Sierra Towers, but that is subjective.
Edited by jpmst3 - 2/15/13 at 6:15pm

I always wanted to build them.
Post some pix of your build!

A far as I know, Statements are a 90dB sensitive speaker (if someone knows for sure, please elaborate). This means that for reference level playback, if you sit around 12 feet away, they will need over 400W each, closer to 500W.

With one Watt in, at around 12 feet you get 78dB. The first 100W (what a receiver usually can give), gets you to 98dB. 200W gets you to 101dB. 400W to 104dB (ONLY if there is ZERO power compression. Good luck with that). Reference level can ask 105dB from any speaker, and 115dB from a sub. if you listen 5-10dB below reference, you should be great with 300W each.

You simply cannot get past a low sensitivity speaker for reference level home theater playback without running into problems, hence the popularity of higher sensitivity builds lately.

For lower volume playback, the Statements look like a real hi quality speaker, and are very well regarded. But they are not the right tool for the job in an HT that needs to be capable of Reference Level playback.

JSS

Man I live in an apartment and absolutely never go any higher than -15db on the volume. Doesn't matter because I am using a Behringer EP4k to power my left and right mains, and then a single Behringer EP1.5k for the center. So I should have more than enough power to get the volume levels I want in my room, which is also small.

Not everyone is interested in reference level play back. That would be dead last on my list of priorities.

Not everyone knows the limitations of low sensitivity speakers, either. I guess I should have quoted the OP. My mistake. But since you did bring up 2 high sensitivity type speakers to compare to the Statements, I thought I would share where they differ, and the limitations therein.

JSS

That is true, I suppose. I have personally never been a fan of high efficiency speakers compared to what I will call, hifi speakers. To me, having the best reproduction of vocals and other mid-range to high-range sounds, takes priority over being able to fill the room with reference level sound. Now granted, this is a highly individual thing and everyone has their own opinion. I can certainly see what so many people love about high efficiency designs. They fill the room with lots of sound, have killer dynamics, and sound more like an actual movie theater. I get that some folks love those traits, but for myself, I am willing to sacrifice some SPL for detail and clarity. There are several brands and models that combine the high efficiency design benefits with the hifi sound quality benefits to form a speaker that is truly spectacular, unfortunately those usually cost well over $10,000.00. LoL. Unfortunately I can not afford those

With all of that being said in the above paragraph, I am exploring possible ways to make a really nice high efficiency speaker that has just as good sound quality as something like the Ascend Acoustics Sierra or Salk Song-Tower. Perhaps that is shooting a little too high and I should consider trying to best something like a Dynaudio Focus 360 or a Paradigm Studio 100, or Paradigm Signature series. There are brands and models that get a lot of respect in the DIY high efficiency world such as TAD, Radian, Beyma, BMS, ect;...I plan on building something from some of these drivers one day......First thing is first though, and that is the Statements or Corn-Scalas!

I would be surprised if you need more than half the power you are talking about. A true 100 -150w in HT is way loud even for the most inefficient speakers.
I don't have the largest theater, but I could never use even 100w with 88db speakers. Even that gets me to 120db peaks.

How is that possible? 100w gets you 120db peaks with a speaker rated at 88db...maybe if you were sitting 1 feet away but not at a normal listening distance. You would need something like 6000 watts to get to 120db.
 

What brand and model is your AVR? How big is your listening area?

I seriously doubt that you are going to be disappointed because of lack of SPL. Don't let those guys get to you. They always preach about high efficiency and being able to hit reference, over sound quality. I would take sound quality any day over high efficiency.. I am sure that you will be able to drive these Statements to levels higher than you would normally listen at. The truth is that most of us rarely ever listen to anything even remotely close to reference. Good luck with your build and don't sweat the small stuff!

Well, I am not just running a pair of mains. They are part of a multi-channal HT system.
Even when I am running only stereo, there is no way I could be seated in front of my speakers for extended periods without hearing damage/headaches.
HT is one thing with peaks here and there. But continual listening at anywhere those levels is literally painful.

I don't know who these people are that listen to things at reference levels for casual listening.

I agree, it is always better to have plenty of headroom for sure. 250W will be headroom galore.

This is not a cheap hobby!

Dont let the people who consider SPL capability as the #1 priority, make that your #1 priority. You are going to be very impressed with the Statements.

Guys,

I was not trying to start a war here. But as far as I can tell, the OP wants SPL capability.

I personally listen at -7 to -10dBref, due to a combination of small children + distortion limitations. I use 93dB mains, and they begin to sound strained above -7dBRef, so counter to the above, sound quality actually is something I seriously pay attention to.

Lemme put it to you this way:

1. IF, again, I say IF Reference Level playback is a high priority for you, low sensitivity speakers are not the best way to go.

2. If you are interested in sound quality over everything else, and do not require Reference Level playback, low sensitivity speakers in a well treated room are a very good option.

3. No matter what speaker type you choose, room treatments are essential to good sound, but that is also a matter of preference vs reference. JBL's Everests will sound like crap in an empty gymnasium to my ears, but may be magic to another's.

If you already have the Statement stuff, build them. I cannot think of a single person that did not think they were amazing, they are world-class.

As for reaching 120dB peaks with 88dB speakers, your 88dB speakers are not providing the 120dB by themselves, they cannot, unless room modes are doing some boosting (SPL meters do not care what frequency the highest amplitude is at). Greater than 115dB peaks are only possible when subwoofer + several speakers are all playing back coherent sound at the limits of the amplitude built into the spec, IF you have flat frequency response at the location your SPL meter is measuring. My old house had a great +15dB peak at 60Hz. Needless to say, Reference Level,was easy to get at that frequency, and 'midbass slam' was quite prominent in any recording. Once EQ'ed, everything was much quieter, and it was far easier to run into distortion limits than SPL limits.

People playing back at Reference with only 100-150W AVR power and 88dB speakers are deluding themselves. By definition there is negative headroom in such a scenario at >3m listening distances for the loudest passages. I would be very curious to test such a system and see how much distortion is present.

JSS

There is no question, as I stated above, 5.1 and level balanced. 88db is anechoic, not real world.
The OP said he is building the center so I would assume it will be at least 5.1 as well.

But, yes, if SPL is your focus then yes, you would want much more efficient speakers.

If you want balance or SPL and SQ, based on the testimonials, I would bet you will be very pleased with the Statements.
Edited by jpmst3 - 2/18/13 at 11:43am

It's one of them topics that has always been debated. ( at least as I remember )
Peak reading meters have been around long enough to provide guidelines and a good idea of the dynamic range of any piece of music.

I would build them first and try out what you have.
You may already have all the power you need.

Agreed. I think the statements with the power the OP has will be a great improvement over nearly any system.

JSS