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*WOW* ... SVP +1080p Animation = OMG ! (60 frames per second for the win!) - Page 2

post #31 of 660
I must say it - here is the main thread about SVP wink.gif
post #32 of 660
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by renethx View Post

SVP 3.1.4 was just released. Lite is enough if you already have Avisynth and ffdshow installed (you can download them from the same page). BTW it works with any 32-bit DirectShow player including WMP (32-bit is default) and WMC (if you use Windows 32-bit).


I have 3.1.3 installed.

Should I bother installing the new one ?
post #33 of 660
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chainik View Post

I must say it - here is the main thread about SVP wink.gif

I found it from the link ReneThx posted above, but after I started this one. Sorry.
post #34 of 660
Interesting thread.

So what do you all feel is the minimum monetary investment in hardware required to be able to tinker w svp? Seems like its substantial.
post #35 of 660
There are several preset levels, from 1c, 1g up to 5c, 5g. Even Core i3-3225 with its iGPU can handle madVR BC50/DXVA2/DXVA2 + SVP level 2g with "crop" on. Better hardware means better quality (i.e. higher levels), of course.
Edited by renethx - 2/17/13 at 9:11am
post #36 of 660
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by assassin View Post

Interesting thread.

So what do you all feel is the minimum monetary investment in hardware required to be able to tinker w svp? Seems like its substantial.


I'd say a 3570k is a good compromise between "high end / expensive" and very basic. It is probably enough for level 3/4 I am guessing; and I am pretty certain you could level 5 with a good GPU card and/or overclock.
It would give you a basic entry point or upgrade path.

3570k + say Asrock Z77 board is about $200ish at Microcenter ... so that's probably the cheapest you could go and have a reasonable expectation for a good upgrade path like overclocking or adding a more serious GPU if you wanted in future. I would guess most i3's can do it, and do it even better with a GPU of coarse wink.gif It all depends on the levels you want. The lower levels run fine on an i3.

If you already own an i3 or higher it's free to try it out. My guess is some will try SVP and then never really use it much beyond playing around, while others might really like it and add a robust GPU to get more .

If you want max quality though you'll certainly want a decent CPU and GPU combo. No way can you go maximum quality on cheap hardware.

I ran VLC on one monitor and MPC-HC with the toys on the other side by side and in time sync. I dropped a few frames when the movies started and I click MPC-HC from window to full screen then after that none.

Very noticable improvement on Monsters Inc and Cars. Even wife instantly noticed and agreed. I would use one of these for the first test before switching to other scenes if you have them. Use a 1080p video (although with a weaker CPU you'll get better quality on 720p) if you can. It's a good stress test.

I wish there was a cool way to post my test. It's very obvious side by side testing. I am lucky enough to have dual monitors and the ability to run dual 1080p side by side with different players to compare. I have the exact same Samsung Monitors so it's pretty easy for me to test this out. The into of TITANIC and some of the universal intro, Columbia or Fox intro's are pretty easy to tell if SVP is on in the first few seconds of something playing. I think it's a huge benefit for newer animation but I am still playing around with it for movies. It's possible too good for normal movies.. lol.

I'm nearly certain a 7000 series Radeon and 3570k would be a really good entry point if someone was starting out fresh but I'll digress to ReneTHX's advice for certainty.
post #37 of 660
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by renethx View Post

So do you see 6c and 6g (maybe more, 7c, 7g)? I haven't seen such levels. confused.gif

I am reading this as tongue in cheek wink.gif yes ?

I'm pretty certain a 7G setting would crush even a high end PC. I'd be afraid to think what you'd need to run that eek.gif

Perhaps a LGA2011 based system with multiple GPU cards and 2133mhz+ memory clock might do it.
post #38 of 660
I have some mismatched memory temporarily installed with a gt430 and an i3-3220 and it does pretty damn good.

So! If you are reading this, and you have a similar setup to mine, give it a shot. You'll be happy with the results
post #39 of 660
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mfusick View Post

I'm nearly certain a 7000 series Radeon and 3570k would be a really good entry point if someone was starting out fresh but I'll digress to ReneTHX's advice for certainty.

Yes, i5-3570K + HD 7770 is good for madVR and SVP in the current highest level profiles and is not terribly expensive. If you can afford, go with i7-3770K + HD 7970 (even good for playing SD/HD/FHD contents with madVR+SVP in 4K UHD display; playing back 4K UHD contents with SVP is out of question of course, because of 32-bit memory limitation [this is the first case that 64-bit is actually necessary in video playback, except for multi-tasking cases]).
Edited by renethx - 2/17/13 at 10:40am
post #40 of 660
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mfusick View Post

I am reading this as tongue in cheek wink.gif yes ?

I'm pretty certain a 7G setting would crush even a high end PC. I'd be afraid to think what you'd need to run that eek.gif

Perhaps a LGA2011 based system with multiple GPU cards and 2133mhz+ memory clock might do it.

I just ran a few performance tests. I am not manually overclocked or anything serious. My PC is very stable with headroom if I wanted to get more serious.

I'll post my results for anyone that wants to compare.

If anyone is interested in seeing what their system can do there is a good FREE trial benchmark at Passmark you can try.

http://www.passmark.com/products/pt.htm


Here is a little of what I got just now with very little optimization:













I think the biggest benchmark for SVP is probably CPU. What your CPU can do will go a long way in SVP.

http://www.cpubenchmark.net/high_end_cpus.html

You can find your CPU there (That is the high end chart, might need go midrange to find some CPU)











I am guessing any CPU with a 5000 score or higher has good potential for SVP, and anything about 7500 should do level 5 no problems.

Now,


As far as level 7G eek.gif

I doubt even an i7 3770k could do it... lol That's probably the most affordable and main stream high end CPU today.
post #41 of 660
The biggest problem I'm running into is comskip is eating up my cpu at times. Other than that, I get some pretty good results.
post #42 of 660
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by AnthonyB View Post

The biggest problem I'm running into is comskip is eating up my cpu at times. Other than that, I get some pretty good results.

Yup. I would imagine the biggest problem with running an i3 would be headroom. If something competes for CPU or system power it's going to effect your SVP.

You either need to set it even lower or disable other activities
post #43 of 660
but its so uhm un-natural, like its filmed with video cam... .. just weird
post #44 of 660
You have to give it some time for your brain to get used to it. It looks more natural as you grow more used to it. Especially mouth movements.

Here is a nice little quote:
First, it's free, second - if both Peter Jackson and James Cameron don't think the "soap opera effect" is something bad why should you? wink.gif "We are indeed shooting at the higher frame rate. The key thing to understand is that this process requires both shooting and projecting at 48 frames/s, rather than the usual 24 frames/s (The great majority of films have been shot at 24 frames per second since the late 1920s). So the result looks like normal speed, but the image has hugely enhanced clarity and smoothness. Looking at 24 frames every second may seem ok—and we've all seen thousands of films like this over the last 90 years—but there is often quite a lot of blur in each frame, during fast movements and if the camera is moving around quickly, the image can judder or "strobe." Shooting and projecting at 48 frames/s does a lot to get rid of these issues. It looks much more lifelike and it is much easier to watch, especially in 3-D." - Peter Jackson "3D shows you a window into reality; the higher frame rate takes the glass out of the window" - James Cameron

Plus. who likes ringing?

Edit:
If you have "RED" with Bruce Willis the first scene in the movie when he goes outside and there camera pans a full 360° .. Watch that with and without SVP. Best example of how SVP removes ringing and gives a very smooth picture.
Edited by AnthonyB - 2/17/13 at 2:15pm
post #45 of 660
When I think that my build is solid for playback, I discover another great solution to improve it. haha

I'm interested in SVP, but I don't know if I want to use it for movies other than animations. Why?

When I started taking myself to the HTPC way, I watched a video that really put me to think about frame rates. A "too long; didn't read" about the video would be this: let's say you are watching Star Wars, it's a fantasy that you can't experience. The 24 fps creates a cinematrofic feel to it. As if you filmed it at 60 frames, it would create a extreme sense of reality that is not suitable to the genre of the movie. 60 fps would be that "same" as watching through a window, as it's close to what you see.

In case of documentarys, for example, the use of higher frame rates is very welcome. As it's reality.

My explanations may be bad, but I hope you guys understand what I'm saying. What are your opinions about it?
Edited by mrfury - 2/17/13 at 5:47pm
post #46 of 660
Thread Starter 
I think it's pretty cool. On some stuff there is obvious benefit. But I could be happy without it too. I like playing more than I care what it actually looks like. It looks good either way to me.

On animation it's amazing. Really a clear improvement.

Some scenes it gives a nice 3d effect to it.
post #47 of 660
Thread Starter 
Is there a 4k solution software program ?
post #48 of 660
I will give it a try for animation/documentary. If there could be a way to filter by genre, or either by name, of the movie, it would be perfect.

Any suggestions for video profile? I have a i5 3450, GTX 670 and 8GB 1600MHz memory.
post #49 of 660
I am trying it out now and it just feels like watching a movie in 3d. Just to make sure everything is set right what filters are you running in mpc hc? And what setting for those? If that makes sense.
post #50 of 660
I wonder how a A8-3820 with the IGP would do smile.gif.
post #51 of 660
Tried it out, not my cup of tea. The smoothing deteriorates the PQ IMO. Uninstalled it frown.gif
post #52 of 660
Well, here is the deal. I have discreet video and IVB graphics.

Ivy bridge won't even do madVR bicubic 75 without a lot of stuttering.

YMMV, however, I think that with any AMD chip, it probably isn't going to be possible.

/Intel guy, may be biased.
post #53 of 660
Quote:
Originally Posted by StardogChampion View Post

I wonder how a A8-3820 with the IGP would do smile.gif.
Slightly better than i3-3225 with external graphics.

Mfusick
Have you missed SVPmark bench with a huge results database? wink.gif
post #54 of 660
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mfusick View Post

It seems to be working much better now. I guess SVP just does not like multi tasking.

After turning most stuff off my PC seems to glide right through it. Playback looks smooth.

CPU is between 30% and 45%



5G heavy setting.

How many threads are you using?

It looks like one of your CPUs cores is close to saturating (the one in the middle) in the screen cap.
Increasing the number of threads can take some load off the most heavily loaded core and give you a modest performance increase.

The flipside is increased memory usage. SVP has a performance window that shows you how much memory your player is using.
post #55 of 660
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tong Chia View Post

How many threads are you using?

It looks like one of your CPUs cores is close to saturating (the one in the middle) in the screen cap.
Increasing the number of threads can take some load off the most heavily loaded core and give you a modest performance increase.

The flipside is increased memory usage. SVP has a performance window that shows you how much memory your player is using.

Its on auto. I have 16gb DDR3.

Advice ?

Should I manually use more threads ??
post #56 of 660
Memory doesn't matter to threading, the number of CPU cores does. Threading spreads out loads between cores. (Over simplified explanation).
post #57 of 660
Will the amout of ram and speed of the ram help?
post #58 of 660
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by vladd View Post

Memory doesn't matter to threading, the number of CPU cores does. Threading spreads out loads between cores. (Over simplified explanation).

I have 2600k with 4 cores.

I left it on auto.

The highest I get is 50% about on individual cores. I can run level 5G without issues. I am not sure I'll benefit from additional tinkering around...

Overclocked at 4.5ghz it only uses about 30% CPU. But I dont run my PC that way all the time.
post #59 of 660
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by AnthonyB View Post

Will the amout of ram and speed of the ram help?

Probably up to a point.

Beyond 4GB usually most applications don't use more ram so it doesn't matter.

on a 64bit application that is ram heavy it matters- but SVP does not appear to be that.

So if you have 8GB like most people you should be fine.



I think memory clock speed might help more than just the amount of ram. I'd bet 8GB at 2133mhz and low CAS would outperform 16GB of Ram with higher CAS latency and only 1600mhz.
Just a guess though. ReneThx probably knows the real answer.

Usually DDR speeds only amount to under 10% difference in real world speeds from my experiences. from 1066mhz to 2000+mhz I think you'd notice a difference, but the difference between 1600mhz and 1866mhz is probably much smaller.
That is my general belief anyways. Not sure I am right but everything I have read and tested suggests such.

What is the memory issue your having ????


I would guess a good set up would be the same as it is for just about anything else. In today's day and age that is 1866mhz or higher. 2 Sticks. Dual Channel. 2x4GB for 8GB total.
Very affordable. Easy to get. I have 1600mhz because my PC is more than a year old and that's what was going on before Z77 and IVY bridge came out. I don't sweat it. Probably not a huge deal.
post #60 of 660
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mfusick View Post

Its on auto. I have 16gb DDR3.

Advice ?

Should I manually use more threads ??

Auto for 8 virtual cores is 8-10 threads .

I use a i7 950@4GHz with 19 threads.

SVP is a 32 bit app so it can only address up to 2Gb in user space, 16Gb on your machine is sufficient.
It is uses a lot of memory @19 threads, I run mine with a patched MPC-HC which gives me 3Gb user Virtual Address.

The memory is used for the per-thread motion vector search buffers, more threads = more memory
when there is work to be done. Increasing the number of threads increases the work thruput up to a point.

Here is mine during the opening scene of Sherlock Holmes A Game of Shadows.
Note the loading on the cores
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