Playstation event February 20, 2013

I'm all hyped up for this! Sony better deliver!

I will be an early adopter if it delivers I'm excited

How can it? They rushed it out before the UHD standards could be fleshed out. Unless Sony has been tipped by the BDA as to a final 4k Blu-ray spec. and whether or not they'll use higher capacity discs (requiring a new Blu-ray laser optical reader and spindle drive to be included), this may be a day late and a dollar short. There hasn't even been a finalized object-oriented soundtrack delivery method since Dolby and DTS are still scrabbling over that.

The PS4 will probably be a next step, not a revolutionary leap as the PR spin seems to put it.

Can't wait!

If it doesn't include a next-gen Blu-ray optical drive and software upgradeable audio/video decoding and output, then you know the answer to whether or not the PS4 is the end-all, be-all UHD nerve center like they state. That should be one of the first questions asked at the press event.

There has not been a locked in specification for frame rates supported, bit depth, color depth, etc. for a unified UHD delivery method using H.265. That requires an HDMI chip set that will allow for HFR, 10 bit or greater video streams, open support for Dolby Atmos or DTS MDA etc. etc. etc.

At the CES there were demos for at least DTS's Multi-Dimensional Audio object-oriented soundtrack system (devised with SRS, which they bought). I'm sure an at-home object-oriented codec would be a scaled down version of the 64 speaker cinema experience. One thing both Atmos and MDA call for are height channels to create x-y-z panning plot points for the mixing engineer and the final decoder. Both also recommend extra screen speakers like Dolby Prologic IIz and DTS Neo X for a wider front sound stage and separate subwoofer outputs for the surround channels. So, that would be 11.2 right there (two more speakers up front, another sub effects channel, and at least two voice-of-God speakers along with the current 7.1 layout).

These are scalable systems... the more speakers you have, the more accurate the sound field placement. This may be where receiver and pre-amp manufacturers would base the amount of speaker outputs available on the model purchased by the consumer. The Atmos or MDA controller would map the soundtrack accordingly.

However, the HDMI chipset would have to allow for them (they're usually hard coded, and not firmware upgradeable, which is a stupid oversight). I don't think the HDMI committee had final UHD or object-oriented soundtrack specs. available when they made their chipset recommendations. This was a problem with the PS3 as well where the initial "fat" versions had implemented outdated HDMI chipsets that limited their functionality. Even the PS3 "slim" versions had issues with 3D and audio bitstreaming, that regular Blu-ray players did not.
Edited by Dan Hitchman - 2/17/13 at 11:00am

Sony did the same exact thing with the PS3 and so did Microsoft. If Sony says it will 4K it will have 4K all you need is BDXL and use firmware to work on it.

As long as it does 4k and would be able to go MDA either built in or via update I'd be happy.

The PS4 would have to bitstream either Dolby Atmos or DTS MDA to work properly.

The outboard surround processor from a receiver or pre-amp would look at the specific bitstream data and take the allocated discrete channel bed and sound effects "objects" (controlled via panning metadata created at the time of the original sound mixing sessions) and process them in real-time. The specific panned effects from these individual "objects" are calculated and derived from how many speakers are attached and where you've located them within the room. Those formats do not work like traditional channel-based-only compression codecs such as Dolby TrueHD and DTS Master Audio lossless that can be de-compressed back to PCM (those older codecs are just "Zip"-like audio containers).

I still have (and currently use) my launch PS3 in my HT room. I will probably buy one of these too and I can't wait to hear what the new machine can do.

If at all possible, please find out if PS3 peripherals will work on the PS4 (bluetooth/IR adapters, controllers, remote, move controllers, nav controllers, etc). That would be great, and quite possibly not covered by the general media.

I've been following the rumor mill pretty closely with PS4. The latest rumors say the BD drive will read the 50GB discs (BDXL), with a read speed increase to 6x. Combine that with the rumored high bandwidth of the system overall and 4K/UHD shouldn't be a problem. IF the rumors hold true. BTW, I like the term 4K better than UHD, just rolls out easier

Rumor says that PS3 controllers will be forward compatible, so would probably cover the remote as well. Confirmation would be great if Sony forgets to mention it.

The rumored computer inside is low end for gaming. So unless it's 4K, I don't see how this will be much of an upgrade. I just finally went from a Phenom X4 965 with a GTX 460 to a Intel 3570K and Radeon 7950 in my home computer. It's amazing how many DX11 effects were missing on the 460. I am usually an early adopter, I have 2 PS3s and 2 360s currenlty, but right now I have heard nothing about the PS4 or 720 that make me say, gotta have it.

I am still debating on building a Media Server and ripping my 250+ Blu Rays, but I can't find anything that rips them perfect. I like the MKV format, but even XBMC ver 12 has been a no go at play back, or else it's the Radeon. Can people share what they think will be exciting about this as a media center over a PS3 if it doesn't do 4K?

You do mean 150 GB bdxl discs, don't you?? 50 GB is a normal Blu-ray.

My mistake. More research shows that any BD that has three layers or more requires a different design of player to function. A few rumor mills put that cart before the horse and I went along for the ride.

Then again, now would be the time to announce 150GB discs as standard for PS4.

The last I heard, a quad-layer BDXL was 128 GB. However, these pre-recorded discs would have to be stamped versions, not write-once data discs, so I don't know the exact capacity of a stamped version of BDXL. TDK also discussed developing a 250 GB disc too.

There's a way to do excellent 10 bit UHD + object-oriented lossless audio on higher capacity discs, if there's a will. The will part, I'm worried about.

As far as I know, BDXL is a recordable format only; there is no ROM (stamped) version of it. I suspect the Blu-ray Disc Association is working on a higher-capacity ROM spec, but it's certainly not available at this time.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aBaYVo89mmY&feature=youtube_gdata_player

The first ever blu ray disc's ever to market were recordable 23gb disc's then 50gb, so there is precedent of having recordable disc's before stamp versions. I assume in R&D you would have to have a working stamped version before a recordable one.

It doesn't have to be amazing or the end all be all of consoles, just better than the last one. The PS3, to me, was a massive failure as a gaming console.

There is no way that this going to support UHD/4k. It just is not going to happen. By the time 4k/UHD sets are down in price to where the average joe can afford or care about them the PS5 will be out.

That's my sad theory too. Even a Sony exec said the PS4 may not be the ultimate delivery method for 4k. They probably are cheapening out on their consoles now due to the fact they lost so much on the PS3 with its expensive parts (you'd think a proto-type BDXL drive that can read stamped media would be pricey right now). Unless it was a fake out to lower expectations and then surprise Microsoft with a one-two sucker punch. Hard to say in business-land these days.

Any meaningful explanation or just another statement pulled out of someone's bottom part?

50GB BD can easily support UHD, period.

SO are you in town already, imagic, or just coming tomorrow? I might go to the event, provided I can get out of my office in time...

It can, but barely, and probably only if they stick with 8 bit video and no state-of-the-art audio track. I'd rather they put in a BDXL (stamped version readable) drive so they have some cushion to add higher frame rates, greater bit depth, better audio, etc. etc.

+1