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JTR Noesis 228HT - The best speaker you never heard of for ~ $1200 pricepoint. - Page 11

post #301 of 536
I was a set on getting rid of my Pioneer VSX21TXH because it didn't have Audyssey XT32 and I wanted to be able to EQ dual subs and my room speakers. But after reading from various JTR owners it seems that have been more then one comment about guys not liking what it does to their JTR speakers and just end up turning it off.

So I figured I'd keep my current receiver and pick up an Anti-mode 8033.

Gear mentioned in this thread:

post #302 of 536
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jedirun View Post

That is a pretty good idea,and one I might toy with if I don't like what Audyssey does to the 228's. For now, I hope I like it. I don't want to buy anything else. I still have to pay the contractor to hide my Triple 8 surrounds.

I have not run Audyssey yet, so I do not want to speak poorly of it without hearing the result. I am just saying that the system, including the sub, sounds great, even without it.
RMK, I seem to remember you running a sub eq in addition to Audyssey for your Orbit Shifters in the past. Are you still using it?

Nope, I've owned several SMS-1's but have been using Audyssey XT32 for the last 18 months. I'm liking the Audyssey off sound better (as of today) and may run it that way for a while. After discussing MC music in the Thread I dug up that Steve Stevens DVD-A and gave it a spin this afternoon. It sounded better than ever. That disk is a great test for dynamics.cool.gif
post #303 of 536
Quote:
Originally Posted by RMK! View Post

Nope, I've owned several SMS-1's but have been using Audyssey XT32 for the last 18 months. I'm liking the Audyssey off sound better (as of today) and may run it that way for a while. After discussing MC music in the Thread I dug up that Steve Stevens DVD-A and gave it a spin this afternoon. It sounded better than ever. That disk is a great test for dynamics.cool.gif
After all of this talk, I ran Audyssey and did some listening while blindly toggling the eq setting between manual, off and Audyssey several times per song. I ended up picking the Audyssey on setting.

I am really really likening these speakers for music. We will watch our first full movie tonight.
post #304 of 536
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jedirun View Post

After all of this talk, I ran Audyssey and did some listening while blindly toggling the eq setting between manual, off and Audyssey several times per song. I ended up picking the Audyssey on setting.

I am really really likening these speakers for music. We will watch our first full movie tonight.

Yeah, that's the thing with Audyssey. Every time I run it I get slightly different results ... so my relationship with this software has been a bit of an Odyssey wink.gif. I definitely preferred Audyssey off with music yesterday as it seems to remove the live factor. I haven't watched a movie yet but we may view the Hobbit (3D) if there is time tonight so that should be a good test.
post #305 of 536
Quote:
Originally Posted by RMK! View Post

Yeah, that's the thing with Audyssey. Every time I run it I get slightly different results ... so my relationship with this software has been a bit of an Odyssey wink.gif. I definitely preferred Audyssey off with music yesterday as it seems to remove the live factor. I haven't watched a movie yet but we may view the Hobbit (3D) if there is time tonight so that should be a good test.
Usually I feel like Audyssy puts a slight veil over the sound and like you said, eliminates the live feeling of the music. However, yesterday it was the exact opposite. It sounded more live with it on. Probably next time I run it, which will be when I have the surrounds installed, I will be back to liking it off.
post #306 of 536
Reading this thread got me thinking. I'm going to eventually have Chad B calibrate my display. I noticed that he also does audio with Audyssey pro as well as speaker placement, etc. Do you guys think that this would be helpful in an untreated room? I really am lost when it comes to this stuff. Thanks.
post #307 of 536
Quote:
Originally Posted by hogues View Post

Reading this thread got me thinking. I'm going to eventually have Chad B calibrate my display. I noticed that he also does audio with Audyssey pro as well as speaker placement, etc. Do you guys think that this would be helpful in an untreated room? I really am lost when it comes to this stuff. Thanks.
I think that it would be helpful, especially in an untreated room. Having someone who really knows what they are doing with Audyssey may also lead to better results.
post #308 of 536
Quote:
Originally Posted by willswing View Post

I'm waiting for a pair of the 228's, and thats my plan to use the DSPeaker AntiMode 8033S-II.
The only problem i see at this point is, that i don't know how to cut the frequency for the 228's at 60-80, because i only use a 2-channel pre amp
and a power amp.

What happens if i drive the 228's in full range?
post #309 of 536
Quote:
Originally Posted by willswing View Post

I'm waiting for a pair of the 228's, and thats my plan to use the DSPeaker AntiMode 8033S-II.
The only problem i see at this point is, that i don't know how to cut the frequency for the 228's at 60-80, because i only use a 2-channel pre amp
and a power amp.

What happens if i drive the 228's in full range?

I do not think you will hurt the speakers running them full range, but you could buy some line level crossovers and put them between the pre and amp.

Assuming you are using a sub, you might be able to use it's crossover as a high pass filter for the 228's. Of course that depends on the sub having that capability.
post #310 of 536
I tried using my subs crossover, with my present speakers, but after using the DSpeaker calibration, the sound is sooooo distorted and bad.
DSpeaker works after i connected back to drive the mains full range again.

Thanks for the tip about line level crossovers.....something like this?

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Car-Home-Amplifier-Subwoofer-Equalizer-Crossover-RCA-Adjust-Line-Level-Volume-/261069735934?pt=AU_Car_Parts_Accessories&hash=item3cc8f807fe&vxp=mtr
post #311 of 536
Quote:
Originally Posted by willswing View Post

I tried using my subs crossover, with my present speakers, but after using the DSpeaker calibration, the sound is sooooo distorted and bad.
DSpeaker works after i connected back to drive the mains full range again.

Thanks for the tip about line level crossovers.....something like this?

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Car-Home-Amplifier-Subwoofer-Equalizer-Crossover-RCA-Adjust-Line-Level-Volume-/261069735934?pt=AU_Car_Parts_Accessories&hash=item3cc8f807fe&vxp=mtr
I remember seeing some passive line level crossovers at Parts-express, but I couldn't find them this morning. I will look again.
post #312 of 536
Quote:
Originally Posted by willswing View Post

I tried using my subs crossover, with my present speakers, but after using the DSpeaker calibration, the sound is sooooo distorted and bad.
DSpeaker works after i connected back to drive the mains full range again.

Thanks for the tip about line level crossovers.....something like this?

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Car-Home-Amplifier-Subwoofer-Equalizer-Crossover-RCA-Adjust-Line-Level-Volume-/261069735934?pt=AU_Car_Parts_Accessories&hash=item3cc8f807fe&vxp=mtr

I found them. This should work:

http://www.parts-express.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?partnumber=266-272

It is a 70hz RCA line level high pass filter.
post #313 of 536
That simple....???
THANKS Jedirun!!
post #314 of 536
Quote:
Originally Posted by willswing View Post

That simple....???
THANKS Jedirun!!
You're welcome. It is that simple in theory... I hope it works out in practice.
post #315 of 536
Thread Starter 
Scream and Shout by Will.i.am is incredible on the Noesis 228HT. I don't know how this song could possibly sound cleaner?
post #316 of 536
Quote:
Originally Posted by Archaea View Post

Scream and Shout by Will.i.am is incredible on the Noesis 228HT. I don't know how this song could possibly sound cleaner?
I have to wait a month for my 212's. It is going to be a long month. frown.gif
post #317 of 536
Quote:
Originally Posted by Archaea View Post

Scream and Shout by Will.i.am is incredible on the Noesis 228HT. I don't know how this song could possibly sound cleaner?

I do, come over to my place. tongue.gif

KIDDING!! Glad to hear you are loving the 228's. Are you as happy with them as you hoped you would be? No thoughts of selling to Tim?


Hmm, I'll check that one out when I get a chance. I'm not nearly as repulsed by Archaea music as Archaea is by Carp music. Although... your music doesn't give me chills, can you say the same about ALL of mine? wink.gifsmile.gif
post #318 of 536
Quote:
Originally Posted by Archaea View Post

Scream and Shout by Will.i.am is incredible on the Noesis 228HT. I don't know how this song could possibly sound cleaner?

Care to give me more mini reviews on any test material Archaea? What or movies have you watched with them?
You were using eD Cinema 12's as your mains weren't you? How do the 228HT's compare?
post #319 of 536
Thread Starter 
Much better for music...a bit better for movies

Both are very good for movies... not sure it's so clear a victory there, but I haven't a/b' d directly for movies- just going on memory.

The eDs were a fantastic setup for movies imo(excellent clear dialogue is their strength) But the eD horn pales in comparison to the JTR and sounds dirty and harsh by comparison - even on some movie clips I've watched. I recall some of the scenes in the Art of Flight with the dubstep music sounding downright harsh and irritating on the eD. TURN IT DOWN type feeling. The JTR have none of that. The harshness of the eD treble in my untreated room is is noticeable in both movies and music, but much more noticeable with music ... seemingly regardless to genre. The JTR 228HT are clearly a better speaker.

The main unique thing I notice about these 228HT is they have a very focused soundstage when the distances are dialed in. In my MLP when I'm listening to two channel stereo it sounds exactly like the center channel is on. Due to my weird seating arrangement (too close to be optimal) I've never had a speaker image like this in my room. The 228HT was exteremely focused imaging in carps room too. I remember stitch1 saying it was like the center channel was sitting in his lap when listening to two channel stereo in the MLP. I've picked that sense up in both rooms I've auditioned the 228HT in. In contrast the 212HT (the big brother) has a huge big soundstage with less tight "focus'. For music I personally prefer the 212HT's soundstage to the 228HT's soundstage, but is it worth 2x's the cost? That's a horsepilll to swallow. The 228HT sounds so good already!

I've watched 2 movies so far and a handful of demo scenes. I watched Prometheus at about -10 to -12 and they sounded incredible. I was thinking how could this sound any better. JTR really has an EPIC system in the caps and 228HT setup. Then I watched Wrecking Ralph at about -16 with the family. That movie pretty much sucked and I sort was disinterested honestly - but I don't by any means think it was the JTR's fault. The movie had so much potential, but every funny scene they had in the previews and the rest of the movie was pretty terrible. I usually like animated movies. Did I say I was disappointed in this one? Sooooo, I'm really looking forward to spending more time with these speakers. My buddy at work asked me today how I liked them, and I said I haven't got to listen to them NEARLY as much as I'd like. He's like what? You've had them for 1.5 months? I'm said, no I"ve had the front sound stage for 2 weeks, because the center came a month later, and Megan and I have been house searching and spending tons of time looking for a new home, and work's been busy, and I have a 1 and 4 year old and --- yada yada yada....

Carp, the only way I'd consider selling the 228HT right now, is if I decided to buy the 212HT. But since you are so competitive I may have to wait until JTR releases the 212HT killing successor and then one up you and your (by that time) twenty four 18" subwoofers and 212HT soundstage.

Cliffnotes: My JTR 228HT and JTR Captivator front soundstage absolutely rocks. I'm very happy with the setup!
Edited by Archaea - 3/27/13 at 8:10pm
post #320 of 536
To anyone that is considering the 228's that has heard the Triple 8's, the 228's have all the strengths of the Triple 8's and add a fair bit of detail to the top end. As much much as I like the Triple 8's, and I do, the 228's are just clearer. Like Archaea said, the difference is more noticeable with music, but it is there with movies as well if you listen for it. Hopefully, this weekend I will get a chance to crank the volume up some more. During the week, I rarely get a chance to listen at full volume.
Edited by Jedirun - 3/27/13 at 9:19pm
post #321 of 536
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jedirun View Post

To anyone that is considering the 228's that has heard the Triple 8's, the 228's have all the strengths of the Triple 8's and add a fair bit of detail to the top end. As much much as I like the Triple 8's, and I do, the 228's are just clearer. Like Archaea said, the difference is more noticeable with music, but it is there with movies as well if you listen for it. Hopefully, this weekend I will get a chance to crank the volume up some more. During the week, I rarely get a chance to listen at full volume.

The thing I am need some clarification on ..is that the 228's supposedly have a narrow sound disbursement and are not great for surrounds...at least that was what I was told. If that is the case and your building a HT system with the Noesis speakers..what do you do for surrounds? Center?
post #322 of 536
Quote:
Originally Posted by Newbie01 View Post

The thing I am need some clarification on ..is that the 228's supposedly have a narrow sound disbursement and are not great for surrounds...at least that was what I was told. If that is the case and your building a HT system with the Noesis speakers..what do you do for surrounds? Center?
There is 60% horizontal dispersion so basically your center channel will reach a seat row width that is 1.2 times the distance of the speaker to that row. Unless you have a very wide seating area and sit extremely close, the 228 makes a great center channel.

If you have only one row and can aim the speakers well, they could be used as surrounds. However, for most people, Single or Slanted 8's or Triple 8's do a great job in surround duty (or as LCR). Their 90 degree dispersion pattern makes them work better when close to the seating area or when mutiple rows are involved.
post #323 of 536
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jedirun View Post

I found them. This should work:

http://www.parts-express.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?partnumber=266-272

It is a 70hz RCA line level high pass filter.

Do you think that is going to be any better than the crossover in his sub?
post #324 of 536
Quote:
Originally Posted by mrlittlejeans View Post

Do you think that is going to be any better than the crossover in his sub?
I am not sure, but it nay be fine since it will be operating outside of the normal frequency range of the 228's as nothing more than a protection device, to keep the amps from sending frequencies that the 228's are not designed to reproduce. My guess is that it would take a lot of power to hurt the 228's even without a high pass filter, but this could offer an extra measure of safety. He could also try the 50 hz model to be sure that the filter is not affecting the sound of the speakers while still protecting them from 20 hz frequencies. Someone else may be able to chime in who knows whether a high pass filter is needed and how much it will affect the sound. If his sound quality will be affected by the high pass filter, a stand alone bass management system like the Outlaw Audio ICBM would work. I actually have one sitting around that I am not using anymore.
post #325 of 536
I use that exact filter on an entirely different pair of speakers to prevent LF from getting to them. The sound improvement was significant.
post #326 of 536
I read the reviews at Parts express about the effect the filter had to the sound....not so good.
JerryLove: Did you notice any of that, after installing the filters?
post #327 of 536
Quote:
Originally Posted by willswing View Post

I read the reviews at Parts express about the effect the filter had to the sound....not so good.
JerryLove: Did you notice any of that, after installing the filters?

No. But in fairness I have used this in an installation which is pretty rough to begin with. Much could have been done I would not have noticed under the circumstance.
post #328 of 536
Quote:
Originally Posted by willswing View Post

I read the reviews at Parts express about the effect the filter had to the sound....not so good.
JerryLove: Did you notice any of that, after installing the filters?
I didn't read the review when I linked to the product. It may be that an active crossover between your pre and amp would work better, or like I mentioned before, an ICBM from Outlaw Audio. However, at $25 the FMOD may be with a try.
post #329 of 536
willswing,

I took a look at the reviews of several of the other FMOD's for different frequencies. The rest have positive reviews, it is possible that this will solve your problem for a reasonable price and that the user who posted the negative review was an anomaly.
post #330 of 536
I am seriously looking at these as a possible upgrade for my current LCR set-up, which has:
- Klipsch RF-83 (3-8" woofers, 1-1.25" compression horn driver, sensitivity 100dB @ 2.83V / 1m) fronts and
- Klipsch RC-64 center (4-6.5" woofers, 1-1.25" compression horn driver, sensitivity 99dB @ 2.83V / 1)
(all are 2-way cross-overs)

My concern is whether this would be a significant enough upgrade as the RF-83s/RC-64 are already very high efficiency compression horn driver speakers.
I am not unhappy with their performance - either sound quality or output. (For audio only, I have a separate set up with customized/up-graded Klipsch La Scalas, with a sub for bottom notes. Prefer these for audio only in terms of sound quality)
It is just that continual upgrade path that many of us follow in search of a better state
(i.e. I had Epik Conquest sub, yet added JTR Captivator S2 and thinking about an Orbit Shifter in the future)

Has anyone heard both the Noesis 228HT and the Klipsch speakers (or other comparable Klipsch speakers RF-7, RF-7II, RF-63, RF-82,...) ?

Any opinions as to what I might see going to Noesis 228HT would be appreciated.

Thanks
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