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Killzone: Shadow Fall (PS4) - Page 5

post #121 of 993
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by bd2003 View Post

Yeah, it will stay stuck to the general area around your target, only at close range. It doesn't actually put the sights on the target for you, but if you're on target, it'll stay on target.

Without it all someone has to do is strafe, and it's crazy difficult to kill them. It's be nice if dual sticks were precise enough not to need it, but hearing that the game doesn't have it takes it down a notch IMO. It's not an easy button, it's what makes the game playable at all.
Well then the game will be evenly "unplayable" for all. In an effort to put a greater emphasis on player skill and team work, no aim assist is a reasonable play mechanic for the action that the game can build upon.
Edited by joeblow - 8/28/13 at 5:04pm
post #122 of 993
Quote:
Originally Posted by joeblow View Post

Well then the game will be evenly "unplayable" for all. In an effort to put a greater emphasis on player skill and team work, no aim assist is a reasonable play mechanic for the action that the game can build upon.

I understand people want skill to be rewarded but doing this will make this a really hardcore game. They should be trying to expand their audience not push people away. All consoles shooters have some degree of aim-assist as far as I know. They should just make it an option. I think MaxPayne 3 had separate playlists where no aim-assist was allowed. Something like that would be better.
post #123 of 993
Problem has always been the controllers. GG seems to think the DS4 is that good, otherwise they wouldn't be doing this.

You do need a very small dead zone, better latency, and more precise sticks to pull this off.
post #124 of 993
Quote:
Originally Posted by bd2003 View Post

Yeah, it will stay stuck to the general area around your target, only at close range. It doesn't actually put the sights on the target for you, but if you're on target, it'll stay on target.

Without it all someone has to do is strafe, and it's crazy difficult to kill them. It's be nice if dual sticks were precise enough not to need it, but hearing that the game doesn't have it takes it down a notch IMO. It's not an easy button, it's what makes the game playable at all.

Not having to aim to hit a moving target sounds like an easy button to me.

Each game is different in how much aim assist is used though, COD probably being the worse. You just got to throw your crosshairs in the general direction of someone and it just locks right on. It is probably one of the reasons COD is so popular, the game makes a lot of people good at it by making it real easy to shoot people.
Quote:
Originally Posted by MarkcusD View Post

I understand people want skill to be rewarded but doing this will make this a really hardcore game. They should be trying to expand their audience not push people away. All consoles shooters have some degree of aim-assist as far as I know. They should just make it an option. I think MaxPayne 3 had separate playlists where no aim-assist was allowed. Something like that would be better.

I've never really played the Killzone games before, so I'm not sure if they were ever considered hardcore, but coming from the SOCOM community, which was considered a hardcore shooter, making games easier to try and bring in a wider audience has a tendacy to backfire. You end up turning your hadcore fanbase off from the series and then still never capturing the casual crowd because most of the casual crowd just keep playing that casual shooter they've always been playing. SOCOM went from being one of the most successful online games of the PS2/Xbox era to the developer (Zipper Interactive) now being closed.
post #125 of 993
It's not just a skill problem, it's an anatomy problem. Try fully flexing your index finger without moving your thumb AT ALL. If you can do it, you're either a freak or a liar.

You'd have to apply a constant and precise pressure to the analog stick to track a target moving laterally (hard enough already). As soon as your index finger pulls the trigger, it'll interact with with your thumb muscle and change the pressure you're applying to the stick. Mouse/kb doesn't have this issue because your wrist muscle is completely isolated from your index finger.

That's why that particular assist exists, because its almost impossible for any normal human to pull it off.
post #126 of 993
I guess I am a freak then... I can do just that on both hands.

I did jam both thumbs pretty badly as a child though, I have little to no cartilage in my right thumb's base joint.
post #127 of 993
Quote:
Originally Posted by bd2003 View Post

It's not just a skill problem, it's an anatomy problem. Try fully flexing your index finger without moving your thumb AT ALL. If you can do it, you're either a freak or a liar.

You'd have to apply a constant and precise pressure to the analog stick to track a target moving laterally (hard enough already). As soon as your index finger pulls the trigger, it'll interact with with your thumb muscle and change the pressure you're applying to the stick. Mouse/kb doesn't have this issue because your wrist muscle is completely isolated from your index finger.

That's why that particular assist exists, because its almost impossible for any normal human to pull it off.

Quote:
Originally Posted by PENDRAG0ON View Post

I guess I am a freak then... I can do just that on both hands.

I did jam both thumbs pretty badly as a child though, I have little to no cartilage in my right thumb's base joint.

I think I am a freak too then... maybe it's from all that game time using that same Dualshock controller over the last 15+ years.
post #128 of 993
I think you guys are underestimating what I mean by "without moving it at all". Even a tiny little change in tension would throw your aim off.

Doesn't make the game unplayable but makes strafing way more powerful. I played KZ mercenaries for a bit last night, it doesn't seem to have any aim assist either. And I hate to say it, but that combined with the heavy/laggy feel typical of killzone resulted in a really awful feel to the game. It was way too difficult to aim at people. There's more to skill in an FPS than your twitch reflexes, but when it's a struggle to hit anything, the higher level play doesn't even factor in, all that matters is reflex.

If it's anything what KZSF feels like, count me out.
post #129 of 993
My right thumb just doesn't do it, my left has a slight change since it wasn't injured as badly. (dodge ball is dangerous kids) I also have double jointed thumbs, well, had in the case of my right thumb.

Maybe it isn't as much of a handicap as I thought...
post #130 of 993
Quote:
Originally Posted by bd2003 View Post

I think you guys are underestimating what I mean by "without moving it at all". Even a tiny little change in tension would throw your aim off.

Doesn't make the game unplayable but makes strafing way more powerful. I played KZ mercenaries for a bit last night, it doesn't seem to have any aim assist either. And I hate to say it, but that combined with the heavy/laggy feel typical of killzone resulted in a really awful feel to the game. It was way too difficult to aim at people. There's more to skill in an FPS than your twitch reflexes, but when it's a struggle to hit anything, the higher level play doesn't even factor in, all that matters is reflex.

If it's anything what KZSF feels like, count me out.

Maybe I am underestimating, but I cannot say firing with R1 and aiming (and some times strafing as well) has ever been an issue in the games without aim assist.

Funny, playing KZ:M on the Vita is another thing that has been putting KZ:SF higher on my list.
post #131 of 993
Does BF have aim assist?
post #132 of 993
Quote:
Originally Posted by SmokenAshes View Post

Does BF have aim assist?

Definitely, very similar to CODs.
post #133 of 993
I've never noticed
post #134 of 993
Quote:
Originally Posted by SmokenAshes View Post

I've never noticed

It can be turned off so maybe you have it off in the settings menu.
post #135 of 993
Thread Starter 
Seven multiplayer features detailed below:

Quote:
  1. Player Mechanics:
    Most of the player mechanics available in the single-player campaign are now also available in multiplayer. This includes the cover system that allows you to snap in to/lean out of/vault over cover, as well as the sliding mechanic. In addition, the brutal melee system has been expanded with drop-down melees (as seen in the single-player playthrough).

  2. Weapons:
    Multiplayer features 22 different weapons, all of them unlocked from the get-go. Your ability to master the weapons is key, as each weapon has very different dynamics. For an in-depth look at the new weapons, read our “Guerrilla Armory” articles about the StA-55 assault rifle, the VC-15 shotgun pistol, the M55 assault rifle and the VC-30 shotgun. More weapon articles are coming to Killzone.com soon!

  3. Attachments:
    There are 19 different weapon attachments in multiplayer, unlocked by completing specific challenges. You can use these to extend the functionality of your weapons in a variety ways, from enhanced scopes to new ammo types to secondary fire options. Adding attachments that complement your playing style can greatly enhance your combat effectiveness.

  4. Classes & Abilities:
    There are three distinct classes and 12 unique special abilities in multiplayer. Each of the classes can be enhanced with up to two special abilities, allowing for some highly specialized playing styles. We’ll cover the three classes and their available abilities in more detail in the coming weeks, but we can already reveal that there will be a Placeable Spawn Beacon ability.

  5. Custom Warzones:
    Warzones, with their trademark rotating mission modes, return to multiplayer with supercharged customization features. There are eight mission modes in total, four of which are new to Killzone. More importantly, you can customize these modes to your heart’s content and share your favorite settings with the rest of the community. We will regularly highlight popular and interesting community-created Warzones for you to try out.

  6. Combat Honors:
    Combat Honors are temporary bonuses that can be activated by earning enough points during a round. These bonuses stay active for as long you continue play - when your play session ends, you lose your Combat Honors. Combat Honor bonuses range from an increase to movement speed to reduction in recoil.

  7. Post-Launch Support:
    We aim to keep the post-launch multiplayer experience fresh through the frequent release of paid DLC expansion packs that offer new gameplay and customization features. At the same time, all DLC multiplayer maps will be released free of charge to prevent the player base from becoming fractured.
post #136 of 993
post #137 of 993
Looks really good, including the framerate. Going back to Vetka is a great idea, really lets them expand the color pallet which is so drab in most war torn shooter
post #138 of 993
Thread Starter 
Killzone Shadow Fall Multiplayer Detailed - Part 2
Quote:
1. Progression System:
Unlike previous Killzone games the multiplayer progression in Killzone Shadow Fall isn’t based on XP, but on Challenges. Completing a challenge adds a point to your rank, and rewards you with weapon attachments as well as enhancements to your abilities and visual identity. There will be more than 1500 challenges available when the game launches, ranging from straightforward (“Destroy 1 Turret”) to very specific (“Kill 1 enemy player with Laser Tripmine while they are carrying a Beacon”).

2. Combat Honors:
Combat Honors are temporary bonuses that can be activated by earning enough points during a round. They’re stackable, and you can unlock as many Combat Honors as you put points into. They only last as long as your play session, however, meaning you’ll lose all combat honors when you quit playing. Of course, you can disable Combat Honors in your own Custom Warzones if you like.

3. Weapons & Attachments:
Weapons can be augmented with up to two different attachment types at once. The number of attachments available for each weapon varies – for example, some guns won’t have room for a grenade launcher attachment, while others will be compatible with a range of grenade launcher attachments and ammo types. All weapons are skill-based – there will not be recoil-less or auto-aiming firearms.

4. Shields:
As glimpsed in the Gamescom multiplayer trailer, players can now select the ability to deploy a smart nano-shields that block enemy attacks while allowing allied projectiles through. The nano-shields can be destroyed or knocked out with EMP weapon attachments, or simply deconstructed when no longer needed. As with all class abilities, players have the option of disabling nano-shields in their custom Warzones. We’ll cover the classes and their available abilities in more detail in the coming weeks.

5. Spotlight System:
The Spotlight System allows you to celebrate your victory in style. At the end of each round, players are presented with a brief scene featuring the three top players from the winning side and the top player from the losing side. One of the winning players gets to select a Spotlight move to celebrate his victory over the losing player. If he fails to execute the move in time, the losing side has an opportunity to perform a countermove. The game ships with a wide selection of Spotlight moves, and more will be released after launch.

6. Warzone Leaderboards:
In Killzone Shadow Fall, each warzone will have its own leaderboard. This doesn’t just apply to official or featured Warzones, but to custom ones as well. You can even choose which stats you want the leaderboard to be ranked on when you set up a custom Warzone, to encourage a particular form of play.

7. Online and Offline Bots:
You can add bots to online matches for any Warzone you create. Human players can replace bots during the match, to ensure that there’s always a consistent amount of players present in the Warzone. You can even add bots to only one faction, to allow for ‘Bots vs. Humans’ type Warzones. In offline mode you can still create your own Warzones and play against bots, but you don’t have the ability to complete Challenges.

8. No Exoskeletons or Jetpacks:
Owing to the decision to ensure that custom Warzone presets work on all multiplayer maps, there will be no Exoskeletons or Jetpacks in multiplayer when Killzone Shadow Fall launches. Their inclusion would introduce a wide number of new variables and exceptions to account for, and we want to focus on offering fair, reliable and consistent Warzone customizability.
post #139 of 993
Forrest area looking much more polished
post #140 of 993
So far looks to be the best looking launch game for the next gen.
post #141 of 993
Wow. Even filmed off a screen you can see the improvement from what they showed at E3.

I was trying to watch the player's hands to see how the touch pad is going to work, but he's either not using it or it's just too dark to see. Touch pad is being used to control the flying robot, right? Maybe touch pad optional?
post #142 of 993
Quote:
Originally Posted by Crash44 View Post

Wow. Even filmed off a screen you can see the improvement from what they showed at E3.

I was trying to watch the player's hands to see how the touch pad is going to work, but he's either not using it or it's just too dark to see. Touch pad is being used to control the flying robot, right? Maybe touch pad optional?

I have a feeling it'll be implemented similar to how the DS 3/Sixaxis was in KZ 2/3. Instead of turning wheels or valves, we'll be pressing interfaces and switches.
post #143 of 993
Speaking of Killzone

Is Killzone 3 "Online" active

I was playing black ops 2 earlier today and kept on getting the same 2-3 lobbies (happens during double xp for some reason). And mw3 has more playing ground war with these god hack ass clowns running around
post #144 of 993
Couple more, same area but she focuses more on looking around

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-jUAkiHAaJc

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3ii8uPl1Wvo
post #145 of 993
This looks so good biggrin.gif One hell of a showcase for a launch game.

http://blog.eu.playstation.com/2013/09/24/killzone-shadow-fall-multiplayer-trailer-and-season-pass-details/
Quote:
As you can tell we’re pulling out all the stops for Killzone Shadow Fall multiplayer, and we already have a several forms of downloadable content planned for extensive post-launch multiplayer support. In addition to new competitive multiplayer maps – which, as we mentioned before, will be released for free – we’re also working on paid expansion packs that will further enhance your online experience.

To help you save on the first six expansion packs, we’re introducing the Killzone Shadow Fall Season Pass. For just £15.99/€19.99, you will receive access to the following packs as they become available:

Online co-op expansion pack
Focusing on team play and intense combat, the online co-op expansion pack adds a new co-operative game mode in which you and up to three online friends must survive against impossible odds. Fight waves upon waves of enemies in four new arena maps, featuring a unique leveling system and new unlocks.

Three online co-op map packs
Each map pack consists of two brand-new arena maps you can play in co-op mode with your friends. Please note that these arena maps will only work with the online co-op expansion pack.

Two additional multiplayer expansion packs
We’ll reveal more about these additional multiplayer expansion packs when Killzone Shadow Fall’s launch date nears. Suffice to say they’ll offer many hours of additional multiplayer thrills!

But that’s not all – if you get your Season Pass for day one of Killzone Shadow Fall, you will also receive access to an exclusive OWL combat drone skin and a unique Multiplayer Spotlight move. Take advantage of this excellent value deal to maximize your online experience!
post #146 of 993
So instead of having map packs, they are adding a horde mode, some new game types and co-op challenges. And at only $20, I may just bite on that one...
post #147 of 993
Yeah not bad. I'd rather they not fracture the core MP product they release with.

Extra modes that don't screw with vanilla MP is better than making haves and have nots with maps.
post #148 of 993
LOL I'm loving all the no-aim-assist bitching. I guess there's not a lot of original console Rainbox 6 players here then? All hardcore, all the time. I'm talking original Rainbow from PS2/Xbox previous gen. You're worried about strafing to avoid a bullet and that being cheap? You used to be able to just lean and avoid bullets in Rainbow. A headshot in Rainbow used to have to hit right between the eyes, aimed with your own friggin' hands. I'm way older now, but bring it on! I'm curious to try it out this coming gen and see if I still got it. To me this is a move to attract hardcore gamers further away from the x1 to the PS4.
post #149 of 993
I guess I may be in the minority as I always turn off aim-assist/auto-aim/snapping in every game that allows it. One of my friends even asked me how I managed to hit anything in GTA V without auto-aim. I just looked at him and said, "Skills."
post #150 of 993
Note, there are details in the video presentation that didn't make the article. The quote below was cited from the presentation.

"In the latest Eurogamer Expo presentation, they said that it'll run 60fps most of the time, but cited scenarios like "24 guys throwing grenades at the same time" as the 60fps killer."

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2013-09-26-guerrilla-killzone-shadow-fall-multiplayer-runs-at-60-fps-a-lot-of-the-time

Basically, it runs like Call of Duty on current consoles, targeting 60fps but it can drop frames under stress. To hit a locked 60 at all times would lead to a lot of power being left on the table in less stressful scenes. (They would need to target an even higher framerate and make sure the lowest point never dropped below 60)

There are some quotes that will become console war fodder, but make perfect sense when taken in the proper context.
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