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Panasonic 65V10 - The Horror!

post #1 of 10
Thread Starter 
Hopefully you folks can help me find some light at the end of this nightmare.

I'll keep it short, since I do realize this subject has been discussed ad nauseam (yet I can't seem to find that many posts that specifically refer to 65" models):

I own a Panasonic TCP-65V10, purchased brand new around April 2010. Had it professionally calibrated about a year ago. Before that, it was properly broken-in and used in TXH mode exclusively. It has always been connected to a PS Audio Duet conditioner. It doesn't have too many hours on it. I would estimate no more than 1000 hours, at the very most. Possibly quite a bit less, which is not much at all in almost 3 years.

I loved this set and had never had any issues with it, specially after ISF calibration.... until a couple of night ago.

You guessed correctly: black levels are now SIGNIFICANTLY higher. The blacks on the "stand by" screen on my Oppo 95 used to have depth and seemed to go on forever before. Now they look flat, lifeless and grey. For the record: I do all my watching at night in a perfectly dark room. Watching the brand new second season of "Game Of Thrones" on BD has been painful, specially during the last few episodes that take place at night. In short, the TV now looks like crap, worse than a mediocre LCD. Worse than my 2077 50" 720p Panasonic, which resides in the living room (and suffers from floating blacks, no less!). No image retention so far, at least, but blacks are washed out beyond belief. As with a lot of you, this basically happened overnight. I could not believe my eyes!

This is where it gets weird:

I had noticed minor increments in black levels throughout the years, but they were minor at best, and I thought perhaps my mind was playing tricks or I was being overly sensitive based on what I was reading here. Then, also all of a sudden, things would revert back to normal and the set would look great again. Sometimes BETTER than before. Punchy, inky, well saturated. Then, I started to sometimes notice changes during the same day. The set would look either amazingly great and lifelike, or simply just great. But now it's basically either BAD or WORSE, and it's been a few days so far, with no hopes in sight.

My question to you: Do I consider this another victim of the infamous "voltage/black level rise" syndrome, or could my problem be something else? Do I wait until blacks revert back to a more acceptable level? If so, when would that happen, in your experience? The TV is truly unwatchable as it is right now. I do not exaggerate. Do I give up, sell it and buy a new TV now that the ZT60 look so promising?

Your comments are appreciated.
post #2 of 10
Thread Starter 
No One?
post #3 of 10
I would give Panasonic a call. Did you have an extended warranty on this panel?
post #4 of 10
Thread Starter 
I'm afraid I did not purchase an extended warranty (I never do, and so far so good, knock on wood), and the set is now almost 3 years old. I'll see what Panasonic has to say about this, but I'm not holding my breath.

One things I just remembered:

A few days ago I installed a PS Audio Dectet power conditioner. I needed extra outlets, so I bought that model to replace my PS Audio Duet, which only has 4. Lucky me, it didn't work properly, so I had to return the unit. I was so frustrated with the Dectet that I simply asked for a refund instead of a new unit, and I put the Duet back to work. THAT's when I noticed the sudden change in black levels. Could the fact that I unplugged everything and then plugged everything back in (a few times until I basically had everything where I wanted it, cable-management-wise) have anything to do with the sudden rise in levels?

Do I wait until blacks "settle" revert back to a more acceptable level? Is this supposed to even happen? Am I to understand that EVENTUALLY the phosphors will age and so things will have to inevitably "darken" again? Or will levels basically just remain where they are now, with no further increases? (If so, this TV is useless to me).
post #5 of 10
Esteban:

I dealt (briefly) with the same issue that you are. Had a 65V10 as well, purchased new in late 2010. GREAT TV.....until black rose. Even with the blacks rising, the TV still had wonderful shadow detail. But, I then read about the 2012 Pannys and bought a GT50 and realized how much better the 2012 line-up is over the older Panny sets. And, you don't have to worry about rising/floating blacks. My advise (as I did): sell the V10 and UPGRADE to a ST or VT or ZT. Just know you probably won't get much for the V10. But, you'll have a much better TV. Best of luck on your decision(s)...
Edited by 5150zx - 3/1/13 at 1:33pm
post #6 of 10
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by 5150zx View Post

Estaban:

I dealt (briefly) with the same issue that you are. Had a 65V10 as well, purchased new in late 2010. GREAT TV.....until black rose. Even with the blacks rising, the TV still had wonderful shadow detail. But, I then read about the 2012 Pannys and bought a GT50 and realized how much better the 2012 line-up is over the older Panny sets. And, you don't have to worry about rising/floating blacks. My advise (as I did): sell the V10 and UPGRADE to a ST or VT or ZT. Just know you probably won't get much for the V10. But, you'll have a much better TV. Best of luck on your decision(s)...

Thank you for your feedback and help. I think you are right... As much as it pains me. It seems there are not too many GT50 or VT50 sets available anymore, though (locally, at least... I wouldn't feel too comfortable purchasing such an item online). I suppose the 65GT50 would be the best value, since it offers the two things I really want from a TV: THX mode and 24fps. And (it seems) after one year of user reports, no floating blacks and no rise in black levels. As far as I understand (I might be wrong), there really are no SIGNIFICANT differences between the GT50 and VT50 models, and there's no way I'm paying top dollar for any TV ever again... Yep, after this, I'm jaded.

Thanks again for the advise. My ISF calibrator (who did a great job on the set back when it was functioning as advertised) has kindly offered to stop by tomorrow to check it out and see what can be done, but I am not holding my breath since, like you said, it seems there really is NO cure for these sets...
post #7 of 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by Esteban Medaglia View Post

Thank you for your feedback and help. I think you are right... As much as it pains me. It seems there are not too many GT50 or VT50 sets available anymore, though (locally, at least... I wouldn't feel too comfortable purchasing such an item online). I suppose the 65GT50 would be the best value, since it offers the two things I really want from a TV: THX mode and 24fps. And (it seems) after one year of user reports, no floating blacks and no rise in black levels. As far as I understand (I might be wrong), there really are no SIGNIFICANT differences between the GT50 and VT50 models, and there's no way I'm paying top dollar for any TV ever again... Yep, after this, I'm jaded.

Thanks again for the advise. My ISF calibrator (who did a great job on the set back when it was functioning as advertised) has kindly offered to stop by tomorrow to check it out and see what can be done, but I am not holding my breath since, like you said, it seems there really is NO cure for these sets...

You're welcome. Yes, you're stuck with the blacks your V10 now has. One more point, I own both a GT50 and VT50. Uncalibrated, both are similar in PQ, but the calibration features on the VT50 will make it leap over the GT50 if you get it pro calibrated. It's that good! Both, as well as the ST line, are many steps better than the V10 you have. Good luck.
post #8 of 10
I have a 65V10 that also was pro calibrated. It now has over 10,000 hrs on it and it still looks great. No not as good as the newer versions, but I am still extremely satisfied.
post #9 of 10
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by RickD1225 View Post

I have a 65V10 that also was pro calibrated. It now has over 10,000 hrs on it and it still looks great. No not as good as the newer versions, but I am still extremely satisfied.

You got lucky, I suppose. You have my (well-intentioned) envy. smile.gif I admit that I doubted all those horror stories about the black levels rising overnight as if by some sort of Machiavellian master plan, but I have to say that, at east in my case, things happened exactly as described. Big, big difference overnight. My ISF calibrator came over the other day. Ironically, he was not as horrified with the overall quality as I was. In fact, he actually said the TV looked great to him, perhaps even "too" dark. He suggested to not stress over numbers and specs and focus on the big picture (pun intended) which in this case is certainly watchable. BUT measurements don't lie, and in this case they resulted in 0.02 ftl blacks, which is a far cry from the original 0.006 or so I was able to get when the TV was a few weeks old. Don't get me wrong: it is by no means a "disaster". Grayscale is excellent, definition is crisp as the first day and colors are accurate,. One tends to exaggerate and overreact in such cases (but can you blame us after spending so much money on a supposedly "premium" product?), BUT there is no question that the quality as a whole suffers severely from the no-longer-inky-yet-"ok" black levels. If I could turn back time, I would have not purchased this same TV...
post #10 of 10
I can sympathize with your issue, I couldn't live with it either. I must have gotten lucky. You spend the kind of dough we spent on these panels and you expect to have some reliability!
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