AVS › AVS Forum › HDTV › HDTV Recorders › Entone Amulet 458 DVR: A CM7400 replacement from the actual manufacture with changes
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

Entone Amulet 458 DVR: A CM7400 replacement from the actual manufacture with changes

post #1 of 62
3/1/13 at 11:02am
Thread Starter 
A year ago some of the members here discovered the actual manufacture of the (apparent) discontinued Channel Master CM 7400 DVR;
http://www.avsforum.com/t/1360146/channel-master-tv-cm-7400-hd-dvr-ota-clear-qam-internet-content/990#post_21636053

Entone's website and product info is here;
http://www.entone.com/products/amulet
http://www.entone.com/assets/File/Data%20Sheets/Amulet_400-450%20(v2_0411NA).pdf
Note: the brochure lists a 400 (w/o Internet) & the 450 (w/ Internet), but no 458.
Quote:
Internal Network Options (Model 450 only)
• HomePNA 3.1
• WiFi (802.11 b/g/n)
• HomePlug adapter (external)

A quick start guide is here (I didn't see a full guide anywhere);
http://www.entone.com/assets/File/Reference_Guides/Amulet%20400%20QSG%20v1_2.pdf

It's sold here (1st listed on eBay 2/1/13);
http://antennalogic.ecrater.com/p/17040669/entone-dvr-dual-tuner-for-antenna

In the description, this was stated;
Quote:
Same features and operation as Channel Master CM-7400, but with a welcomed 3 speed menu selected internal chassis fan.
Since this has been sold through this company over a year ago, when was the fan added?? confused.gif
Further down in the description I found this;
Quote:
DeepSleep technology for reducing power consumption up to 99% in standby mode.
Amulet incorporates Entone’s DeepSleep™ technology that reduces power consumption up to 99% in standby mode when compared to competitive products.
DeepSleep enables devices to resume full operation nearly immediately based on
customer activity or at a prescheduled time – for example, to record a program or
receive a scheduled software update. Amulet surpasses energy efficiency guidelines
and regulations from the European Union’s Eco-Design of Energy-Using Products
(EuPs) and United States’ ENERGY STAR program.
I would like to think the CM version did not have this. If true, when was this added/changed? Both tell me the overheating was addressed, by hardware and by a firmware change. If you look at the copyright date of that brochure, it was dated 2011.

Anyway, for $380 with no option for a pay guide, it doesn't seem much of a deal. frown.gif


added model 450 text
Edited by videobruce - 3/1/13 at 9:19pm
Reply
Reply

AVS Top Picks

post #2 of 62
3/1/13 at 11:19am
Cool.
Reply
Reply
post #3 of 62
3/1/13 at 12:36pm
Regardless your notes, CM is a distributor, FW updating by Entone exclusively.
Reply
Reply
post #4 of 62
3/1/13 at 12:43pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by P Smith View Post

Regardless your notes, CM is a distributor, FW updating by Entone exclusively.
Confused: Entone has always done the firmware and CM no longer sells them.
Reply
Reply
post #5 of 62
3/1/13 at 12:43pm
Thread Starter 
Actually, CM is only just a name anymore , someone else bought out a few years ago. wink.gif
Reply
Reply
post #6 of 62
3/1/13 at 1:02pm
Hmm.... Entone must have updated the firmware to let the DVR "sleep" like a PC. I wonder if they updated anything else? In particular, I wonder if they addressed the issue of missing recordings due to the PSIP guide not staying updated?

If they fixed that, we may have something here. But I agree with Bruce that $380 is rather steep, considering no guide subscription is available. Also didn't see any mention of the VUDU service supported by the CM-7400.
Reply
Reply
post #7 of 62
3/1/13 at 3:11pm
One significant upgrade was adding the fan to reduce the overheating. But I wonder if it still has the same weak/problematic tuner?
Reply
Reply
post #8 of 62
3/1/13 at 9:00pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Entone must have updated the firmware to let the DVR "sleep" like a PC.
I would strongly agree with that.
Quote:
I wonder if they addressed the issue of missing recordings due to the PSIP guide not staying updated?
Explain? If the DVR has a program set to record at a specific time & channel in it's memory, why would missing program data matter?
Quote:
But I wonder if it still has the same weak/problematic tuner?
I would say it would, unless there was a firmware change that somehow could correct the problem. Hardware changes are expensive. wink.gif

.
Edited by videobruce - 3/1/13 at 9:11pm
Reply
Reply
post #9 of 62
3/1/13 at 9:06pm
Thread Starter 
I contacted Antennalogic with the following questions;

1. When did this go on sale in the US?
2. When was the fan added, or was it there when it first went on sale here or later on?
3. This "DeepSleep", when was this added? Was it there went it went on sale also or was it added afterwards?
4. What is the power consumption when in standby and while 'on'?
I assume both were for the over heating problem.?

Their answer was this. (You might have to read it twice, I did separate the sentences for easier reading.);
Quote:
Dear videobruce,

this unit is same as cm 7400, only with 3 speed menu selected cooling fan. Stays nice and cool. We are the only seller of this unit.
It is derived from a base unit, that has the cooling function, of which the atsc tuners and qam tuners, wireless capability, which is the final build of the part # 458 Amulet. So, the date of when features were added, would be the date of the build which is as we have them built. so irrelavent.
I have no way to measure current draw at recording, idle, standby, etc. I do not know the specifics of the deep sleep function other than the description in our ad which is a function of this chinese base dvr unit.
Unit much cooler than CM 7400, fan silent, unless placed into stuffy shelf or in cabinet and higher fan speed selected, than fan is audible. Fan turns on and off as needed.
more info and reviews at antennalogic dot com
steve antenna logic
- antennalogic

.
Edited by videobruce - 3/1/13 at 9:12pm
Reply
Reply
post #10 of 62
3/1/13 at 9:38pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by videobruce View Post

If the DVR has a program set to record at a specific time & channel in it's memory, why would missing program data matter?

The CM-7400 performs name-based recording with the paid guide service, but it's possible that scheduling a recording with the PSIP guide will also create a name-based recording event. If that is the case, it would make sense for the recording to fail if the PSIP guide is wrong. It would theoretically be possible to prevent that problem by only setting manual recording events, which would hopefully just use timers.
Reply
Reply
post #11 of 62
3/2/13 at 6:07am
It would be nice to know the fan part number. If the power on/off is from the fan's sensor it would be nice.

Fan turns on and off as needed
Reply
Reply
post #12 of 62
3/2/13 at 7:23am
Thread Starter 
Quote:
The CM-7400 performs name-based recording with the paid guide service
Thanks, I can confirm that for my comparison list.
Quote:
it would make sense for the recording to fail if the PSIP guide is wrong.
I partially mis-read the post. I took it as if the data went missing afterwards. frown.gif Ok, understood about incorrect data when the recording was set.
Quote:
It would be nice to know the fan part number. If the power on/off is from the fan's sensor it would be nice.
The majority of those fans are 12vdc. As long as it fits you should be able to use it. No need to spend $15 for a $5 fan like what is being offered for those TiVo decks. rolleyes.gif
I would think the temperature sensor is PCB mounted.
Reply
Reply
post #13 of 62
3/2/13 at 8:56am

An odd company history.  The listed address *and phone number* for Antenna Logic is a Bakery, according to the BBB.  That may explain why they avoided the direct questions about 'when.'

 

Maybe the question is how long have they been in in the DVR business, not how long have they been selling these.   Not long enough for the BBB to know.  rolleyes.gif

 

http://www.bbb.org/minnesota/business-reviews/bakers-retail/carls-lefse-bakery-in-hawley-mn-96372796

 

 

And good luck finding Entone on the Energy Star site. 

 

ETA:  I guess the answer is since 2009.  Steve Knudson runs the bakery and sells antennas. 

 

https://secure.forumcomm.com/?publisher_ID=1&article_id=245013&CFID=442244965&CFTOKEN=82075185

 

 

Carl's Lefse, Bakery

Edited by TalkingRat - 3/2/13 at 9:16am
Reply
Reply
post #14 of 62
3/2/13 at 10:50am
I wonder if they sell a fan upgrade you can install yourself?
Reply
Reply
post #15 of 62
3/2/13 at 11:13am
Some nice detective TalkingRat! I've lived in MN all my life and never heard of Hawley MN..... I Googled it and it looks to be in the sticks near Fargo ND confused.gif My guess is a entrepreneur has opened up a internet store front and is directly importing these for sale in the US. Nothing wrong with that as long as it works smile.gif
If I were ever up in that neck of the woods(extremely unlikely in my lifetime) I'd have to pick up some Lefse, great with a little butter and sugar, don't cha know biggrin.gif Who knows being a bakery they may even sell Krumkakes or the ever popular sun buckles, doubt they'd sell my favorite Herring in wine sauce cool.gif damn now I'm hungry biggrin.gif
Reply
Reply
post #16 of 62
3/2/13 at 11:33am
Quote:
Originally Posted by TalkingRat View Post

An odd company history.  The listed address *and phone number* for Antenna Logic is a Bakery, according to the BBB.  That may explain why they avoided the direct questions about 'when.'

Maybe the question is how long have they been in in the DVR business, not how long have they been selling these.   Not long enough for the BBB to know.  rolleyes.gif
If you call and they answer as "Peggy" you should get worried.
Reply
Reply
post #17 of 62
3/2/13 at 11:36am
Quote:
Originally Posted by videobruce View Post

Quote:
I wonder if they addressed the issue of missing recordings due to the PSIP guide not staying updated?
Explain? If the DVR has a program set to record at a specific time & channel in it's memory, why would missing program data matter?.

It wouldn't matter for a time-based recording, which is what you described. But my understanding (from discussions on the CM-7400 thread; I don't own one myself so I can't confirm first-hand) is that the CM-7400 (unlike the CM-7000Pal) does name-based recordings as well, and that these sometimes fail with a PSIP-based guide. That makes sense since it's also been reported that a PSIP-based guide often "runs out" unless you periodically cycle through all channels manually. I was wondering if Entone corrected the firmware to refresh the PSIP-based guide automatically, which would presumably correct any issues with name-based recordings also (if they exist).

BTW, I assume it wouldn't be a big problem for a one-time recording, since if the listing were present when the recording was set, it would generally still be there when the program started (unless the schedule changed and the DVR didn't pick up the changed listing).

The big problems would be for recurring recordings. If I set it to record, say, "Emergency!" every time it's on channel 47, it may work the first day but then fail thereafter because the guide isn't getting updated.
Edited by JHBrandt - 3/2/13 at 11:52am
Reply
Reply
post #18 of 62
3/2/13 at 12:10pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Steve Knudson runs the bakery and sells antennas.
Apparently, diversification is the key in the DVR business.
Look at what the drywall business has brought us. biggrin.gif
Reply
Reply
post #19 of 62
3/2/13 at 12:15pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
The big problems would be for recurring recordings. If I set it to record, say, "Emergency!" every time it's on channel 47, it may work the first day but then fail thereafter because the guide isn't getting updated.
I think I get what you mean. That would only apply to a name based recording If it was time based, what does the guide have to do with a set recurring time? It is in the list to record a certain channel, on a certain day, at a certain time.
Reply
Reply
post #20 of 62
3/2/13 at 12:17pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by videobruce View Post

I contacted Antennalogic with the following questions;

1. When did this go on sale in the US?
2. When was the fan added, or was it there when it first went on sale here or later on?
3. This "DeepSleep", when was this added? Was it there went it went on sale also or was it added afterwards?
4. What is the power consumption when in standby and while 'on'?
I assume both were for the over heating problem.?

Their answer was this. (You might have to read it twice, I did separate the sentences for easier reading.);
Quote:
Dear videobruce,

this unit is same as cm 7400, only with 3 speed menu selected cooling fan. Stays nice and cool. We are the only seller of this unit.
It is derived from a base unit, that has the cooling function, of which the atsc tuners and qam tuners, wireless capability, which is the final build of the part # 458 Amulet. So, the date of when features were added, would be the date of the build which is as we have them built. so irrelavent.
I have no way to measure current draw at recording, idle, standby, etc. I do not know the specifics of the deep sleep function other than the description in our ad which is a function of this chinese base dvr unit.
Unit much cooler than CM 7400, fan silent, unless placed into stuffy shelf or in cabinet and higher fan speed selected, than fan is audible. Fan turns on and off as needed.
more info and reviews at antennalogic dot com
steve antenna logic
- antennalogic
.
I'm afraid we won't have any definitive answers until someone is willing to pony up $379 for one of these and review it for the rest of us.
Reply
Reply
post #21 of 62
3/4/13 at 2:07pm
My PALDVR just died and this is one option I am considering. If I buy one I will post here my review.
Reply
Reply
post #22 of 62
3/5/13 at 6:17am
Thread Starter 
Out of curiosity, what happened, or what doesn't happen?
Reply
Reply
post #23 of 62
3/5/13 at 8:15am
It is currently locked in the deadly embrace......the screen shows it is downloading program info (gray screen with info) and it never leaves the screen and the remote will not function to do anything. If it is unplugged and replugged in you will see the green and red lights on at the same time for a few seconds then they go off and the deadly embrace is back with the gray screen. This seems to be a common failure as reported on the PALDVR forum and is documented in post 1 on that forum for problems. I tried all the tricks like pulling the coax, HDMI cable etc. Nothing resolved the deadly embrace.
Reply
Reply
post #24 of 62
3/5/13 at 8:27am
Thread Starter 
Too bad it can't be 'flashed' with the last firmware, I'd bet that would solve the problem unless it is hardware related.
Reply
Reply
post #25 of 62
3/5/13 at 10:26am
OK, so it looks like a chinese CM-7400 clone, imported from china and sold by a guy setting up a side business out of his garage who saw an opportunity -- that essentially means no support -- ask them about their return policy, if there is one -- and who handles warranty repairs, if there is a warranty. No support also means no support for an optional subscription guide service -- but from my reading of the CM-7400 thread, almost no one subscribes to the guide so that should not be much of an issue. If this truly is a CM-7400 clone then it will only record dependably if scheduled manually, VCR-style, for recurring series -- that also doesn't seem to be much of an issue for the CM-7400 users.

At $380 for a manual DVR from a no-name dealer, I don't find this unit compelling -- I didn't find the $400 CM-7400 compelling either. But for those users who are accepting of the CM-7400's price/performance and unwilling to incur the extra cost of a TiVo-lifetime, this could be an alternative if the CM-7400 is really discontinued. Just buy it with your eyes wide open. Don't expect it to ever be any more than what it is coming out of the box -- make sure you can reasonably return it if you don't like it.
Reply
Reply
post #26 of 62
3/5/13 at 10:33am
Thread Starter 
Quote:
OK, so it looks like a chinese CM-7400 clone, imported from china
You have that backwards, The CM was a Entone Amulet 458 clone. Look back into the CM thread and you will find reference to "Amulet" in the firmware.
CM is now only a name that some other company bought out. Like dozens of others, name only.
Quote:
I don't find this unit compelling -- I didn't find the $400 CM-7400 compelling either.
That woiuld make sense since they are the same thing other than the addition of the chassis fan which CM never bothered with, which apparently was the cause of the majority of the problems.
Reply
Reply
post #27 of 62
3/5/13 at 11:02am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kelson View Post

OK, so it looks like a chinese CM-7400 clone, imported from china and sold by a guy setting up a side business out of his garage who saw an opportunity -- that essentially means no support -- ask them about their return policy, if there is one -- and who handles warranty repairs, if there is a warranty. No support also means no support for an optional subscription guide service -- but from my reading of the CM-7400 thread, almost no one subscribes to the guide so that should not be much of an issue. If this truly is a CM-7400 clone then it will only record dependably if scheduled manually, VCR-style, for recurring series -- that also doesn't seem to be much of an issue for the CM-7400 users.

At $380 for a manual DVR from a no-name dealer, I don't find this unit compelling -- I didn't find the $400 CM-7400 compelling either. But for those users who are accepting of the CM-7400's price/performance and unwilling to incur the extra cost of a TiVo-lifetime, this could be an alternative if the CM-7400 is really discontinued. Just buy it with your eyes wide open. Don't expect it to ever be any more than what it is coming out of the box -- make sure you can reasonably return it if you don't like it.

I asked some questions of the seller and was told 14 day return policy and if this makes sense 30 day warranty. Further investigation seems to confirm your thoughts ...a side business for some guy. Low tech shoestring website. Somehow he got his hands on some of these units and is selling them. I can't find any other sellers and I contacted the maker and asked for the names of sellers in the US and I got no response so far. So I am not really anxious to buy one of these units without a better idea as to who is selling these, and the lack of a decent warranty for pluncking down close to $400 after shipping etc. Also you can't find anyone who has bought and reviewed one of these units. Makes you wonder.
Reply
Reply
post #28 of 62
3/5/13 at 11:12am
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Also you can't find anyone who has bought and reviewed one of these units. Makes you wonder.
Since CM was the one selling these in the first place. I assume Entone & CM had some type of agreement/contract and it ran out.
Reply
Reply
post #29 of 62
3/5/13 at 11:27am
Quote:
Originally Posted by LenL View Post

I asked some questions of the seller and was told 14 day return policy and if this makes sense 30 day warranty.

I would guess 14 days to return for a refund; 30 days to return a defective unit for a replacement. Probably all the seller can manage, but you're right; a 30-day warranty isn't much for nearly $400. Even "Channel Master" (actually PCT, Inc.) realized they needed to offer a 1-year warranty back when they started selling the Pals.
Reply
Reply
post #30 of 62
3/5/13 at 9:20pm
Thread Starter 
30 day warranty? They/he will learn quickly when these don't sell at that price. Maybe $250, but surely not $380. rolleyes.gif
Reply
Reply
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: HDTV Recorders

AVS Top Picks

AVS › AVS Forum › HDTV › HDTV Recorders › Entone Amulet 458 DVR: A CM7400 replacement from the actual manufacture with changes