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Official 2013 Sony W802A series LED TVs (KDL-xxW802A) --- 47" and 55" --- Owner's Thread - Page 8

post #211 of 1173
Quote:
Originally Posted by tgm1024 View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by steve1971 View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by mark7677 View Post

I am debating between buying HX750 and w802a. Looks like HX750 is 240Hz whereas w802a is 120Hz. Any advice/input is appreciated.


As tgm1024 said the HX750 is an all around solid performer and the reviews on Amazon are very positive. I can say from experience the I wouldnt replace my HX750 for anything until maybe OLED arrives.

Even then, wait until your 750 completely croaks. From the research done in the OLED thread, OLED has a few enormous nuts to crack, and some horrible stuff might not show up until after you've owned it for a few years: (read this as "blue fading away"). And folks aren't 100% sure it's bright enough to pulse away the sample-and-hold problem. Aye yi yi.


Oh I plan on that tgm. I am sticking with my HX750 until it dies which I hope wont be for a very long time. Nothing thats coming out now or down the road (4K) even remotely interestes me. I am very satified with what I have.
post #212 of 1173
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by steve1971 View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by tgm1024 View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by steve1971 View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by mark7677 View Post

I am debating between buying HX750 and w802a. Looks like HX750 is 240Hz whereas w802a is 120Hz. Any advice/input is appreciated.


As tgm1024 said the HX750 is an all around solid performer and the reviews on Amazon are very positive. I can say from experience the I wouldnt replace my HX750 for anything until maybe OLED arrives.

Even then, wait until your 750 completely croaks. From the research done in the OLED thread, OLED has a few enormous nuts to crack, and some horrible stuff might not show up until after you've owned it for a few years: (read this as "blue fading away"). And folks aren't 100% sure it's bright enough to pulse away the sample-and-hold problem. Aye yi yi.


Oh I plan on that tgm. I am sticking with my HX750 until it dies which I hope wont be for a very long time. Nothing thats coming out now or down the road (4K) even remotely interestes me. I am very satified with what I have.

When it actually *does* die, don't dump it. Sell it. I have absolutely no doubt that by then there will be hard-to-find parts in there that someone will pay for.
post #213 of 1173
Quote:
Originally Posted by tgm1024 View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by steve1971 View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by tgm1024 View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by steve1971 View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by mark7677 View Post

I am debating between buying HX750 and w802a. Looks like HX750 is 240Hz whereas w802a is 120Hz. Any advice/input is appreciated.


As tgm1024 said the HX750 is an all around solid performer and the reviews on Amazon are very positive. I can say from experience the I wouldnt replace my HX750 for anything until maybe OLED arrives.

Even then, wait until your 750 completely croaks. From the research done in the OLED thread, OLED has a few enormous nuts to crack, and some horrible stuff might not show up until after you've owned it for a few years: (read this as "blue fading away"). And folks aren't 100% sure it's bright enough to pulse away the sample-and-hold problem. Aye yi yi.


Oh I plan on that tgm. I am sticking with my HX750 until it dies which I hope wont be for a very long time. Nothing thats coming out now or down the road (4K) even remotely interestes me. I am very satified with what I have.

When it actually *does* die, don't dump it. Sell it. I have absolutely no doubt that by then there will be hard-to-find parts in there that someone will pay for.


Hmmm never thought of that tgm. When the time comes that is just what I might do. But again I am hopeing to have my HX750 for a long time.
post #214 of 1173
I purchased the 47'' w802 earlier this week and so far I'm really happy with it. I'm curious if any knows where I can find configs for the colors online? I'm guessing since it's new that they have not rolled out, yet.
post #215 of 1173
I finally researched the direct backlighting vs. edge backlighting issue. Edge backlighting uses LEDs either on the sides or the top and bottom. As a result, even if you could control the level of each LED, auto LED dimming wouldn't be able to account for the middle sections of the screen. Direct backlighting uses LEDs throughout the panel. Therefore, auto LED dimming would be able to be applied to more parts of the screen, creating a more accurate effect. So ... When Sony uses the term 'edge LED backlighting,' they mean the sides or top and bottom. When they use the term 'direct LED backlighting,' they mean throughout the panel. I don't have any 3D blu-ray discs in my collection. Being that Sony's KDL-32R400A/40R450A/46R453A non-3D displays specificly state they use 'direct LED backlighting,' I'm not going to spend the extra money to futureproof myself for 3D, especially if I'm getting a better picture, and even better sound, for half the price. If you think you can convince us to spend extra money on the KDL-47W802A/55W802A for non 3D use, you'd have to come up with an extremely good reason.
post #216 of 1173
Thanks for the link, it was really interesting. So far I've read 2 reviews of the W905a (same as W900a) and they have been stellar so far!!
post #217 of 1173
Hey guys I recently got the 55 inch at my local sony store. I got it after returning the KDL-60R550A and so far it's better.
post #218 of 1173
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by erios8035 View Post

Hey guys I recently got the 55 inch at my local sony store. I got it after returning the KDL-60R550A and so far it's better.

Better how? I just bought the 60R550A, so it'd be neat to know. How can you stand the blue hue to the bezel smile.gif
post #219 of 1173
Quote:
Originally Posted by tgm1024 View Post

Better how? I just bought the 60R550A, so it'd be neat to know. How can you stand the blue hue to the bezel smile.gif

If you don't like the blue bezel get it in silver?
post #220 of 1173
Tgm I returned my kdl-42w805a today because of speaker problems so am getting a new one but whilst I was there I asked the staff two questions for ya...

1.) is it a LG IPS panel and they replied they purchase the panel from the same supplier but then they add all there own parts to make it there own if you get what I mean..

2nd what is dynamic edge dimming, it basically just means it can dim a larger area than normal edge dimming... Meant to be alot better tho... Sorry I'm not
Going in full detail, enjoying the sun to much haha
post #221 of 1173
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Robertjo View Post

Tgm I returned my kdl-42w805a today because of speaker problems so am getting a new one but whilst I was there I asked the staff two questions for ya...

1.) is it a LG IPS panel and they replied they purchase the panel from the same supplier but then they add all there own parts to make it there own if you get what I mean..

2nd what is dynamic edge dimming, it basically just means it can dim a larger area than normal edge dimming... Meant to be alot better tho... Sorry I'm not
Going in full detail, enjoying the sun to much haha

Hey, THANKS for asking!!!!

Sigh......yeah, they don't know much on #1. The problem is "same supplier" can mean with or without LED's and light-guides. Lots of conversation on that already.

On #2: "Dynamic Edge LED Backlight" ????? They have crocked together a few terms already on this stuff.

Seriously though, thanks for asking. I'd love to hear more of what they said, but only when you get a chance.

Right now, my 550 is on my family room floor and I'm trying to back away from my OCD in setting it up. Being as careful with cables as I normally am and this will take a week. smile.gif OYE!
post #222 of 1173
Ok what the guy from Sony said was that it can support very large parts of each corner of the tv and dim pixels when needed so it covers more areas of the tv than just simple edge lighting, Either way im not to bothered about all of that.. The more and more I realise i spent £1000 on that tv I get sadder and sadder sigh haha oh well I suppose I had better just appreciate it and get on with it.. Just need my replacement now.... Did you purchase a R550 then?
post #223 of 1173
Is this some sort of sick joke....

http://store.sony.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay?catalogId=10551&storeId=10151&langId=-1&productId=8198552921666519659#specifications

http://www.sony.co.uk/product/tv-107-42-lcd/kdl-42w805a

Why is that R550A not available in the UK.. Ah i feel like such a pillock now, I would have preferred the R550A and its so much cheaper for more size...

DAMN YOU SONY..... haha
post #224 of 1173
Quote:
Originally Posted by Big C View Post

I finally researched the direct backlighting vs. edge backlighting issue. Edge backlighting uses LEDs either on the sides or the top and bottom. As a result, even if you could control the level of each LED, auto LED dimming wouldn't be able to account for the middle sections of the screen. Direct backlighting uses LEDs throughout the panel. Therefore, auto LED dimming would be able to be applied to more parts of the screen, creating a more accurate effect. So ... When Sony uses the term 'edge LED backlighting,' they mean the sides or top and bottom. When they use the term 'direct LED backlighting,' they mean throughout the panel. I don't have any 3D blu-ray discs in my collection. Being that Sony's KDL-32R400A/40R450A/46R453A non-3D displays specificly state they use 'direct LED backlighting,' I'm not going to spend the extra money to futureproof myself for 3D, especially if I'm getting a better picture, and even better sound, for half the price. If you think you can convince us to spend extra money on the KDL-47W802A/55W802A for non 3D use, you'd have to come up with an extremely good reason.
Could someone please either back me up or correct me on this?
post #225 of 1173
Quote:
Originally Posted by Big C View Post

Could someone please either back me up or correct me on this?

Yes edge dimming is the sides or the corners, Full dimming is the whole tv and will in most cases give the best display and also help produce proper blacks :-)
post #226 of 1173
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Robertjo View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Big C View Post

Could someone please either back me up or correct me on this?

Yes edge dimming is the sides or the corners, Full dimming is the whole tv and will in most cases give the best display and also help produce proper blacks :-)

No, there is no such thing as "edge dimming", that's not what the rep meant. You don't just dim the edges of the screen. You can dim the LEDs which are on the edges: this gets you a form of local dimming (according to *some* of Sony----read many posts upward).

Dynamic Edge LED Backlight: This doesn't dim the edges of the display itself, it's modifying the LEDs (which of course are on the edges).

This conversation is getting out of control because there are two problems here:
(Most importantly), a collection of similarly named things that even Sony reps seem to not be clear on.
A misunderstanding of what it is I'm finding to be a sincere set of questions still unclear.
post #227 of 1173
Quote:
Originally Posted by Robertjo View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Big C View Post

Could someone please either back me up or correct me on this?

Yes edge dimming is the sides or the corners, Full dimming is the whole tv and will in most cases give the best display and also help produce proper blacks :-)
Please read this carefully and understand exactly what I'm trying to say before you post. After googling "direct LED edge LED," I found a few sites which state that it's not just about the dimming. It's also about the actual backlighting. Edge LED panels use LEDs to backlight either the sides or top and bottom of the panel, therefore, making it impossible for dimming to be applied throughout the panel. The advantages of edge LED backlighting are that the panels are thinner and less expensive to produce. I suspect that the KDL-##W802A is more expensive because of 3D and internet capability. Direct LED panels use LEDs throughout the entire panel, therefore, making dimming possible throughout the entire panel. These are more expensive to produce and the panels are thicker, but result in better contrast. Even though the KDL-32R400A/40R450A/46R453A are thicker and use direct LED backlighting, I suspect they are less expensive than the KDL-##W802A because they aren't 3D and internet capable. So therefore, if you're not looking for 3D or built-in internet capability, wouldn't you be better off with the KDL-32R400A/40R450A/46R453A?
post #228 of 1173
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Big C View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Robertjo View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Big C View Post

Could someone please either back me up or correct me on this?

Yes edge dimming is the sides or the corners, Full dimming is the whole tv and will in most cases give the best display and also help produce proper blacks :-)
Please read this carefully and understand exactly what I'm trying to say before you post. After googling "direct LED edge LED," I found a few sites which state that it's not just about the dimming. It's also about the actual backlighting. Edge LED panels use LEDs to backlight either the sides or top and bottom of the panel, therefore, making it impossible for dimming to be applied throughout the panel.

THIS IS FALSE. Time for YOU to read what it is others are saying before YOU post. 2nd, you need a little more education in what local dimming, and what edge lighting is, and why local dimming used to be considered a full-array thing. 3rd, Robertjo is also incorrect.

You're misreading those sites, and are not understanding an enormous amount.

1. "It's not about the dimming, it's about the actual backlighting". Dimming is achieved by altering the backlighting. Note: In an LED set "backlighting" is coming FROM the EDGE LEDs which are tunneling through something called "light guides" to reach the screen itself. This is one of the reasons that it is so difficult for Edge lit screens to gain uniformity and avoid cloudiness.

2. "Dynamic Edge LED Backlighting" will be referred to by Sony periodically as "boosting" the light to the regions of the screen. This is an oddity in explanations and if the Sony rep was right, it's identical to "local dimming", possibly in reverse. There is considerable confusion as to what they meant in their spec sheet (for the 802, its the only place it showed up) as "frame dimming". It's possible that starting in 2013 they combine the two to employ their local dimming. See the numerous links I've supplied at the top.

3. "Edge LED panels use LEDs to backlight either the sides or top and bottom of the panel, therefore, making it impossible for dimming to be applied throughout the panel." More utter nonsense. Edge LED panels use LEDs to backlight the ENTIRE display as stated above. What you're probably misunderstanding is that commonly the LEDs actually light in large swaths the entire height of the screen from the bottom. This results in an oddly shaped zone. But they do NOT leave parts of the screen untouched.

You do not understand the fundamentals, so it's totally understandable that you do not understand the more complicated confusions with Sony.
Edited by tgm1024 - 5/6/13 at 11:26am
post #229 of 1173
Thread Starter 
This is part of where folks are getting confused.

In this (exaggerated) example, there is a bottom lit TV with local dimming. Note, the dimming zone still reaches the middle of the screen.

Moon_Local_Dimming.jpg

Now, let's please back away from this until we have more information.
post #230 of 1173
Quote:
Originally Posted by tgm1024 View Post

This is part of where folks are getting confused.

In this (exaggerated) example, there is a bottom lit TV with local dimming. Note, the dimming zone still reaches the middle of the screen.

Moon_Local_Dimming.jpg

Now, let's please back away from this until we have more information.

Bloody hell that is a big difference haha!!
post #231 of 1173
55W802A is available at Best Buy locally. Folks can go see it for themselves, assuming it is available in your area.
post #232 of 1173
Quote:
Originally Posted by tgm1024 View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Big C View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Robertjo View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Big C View Post

Could someone please either back me up or correct me on this?

Yes edge dimming is the sides or the corners, Full dimming is the whole tv and will in most cases give the best display and also help produce proper blacks :-)
Please read this carefully and understand exactly what I'm trying to say before you post. After googling "direct LED edge LED," I found a few sites which state that it's not just about the dimming. It's also about the actual backlighting. Edge LED panels use LEDs to backlight either the sides or top and bottom of the panel, therefore, making it impossible for dimming to be applied throughout the panel.

THIS IS FALSE. Time for YOU to read what it is others are saying before YOU post. 2nd, you need a little more education in what local dimming, and what edge lighting is, and why local dimming used to be considered a full-array thing. 3rd, Robertjo is also incorrect.

You're misreading those sites, and are not understanding an enormous amount.

1. "It's not about the dimming, it's about the actual backlighting". Dimming is achieved by altering the backlighting. Note: In an LED set "backlighting" is coming FROM the EDGE LEDs which are tunneling through something called "light guides" to reach the screen itself. This is one of the reasons that it is so difficult for Edge lit screens to gain uniformity and avoid cloudiness.

2. "Dynamic Edge LED Backlighting" will be referred to by Sony periodically as "boosting" the light to the regions of the screen. This is an oddity in explanations and if the Sony rep was right, it's identical to "local dimming", possibly in reverse. There is considerable confusion as to what they meant in their spec sheet (for the 802, its the only place it showed up) as "frame dimming". It's possible that starting in 2013 they combine the two to employ their local dimming. See the numerous links I've supplied at the top.

3. "Edge LED panels use LEDs to backlight either the sides or top and bottom of the panel, therefore, making it impossible for dimming to be applied throughout the panel." More utter nonsense. Edge LED panels use LEDs to backlight the ENTIRE display as stated above. What you're probably misunderstanding is that commonly the LEDs actually light in large swaths the entire height of the screen from the bottom. This results in an oddly shaped zone. But they do NOT leave parts of the screen untouched.

You do not understand the fundamentals, so it's totally understandable that you do not understand the more complicated confusions with Sony.
I am aware that I am talking about two types of dimming AND two types of backlighting. Frame dimming applies dimming to larger parts of the panel at a time. Local dimming applies dimming to more specific areas. Edge LED backlighting uses LEDs on either the sides or the top and bottom of the panel. Direct LED backlighting uses LEDs throughout the panel. With frame dimming, whether edge or direct LED backlighting is used, because it dims larger areas at a time, it won't produce as accurate an effect. If local dimming is used with edge LED backlighting, the effect can only be applied to the LEDs on the sides or top and bottom, not throughout the panel. If local dimming is used with direct LED backlighting, dimming would correspond with the intensity in more specific areas throughout the panel, producing a better, more accurate effect. Now that I separated dimming and backlighting, and then combined the results when using different types of dimming with different types of backlighting, I feel I understand Sony's terms. The KDL-##802A uses edge LED backlighting with frame dimming. The panel is thin. These models are expensive. The KDL-32R400A/40R450A/46R453A use direct LED backlighting, are thicker, and are less expensive. Even though the backlighting is better on the less expensive series, is the KDL-##802A more expensive simply because of higher refresh rate, 3D support, and built-in internet capability?
post #233 of 1173
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Big C View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by tgm1024 View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Big C View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Robertjo View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Big C View Post

Could someone please either back me up or correct me on this?

Yes edge dimming is the sides or the corners, Full dimming is the whole tv and will in most cases give the best display and also help produce proper blacks :-)
Please read this carefully and understand exactly what I'm trying to say before you post. After googling "direct LED edge LED," I found a few sites which state that it's not just about the dimming. It's also about the actual backlighting. Edge LED panels use LEDs to backlight either the sides or top and bottom of the panel, therefore, making it impossible for dimming to be applied throughout the panel.

THIS IS FALSE. Time for YOU to read what it is others are saying before YOU post. 2nd, you need a little more education in what local dimming, and what edge lighting is, and why local dimming used to be considered a full-array thing. 3rd, Robertjo is also incorrect.

You're misreading those sites, and are not understanding an enormous amount.

1. "It's not about the dimming, it's about the actual backlighting". Dimming is achieved by altering the backlighting. Note: In an LED set "backlighting" is coming FROM the EDGE LEDs which are tunneling through something called "light guides" to reach the screen itself. This is one of the reasons that it is so difficult for Edge lit screens to gain uniformity and avoid cloudiness.

2. "Dynamic Edge LED Backlighting" will be referred to by Sony periodically as "boosting" the light to the regions of the screen. This is an oddity in explanations and if the Sony rep was right, it's identical to "local dimming", possibly in reverse. There is considerable confusion as to what they meant in their spec sheet (for the 802, its the only place it showed up) as "frame dimming". It's possible that starting in 2013 they combine the two to employ their local dimming. See the numerous links I've supplied at the top.

3. "Edge LED panels use LEDs to backlight either the sides or top and bottom of the panel, therefore, making it impossible for dimming to be applied throughout the panel." More utter nonsense. Edge LED panels use LEDs to backlight the ENTIRE display as stated above. What you're probably misunderstanding is that commonly the LEDs actually light in large swaths the entire height of the screen from the bottom. This results in an oddly shaped zone. But they do NOT leave parts of the screen untouched.

You do not understand the fundamentals, so it's totally understandable that you do not understand the more complicated confusions with Sony.
I am aware that I am talking about two types of dimming AND two types of backlighting. Frame dimming applies dimming to larger parts of the panel at a time. Local dimming applies dimming to more specific areas. Edge LED backlighting uses LEDs on either the sides or the top and bottom of the panel. Direct LED backlighting uses LEDs throughout the panel. With frame dimming, whether edge or direct LED backlighting is used, because it dims larger areas at a time, it won't produce as accurate an effect. If local dimming is used with edge LED backlighting, the effect can only be applied to the LEDs on the sides or top and bottom, not throughout the panel.

You're almost there. Those LEDs light throughout the panel, just in very long shapes. You're changing the phrasing a little from before, but as long as you're aware that the dimming, even with Edge LEDs, does infact reach into the middle of the screen (just often with large vertical swaths). You're talking about there being regions in the middle independent from the edges but those *do* get dimmed just along with regions above and below (in the simplest case).

Keep in mind, that even central zone targetting is theoretically possible with edge lighting. The light guides can be theoretically be complicated and target the middle if they tunnel around properly in the back. There is some talk that this is precisely what Vizio is attempting either now or soon. Or from whomever (LG?) they buy the panels from. Time will tell because I'm not sure who is doing this currently.

In any case, enough with Dimming 101. We need more time for the heavy hitters to get a hold of this thing and investigate just WTF Sony is talking about. There are good reviewers that are able to see through the BS, the mis-speak, and the subtle changes in terms.
post #234 of 1173
Quote:
Originally Posted by tgm1024 View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Big C View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by tgm1024 View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Big C View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Robertjo View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Big C View Post

Could someone please either back me up or correct me on this?

Yes edge dimming is the sides or the corners, Full dimming is the whole tv and will in most cases give the best display and also help produce proper blacks :-)
Please read this carefully and understand exactly what I'm trying to say before you post. After googling "direct LED edge LED," I found a few sites which state that it's not just about the dimming. It's also about the actual backlighting. Edge LED panels use LEDs to backlight either the sides or top and bottom of the panel, therefore, making it impossible for dimming to be applied throughout the panel.

THIS IS FALSE. Time for YOU to read what it is others are saying before YOU post. 2nd, you need a little more education in what local dimming, and what edge lighting is, and why local dimming used to be considered a full-array thing. 3rd, Robertjo is also incorrect.

You're misreading those sites, and are not understanding an enormous amount.

1. "It's not about the dimming, it's about the actual backlighting". Dimming is achieved by altering the backlighting. Note: In an LED set "backlighting" is coming FROM the EDGE LEDs which are tunneling through something called "light guides" to reach the screen itself. This is one of the reasons that it is so difficult for Edge lit screens to gain uniformity and avoid cloudiness.

2. "Dynamic Edge LED Backlighting" will be referred to by Sony periodically as "boosting" the light to the regions of the screen. This is an oddity in explanations and if the Sony rep was right, it's identical to "local dimming", possibly in reverse. There is considerable confusion as to what they meant in their spec sheet (for the 802, its the only place it showed up) as "frame dimming". It's possible that starting in 2013 they combine the two to employ their local dimming. See the numerous links I've supplied at the top.

3. "Edge LED panels use LEDs to backlight either the sides or top and bottom of the panel, therefore, making it impossible for dimming to be applied throughout the panel." More utter nonsense. Edge LED panels use LEDs to backlight the ENTIRE display as stated above. What you're probably misunderstanding is that commonly the LEDs actually light in large swaths the entire height of the screen from the bottom. This results in an oddly shaped zone. But they do NOT leave parts of the screen untouched.

You do not understand the fundamentals, so it's totally understandable that you do not understand the more complicated confusions with Sony.
I am aware that I am talking about two types of dimming AND two types of backlighting. Frame dimming applies dimming to larger parts of the panel at a time. Local dimming applies dimming to more specific areas. Edge LED backlighting uses LEDs on either the sides or the top and bottom of the panel. Direct LED backlighting uses LEDs throughout the panel. With frame dimming, whether edge or direct LED backlighting is used, because it dims larger areas at a time, it won't produce as accurate an effect. If local dimming is used with edge LED backlighting, the effect can only be applied to the LEDs on the sides or top and bottom, not throughout the panel.

You're almost there. Those LEDs light throughout the panel, just in very long shapes. You're changing the phrasing a little from before, but as long as you're aware that the dimming, even with Edge LEDs, does infact reach into the middle of the screen (just often with large vertical swaths). You're talking about there being regions in the middle independent from the edges but those *do* get dimmed just along with regions above and below (in the simplest case).

Keep in mind, that even central zone targetting is theoretically possible with edge lighting. The light guides can be theoretically be complicated and target the middle if they tunnel around properly in the back. There is some talk that this is precisely what Vizio is attempting either now or soon. Or from whomever (LG?) they buy the panels from. Time will tell because I'm not sure who is doing this currently.

In any case, enough with Dimming 101. We need more time for the heavy hitters to get a hold of this thing and investigate just WTF Sony is talking about. There are good reviewers that are able to see through the BS, the mis-speak, and the subtle changes in terms.
Unless you add the guide element to the mix, if edge LED backlighting is used, local dimming can't apply dimming to as precise an area as with direct backlighting.

OK. Now that we hopefully got the dimming function straight, even though the KDL-32R400A/40R450A/46R453A is less expensive than the KDL-##802A, being that it uses direct LED backlighting, will it do better if you're not into 3D?
Edited by Big C - 5/6/13 at 1:33pm
post #235 of 1173
Quote:
Originally Posted by Big C View Post

OK. So even though the KDL-32R400A/40R450A/46R453A is less expensive than the KDL-##802A, being that it uses direct LED backlighting, will it do better if you're not into 3D?

None of those models have x-reality pro which is great for upscaling video and images.
post #236 of 1173
Quote:
Originally Posted by Robertjo View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Big C View Post

OK. So even though the KDL-32R400A/40R450A/46R453A is less expensive than the KDL-##802A, being that it uses direct LED backlighting, will it do better if you're not into 3D?

None of those models have x-reality pro which is great for upscaling video and images.
I don't upscale. I just accept the black borders when playing 480i material. When playing native 1080p non-3D Blu-ray discs, will the KDL-32R400A/40R450A/46R453A do better than the KDL-##802A when used as a non-3D display because of the KDL-32R400A/40R450A/40R453A's direct LED backlighting?
post #237 of 1173
I think i may have worded that incorrectly..

read this

http://www.sony.co.uk/hub/lcd-television/benefits/article/x-reality-pro

What i meant from upscale is it can take a normal video and process it to make it much clearer and vibrant.

I honestly couldn't tell you if the range you are looking at will be better but in terms of the backlighting/dimming etc yes i expect they will be better and for the price they are going for its fairly good but they are lacking a lot of neat features.

The link i just posted is about the x-reality pro image processing technology the 802a comes with.
post #238 of 1173
The only thing that puzzles me is the database. Does that really work?
Does the database get updated or am I reading that wrong?

Step up to High Definition with the Reality Creation Database
"With X-Reality Pro, it’s like everything you watch, whether it’s an old home movie or an online TV show, looks like it has been shot in HD. Each picture is analysed at source and every frame is compared, pixel-by-pixel, with a built-in library. Wherever possible these pixels are replaced by their High Definition counterpart. This boosts even low quality content from the web to as close to HD as possible –an instant upgrade for everything you watch."
post #239 of 1173
Quote:
Originally Posted by tgm1024 View Post

THIS IS FALSE. Time for YOU to read what it is others are saying before YOU post. 2nd, you need a little more education in what local dimming, and what edge lighting is, and why local dimming used to be considered a full-array thing. 3rd, Robertjo is also incorrect.

You're misreading those sites, and are not understanding an enormous amount.

1. "It's not about the dimming, it's about the actual backlighting". Dimming is achieved by altering the backlighting. Note: In an LED set "backlighting" is coming FROM the EDGE LEDs which are tunneling through something called "light guides" to reach the screen itself. This is one of the reasons that it is so difficult for Edge lit screens to gain uniformity and avoid cloudiness.

2. "Dynamic Edge LED Backlighting" will be referred to by Sony periodically as "boosting" the light to the regions of the screen. This is an oddity in explanations and if the Sony rep was right, it's identical to "local dimming", possibly in reverse. There is considerable confusion as to what they meant in their spec sheet (for the 802, its the only place it showed up) as "frame dimming". It's possible that starting in 2013 they combine the two to employ their local dimming. See the numerous links I've supplied at the top.

3. "Edge LED panels use LEDs to backlight either the sides or top and bottom of the panel, therefore, making it impossible for dimming to be applied throughout the panel." More utter nonsense. Edge LED panels use LEDs to backlight the ENTIRE display as stated above. What you're probably misunderstanding is that commonly the LEDs actually light in large swaths the entire height of the screen from the bottom. This results in an oddly shaped zone. But they do NOT leave parts of the screen untouched.

You do not understand the fundamentals, so it's totally understandable that you do not understand the more complicated confusions with Sony.

False, clouding is caused by sections of the lcd matrix not being able to block out light as well as other sections of the lcd matrix and not by the led edge lighting. Thus causing clouding.
post #240 of 1173
@ tgm1024 I hardly notice the blue hue, the noticeable difference is the x reality pro. With the 60R550A it look like it had no color, was changing the settings and finally gave up, my 5 year old samsung look better. The w802a came with ok settings I had to adjust a couple them and it looks good now.
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