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Official Samsung PNxxF8500 Series Discussion Thread [No Street Price Talk] - Page 53

post #1561 of 11459
Quote:
Originally Posted by andy sullivan View Post

I kind of have to disagree with you a bit on this one Ken. I've felt for many years that Panasonic is the way to go for plasma but I also knew that there is only three players left in the plasma game. I pretty much dismiss LG because they seem to always rank 3rd in the pecking order. Now with the 8500 series from Samsung I've strongly swung into the Samsung camp for the first time. I disagree with your idea of staying away from a thread because you've decided on another model or brand or even a different technology. Did you not abandon (maybe abandon is too strong a word) plasma for LED when you went with the Elite? Now the 8500 is tempting you because the 8500 has moved into new territory on several fronts. You just never know when a technology or brand you've dismissed will jump up and shock the world.

Well that's sort of apples & oranges. Ken tends to serve in kind of a host role on many of these threads, since he is more "tech agnostic" if you will (objectively seeking the best, regardless of brand or technology); so that in combination with being "in the know" puts him in a unique position to moderate the hype/fanboism with a more informed voice of reason . JMO.
post #1562 of 11459
Quote:
Originally Posted by vinnie97 View Post

Correct, most don't, and the method that D-Nice is using to lower the blacks would take trial and error for anyone to duplicate. As to why I'm back, I just like to see the latest impressions from time to time. I also found Glashub's full-scale review interesting (sorry, Ken). wink.gif

I didn't see Glashub's 'full-scale review', I must have missed it. I saw some impressions he gave upon first seeing the 8500, but I didn't see anything beyond that.

If that's what you're referring to, I'm not sure why you're apologizing. He like you, loves the Kuro and still feels it hasn't been beat. I think it has. So that means that reasonable people can have different opinions. He thinks it doesn't add to the picture to have greater detail. I couldn't disagree more. Again, different opinions. No need to apologize and I certainly wasn't 'offended' by his post. smile.gif
post #1563 of 11459
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ken Ross View Post

Captenblack, where is this band located? IOW, how far from the bottom of the screen? I'd like to look at that the next time I see the panel.

Checked using an HTPC with a white screen. It is faint and at certain angles very difficult to see, but it is there. The screen itself is a bit under 30 inches tall. The band is precisely in the center, so roughly between 10 inches from top and 10 inches from bottom (on the 60").
post #1564 of 11459
Quote:
Originally Posted by Glashub View Post

I should direct this at Ken, Vinnie, but I'm amazed he got over his Elite 151 so quickly. I still grieve selling mine and I regret not buying a 151 instead of a 111. I just see anything wrong with the Kuro PQ and it has set a benchmark in my mind after about 7 years of Kuro ownership 8g & 9g. The VT is close in a lot of ways. I guess the Kuro just gave a depth and clarity of image even to the smallest background details. Hard to explain to someone who has never seen one. But Ken, whom I trust, seems to really like this 8500.

Glashub, I guess it was living with both displays, showing the same material for about a month. It gave me countless opportunities to compare everything from color to sharpness to brightness to black levels. I watched movies, live sports, documentaries, sitcoms, you name it. It was actually a dream A/B.

After I did all that, I came to the conclusion that the Elite (IMO) bested the Kuro in enough areas (sharpness, brightness & black levels...sorry Vinnie wink.gif) that its overall PQ was significantly better. BTW Glashub, if you read the Elite threads, there are many former Kuro owners in that group who feel precisely the same way. They never once looked back after selling their Kuros.

Again, it doesn't take away from the fact that the Kuro was and is a great display. But IMO, things change and we move on. Of course there are many other Kuro owners (hello Vinnie!) who think otherwise. biggrin.gif

But I am curious why you got rid of your Kuro for a VT50, especially feeling the way you do?
post #1565 of 11459
Quote:
Originally Posted by yamvmax View Post

How do we get the cal day and night menus????


Its in the service menu and if you are not familliar with it then I suggest staying very very very far away as you CAN brick your TV and do damage that will not be covered by and warranty.
Quote:
Originally Posted by floridaman View Post

The band is just above the center of the screen.

I got fianlly got a chance to see the 64F8500 in Magnolia today, the website showed that none of my loal stores had it in stock, but I thought Id try it out anyways. I have to say this is a beautiful set, it seemd someone had tweaked the set as the E8000 next to it was in torch mode and the F8500 seemed "muted" compared to it, butmore natural in my eyes. I tried to get the remote, but of course there as none availabel for me to check the settings. I noticed what seemed like a band and some fluctuations, but like Ken when I looked at the other sets all of the "problems" were with the feed, Im not sure if I have seen a worst feed which makes it look like there are a ton of issues with all the sets.....They showed some hockey, I didnt notice any strobing or flashlighting while watching the game, I also saw various other material and didnt noticce the ABL in dark scenes or light scenes. I also checked for the filter darkening and while I did see it, I saw the same thing on other sets as I got VERY close, at normal distance I couldnt see anything.....The pictures I saw earlier had me a little worried, but I see that the picture greatly exaggerates the effect on the TV (at least in my eyes)....

I had to laugh a littel inside though, becasue according to the salesperson in the Magnolia section Pioneer techs went to Samsung and thats why thier sets are so good biggrin.gif

Overall i was very pleased with what I saw, I really wanted to check out an ST60, but they didnt havae any out...They had 2 F8500s though the 64 in the "main room" and a 51 in the "audo" room......I may just program my Harmony or try to dig out my old Samsung TV remote and take it to the store so I can fiddle with the set lol....
Edited by Ph8te - 4/7/13 at 11:54am
post #1566 of 11459
Quote:
Originally Posted by jiholl5333 View Post

UPDATE..Stand "GAP" - Photo

This is how my stand "seats"..it really seems like it just could not go down further...this is the same on both sides.



Is this "normal"


Could you or someone with this TV tell me if you think I'll have trouble with this TV due to the stand? Currently my 59D7000 hangs slightly over each edge of my TV stand - this isn't a problem with the D series because the stand is much smaller than the length of the bottom of the TV. My concern is that since this stand runs the full length of the screen that this would give me problems, but I guess it would depend on where on the stand the "grips" or whatever on the bottom of the stand are.
post #1567 of 11459
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pinger View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ken Ross View Post

Pinger, no letter-boxed movies I hope.

No way... Only full screen material and through the night StarzHD zoomed 2x to alleviate any bars or logos..
Call me over cautious but I plan on a 200 hr break in period for my F8500..

I'm finding mixing everything is working just fine. Movies with bars et al. Last thing each night I run the scrolling bars for five mins.
post #1568 of 11459
Quote:
Originally Posted by DanF8500 View Post

I'm watching a live, nationally televised hockey game on nbc right now with my 51F8500. I enjoy watching live sporting events with this new PDP!! Camera flashes/strobes in the event are more recognizable with this plasma than with my older plasma. Perhaps the larger screen size and the brighter whites this tv displays makes them stand out more. Best tv I've ever owned by a long shot!

Dan, are you seeing any brightness pops or just the ubiquitous camera flashes? I find the camera flashes much more distracting then the brightness pop since they're much more intense.
post #1569 of 11459
Quote:
Originally Posted by floridaman View Post

I have looked at the display in the Magnolia Center but never checked the motion judder setting. I am going back to look at that setting and the banding issue. Thanks for all of your input on this forum.

Your welcome floridaman. If I can make a suggestion. Take a Blu Ray disc to Magnolia where you see bad judder on your display and compare it to the judder, playing the same disc, to their. Then take a look at their settings if it seems better.

It might also be good if you can identify a Blu Ray movie where you see frequent 'pops' and take that one too to Magnolia to compare.

Good luck!
post #1570 of 11459
Quote:
Originally Posted by captenblack View Post

Checked using an HTPC with a white screen. It is faint and at certain angles very difficult to see, but it is there. The screen itself is a bit under 30 inches tall. The band is precisely in the center, so roughly between 10 inches from top and 10 inches from bottom (on the 60").

So, even though your screen sizes are different, the band seems to be located in almost the same spot as Floridaman's.
post #1571 of 11459
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ph8te View Post


Overall i was very pleased with what I saw, I really wanted to check out an ST60, but they didnt havae any out...They had 2 F8500s though the 64 in the "main room" and a 51 in the "audo" room......I may just program my Harmony or try to dig out my old Samsung TV remote and take it to the store so I can fiddle with the set lol....

That's pretty funny. I remember the days of Harvey Electronics, a high-end audio/video dealer in N.Y. They never particularly liked customers playing with their TVs settings, so I used to do kind of what you're thinking of doing, programming a universal remote and putting it in your pocket. I often didn't have that manufacturer's set at home and so I had no manufacturer specific remote to play with.
post #1572 of 11459
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ken Ross View Post

Glashub, I guess it was living with both displays, showing the same material for about a month. It gave me countless opportunities to compare everything from color to sharpness to brightness to black levels. I watched movies, live sports, documentaries, sitcoms, you name it. It was actually a dream A/B.

After I did all that, I came to the conclusion that the Elite (IMO) bested the Kuro in enough areas (sharpness, brightness & black levels...sorry Vinnie wink.gif) that its overall PQ was significantly better. BTW Glashub, if you read the Elite threads, there are many former Kuro owners in that group who feel precisely the same way. They never once looked back after selling their Kuros.

Again, it doesn't take away from the fact that the Kuro was and is a great display. But IMO, things change and we move on. Of course there are many other Kuro owners (hello Vinnie!) who think otherwise. biggrin.gif

But I am curious why you got rid of your Kuro for a VT50, especially feeling the way you do?

See that's part of the value you bring Ken and why I respect you -- you are agnostic, objective and you have owned a number of different display. I sold the 111 because I moved to a new house and now sit 12 feet from the screen. I will be buying either an 8500 or a ZT60 this yeat. I'll put the VT on the market and be done with it until OLED.

Thanks for all you contribute.
post #1573 of 11459
I decided to set my verizon fios stb to output "native" video (set this up in the stb's service menu) and let my 8500 do all up-conversions of the video signal. This reduces unessesary/redundant video processing between the stb and your tv, but introduces another artifact that may be undesirable to some. When changing from, say a 720p broadcast to a 1080i broadcast (i.e. abc to nbc), my 8500 will blank its display and audio (for 2 seconds or so), before displaying the new channel. Upon display of the new channel, my 8500 will show the native video resolution of the broadcast channel in the upper left corner. Changing to a different channel with the same native video output creates no delay. Is this delay consistent (i.e. slower, faster , nonexistent) with most tv's during a video resolution change from one channel broadcast to another?
Edited by DanF8500 - 4/7/13 at 12:11pm
post #1574 of 11459
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ken Ross View Post

Your welcome floridaman. If I can make a suggestion. Take a Blu Ray disc to Magnolia where you see bad judder on your display and compare it to the judder, playing the same disc, to their. Then take a look at their settings if it seems better.

It might also be good if you can identify a Blu Ray movie where you see frequent 'pops' and take that one too to Magnolia to compare.

Good luck!
I actually haven't had any judder problems. Maybe I misunderstood what the setting was for. In previous posts it is mentioned to leave this setting off to minimize the soap opera effect. I was testing this setting to see if there were any visible differences in the picture and there weren't. I plan on taking the break in slide DVD with me as you can see the band on a white background. I want to clarify that the band is faint but once you have seen it you will always see it. As with any flaw in the picture it is hard to miss once you have seen it. I watched Collateral Damage blu ray last night and didn't notice the popping. When I watch regular TV content though I can see the brightness pops. I will take a blu ray movie however and check it out.
post #1575 of 11459
Quote:
Originally Posted by Glashub View Post

See that's part of the value you bring Ken and why I respect you -- you are agnostic, objective and you have owned a number of different display. I sold the 111 because I moved to a new house and now sit 12 feet from the screen. I will be buying either an 8500 or a ZT60 this yeat. I'll put the VT on the market and be done with it until OLED.

Thanks for all you contribute.

Thanks Glashub. I'm also looking forward to the ZT60. We know it will have the best black levels of any display available today, but I'd like to see how much they've improved brightness. I don't expect it to match the 8500's brightness, but if it's a significant increase over the current Pansonics, it could be very interesting.

The bonded glass deal doesn't wow me that much. It will help with off-axis double images like credits on a black screen, but I'm not sure how much it will help beyond that. I don't think anyone sees too many double images from any display these days from anything approaching a typical seating position.

Between the 8500 & the ZT60, I suspect it will be hard to make a mistake. smile.gif
post #1576 of 11459
Quote:
Originally Posted by DanF8500 View Post

I decided to set my verizon fios stb to output "native" video (set this up in the stb's service menu) and let my 8500 do the upconversion of the video signal. This reduces unessesary/redundant video processing between the stb and your tv, but introduces another artifact that may be undesirable to some. When changing from, say a 720p broadcast to a 1080i broadcast (i.e. abc to nbc), my 8500 will blank its display and audio (for 2 seconds or so), before displaying the new channel. Upon display of the new channel, my 8500 will show the native video resolution of the broadcast channel in the upper left corner. Changing to a different channel with the same native video output creates no delay. Is this delay consistent (i.e. slower, faster , nonexistent) with most tv's during a video resolution change from one channel broadcast to another?

There will always be some sort of delay as the TV hadshakes at the new resolution, much like when and AVR needs switches to a different format there is a "small" delay while it changes modes and resyncs......Usually most people leave the STB set at a fixed resolution (720p\1080i) and then are done with it.....Youll msot likely see this with any TV if you are cosnanly changing resolutions (IMO)....
post #1577 of 11459
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ken Ross View Post

That's pretty funny. I remember the days of Harvey Electronics, a high-end audio/video dealer in N.Y. They never particularly liked customers playing with their TVs settings, so I used to do kind of what you're thinking of doing, programming a universal remote and putting it in your pocket. I often didn't have that manufacturer's set at home and so I had no manufacturer specific remote to play with.

It seems people ahve a bad habit of waslking away with remotes to TVs they dont own.....Then when it comes time to sell an open box, BB sells it without the remtoe, because someone "stole" it, or its bee "misplaced".......Im almsot for sure going back with the remote when I have enough time to change some settings.....Ill ahve to try both sets as the 51" is in a "darker" setting within the audio room....
post #1578 of 11459
Quote:
Originally Posted by jiholl5333 View Post

UPDATE..Stand "GAP" - Photo

This is how my stand "seats"..it really seems like it just could not go down further...this is the same on both sides.



Is this "normal"

No. Mine sits flush.
post #1579 of 11459
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ph8te View Post

Well I cant REALLY blame you for beeing a Steelers fan wink.gif Im a Raiders fan in "Patriot Country" wink.gif
Now we know where the typos come from -- brain damage. eek.gif
post #1580 of 11459
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by DanF8500 View Post

I'm watching a live, nationally televised hockey game on nbc right now with my 51F8500. I enjoy watching live sporting events with this new PDP!! Camera flashes/strobes in the event are more recognizable with this plasma than with my older plasma. Perhaps the larger screen size and the brighter whites this tv displays makes them stand out more. Best tv I've ever owned by a long shot!
How small was your last set, what kind of technology was it ?
post #1581 of 11459
Quote:
Originally Posted by htwaits View Post

Now we know where the typos come from -- brain damage. eek.gif

Hey now take it easy on me, I have enough pain year in year out with my team doing poorly....One of these days we'll get back to the good ole days wink.gifbiggrin.gif every year its the same thing, we do well then BOOM we get an injury and the team goes to utter "cow pie"......
post #1582 of 11459
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ph8te View Post

Its in the service menu and if you are not familliar with it then I suggest staying very very very far away as you CAN brick your TV and do damage that will not be covered by and warranty.
I got fianlly got a chance to see the 64F8500 in Magnolia today, the website showed that none of my loal stores had it in stock, but I thought Id try it out anyways. I have to say this is a beautiful set, it seemd someone had tweaked the set as the E8000 next to it was in torch mode and the F8500 seemed "muted" compared to it, butmore natural in my eyes. I tried to get the remote, but of course there as none availabel for me to check the settings. I noticed what seemed like a band and some fluctuations, but like Ken when I looked at the other sets all of the "problems" were with the feed, Im not sure if I have seen a worst feed which makes it look like there are a ton of issues with all the sets.....They showed some hockey, I didnt notice any strobing or flashlighting while watching the game, I also saw various other material and didnt noticce the ABL in dark scenes or light scenes. I also checked for the filter darkening and while I did see it, I saw the same thing on other sets as I got VERY close, at normal distance I couldnt see anything.....The pictures I saw earlier had me a little worried, but I see that the picture greatly exaggerates the effect on the TV (at least in my eyes)....

I had to laugh a littel inside though, becasue according to the salesperson in the Magnolia section Pioneer techs went to Samsung and thats why thier sets are so good biggrin.gif

Overall i was very pleased with what I saw, I really wanted to check out an ST60, but they didnt havae any out...They had 2 F8500s though the 64 in the "main room" and a 51 in the "audo" room......I may just program my Harmony or try to dig out my old Samsung TV remote and take it to the store so I can fiddle with the set lol....

Thanks for your concern, but i would like to do what i want. I take all responsibilty of what happens.
post #1583 of 11459
Quote:
Originally Posted by yamvmax View Post

Thanks for your concern, but i would like to do what i want. I take all responsibilty of what happens.

yam, do you have a "regular" Samsung remote? it will be very difficult if not near impossible with the supplied "smart" remote. A universal remote that has keys mapped will work as well. I can PM you the directions I sent antother member that worked and allwed them to activate Cal Day\Night.......
post #1584 of 11459
Crap, does anyone have any thoughts about the previous question I had about the stand? This would definitely throw a huge wrench into my plans if the stand is going to cause me problems because right now I don't have a good way to mount a TV.
post #1585 of 11459
Quote:
Originally Posted by JMUdukes07 View Post

Crap, does anyone have any thoughts about the previous question I had about the stand? This would definitely throw a huge wrench into my plans if the stand is going to cause me problems because right now I don't have a good way to mount a TV.

personally I would be cautious if the TV was going to be hanging over the edge.....While thecnically as long as the majority of the stand of the TV is level and sitting on something, not sure I would want to take the risk of if falling to either side....Maybe its time for a new stand wink.gif
post #1586 of 11459
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ph8te View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by htwaits View Post

Now we know where the typos come from -- brain damage. eek.gif

Hey now take it easy on me, I have enough pain year in year out with my team doing poorly....One of these days we'll get back to the good ole days wink.gifbiggrin.gif every year its the same thing, we do well then BOOM we get an injury and the team goes to utter "cow pie"......
I saw the Raiders play at Kezar stadium during their first season. There was me and a couple of seagulls in the East end zone. Would you settle for getting aback to the glory of the "Tuck"?
post #1587 of 11459
Quote:
Originally Posted by htwaits View Post

Now we know where the typos come from -- brain damage. eek.gif

Ph8te could never get away with those typos on usenet back in the day.biggrin.gif
Particularly if he was posting to alt.music.pink-floyd in it's heyday before social media killed usenet.mad.gif
post #1588 of 11459
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ph8te View Post

personally I would be cautious if the TV was going to be hanging over the edge.....While thecnically as long as the majority of the stand of the TV is level and sitting on something, not sure I would want to take the risk of if falling to either side....Maybe its time for a new stand wink.gif

Ugh, not what I was hoping to hear. Not sure why Samsung felt the need to mess with the stands so much, it was pretty much perfect on my previous display and looked awesome. Not going to be able to swing the extra hundreds of dollars for a new stand either - this blows.


EDIT: This picture from earlier in the thread has me feeling a lot better. My set would only hang over


Edited by JMUdukes07 - 4/7/13 at 1:27pm
post #1589 of 11459
JMU, did you take a look at the stand in person? That would be your best bet.
post #1590 of 11459
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ph8te View Post

I had to laugh a littel inside though, becasue according to the salesperson in the Magnolia section Pioneer techs went to Samsung and thats why thier sets are so good biggrin.gif
I've been through the same show when the Sharp Elite was new on the market, only they were working in old Pioneer Elite production line. rolleyes.gif

I've read news reports that Sharp bought the Elite name and is a minority owner of Pioneer stock. There were also reports that large numbers of Pioneer plasma engineers went to work for Panasonic. Panasonic is supposed to have bought some Pioneer patents.

Rogo probably knows the actual history of what happened to those Pioneer engineers. smile.gif
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