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Official Samsung PNxxF8500 Series Discussion Thread [No Street Price Talk] - Page 110

post #3271 of 11445
Quote:
Originally Posted by whiznant View Post

Is there no official f8500 owners thread anywhere?
You are in it. The word official in the title of a thread has no official meaning. Neither does the word owner. wink.gif
post #3272 of 11445
Quote:
Originally Posted by whiznant View Post

Is there no official f8500 owners thread anywhere? Also, I'm really surprised that there's no talk about the recent firmware update samsung issued on 3/19. Does it address the brightness pos and/or black fluctuations? I returned my f8500 to amazon on Thursday with the intent of waiting for the ZT60 and of course, no sooner than I return mine, a firmware update is issued! Murphy's law...

Any feedback on the firmware update?

This IS the "official" owners thread....As farr as the update on 3/19 no. Word is from Robert at VE that Samsung will be coming out with a firmware fix for the issues you commented on. That update has no ETA at this time, but I have a feelign taht it will either be released before the shootout in May or they will have a working beta version of it there......
post #3273 of 11445
Quote:
Originally Posted by whiznant View Post

I was at BB last night comparing the VT60 to the F8500 and the F8500 has the VT beat by a nose in the sharpness department. Not a huge difference but it was noticeable. For those who value sharpness I'd say its enough of a difference for a prospective owner to be proud of. I for one came away thinking that I prefer the F8500. Granted the viewing conditions were not optimal. There's something about the F8500 that I really like. I think it's the motion handling.



I was also at BB yesterday. I spent about an hour and a half there. At the time, they were setting up a new VT60 diagonally to the F8500. Under the 8500 and to the left of the VT60 was a Sammy 65ES8000. Both plasma's blew away the ES 8000 LED. The VT60 was changed to Cinema (I believe) and left with all its remaining default settings. The F8500 was set to Movie mode and left with all its remaining default settings. We tested both sets using Blue-Ray and a local HD television feed. When viewing the Blue-Ray we not only watched portions of The Avengers, we also set a certain scene of it on pause to compare the two sets. I gave the Sammy a sight edge on the Blue-Ray when the two sets were set on pause. As to the live tv feed, the four BB employees and I all gave a very slight edge in color clarity and contrast to the VT. We also gave the VT60 a slight edge when its lighting was set to high (it has low, medium and high settings). The F8500 cell was set to 20 (default). However, I'm still drawn to the F8500 because of its pop. Granted, I have a bias toward the F8500 but, the VT60 was impressive nevertheless. Given that it was that close, I am wondering just how good the ZT60 will be. Hopefully, we will all find out at the shootout. However, correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe Ken was able to compare the F8500 with ZT60 and gave a light edge to Sammy.

BTW: I didn't notice and judder or pops - but, the feeds that we were watching weren't the ones that they would be noticed on.
post #3274 of 11445
Quote:
Originally Posted by gmarceau View Post

People forget this. There really isn't much to improve upon, especially since this set now has added brightness and improved clarity, in addition to contrast that is near reference. We've got sets this year that are pretty much equal to a 9G Kuro and we might be done with big improvements in picture quality.

There was a wall at Magnolia with the GT50, E8000 plasma and LED, and the new F8500. The biggest difference watching a feed between all of them was the brightness, with the F8500 having less abl than the other two plasmas, and being close in brightness to the LED.

The biggest difference people are noticing with the F8500 is brightness and the LED look to the picture, a crispness that is part of the new pixel structure. This is part of the reason why I'm more interested in this set than the Panasonics. Unless Panny changes the look of the image, something that really can't be measured with equipment, I'm not too interested in upgrading from a Pioneer. With Sammy, it's almost like I'm changing to an LED or an OLED because of the unique look to the image that it produces.

The most striking part of the ZT60 v. Kuro demo at the Panasonic event the other week was the difference in shades of gradation. It wasn't black level. That tells me that black level is almost maxed out, since anything above 0fL is going to have some slight glow to it, so it's almost irrelevant.
I am interested in actual sharpness and not just a perception of sharper PQ where artifacts are introduced (I know, I know, the Samsung is magical in how it sharpens yet yields no visible artifacts such as ringing, etc. wink.gif)...thus I'm still leaning towards Panasonic (and with the report of the VT60's black levels, it sounds like a beast).
post #3275 of 11445
For what it's worth I just went to BB to see how the VT60 looked in person and it was next to the PN64F8500AF, the panny was hooked up with HDMI and the sammy with component, not only did the sammy looked better to me - no silver bezel among other things - but the picture was also much sharper and vivid, I asked the person to switch thru different mode movie etc on both and the Samsung was always ahead. I don't know in the long run but I'm not so sure I'll blindly buy a VT/ZT as intended. Heck even the VT50 was close by and I could not see the difference with the newer model. The ZT will also have that shiny bezel and it's really becoming a deal breaker to me. I never watch in a pitch black room so anything that will reflect might be annoying, especially all around the image gosh. Just my 2 cents.
post #3276 of 11445
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ph8te View Post

This IS the "official" owners thread....As farr as the update on 3/19 no. Word is from Robert at VE that Samsung will be coming out with a firmware fix for the issues you commented on. That update has no ETA at this time, but I have a feelign taht it will either be released before the shootout in May or they will have a working beta version of it there......

Can I ask what shootout you are talking about?
post #3277 of 11445
Quote:
Originally Posted by quicknick View Post

I was also at BB yesterday. I spent about an hour and a half there. At the time, they were setting up a new VT60 diagonally to the F8500. Under the 8500 and to the left of the VT60 was a Sammy 65ES8000. Both plasma's blew away the ES 8000 LED. The VT60 was changed to Cinema (I believe) and left with all its remaining default settings. The F8500 was set to Movie mode and left with all its remaining default settings. We tested both sets using Blue-Ray and a local HD television feed. When viewing the Blue-Ray we not only watched portions of The Avengers, we also set a certain scene of it on pause to compare the two sets. I gave the Sammy a sight edge on the Blue-Ray when the two sets were set on pause. As to the live tv feed, the four BB employees and I all gave a very slight edge in color clarity and contrast to the VT. We also gave the VT60 a slight edge when its lighting was set to high (it has low, medium and high settings). The F8500 cell was set to 20 (default). However, I'm still drawn to the F8500 because of its pop. Granted, I have a bias toward the F8500 but, the VT60 was impressive nevertheless. Given that it was that close, I am wondering just how good the ZT60 will be. Hopefully, we will all find out at the shootout. However, correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe Ken was able to compare the F8500 with ZT60 and gave a light edge to Sammy.

BTW: I didn't notice and judder or pops - but, the feeds that we were watching weren't the ones that they would be noticed on.

I didn't get a chance to compare the 8500 to the ZT since Panasonic pitted the ZT against the old Kuro. No 8500 was in sight.

I'm a bit confused though about your post. You mentioned you gave a very slight edge to the VT for contrast, yet you said you were more drawn to the 8500 for pop. Can you clarify?
post #3278 of 11445
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ph8te View Post


Not so sure he was saiying "bargain plasma" in that sense, but find a good bargain on a plasma. The ST60 right now is a great bargain for the performance\picture you are getting, which is what I think jack was referring to....

Yea, I hope I didn't come on too strong by saying that, but only the F8500 truly stood out from all the other plasma's I looked at, that's really what I was trying to say.

I am not a Samsung loyalist, but a friend of mine just received one of the new 5500 plasma's and he's telling me the picture is also stunning. The first thing he mentioned was "unbelievable detail" and then went on and on how great the picture is. It has a single layer panel similar to the ZT60 and I have a feeling it just might be the sleeper plasma of 2013. I really respect my friends opinion and he's telling me it's picture is clearly better than my VT50. He lives in Chicago now and I'm in Florida, so I haven't seen it, but...there is a very good chance it just might be better than anything we've seen from Panasonic this year. I would definitely check it out before popping on a ST60, that's for sure.
post #3279 of 11445
Quote:
Originally Posted by david3772 View Post

Can I ask what shootout you are talking about?

The Value Electronics Shootout, there is more information on their website and discussion about it in the "Flat Panel Discussion" section of the forum
post #3280 of 11445
Quote:
Originally Posted by vinnie97 View Post

I am interested in actual sharpness and not just a perception of sharper PQ where artifacts are introduced (I know, I know, the Samsung is magical in how it sharpens yet yields no visible artifacts such as ringing, etc. wink.gif)...thus I'm still leaning towards Panasonic (and with the report of the VT60's black levels, it sounds like a beast).

Well we all know your a MLL junkie wink.giftongue.gifbiggrin.gif

edited to remove possible offensive term...
Edited by Ph8te - 4/21/13 at 8:37pm
post #3281 of 11445
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ph8te View Post

Well we all know your a MLL whore wink.giftongue.gifbiggrin.gif
MLL?
post #3282 of 11445
Quote:
Originally Posted by AuralSex View Post

MLL?

Minimum Luminance Level aka how black can the set get.....vinnie wont even consider the set unless it can beat his current Kuro wink.gif he's a bat afterall so its understandable biggrin.gif
post #3283 of 11445
minimal luminance level (and be careful about using the "W" word, I got an infraction for innocently using it recently ;( ).
post #3284 of 11445
Quote:
Originally Posted by vinnie97 View Post

minimal luminance level (and be careful about using the "W" word, I got an infraction for innocently using it recently ;( ).
Dang thanks for t heads up Ill edit that out......but at least you know its all in fun biggrin.gif
post #3285 of 11445
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ken Ross View Post

I didn't get a chance to compare the 8500 to the ZT since Panasonic pitted the ZT against the old Kuro. No 8500 was in sight.

I'm a bit confused though about your post. You mentioned you gave a very slight edge to the VT for contrast, yet you said you were more drawn to the 8500 for pop. Can you clarify?


I stand corrected. In retrospect, without going through all the posts it most likely was the VT60 that you had compared this panel to.

Perhaps, I didn't use the right terms in the difference I saw between the panels. As you know, outside of calibration everything is subjective. As to the live tv feed - there were vertical columns with colored brick veneer in the background of the studio set that we were observing on the HD broadcast. The colors of the various brick appeared slightly more vibrant and rich in detail even though the F8500 had more illumination, if you will. I balanced my observations on the fact that the BB employees assured me that the F8500 had all default settings except for Movie mode. I saw the set-up done of the VT60 and I can assure you that it had all default settings except being in the Cinema mode.

The comparison has not changed my opinion of the F8500. I still believe it to be a fantastic panel and, most likely, will be the panel of my choice. I'm not technically advanced enough to know the differences in how various source material is delivered to the panel but, I think the source may have had something to do with what I had observed. BTW: I didn't notice any difference between the two panels when looking at BB's house feed except for the F8500 having more pop.
post #3286 of 11445
I'll go ahead and throw in my "subjective" view on this F8500 at this point. Saw it in BB, and they claimed that it had not been altered out of the box (so I suppose what?...What is "torch mode" for Samsung currently? ) Anyway, I was immediately struck by the excellent plasma-blacks, in combo with excellent lcd-whites, i.e. not the dirty whites some of the plasmas tend to show out that we have become familiar with. Brightness? Yea. Then there was an apparent sharpness that exceeded the other tv's around it, both a Panny GT50 and some lcd unit (both were last season's models). Very sharp. I was impressed. Unfortunately, due to schedule, I had to leave so I was unable to form an opinion on color, but certainly the facial skin tones did not jump out at me saying "This is not right !" or "Ug-lee !" I left (all too soon) being impressed, and thinking that Samsung has something special. As I said..."subjective." Oh, one more thing, I could live with the "towel bar" stand design just fine, but I think I prefer the less conspicuous cheap black slab by Panasonic. biggrin.gif
post #3287 of 11445
Quote:
Originally Posted by vinnie97 View Post

minimal luminance level (and be careful about using the "W" word, I got an infraction for innocently using it recently ;( ).



Vinnie

I really feel dumb. What is the "W" word???????????????????


m
post #3288 of 11445
Quote:
Originally Posted by htwaits View Post

You are in it. The word official in the title of a thread has no official meaning. Neither does the word owner. wink.gif

Thanks for the clairification. I asked mainly because I've been looking for news about the 3/19 firmware update. So there've been no reports of the update fixing any of the issues weve been having? I feel like I'm taking crazy pills!

Friday when I was over at BB checking out their F8500 I didn't notice any brightness pops or black fluctuations or halos/ghosting/double images I was getting with my set when I had it. The associate there said that he'd applied the 3/19 update so I'm wondering if that fixed the issues or if maybe I just had a defective set. I haven't heard of anyone else seeing the haloed images I was seeing.
post #3289 of 11445
Quote:
Originally Posted by JimShaw View Post

Vinnie

I really feel dumb. What is the "W" word???????????????????

m

It rhymes with shore wink.gif

Quote:
Originally Posted by whiznant View Post

Thanks for the clairification. I asked mainly because I've been looking for news about the 3/19 firmware update. So there've been no reports of the update fixing any of the issues weve been having? I feel like I'm taking crazy pills!

Friday when I was over at BB checking out their F8500 I didn't notice any brightness pops or black fluctuations or halos/ghosting/double images I was getting with my set when I had it. The associate there said that he'd applied the 3/19 update so I'm wondering if that fixed the issues or if maybe I just had a defective set. I haven't heard of anyone else seeing the haloed images I was seeing.

I think we did have a few reports back then that it did help slightly, but this was not "the" fix, Samsung has a sseperate unreleased firmware that they have been working on for those issues. I believe Robert form VE has been the Point of Contact for that so he may get something 1st to test it out.....I would think Samsung has some motivation to get it done before the shootout wink.gif
post #3290 of 11445
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ph8te View Post

It rhymes with shore wink.gif

Oh, OK, Thanks



m
post #3291 of 11445
So I was in Best Buy earlier this evening looking at the VT60's 3D performance to compare it to that of the F8500, which I already know from first hand experience is excellent. BBY didn't have any live action 3D discs on hand so I popped in Avatar 2D and looked at it in converted 3D. One thing I noticed was frequent cross-talk/ ghosting in the converted 3D image on the VT60, something that the F8500 was more or less free of.

Would someone with an F8500 mind checking out the Avatar 2D Blu-ray in converted 3D? If so, would you mind looking at the first ten minutes or so of the movie? I noticed heavy cross-talk on the VT60 in the scene where Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)
they wake up from hyper-sleep inside that long, cylindrical ship and also on the mask-covered faces of the veteran soldiers greeting the new recruits exiting the shuttle on Pandora for the first time.

Thanks!
post #3292 of 11445
Quote:
Originally Posted by Watcher12 View Post

Would someone with an F8500 mind checking out the Avatar 2D Blu-ray in converted 3D?
I don't do 3D or intend to do 3D but I'm curious about your question. Is 3D converted from 2D at a stage where differences in PQ is an issue?confused.gif
post #3293 of 11445
Quote:
Originally Posted by htwaits View Post

I don't do 3D or intend to do 3D but I'm curious about your question. Is 3D converted from 2D at a stage where differences in PQ is an issue?confused.gif

I'm trying to gauge the 3D quality of the VT60 (and eventually the ZT60). If the F8500 were to playback 3D material without ghosting that the VT/ ZT exhibited ghosting on, then it would be a rather large check in the column of the F8500 for me.
post #3294 of 11445
Quote:
Originally Posted by whiznant View Post

Is there no official f8500 owners thread anywhere??

+1
I have to agree, I'd love to see a dedicated discussion thread for " Owners''... Already having the F8500 myself and I'm sure other owners faster nit have to sift through post after post of comparisons, store visit opinions and which tv someone is thinking of buying..
We have the TV we want and it would be nice to have posts only dealing with settings, tweaks and help concerning only our f8500s...
post #3295 of 11445
Quote:
Originally Posted by skoor View Post

You know, I did the same thing. One of the reasons I passed on the closeout 2008 Kuro 9.5G Signature Elite was the poor black levels I observed in a dark room viewing. I was used to Sony XRBs CRT sets and just assumed the Kuro would be better, but it looked really gray to me in a 4hr dark room observation setting. I play with the adjustment and just kept noticing the glow. And to boot the picture was too dim ..

Kind funny thinking here in 2013 we are just now getting back to the Kuro level MIL finally with the latest Samsun and Panasonic sets. And to some, that may even be debatable.

Maybe I am the odd person

However..as I recall color was not a Kuro strong point...and I agree with you it was a "dimmer" TV
I remember looking at those and thinking how over priced it was

Nice picture...but it still lacked color and brightness

Fast forward to today
As I recall those Sony XBR CRT's were expensive...I seem to recall a price structure about the same as the new Samsung F8500( with a MUCH larger screen)

From what I recall of those Sony XBR CRTs...the Samsung F8500 is a better TV in every way

.I thought that Sony XBR CRT was overpriced as well...something Sony seems to like to do


Warren
post #3296 of 11445
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pinger View Post

+1
I have to agree, I'd love to see a dedicated discussion thread for " Owners''... Already having the F8500 myself and I'm sure other owners faster nit have to sift through post after post of comparisons, store visit opinions and which tv someone is thinking of buying..
We have the TV we want and it would be nice to have posts only dealing with settings, tweaks and help concerning only our f8500s...

Isnt that what the Settings thread is for? As always though it takes a while for the main thread to calm down.Soon after the shootout youll start to see less and less activity as prospective owners eitehr become owners OR choose another set.
post #3297 of 11445
Hi guys. I just received the 64F8500 plasma here in Athens, Greece.

The PQ is outstanding. I have it in movie mode, cell 12, contrast 75. Its already bright for my dark living room! No pops or floating blacks in these settings.

I have one problem though. I also have a very faint horizontal line just above the middle of the panel, that appears in light backrounds like sky, snow etc. Is this the filter that others talked about? Should i return it? Is it a faulty set? Its very faint but visible by me...If i change it, the new will be the same?
post #3298 of 11445
Just went with friend yesterday and got the 51' model great picture like the hand gestures comes in handy when you cant find remote to turn down volume. But IMO little slow and laggy for being quad core powered. Im sure this can be fixed with firmware update

My only complaint is the awful top and bottom viewing angles screen goes so dark from these angles.
The top isn't an issue since it will be mounted on wall but hopefully the bottom isn't a problem . Find out when he gets wallmount delivered
post #3299 of 11445
FYI...

another report on HTS of the faint horizontal band on the 64". funny i don't have this, but have the pink vert. band.

edit: oops, i see it's been posted here as well.
post #3300 of 11445
Quote:
Originally Posted by polakis View Post

Hi guys. I just received the 64F8500 plasma here in Athens, Greece.

The PQ is outstanding. I have it in movie mode, cell 12, contrast 75. Its already bright for my dark living room! No pops or floating blacks in these settings.

I have one problem though. I also have a very faint horizontal line just above the middle of the panel, that appears in light backrounds like sky, snow etc. Is this the filter that others talked about? Should i return it? Is it a faulty set? Its very faint but visible by me...If i change it, the new will be the same?

Is this band viewable in all content? how close are you to the TV? does it diminsh, get worse as you move at different angles? I dont remember 100%, but I believe we had a report of something simillar before and once exchanged everything was OK. No one can say for sure if you exchange it, the next one wont have the issue, jsut too many variables to take into account.

Quote:
Originally Posted by demo23019 View Post

Just went with friend yesterday and got the 51' model great picture like the hand gestures comes in handy when you cant find remote to turn down volume. But IMO little slow and laggy for being quad core powered. Im sure this can be fixed with firmware update

My only complaint is the awful top and bottom viewing angles screen goes so dark from these angles.
The top isn't an issue since it will be mounted on wall but hopefully the bottom isn't a problem . Find out when he gets wallmount delivered

How close were you to the TV? Usually the filter only effects viewing when extreemly close, at least form what I have seen at the Magnolia and reports from otehr owners here. If you are 3ft or less from the TV and yes youll notice it, normal viewing distance you usually dont.
As far as the interface, all depends on what you are expecting possibly, it may seem slow compared to a PC etc, but for a TV it may be quick......I dont think we've had many reports of it being laggy...
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